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mystic_robert
USA
7 Posts |
 Posted - Nov 15 2009 : 10:28:34 AM
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| If so, how did you get it? I seek it, because I'm worried about what I will experience when I die. |
Edited by - AYPforum on Nov 15 2009 12:43:22 PM |
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AYPforum
351 Posts |
Posted - Nov 15 2009 : 12:43:22 PM
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| Moderator note: Topic moved for better placement |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Nov 15 2009 : 3:57:03 PM
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Yes. Through bhakti and meditation. Deep meditation leads to finding inner silence. Inner silence leads to finding the guru within. The guru within connects you to God.
you can learn how in the lessons, or get the "Deep Meditation" book or "Advanced Yoga Practices" book. You won't find claims of contacting God in these books, but that's what it's about. The experience is different for everyone, so reading about other people's experience won't necessarily help you.
The ironic thing is if you practice meditation twice a day as taught, you will lose your fear of death long before you have contact with God. This is because you will feel a connection with God long before your brain will accept what it is. |
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Kirtanman
USA
1651 Posts |
Posted - Nov 15 2009 : 7:24:02 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by mystic_robert
If so, how did you get it? I seek it, because I'm worried about what I will experience when I die.
Hi Mystic Robert,
Yes, as Etherfish wrote, deep meditation is the key.
Fear of death is a symptom of being lost in the dream of partiality.
Meditation is the cure.
You may want to just start reading at the beginning of the AYP Main Lessons, and find the starting point that feels right for you.
At least a few of us who have practiced AYP had fear of death, and/or certain other psychological symptoms and stresses when we started, and we don't have them now.
And it's not an instant cure-all; lifelong fears probably won't vanish in a week or two.
However, fairly quickly, a lot of stress and mental fear will start to dissipate, and at a certain point ... all fears dissipate, because they're seen to be based in illusion.
I hope this is helpful.
Wholeheartedly,
Kirtanman
PS- And yes, I've had direct contact with God, though in a different sense that some people might imagine the experience to be like .... but as far as full immersion in and awareness of all reality ... yes, I have. And again: meditation is the way to contact God (as the Bible says: "Be still, and know I AM God").
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Edited by - Kirtanman on Nov 15 2009 7:27:07 PM |
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - Nov 15 2009 : 10:24:05 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by mystic_robert
If so, how did you get it? I seek it, because I'm worried about what I will experience when I die.
Hi Mystic Robert,
Don't seek God because the seeking will stand in the way.
Realize that God is looking through your very eyes at this very moment. That part of you that never changes, that feeling of you that was there when you were a child, that same feeling that you have right now that never changes despite the circumstance, right in front of your face (literally), that is God.
God is everywhere, you can't escape it. God is in the outer world and in the silence from which the outer world is born.
If you make an effort to realize God, God will appear to you in your chosen Ishta (what you believe God to be, whether it be a religious person or symbol or chosen ideal).
There are many ways to make an effort to realize God, some as simple as raising your hand, or performing a simple chore while focusing on God. The important thing is to have the intent of realizing God and then put your energy into some kind of action, practice or endeavor. If you don't have enough control of your attention to sustain your intention of contacting God, then you will have to train your attention through some form of meditative/concentrative practice. Either that or send God some Love, as God always sends Love back to someone who Loves God.
And I know I can tell you this, but you have to experience it for yourself, and even then it is hard to believe.. but.. there is a part of us that doesn't die. That part has had countless lives and will continue to do so. So, you are really an old hat at dying and being born so there is nothing to be afraid of, unless you're worried about coming back as a bullfrog!
:)
TI
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Edited by - Tibetan_Ice on Nov 15 2009 10:43:52 PM |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Nov 16 2009 : 07:37:43 AM
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Kirtanman wrote:
And yes, I've had direct contact with God, though in a different sense that some people might imagine the experience to be like...
Me too, and I expect it is different for everyone.
