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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
 Posted - Jan 29 2010 : 4:12:47 PM
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Namaste All
Am wondering if any of you out there ever go through phases of feeling like you are "acting your character" but aren't really invested in it anymore? I have been going through some fairly long sections of time during my daily life lately, where I feel as though a lot of the movements and dialogue is basically "a show" or just "playing a/the part". I feel I am expected to act like someone I used to be (especially at work) but inside I am something much different....and rather then go through this whole "dropping the personality thing" I am allowing it to stay as a "front" and am witnessing a different existence then what is portrayed.
Encased in this drama of playing the part, I am also finding that it is difficult not to "read" people, and the parts they are (mostly unconsciously) playing. This adds to the feeling of acting. It's really difficult to describe. It's hard not to "shake the whole thing up"....like choose to stop playing the part, and at the same time "wake" others up to the part they too are playing. I can see this unfolding in my minds eye, and I can always see it as being really uncomfortable for those affected (other then "me"), and this is what stops me from "dropping my part". I feel a little "crazy" during these moments, and it's hard not to laugh (or cry) like a psycho at the ridiculousness of it all.....but if I did I would probably lose my job and get locked in a padded room.
Anyone out there ever had to deal with this?
Love.
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Edited by - CarsonZi on Jan 29 2010 4:23:20 PM |
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Yonatan
Israel
849 Posts |
Posted - Jan 29 2010 : 4:34:46 PM
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Hi Carson,
Yeah I can relate to the feeling. Sometimes I see myself "acting" while also seeing that there's like a potential for a more truthful way of being. But like you at one time I tried to drop it and I think it scared me, the thought "what would he think?". Maybe being more truthful is what scared me. Anyway I intend to take it gradually and smoothly transform. But if there would be a sudden letting go of all the bagage, I'll take that too 
Thanks,
Yonatan |
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Yonatan
Israel
849 Posts |
Posted - Jan 29 2010 : 4:41:52 PM
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| Anyway, what I think is that the thought of what others would think and do, is me being afraid of what I would think and do if I'm more truthful. |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Jan 29 2010 : 5:13:40 PM
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Hey Yonatan
Thanks for adding your perspective here!
For me, I am mostly scared of seeming really "out-there"...
What I have also noticed lately, is that there have been a few occassions where I "lose it", and am not witnessing "the play" anymore and am fully involved in it and have lost my inner silence for a little while. Specifically I am thinking of Tuesday night...I was trying to do too much at once.....cook dinner, figure out some computer software issues I was having, feed the dogs and more, and was a little bit stuck in my head over how busy my entire day had been....had worked all day, had to rush home on my lunch break to get some paperwork, then rush off at the end of the day to attend a home inspection, then home to practice, and I was generally feeling a little sorry for myself and like I had too much on my plate (I probably should have rested longer after my practices). Anyways, I finished making dinner right as my wife came in the door from work, and as I was carrying our plates, full of food, to the table, I dropped mine right upside down on the rug. I lost it. I swore at God, and said "What did I do to deserve that!?!?"....silly I know. I don't even believe in "God". But this was my instinctual reaction. A total loss of awareness. "I" came back (to silence that is) a few minutes later and all was good, but it still happened.
Another (kinda unrelated) observation I have been making recently comes when watching a movie or a TV show.....maintaining full awareness while watching something on TV or whatever is quite an interesting experiment. It almost feels like TV (for the most part) is meant to distract us from the "current moment".....put us in our heads more. Anyways....
Love.
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Edited by - CarsonZi on Jan 29 2010 5:16:04 PM |
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Jan 29 2010 : 5:46:17 PM
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quote:
Encased in this drama of playing the part, I am also finding that it is difficult not to "read" people,
Yes,it becomes really easy to read some people due to spiritual practice.You percieve the role and the game they are playing.Its not very surprising,we life in a predecible society.In our western society we tend to act and think in a really simple way.They (and me) just imitate.The goals are mainly the same:power,sex,money...
These are very superficial labels and easy to percieve with some meditation for some months.In you and in others also.
