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Chrisk
USA
87 Posts |
 Posted - Mar 14 2011 : 5:27:16 PM
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Hello all on this forum,
I have been doing what Yogani was saying for a couple months now and my practice seems to have stabilized, but it still feels like a bumpy ride. The problem seems that I can only do meditation for 1 day per week (for 40mins + 15 mins of pranayama), while the rest of the week I have to do heavy grounding. It seems that meditation does affect me a lot at this point.
So it appears to me that grounding is important as well especially for neophytes such as me. So after my meditation, I have learned to expect kundalini symptoms like mild depression, mood swings, and some psychological and bodily stress, i.e. fear and indigestion, bloating, dry skin, etc.
Anyways, I wonder for how long I am supposed to go on in this slow mode of meditation. Of course i am willing to give up meditation completely until symptoms of excess dissipate but then I will be doing no progress. The reason is I generally find myself doing mostly grounding. Sparingly I also decide to brign on a day of meditation here and there to spice things up and make me feel i do progress.
Has anyone else noticed such thing? Thus, for how long will I be involved in this way? It seems that if obstructions are too abundant, then we basically cannot proceed by doing meditation upon meditation since it will bring forth all kundalini symptoms. Therefore, this compells me starting off with some grounding first while adding meditation slowly.
Nothing else seems to work for me right now, but I do also try to instill some experience in silence by forcing in some meditation sessions since as Yogani says silence is important by itself, as well as pranayama.
Thanks very much,
Chris.
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Edited by - Chrisk on Mar 20 2011 09:14:06 AM |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Mar 14 2011 : 5:59:35 PM
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Hi Chris,
Sorry but from what I've learned from Yogani ever since I've been around at AYP is that he's totally against this kind of act:
quote:
Originally posted by Chrisk
The problem seems that I can only do meditation for 1 day per week (for 40mins + 15 mins of pranayama), while the rest of the week I have to do heavy grounding.
Practice should be done daily! In the morning and in the evening and never for a one time big hit like meditating for hours and then letting things rest for the entire week; Things just simply don't work this way.
I hope you or Yogani could clarify if this one time a week meditation advise have been given by Yoganiji.
Dear Chris, I wish you a safe recovery and if you like to you can follow up with me by email in private and maybe I could help out if you could share more of the specifics of your practice routine.
Love,
Ananda |
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 05:11:36 AM
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Hi Chris,
What are your grounding techniques? Perhaps someone can suggest more effective methods than you are using.
L&L
Dave |
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Chiron
Russia
397 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 06:37:07 AM
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| Walking does the trick here everytime. Barefoot in a park or on the beach. Plus listening to Omdasji. A few hours of this practice and meditation can be done for as long as time and stamina allow. But everyone's different, there are many grounding techniques out there. These two are quite simple but effective. |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 08:47:05 AM
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Once a week for 40 min is not AYP.
If you want to do once a week, you can, but you cannot do more than 20 min of deep meditation and 10 min spinal breathing in one sitting... doing more will make you overload.
The best thing in your case would be to do 5 min meditation twice a day every day.
Think about it this way, if you are working out, it is better to do a few min a day and build up your stamina, and not do an hour workout one day, feel beat and take the rest of the week to recover. Building practices is done in the exact same way. If meditation gives you kundalini symptoms, do 2 or 3 rounds of spinal breathing and 5 to 7 min of meditation twice a day, every day. This will help clear things out smoothly. Then when you feel stable, you can increase your time. This way you are gently chiseling away at the blocks, rather than taking a huge chunk off and then taking a break while you recover and stuff gets added back in... its like taking 1 step forward and 2 steps back.
As for grounding, walking and exercise help a lot.
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Chrisk
USA
87 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 11:55:09 AM
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I do exactly what Yogani says, I do twice 20mins daily + some opening pranayama at the beginning. I go on to do this 3 days continously and I' m light headed and innervated and feeling down/ depressed after that. I reduced it to 2 days same schedule and I still get some symptoms. This week I recuded it to 1 day same schedule and I dont dare do any more.
Yes, I beleive you are correct, I' ll switch to what you have said in the answers here, I' ll reduce it to 5 mins every day. But this is a joke, it seems, to me, I cant just sit and try concentrate for 5 mins meditation. Thus, if the twice 20 mins for 1 day works for me, I' ll try stick to this, else I cant do anything else than fall for 5 mins med. per day, so I make you all folks happy about this.