God has never stood before me and said "I am God. What is your wish?" Ha ha. I usually experience one aspect of him at a time because he is too vast to perceive all at once. (for me anyway.)
And rather than answering my questions in a deep Godlike voice, he waits a few hours or a day, and shows me the answer by putting me in a situation where the answer is demonstrated in reality. At first this seems to be a coincidence. But when it happened over and over I realized that's how God answers my questions.
Same thing with other aspects of God. I see a little bit at a time, but not enough to scare the crap out of me.
The awesome thing is I realize even the way he presents himself is perfect for me. If i asked to see God, and he were to present too big an image at one time, too much of himself, it could easily cause mental illness. But because of meditation he manifests in benevolent ways.
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Edited by - Etherfish on Nov 16 2009 07:46:38 AM |
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wigswest
USA
115 Posts |
Posted - Nov 17 2009 : 10:34:22 PM
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Mystic Robert, good for you for facing this; most people are so afraid of this subject they shove it to the back of their minds whenever it surfaces. Thinking about our own deaths can be tremendously rewarding for us in the present, in so many respects.
I'm going to wander off of the reservation here (as usual ;) and recommend a book by an author I respect tremendously: "Sane and Sacred Death" by Louise Ireland-Frey ( http://www.amazon.com/Sane-Sacred-D...14833&sr=8-1 ); and of course you might want to read anything by Raymond Moody.
Near-death and after-death experience is becoming more and more well-chronicled all the time, and the overwhelming consensus in all of the documentation is how all-encompassing and personal Love is. Even those who end up in the "dark realms" on the other side, always have the offer of love and light extended to them, whether they can perceive it or not.
I have a couple of acquaintances who have been through the near-death experience; it's not a fantasy :)
Namaste, my friend, have courage in your seeking :)
Gayle |
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mikkiji
USA
219 Posts |
Posted - Nov 18 2009 : 9:39:49 PM
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My first direct experience of god was at the age of 13, in a near-death experience (NDE). Yes, they ARE real, and yes, the content of the experience is totally infused with directly contacting the Divine. I had no idea what was going on as I was in that coma for 3 days, but I was alert, joyous, peaceful, and felt that everything was right and correct and perfect in the white light that inhabited the spaceless space I was in for that timeless time. When I awoke, I carried the feelings of joy and peace with me for the rest of my life--It just took me many years until I totally figured out what it all meant and how to make it totally a permanent part of my Self. 40 years of meditation, darshan with my guru (the late Maharishi Mahesh Yogi) and other practices, techniques and experiences have deepened and clarified my contact with the Divine until, now, she is with me, in me, IS me 24/7...
Michael |
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alwayson2
USA
546 Posts |
Posted - Nov 19 2009 : 10:58:15 AM
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Someone who I respect says that you are God ALREADY.
So if you want a direct contact with God, get up and look in a mirror.
YOU are God. |
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chinna
United Kingdom
241 Posts |
Posted - Nov 19 2009 : 4:29:08 PM
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Hi Mystic Robert
In what way do you imagine that you are not in direct contact with God? How could you possibly not be in direct contact with God?
'Not being in direct contact with God' is imaginary.
Explore, as a matter of present experience, that which is unchanging, before 'birth' and during 'life', and then you will know what has always been, and always will be, and the answer to your question of what comes after 'death'.
chinna
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gumpi
United Kingdom
546 Posts |
Posted - Nov 19 2009 : 5:37:02 PM
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| Nobody knows God. Do not listen to persons that say they do, or say you are God or they are God. That is just lies and delusion. |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Nov 19 2009 : 7:21:11 PM
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| All you can say is what is true for you. You have no way of knowing what is true for other people. |
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chinna
United Kingdom
241 Posts |
Posted - Nov 20 2009 : 07:06:28 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by gumpi
Nobody knows God. Do not listen to persons that say they do, or say you are God or they are God. That is just lies and delusion.