This is a generalization.There are some unpredictable and "deep" people also.But the superficial people,easy to percieve their intentions and toughts and future reactions.
It can be said that due to practices,you percieve with clarity the false layers and holes of superficial world.You begin to percieve gaps of truth underlying in your normal situations of daily life.You begin to conect with hearth and souls...and they feel something different in you.They like it,but they are afraid also.Many of them.My experience.
quote:
and the parts they are (mostly unconsciously) playing.
I think those are reflect of your ego also.People that ar in your life are reflects of you.They are there cz you want it.So,its not only about them,its about you also.
quote:
This adds to the feeling of acting. It's really difficult to describe.
I understand more or less what youre experiencing.I get the feeling and the idea.
quote:
It's hard not to "shake the whole thing up"....like choose to stop playing the part, and at the same time "wake" others up to the part they too are playing. I can see this unfolding in my minds eye, and I can always see it as being really uncomfortable for those affected (other then "me"), and this is what stops me from "dropping my part". I feel a little "crazy" during these moments, and it's hard not to laugh (or cry) like a psycho at the ridiculousness of it all.....but if I did I would probably lose my job and get locked in a padded room.
Yes,i know about it.
You are doing right.Better under control.I dont recomend you to follow your impulses at 100% (self pacing).I have done in the past and its not a good idea.
Inner silence over long term will make all the work and changes.In you and people around.Im absolutely sure.
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Jan 29 2010 : 5:50:21 PM
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| Throw your tv out of the window.Seriously,its 90% poison. |
Edited by - miguel on Jan 29 2010 5:51:56 PM |
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adamantclearlight
USA
410 Posts |
Posted - Jan 29 2010 : 6:48:53 PM
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I experience this too. It's the most disconcerting of all feelings. This is due to the dissolution of the ego and a symptom of the dark night. The best advice is to keep practicing, recognize that you are going through this and respect others' "roles." People invest all they have into their roles and won't like feeling dissolved around you. When the ego finally dissolves I think one probably doesn't care that people have "roles," and even you old one was pretty cool, because it got you here.
Adamant |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Jan 29 2010 : 7:02:05 PM
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Thanks for conversing Adamant and Miguel
It also occurred to me, that this "acting problem", may be a good reason to take some time in seclusion at a certain point. It would allow you the time to leave, let everyone forget a little about who you were before you left, and make a more seamless transition into Wholeness, for yourself and for others around you. Then "dropping the act" wouldn't be as jarring for everyone, me/you/us included. I think a month meditating in a cave in the Canary Islands would be a great plan at some point
Love.
P.S> adamant...what is "the dark night"? Are you talking "The dark night of the Soul"? |
Edited by - CarsonZi on Jan 29 2010 7:03:29 PM |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Jan 29 2010 : 7:05:52 PM
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Throw your TV out Miguel? I love my TV! You just have to pick very few programs and give other things more priority. There is great education and awesome creativity.
One reason I like it is to learn how to act, as in this thread.
Yes I often feel both me and others are playing a role. That's where acting comes in. Play a role you LIKE to play. And become good at it. Know it's a role, and excel at it. You can drop it anytime from this viewpoint.
Often when I see other people playing roles, I pick a role that compliments theirs. People like it when you do that. Then you can let your role keep pushing toward the edge of craziness and see how they react. It is often fun.
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adamantclearlight
USA
410 Posts |
Posted - Jan 29 2010 : 7:59:11 PM
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Yeah dark night of the soul. It appears to be a reliable milestone on the path. Certainly go to the canary islands. Get yer fishin reel and fish on!
Adamant |
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Clear White Light
USA
229 Posts |
Posted - Jan 29 2010 : 9:11:28 PM
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| Honestly, I've felt like that for nearly my entire life. It can be very difficult sometimes, to keep all your relationships going. I find myself falling away from my "friends" more and more, the deeper my practice becomes. It's like you say about being able to read people. The more you become able to see past your own ego games, the easier they are to detect in others. This brings the selfish nature of most relationships sharply in to focus. It can definitely feel a little "pointless" at time..but I would rather be where I am now, rather than still caught up in it, you know? It's natural to want to detach a little though. I think when it comes to our relationships, this helps us separate the wheat from the chaff, if you will. |
Edited by - Clear White Light on Jan 29 2010 9:24:25 PM |
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christiane
Lebanon
319 Posts |
Posted - Jan 30 2010 : 01:40:59 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by CarsonZi
I think a month meditating in a cave in the Canary Islands would be a great plan at some point
love this one!!