Since I' m a yoga instructor I rely on my dialy yoga sessions for groudning. I was also tought chi kong/ tai chi by my kung fu school, particularly Wing Chun, Tiger Claw, Crane, Snake, etc, etc, also Tai Chi Chuan the combat sport, not the flowery one that chinese old folks do in the morning. So I just go along with these. Basically, I am a Kung Fu certified instructor as well for many years now.
That' s all for me,
Thanks,
Chris.
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Edited by - Chrisk on Mar 20 2011 09:19:21 AM |
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Chrisk
USA
87 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 1:26:18 PM
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i forgot to mention, I' m even doing the way long version of mantra as Yogani - a great man - has demonstrated for those oversensitive to meditation, i.e. this is the third mantra enhancement which goes Sri Om, sri om, Ayam, Ayam, Namah, Namah, and still K esymptoms emerge aftewards.
I even resort to just breath attention which is not even deep meditation according to Yogani and thus I find it works quite more mildly for me.
Thanks for all your answers.
God bless,
Chris. |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 1:29:40 PM
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Heavy Yoga asanas or too much yoga asanas leads into overloading symptoms also and I speak from my own experience and many others I instruct. Here at AYP, this is the take on asanas: http://www.aypsite.org/71.html
As for light Tai chi it can help in grounding but chi kong leads to overload. As for the meditation time and Yogani's suggestion for you, it's all about finding what suits best every one of us. 20 mins of DM and 5 mins of spinal breathing usually do wonders for the general public but in few cases such as yourself and me included less time is needed. I just finished my DM session a few minutes ago and it was for 5 minutes only tonight... Less is more applies on cases like us, and don't worry you won't lose any benefits you will gain much more...
Shanti's advise is great as usual and we are here to help as much as we can. In the end it's your own responsibility to take care of yourself. I strongly suggest you self pace on asanas and chi kong.
Love,
Ananda |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 1:30:41 PM
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Looks like we cross posted |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 1:44:16 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Chrisk
i forgot to mention, I' m even doing the way long version of mantra as Yogani - a great man - has demonstrated for those oversensitive to meditation, i.e. this is the third mantra enhancement which goes Sri Om, sri om, Ayam, Ayam, Namah, Namah, and still K esymptoms emerge aftewards.
I even resort to just breath attention which is not even deep meditation according to Yogani and thus I find it works quite more mildly for me.
Thanks for all your answers.
God bless,
Chris.
The mantra you just shared will put a sensitive meditator as yourself and me included into one hell of a messy situation. Again Yogani wouldn't give such advise for sensitive meditators especially using Shri om which works directly on the crown and two Namah which really break through the heart knots big time.
As for using the breath, it's advised to either use the breath or mantra meditation and stick to either one of these.
Love,
Ananda |
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Chrisk
USA
87 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 1:58:14 PM
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I would not think yoga asanas can pose much risk of ill- health. As long as you dont do in a meditative way, i.e. you dont fall into chanting the mantra, etc, then they appear to be normal like any other exercise. It' s good for flexibility also, for joints, spine, etc. For those people who are terribly stiff, it' s good practice.
I think pranayama is the one to be avoided that leads to K symptoms especially for newbies.
Fairwell,
Chris.
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Edited by - Chrisk on Mar 20 2011 09:28:24 AM |
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Chrisk
USA
87 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 2:02:50 PM
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The matnra I shared it's the long version by Yogani. The AYAM one is the short deep meditation version, as I read the longer version provides lesser response and its good for starters, not all people. I' m sure it can be confirmed. I can of course return back to the Ayam as everyone else, but I' ll be just doing 5 mins daily then seems the norm and see to whether everything ok from there.
Thanks all for feedback,
Chris.
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 2:10:35 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Chrisk
As I am a yoga practitioner/ instructor, I dont think yoga asanas can pose any risks of overloading.
My first taste of depression and crown activity started when I started doing yoga asanas. I was 21. I had no idea about meditation and spirituality then. So, yoga asanas can cause overload.
Also, shree is a crown activator, so staying away from the mantra that has shree is a good idea for now.
Thanks for sharing here. |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 2:16:32 PM
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My good friend, I respect that you are a yoga instructor and respect your opinion also but asanas and chi kong increase the flow of prana/kundalini energy. Which means lots of energy for a nervous that's not capable of handling it yet. And sitting in Siddhasan is one big NONO in your case.
And yes return to the IAM if you want peace and breath meditation if things are still tricky. I know all about the mantra you shared and used it myself for one year or so...