Dear Gumpi
Nobody knows themselves until they know 'God'. The end of your quest is to realise that knowing self and knowing God are one and the same thing.
This is not an esoteric eastern delusion. It is what all religions point to, including the christian doctrines of Incarnation and Trinity. A Victorian Carthusian monk, the most conservative of Catholic orders, and a hermit who had noone to impress, wrote to one of his novices "Find God, or find yourself, it amounts to the same thing."
What we say about God, authentically, reveals our level of insight into the nature of the divine, of Reality, and our level of self-realisation.
But don't be fooled, those who say that God doesn't exist, those who refuse to name God, and those who worship God, have often realised exactly the same 'thing'.
You are infinitely more wondrous, and wonderfully more infinite, more complete, more whole, than you are yet able to realise.
chinna |
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YogaIsLife
641 Posts |
Posted - Nov 20 2009 : 07:28:48 AM
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Oh yes, definitely!
It is right here, right now, as I type this words. In between every gap, in the middle of every little or big sensation, all-pervading, ever-lasting.
You can feel it too, if you let it. Notice the gap. Forget about things. Notice the unmanifest in the manifest. Right now. Don't worry abouyt the "future" or "your death". It is all happening now. Here. Exactly where you sit. Stop and realise.
Yoga definitely helps. But it is much more intimate than any method.
All the best! |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Nov 20 2009 : 07:47:37 AM
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Very well written Chinna.
(hi Yoga is life we cross posted!)
I wrote above that all you can know is what is true for you, and there is no way to know what is true for other people. The conventional way of dealing with this problem is to tell people to prove something before you believe it.
We know from the study of logic, that it is impossible to prove anything. However, in most everyday things, one can come close enough for most people (a line from a popular movie is "Show me the money!").
However, the problem arises when dealing with intangible things like spirituality. For instance, how can a happy person show a sad person what happiness is? How can a sane person show a crazy person what sanity is? They can't.
So the only answer is called "modelling".
If you wish to change something about yourself, you find someone who has already done it, and follow the same path they did.
This is where there has to be a "leap of faith".
Most poor people believe that it is impossible for them to ever not be poor. as long as they hold this belief, it is true for them.
So to actually make changes in yourself two things are necessary. First you must try to belive it is possible. it doesn't matter if you don't believe at first. What is important is to continue trying. The second thing that is necessary is to follow exactly the same path as those who have made the change. If you throw out certain parts of the path you are likely to never achieve your goal. The reason is, that the part of your mind throwing parts out has not made the transformation yet that is caused by the correct path.
Especially with spirituality, it is necessary to put your energy into your faith, and consistently follow the path that others have followed.
If you constantly ask for proof, or fall off the path all the time, you are following a part of your mind that wants you to fail. That skeptical part of your mind wants to say "See, I told you this path is made of lies!"
But the fault will be from constantly leaving the path, not because it is a false one.
The person who is always trying to prove what path is the "right" one will end up staying home, and never getting anywhere. Most big decisions in life can not be made from a theoretical analysis.
You have to dive in and test the water and make your own decisions, based upon your own observations, over time. |
Edited by - Etherfish on Nov 20 2009 07:48:52 AM |
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atena
113 Posts |
Posted - Nov 20 2009 : 12:04:54 PM
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Being a faithful follower doesn't always work, so it is possible to experiment to find what does, and how 
Even then some faith, or plain curiosity is still required to the fact that there might be something worth discovering.
... but I can't say I've never had contact with god, nor am sure do I believe such thing exists. |
Edited by - atena on Nov 20 2009 1:04:24 PM |
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Nov 20 2009 : 2:52:25 PM
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I don't know what God is. I do know that between each beat of the drum, the space between the lines on a painting are one and the same.
When working with clients I always thank them for helping me sort that little bit of myself that is represented as 'their' problem. Somewhere in those two realisations is a deeper understanding within me that something exists which is greater than me, but of which I am a part. That leads to a greater truth because it indicates that God must have a character.