First, thank you everyone for this interesting thread..
Yes, we are all very skilled actors at moments.. and i confirm
that we enjoy it!
From my experience here, it needs to take some distance from people, to create a gap that allows you, later on, to speak out your truth without getting regrettable consequences (like you mentionned, Carson)..
This gap allows people who used to have a certain image of you to feel that, really, my "old" character is not here anymore..
they feel lost at the beginning.. they try to catch this "old" one they used to "manipulate" and relate to before.. they hold on for a moment.. until they realize "it is not here anymore!!"
THEN, they look at you as a brand new individual.. and a miracle can happen, like it did for me yesterday,.. when people - in my case, it was relatives i didn't see for years - drop their masks and simply listen to what you're saying, like children..
TO my great surprise, i was able to talk about every taboo topic they would have resisted, in the past..
and it needs great sensitivity and awareness..
but a moment comes, while talking, when you feel you can strike hard and cut through their illusions and beliefs..
and i did it! and........... cannot tell you the silence that followed!
My grandma, and 2 aunts were puzzled to hear what i said.
it hit something in their heart, deeep inside..
Tons of repressed old things.. and the more i hammered, the more they listened and let go of their resistance..
TO me, this was a miracle.
I talked for 5 hours on a row without feeling any fatigue..
why? coz the ego was not here.. the little "i" was absent..
words were coming through me in a flow.. no mind.. pure intuition and deep listening..and responding..
it was a meditation in itself..and it taught me that really, there is much to learn through inter-acting - without acting! - with people can teach deep things.. in their unawareness, a word from them can hit me inside and it becomes a great wisdom..
i felt so grateful to them..
Like you said Miguel, i felt we all became ONE heart.
All the masks/ego/acting dropped.. only the heart remains..
Amazing!
But all this could happen because there was years of distance between me and those relatives..
also, the energy was high here, and there was clarity and some amount of silence inside..
No emotion/no judging mind..
only listening and responding accordingly..
and this meeting was challenging in every way..
it was about my whole mother's family and background i had to face!
NO need to say it needed great tact and awareness in every single word i said..
So... to me.. no tact! no acting anymore! total nakedness .....BUT
.... deep awareness and responsiveness!
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Jan 30 2010 : 01:55:58 AM
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Acting 'as if' is what we do. We are acting out our AYP part right now. Dropping all pretentions is difficult because that also becomes another act.
One step at a time and have faith. The night is always darkest before the dawn and even an Egg will walk eventually if you give it enough time.
Extracting yourself from the impermanence of it all is difficult. I'm in the same boat. Quit a job for the first time in over 34 years without having another to go to. Had exactly that feeling that somehow I was simply living out an act, the more I got involved the more farcical it became and my mind /heart was no longer in it.
Now I'm in a situation where we have enough savings and my wife has a steady income for now. But what do I do next ? I believe that something will happen when it happens and only then will be the right time.
I feel I'm living 'The Secrets of Wilder'. I don't know the next step and I'm scared that there won't be one. I've hopped off the bus in the middle of nowhere, it's raining and I have enough food for a couple of days.
In a small way it feels I'm driving change, just putting myself out there a tiny bit more than I have ever done. Taking the first tentative steps along an invisible bridge and trusting that it's there. Accepting that to change something I really have to change myself and accept that everything is impermanent anyway.
It's trust or faith or whatever. There's a passage in the bible that says 'be like a child'. I think thats what it is to simply trust and accept without question, without an impervious shield of logic and aldulthood and go with the flow. That way you stop acting out anything and just simply 'are' and 'be' and 'I am that I am' makes more sense.