Love,
Ananda |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 2:19:24 PM
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Dear Chris, a lot of people here in the forums have shared their experiences about overloading because of asanas also.
Shantizzz we cross posted
[img]icon_heart.gif[/img] |
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Chrisk
USA
87 Posts |
Posted - Mar 15 2011 : 5:59:04 PM
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From my practicing experience, I beleive yoga and other taoist practices are safe uless they are done wrongly, then they can cause more blockages which will lead to serious health issues and even death without ever the person knowing what caused it as it would be an energetic occurence.
If we take the covnersation further, obstructions are always the result of some faulty practice, whether be physical, or emotional from primordial lives we had, or in this life.
In conclusion, I beleive it's best for each person to experiment on their own.
Peace to all,
Chris.
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Edited by - Chrisk on Mar 20 2011 09:36:56 AM |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Mar 16 2011 : 04:08:04 AM
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My good friend, Yes I agree to each his own... Speaking for myself, I speak from experience and honestly I stopped caring much about literature...
I've said what I think may help in your case, but feel free to follow or not to it's your choice.
Love,
Ananda |
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Chiron
Russia
397 Posts |
Posted - Mar 16 2011 : 05:02:30 AM
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Most heavy exercises tended to cause overload here. That's why i'd recommend walking over running everytime.. and calmer, smoother tai chi practices vs the heavy combat movements.. at least until things smooth out and one is able to meditate consistently every day.
Not sure about literature either.. most people tend to speak from experience around here and that's what makes it so helpful. And good teachers are a luxury these days so most of us just have to make best use of the advice we get and guide outselves through intuition.
The guru is in Yogani..
oooops, err
the Guru is in You. |
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Mar 16 2011 : 07:02:40 AM
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Hi Chris,
Actually it is well known that 'chi sickness' or purification symptoms/overload (whatever name you want to tag on it)can be a result of chi gung even if one practises correctly with people who are overly sensitive.Also I recall of a lady who was practicing hatha yoga that was experiencing tingling in her body during practice. When she asked her teacher what it was her teacher did not know and have never experienced it.Of course it frightened her and she stopped practices.My limited experience with hatha teachers is that some have little knowledge of the energy side of yoga that is often associated with advanced practices like pranayama and meditation etc.BUT not limited exclusively to those practices.
You may have 'got away' with little or no energy overload in the past with your (what seems extensive)regular practices but I think adding meditation is the 'straw that broke the camels back' in your case.I have been involved in martial arts, tai chi, energy work for over 30 yrs and have just about got away with it but even I overload and I am very well grounded.IMHO I don't think you will be able to continue in your normal way including excess meditation no matter how much grounding you do but that is your call.
L&L
Dave |
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Chrisk
USA
87 Posts |
Posted - Mar 16 2011 : 08:49:17 AM
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I agree most yoga teachers do not know the energetic impact of yoga whcih can be either good, or dangerous.
There are some particular chinese taoist teachers though, which are very good, they know how to manipulate/ control energy and heal, or harm others by the use of it. These folks are powerful in this respect, some of them even have inner vision. These folks are very good and they can heal by practice of accupuncture, accupressure, vital points massage, etc.
It is ok for those who dont have K. symptoms at all, these people are blessed with a clear concience and clear soul and they are free to move on to the path of enlightenment, but considereing people like myself for example, seems we are more into trouble because of our past discrepances and perhaps, may be, we have been more 'evil' than others and thus our concience is not so clear. These people need to move move more slowly and methodically towards spirituality. I agree that 5 mins of meditation would be a good approach and I am switching to this method, hopefully without any overloads.
So in the end, each is to pick their own path according to where they are in the path, some are way ahead and moving fast - the blessed ones - others are quite further behind and cant continue as fast either. Therefore, those in the second category need the extra help. I even heard that even the touch from a blessed Master on someone else, is enough to clear their concience and catapult them forward towards the enightenment. In this respect, no meditation needed, no flimzy yoga, or other efforts either.
Thank you all for your wonderful peices of conversation.
Chris.
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Edited by - Chrisk on Mar 20 2011 09:47:29 AM |
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Mar 16 2011 : 10:57:11 AM
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Hi Chris,
I have had shaktipat 5 times and although it does catapult one further it is not the complete answer that one may believe.Very few experience enlightenment instantly with shaktipat and even when one is enlightened one still needs to practice sadhana to maintain that level.As all my gurus disciples are enegetically connected on a permanent basis we are constantly drawing off his energies daily and especially when we sit for meditation or japa.He does many hours sadhana daily to maintain his energy levels and once when I asked him about enlightenment he said it wasn't achiving it that was difficult but maintaining it.As you travel further on the path and become further purified you experience higher levels of cleansing and are more sensitive to others around you.
