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Jamil
USA
14 Posts |
 Posted - Apr 26 2011 : 3:45:31 PM
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Upward meditation is described as drawing energy upwards and consciousness out of the body. That is where the term out-of-body experience is used. Downward meditation invites energy down into the body through the body’s third eye, or heart.
Out of the two described, is AYP practice either one? or a combination of the two? Just asking questions. Hope I am not a bother.
Namaste
Jamil |
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Apr 27 2011 : 08:10:53 AM
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Hi Jamil,
In 'traditional' Yogic meditation one is taught to sit on a non conductive material known as an Asan. In this way there is no downward flow to the ground. The process can be likened to a pot boiling on the stove with the intent of boiling out the impurities in the pot. Once the pot has boiled then the steam coming off the top will be pure.This meditation is often termed 'Fire' method and in fact some mantras focus on igniting the fire to burn out the impurities.
The Taoist method is commonly refered to as 'Water' method as the energy comes in through the crown and connects to the earth as they do not use an Asan to prevent energy loss.The term water is used an an analogy of cooling the fire by bringing the energy from above and to earth.I guess one can liken this to a lake that has light shining through it.As the water clears the light penetrates deeper and is absorbed on the bottom.
Both methods are valid as has been proven by both methods bringing realisation.
In my experience mantras generate more energy than observing hence the need for more self pacing I believe but the speed of progress is more directed by the practioner than the method IMHO.
I have also found that once one reaches a certain level then neither method are needed to enter deep levels in meditation.
L&L
Dave |
Edited by - riptiz on Apr 27 2011 08:34:33 AM |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Apr 27 2011 : 09:49:39 AM
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AYP would be neither up nor down, or both up and down, or upwards one day and down the next.
We don't focus on this... we just stay with the procedure and let the stillness decide on what needs to happen during the sessions.
Here is how Yogani explains it. 
http://www.aypsite.org/69.html
The metaphorical mythology of kundalini describes a union between Shakti (a name for kundalini in motion) and Shiva (pure bliss consciousness). As you know, Shakti starts out near the base of the spine in the huge storehouse of prana there, i.e., sexual energy. In the mythology, Shiva is located at the top of the head. So the way it is described is Shakti awakens, goes up through all the chakras until she reaches the top of the head, and there she finds union with Shiva who is waiting there for her. He is just hanging out there doing nothing, you know. They make love and nectar overflows downward, enlightening the practitioner. Very romantic, isn't it? Especially for Shiva, who sits up there doing nothing while Shakti fights her way upward (through your nervous system!) to find him.
While it looks great on paper, this scenario does not work very well. In practice, most of the time this approach is a flop because it assumes that Shakti will do all the work, and find Shiva at the crown. She will sure try, and tear up your nervous system in the process. Hence the excessive kundalini symptoms. Things can get so
uncomfortable that practices can't continue, and then it goes into a long slow burn from then on.
The answer to this is to get Shiva off his butt and doing something. He has to get off his lofty perch and "get down" with Shakti wherever she may be in the body, which is everywhere once she is awake and coming up. While their union may finally end up somewhere "up there," Shiva and Shakti must be brought together everywhere in the body first. If this is done, some craziness may still be there, but it will be the craziness of the ecstatic union of Shiva and Shakti going on in every nerve and cell in the body, rather than the blistering chaos of Shakti's energy alone burning through everything it meets, all of which is in your body. In short, which do you prefer, ecstasy or agony?
This is why spinal breathing is the first recommendation. It directly activates both masculine and feminine energies, and it brings them together in a balanced way. The ascending breath brings Shakti to Shiva, and the descending breath brings Shiva to Shakti. It is a balanced relationship. Then, in union, they go out together to every nerve and cell in the body. With this approach, much more energy can be moved with far less stress to the system. It opens the possibility for much more aggressive spiritual practice than is possible using the Shakti-only approach. And it is a lot of ecstatic fun too.
It should be mentioned that with the I AM mantra, the balancing of masculine and feminine energies is taken into account also, as was discussed in the lesson, "Q&A -- Some mantra particulars."
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Jamil
USA
14 Posts |
Posted - Apr 27 2011 : 11:46:57 AM
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Wow, love your guys answers. For Ripitz, does the water method lead to a more grounded, spirituality. I have heard in Taoist circles and in one particular heart centered meditation method that downward meditation causes one to be more grounded, balanced. You know the cliche of the blissed out Yogi, functional in the spiritual terms but unable to navigate the "real" world. They contend this is the danger of upward meditation.
Do you think an ungrounded yoga practitioner is one who has favored the development of Shakti over Shiva or vice versa? (I know overdoing practices either way can do this, selfpacing is your Friend!)
Shanti, so the union of Shakti and Shiva is a full neurobiological system process. Its not like Shiva says to Shakti, "You, me at the Crown 7pm", the process of unification takes place throughout. So, what I am seeing is that AYP practices and balanced Yoga and spiritual practices seek a union of these two forces. As you say Shanti this process of union takes place everywhere even though it may end up somewhere in ye ole noggin. Great description of the process btw.
As you guys here go through the process, how do you relate to your body as consciousness expand/deepens? Is it detached, somewhere in between, reverence for the bodys processes?
Namaste
Jamil |
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Apr 27 2011 : 12:38:51 PM
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Hi Jamil,
I guess in theory the water method SHOULD give less problems but the reality is we are all different and I have heard of chi sickness from doing chi gung etc.In fact there is a technique for stimulating kriyas in chi gung which I was shown when I practiced Tai Chi.IMHO anyone who practices meditation or energy practices should have guidance and support to help avoid problems and to have a safe outcome.I cannot stress this enough and make a point of telling students that I am available and take the responsibilities very seriously.
On the other hand the water method should actually be a slower method as you are giving up energy by conduction to the earth but there is no hard and fast rules and it's different for all of us.Of course there are more advanced techniques in both methods and some are not available to the general public or taught openly.
L&L
Dave |
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Jamil
USA
14 Posts |
Posted - Apr 27 2011 : 1:07:02 PM
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Thanks Dave, that cleared up alot. Its nice to get thoughtful explanations from voices of experiences to questions I have had to various spiritual topics. Have a good day.
Namaste
Jamil |
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Upward vs. Downward Meditation