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cosmic
USA
821 Posts |
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Jan 30 2010 : 09:00:28 AM
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Great experience christiane for you and loved ones.Congrats!
Dont know in other countries,but here most of tv programs are a really bad thing .
Good music band cosmic. |
Edited by - miguel on Jan 30 2010 09:02:02 AM |
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wakeupneo
USA
171 Posts |
Posted - Jan 30 2010 : 11:18:42 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by CarsonZi
Namaste All
Am wondering if any of you out there ever go through phases of feeling like you are "acting your character" but aren't really invested in it anymore? I have been going through some fairly long sections of time during my daily life lately, where I feel as though a lot of the movements and dialogue is basically "a show" or just "playing a/the part". I feel I am expected to act like someone I used to be (especially at work) but inside I am something much different....and rather then go through this whole "dropping the personality thing" I am allowing it to stay as a "front" and am witnessing a different existence then what is portrayed.
Encased in this drama of playing the part, I am also finding that it is difficult not to "read" people, and the parts they are (mostly unconsciously) playing. This adds to the feeling of acting. It's really difficult to describe. It's hard not to "shake the whole thing up"....like choose to stop playing the part, and at the same time "wake" others up to the part they too are playing. I can see this unfolding in my minds eye, and I can always see it as being really uncomfortable for those affected (other then "me"), and this is what stops me from "dropping my part". I feel a little "crazy" during these moments, and it's hard not to laugh (or cry) like a psycho at the ridiculousness of it all.....but if I did I would probably lose my job and get locked in a padded room.
Anyone out there ever had to deal with this?
Love.
Carson,
This seems to be one of the most difficult aspects of the path for me. 'Filling out the forms,' 'playing the game,' sometimes for me it's painful. Listening to the dramas, everyone getting so worked up about their little dream word. Sometimes I sit and stare othertimes I nod and smile, it's very difficult. How to be compassionatte but at the same time not get caught up in the dream?
Unfortunately it seems almost all of our day to day interactions on some level force us in the dream. People tells stories and they want to be validated, they want our opinions. I used to look them in the eye and tell them it's not real, but this didn't go over so smoothly.
For much of the day, I'm identified with pure consciousness, feeling really good, really connected, then I'll have to go to a family party or something and it drains the hell out of me. Next morning I feel so cloudy. The feeling is that of a hang-over and I didn't even drink!
There I times I just want to leave it all and run away, go to some mountain ashram and spend the rest of my life in meditation. However, something compells me to continue playing this game...karma, lack of maturity? Who knows? Perhaps to forgive it and see that my frustration with it is also illusory. Perhaps I need to see and experience the oneness, non-duality.
Ultimately all these perceived questions, answers and situations are also part of the dream as well, as is this reply.
Sorry I couldn't be of any concrete help as I definately have a hard time balancing my spiritual and worldly life as well.
J
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wakeupneo
USA
171 Posts |
Posted - Jan 30 2010 : 11:24:07 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by CarsonZi
Hey Yonatan
Thanks for adding your perspective here!
For me, I am mostly scared of seeming really "out-there"...
What I have also noticed lately, is that there have been a few occassions where I "lose it", and am not witnessing "the play" anymore and am fully involved in it and have lost my inner silence for a little while. Specifically I am thinking of Tuesday night...I was trying to do too much at once.....cook dinner, figure out some computer software issues I was having, feed the dogs and more, and was a little bit stuck in my head over how busy my entire day had been....had worked all day, had to rush home on my lunch break to get some paperwork, then rush off at the end of the day to attend a home inspection, then home to practice, and I was generally feeling a little sorry for myself and like I had too much on my plate (I probably should have rested longer after my practices). Anyways, I finished making dinner right as my wife came in the door from work, and as I was carrying our plates, full of food, to the table, I dropped mine right upside down on the rug. I lost it. I swore at God, and said "What did I do to deserve that!?!?"....silly I know. I don't even believe in "God". But this was my instinctual reaction. A total loss of awareness. "I" came back (to silence that is) a few minutes later and all was good, but it still happened.