L&L
Dave |
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Chrisk
USA
87 Posts |
Posted - Apr 03 2011 : 5:09:21 PM
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I would doubt whether heavy asanas, or qi gong/ tai chi can cause overload symptoms. My overload symptomos seem to have started when starting meditation AND pranayama, pranayama being the first suspect. The second suspect is meditation as also in the literature it says that it needs caution, even Yogani keeps drilling this to us all the time, i.e. the need to pace, i.e. have the wheels straight before accelerating.
But as for yoga and chi kong/ tai chi, etc, I am reluctant to still believe they can cause overload symptoms. Neither Kung Fu by itself seems to cause overload symptoms. It is generally equal to Boxing, or Karate, people doing these seldom complain about symptoms of K., or even not even know they exist. I did myself Kung Fu, Boxing, Karate, some Aikido and Tae Kown Do, all these do not seem to do any harm in regard to surfaciing kundalini symptoms.
It may be the fact really that some folks are doing such practices nearly under some degree of meditation, then it will count both as yoga AND meditation which of course the meditative part will awake some K. symptoms if they overdo. This would be my interpretation.
As a last point, actually running also is good grounding, not just walking as I heard it is good to spend excess energy, rather than preserve it as in walking. Tai Chi is basically similar to walking, but also Kung Fu is done slowly, harly used as fast action sport, as this is only required during an emergency situation such as fight, but generally it is practiced in an easy manner. Same applies to chi kong, its dynamic techniques are also non- straining but slow and fluid.
So there is not much evidence that these above practices can open up someone to K symptoms as we know them ourselves from meditation/ pranayama practice.
Now some particular yoga classes I know, they do teach some breathing techniques, well, this might start getting into the realm of meditation as well as pranayama and result in stirring up K. symptoms. If they want to do that, that' s fine, but they could use caution, or just limit it to a small duration every day, or every week.
Even if we consider gymnastics for women, or just gym training, etc, all these should not pose any danger to health, unless of course done in a wrong way. Even a gym machine if you do it wrongly, you may pull muscle, or drop a weight on your foot, that would be considered bad practice resulting to injury.
So we should probably leave it at that, that all mentioned above practices are considered safe in the respect mentioned here.
Being a yoga instructor myself, well, it is good exercise, for relaxation, flexibility, etc.
Regards,
Chris.
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Edited by - Chrisk on Apr 03 2011 5:45:12 PM |
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JDH
USA
331 Posts |
Posted - Apr 03 2011 : 7:18:59 PM
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Hi ChrisK,
To me, kundalini symptoms mean the ecstatic conductivity is increasing. It opens up slowly over the course of months and years, and various symptoms with varying intensity will come and go. With the rise of inner silence, these symptoms become less and less "symptoms" and more and more... just something that is happening inside, and that actually feels kind of good. Just like the heart is beating, and the lungs are breathing, eventually the kundalini symptoms are flowing. It's a good thing.
The self pacing control lever is all about the inner guru. Sure all of those practices you listed are safe. The caution is that sometimes with the integration and synergy of all the limbs of yoga, things might open up at an uncomfortably fast pace. Just test the limits yourself and find what works. If you gradually build up the practice AYP style, adding things on once a month or so.. the roadsigns will be pretty clear if you're overdoing it.
I usually do about 5-10 minutes of asana before sitting. Sometimes I get into it and go longer. I've heard half an hour is a safe maximum time limit for asanas done before sitting. And that longer asana practices are fine if you don't do sitting practices right afterward.
Love |
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JDH
USA
331 Posts |
Posted - Apr 03 2011 : 7:25:54 PM
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| PS - The "down" feeling you describe after meditation could be an example of opening at an uncomfortable pace. You asked how long will it take before enough obstructions are removed that meditation will feel better. It's differs by session, and by person. Some sessions will leave you feeling great. Some sessions leave you feeling like taking a nap. It gradually feels better over time, and the opening process becomes pleasureful. Giving up meditation completely isn't necessary. Just do a tiny bit each day. Whatever is comfortable, even if it's a few minutes. When it's time to do more, bhakti will be calling, it's all up to you. |
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Importance of Grounding