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Nov 20 2009 : 5:49:50 PM
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My contact with God doesn't match up with any of the descriptions different religions describe!
What I mean by faith is necessary is bhakti. Without it you won't make much progress.
That investigating something greater than yourself is the key. You don't need to believe it to find it. You just need high aspirations. You can even be an atheist with high aspirations, and what you find you may not even call God!
But what is to be found is incredible and mind-boggling!
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alwayson2
USA
546 Posts |
Posted - Nov 20 2009 : 7:23:22 PM
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Since all the universe is pervaded by God, you must also be God.
You are ALREADY unified with God.
Any distance is self imposed |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Nov 21 2009 : 10:04:04 AM
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That concept may be true, but it doesn't help those who have not found God. Since the universe is God, then God is pain, suffering, drug abuse, enslavement, inveiglement, greed, hopelessness, despair, depression. This is the whole world to many people.
These people need small highly visible steps and small promises. They have been deceived by so many for so long that distrust is their best friend. |
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mikkiji
USA
219 Posts |
Posted - Nov 21 2009 : 10:31:42 AM
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While it IS undeniably correct to say that we already ARE or KNOW god, that the divine IS us (how could it be otherwise?), by the time we pass through puberty, most of us have forgotten that fact--we have lost the natural ability to directly experience the Divine. We loose it to logic, convention, distraction and the demands of becoming. In our Becoming, we loose our Being. In the noise, we forget the silence. Remembering how to find your own self again in adulthood can be a long, difficult and frustrating process. Finding god is nothing difficult or complicated, it is not about doing but about stopping. God is not in the waves (although she is there too), she is in the silent depths of the ocean. They don't call the search for god "Self-Realization" for nothing--it is not searching for anything outside of your self!
So, yes--we have nowhere to look, no place to go, nothing to do. We just stop all looking, going and doing--OH!! There is god...! Why was that so difficult...?
Michael |
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YogaIsLife
641 Posts |
Posted - Nov 21 2009 : 10:48:56 AM
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| Oh Michael...So beautiful and oh so true! |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Nov 21 2009 : 12:29:20 PM
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But it can be difficult. The most difficult things some people have ever done. People fight with themselves and it's a hard fight. Telling them they are wasting their energy doesn't help them. Telling them all they have to do is stop doesn't help. Telling them they already have everything doesn't help. People can't see any of that until the fight is over. Whether the fight is necessary or not is a moot point.
So deep meditation twice a day is what they need. Stories of contact with God or being God are just a form of mental masturbation. You can spend time reading them for fun, but until you experience it meditation is the only worthwhile practice. And then once you experience it, the stories are pretty worthless too!
Gurus tell us everything is illusion, but does that help one person who is suffering? |
Edited by - Etherfish on Nov 21 2009 12:32:07 PM |
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alwayson2
USA
546 Posts |
Posted - Nov 21 2009 : 4:02:24 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Etherfish
That concept may be true, but it doesn't help those who have not found God. Since the universe is God, then God is pain, suffering, drug abuse, enslavement, inveiglement, greed, hopelessness, despair, depression. This is the whole world to many people.
If:
A)God is perfect
B)You must literally BE God already...for God to know you perfectly, he has to be you.
Point with your finger to where God is not. Its impossible.
Yes God is both good and bad. That is sort of the whole point.
It is a mistake to think that God is all good. God is totality. |
Edited by - alwayson2 on Nov 21 2009 4:09:53 PM |
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alwayson2
USA
546 Posts |
Posted - Nov 21 2009 : 4:11:30 PM
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Yet another way to think about it is to realize that God is LITERALLY a thoughtform in the mind just like other people are.
So it you realize the nature of the mind, nondualism style, you realize God. |
Edited by - alwayson2 on Nov 21 2009 4:31:37 PM |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Nov 21 2009 : 8:23:24 PM
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| I have never heard of anyone contacting God by philosophising or thinking about God. |
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Have you had direct contact with God?