Another (kinda unrelated) observation I have been making recently comes when watching a movie or a TV show.....maintaining full awareness while watching something on TV or whatever is quite an interesting experiment. It almost feels like TV (for the most part) is meant to distract us from the "current moment".....put us in our heads more. Anyways....
Love.
One more thing... I recommend you have someone facilitate 'the work' on you. Ultimately these are all just thoughts we react to. Thoughts about how things should or shouldn't be. Reality is perfect as it is. We are reacting to our mind, not to reality. For me it's often the ego, playing the poor me game, or wearing the cloak of the 'spiritually superior' person. Do the work on these things. This has helped me in the past.
J |
Edited by - wakeupneo on Jan 30 2010 11:34:48 AM |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Jan 31 2010 : 02:18:29 AM
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To me, somewhere, it doesn't matter if we are awake or not. It's not BETTER to be awake from a Consciousness perspective. Being lost in illusion and mind and believing we are the personal roles IS the play consciousness plays with itself. No harm done - it's evolution. How would consciousness grow if we didn't rub ourselves in oblivion and suffering? It's the design of the play. Consciousness learns from experience. It's when we are tired of experience that we are willing to let go of our roles and find our true origin.
And then it may become obvious that there are no personal selves at all. Starting to see the gameplaying (as it happens here as well) is not about "me" being more awake than the others. As long as there's "me, my awakening and other's sleeping" one is not awake - then there's still separation somehow. It's all consciousness playing with itself.
I must repeat a superb metaphore that someone wrote in this forum a long time ago:
It's like it's all a movie, and we play our parts. However, if you think of a movie, it would be impossible for one character to suddenly jump out of the film and say "Oh, I'm alive, I'm not this character in this movie!" and leave the film. It's impossible, no? The character is not real, it does not exist as anything else than some light on a screen, moving according a script. The film just goes on - all stories and characters glued together as the phenomenon "film". The character cannot wake up in, of and by itself within the film. Waking up is rather about leaving the film all together. Seeing that I am the whole film, the play of light, the screen - the still background enabling the film to be seen, the projector/creator, and the room/space where the film is played. Then I am not a character in the film anylonger who can be aware or unaware. Impossible. I see there's not even a separate character that has been "me".
(And yet there is, cause we cannot help playing the personal part in the movie while we're here in a body. That's the mystery.) |
Edited by - emc on Jan 31 2010 04:35:30 AM |
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adamantclearlight
USA
410 Posts |
Posted - Jan 31 2010 : 08:56:45 AM
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Hi emc, Can't say suffering's any fun; only reason to suffer is if you're confused and don't know how to end it.
Adamant |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Jan 31 2010 : 3:05:10 PM
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| Who mentioned "fun"? What you say is true. And all that confusion and suffering and don't knowing how to end it - IS consciousness playing. Life is both light and shadow. |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Feb 01 2010 : 1:38:59 PM
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Namaste Everyone and thanks for all the great conversation....
Sorry I haven't been as involved in writing on the forum (even in my own topics) lately....my wife and I bought a house recently and between renovation plans, preparing for the baby to arrive at the end of May/beginning of June, the yoga classes I recently started teaching and everyday life, time on the forum has been very limited lately. Either way, I really appreciate all the great input here!
@ClearWhiteLight:
quote:
The more you become able to see past your own ego games, the easier they are to detect in others. This brings the selfish nature of most relationships sharply in to focus. It can definitely feel a little "pointless" at time..but I would rather be where I am now, rather than still caught up in it, you know? It's natural to want to detach a little though. I think when it comes to our relationships, this helps us separate the wheat from the chaff, if you will.
I can really identify with the feeling of many of my relationships, and the conversation/acting that occurs in these, as being "pointless". I have lost all desire for "small talk", and when required to engage in it, I find myself totally "acting". Feining desire to (continue to) engage in the conversation.
@karl: quote:
Acting 'as if' is what we do. We are acting out our AYP part right now. Dropping all pretentions is difficult because that also becomes another act.
Perhaps...but in general I don't feel this way anymore. I feel that, when I am alone or am around just my wife or other specific "spiritual friends", there is no acting, I am what I truly am.....silent awareness. And I don't feel the need to "act" while participating at the forum either. But the idea of dropping all pretentions being another act I am still inquiring into......and I'm sure it CAN be....but is it always? At this point I feel that if you are still "acting" when having dropped all pretentions, then you are lying to yourself about having dropped all pretentions. I'm sure it is possible to be "silent awareness" in regular life, but is it possible without creating anxiety and confusion in others who know nothing of their true nature? This is where the "acting" comes in for me.
@wakeupneo: quote:
This seems to be one of the most difficult aspects of the path for me. 'Filling out the forms,' 'playing the game,' sometimes for me it's painful.
Yes, I feel this here too....it's like I am not being truthful to my nature, to my Self. This is why I said it can be difficult not to burst into maniacal laughter or spontaneous tears over the ridiculousness of "the play", "the game", "the acting the part".....it can be painful to pretend to be something you know you are not.
quote:
How to be compassionatte but at the same time not get caught up in the dream?
Ah....yes....I often feel this too. This is what I meant when I said that sometimes it is hard not to want to "shake things up".....snap people out of the drama they're are engaged in. I seem to attract people who need to "unload" their dramas on me....I am a good listener I guess, and people may take advantage of me in this way. I have people in all areas of my life who seem to feel the need to unload all their baggage onto me. I don't accept the baggage, but I am willing to listen. But it is often hard not to say "HEY! Wake up! You are choosing to suffer over this! None of this is REAL!".....but I know this won't be helpful for most....it will just discourage them, and make them feel angry with me, so I don't do it (often).
quote:
I recommend you have someone facilitate 'the work' on you.
Thanks Bro....I've been doing The Work regularly for getting close to a year and a half already...no facilitator necessary
@emc: quote:
It's when we are tired of experience that we are willing to let go of our roles and find our true origin.
Yes, I agree with much of what you have said....and I have found that personally, I am a little tired of "playing the game"....I Know my true nature, but BEING that true nature out in the world, for all to see, can be difficult (especially when around those who knew you before you came to intimately know your True Nature). This is why I feel like I am acting and am finding it difficult to get away from this feeling of acting; because I know my True Nature as pure silent awareness, "I" am this silent awareness, yet to radiate that out to others as fully as I feel it makes others uncomfortable and can add to their feelings of seperation, not dissolve them.
Thanks for all the great discussion everyone!
Love.
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Edited by - CarsonZi on Feb 01 2010 1:42:57 PM |
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Feb 02 2010 : 06:10:28 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by CarsonZi
Perhaps...but in general I don't feel this way anymore. I feel that, when I am alone or am around just my wife or other specific "spiritual friends", there is no acting, I am what I truly am.....silent awareness. And I don't feel the need to "act" while participating at the forum either. But the idea of dropping all pretentions being another act I am still inquiring into......and I'm sure it CAN be....but is it always? At this point I feel that if you are still "acting" when having dropped all pretentions, then you are lying to yourself about having dropped all pretentions. I'm sure it is possible to be "silent awareness" in regular life, but is it possible without creating anxiety and confusion in others who know nothing of their true nature? This is where the "acting" comes in for me.
I want to be of help to you here. I can see the path and the distractions and it seems my words don't seem to have the capacity to describe it. I will try within the boundaries of my rudimentary understanding and finite capacity.
It cannot be 'silent awareness' in everyday life because that means identifying with the illusion. The anxiety and confusion can only be in your own mind which means you have not accepted your own true nature, yet. It's a delusion really, like watching a movie and indentifying with the person who has become aware, a step in the right direction but still identification. Refuse and deny each character.......'I am not the one who is awareness, I am not the one who knows I am acting'. Awareness cannot know itself, it is just awareness.
This does not mean that I am 'there' by any stretch of the imagination. I just have an inkling of what it is not and I know that I'm kidding myself if I think anything is real. I suppose that is what they call neti neti, burning away the illusion until nothing remains.
It's been written a million times by those far more adept than me so it's difficult to add anything new or, to believe that it will be a better instruction, however it does give me a better understanding of my own internal order
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The Feeling of "Acting"
