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AnEternalNow
Singapore
9 Posts |
 Posted - Sep 08 2009 : 01:16:56 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Katrine
Hi AnEternalNow
..just been watching the video.....thank you so much...
This guy......I am really, really touched by him....
Like:
.....to be tenderly ok with whatever is appearing inside of you
and that little word..."tenderly"......it is such a key....yet the openness required in order for the compassion to pull the mind into itself.....the openness required is non-ending.....so the pain inside.....the piercing that has been here so many times around.....it is in it that I am.....
May I never become distracted again when in pain....
I cry a lot these days.....not for long periods of time....but often.
And...in this dying to...some kind of protection....it is as you say...it is the sound itself that hears. It is the crying that cries..
quote:
This means instead of dissociating, one experiences that there is no one experiencing those experiences -- rather all appearances are simply the dynamic manifestations of Consciousness itself, and there is totally no distance -- no distance between you and the scenery, you and the pain, you and the sound -- there is no subject object divisions, just Suchness of the music, the sensation, the scene. No seer, scenery sees. No hearer, sound hears. Consciousness is not a behind Witness, rather it is manifestation AS all appearances. There is no attempt to sink back to a background space, a center, a witness, because it is realised the non-dual witnessing is simply Wholeness and Totality itself, awareness is pervading and is not other than the universe. Since everything is equally Awareness, there is no choosing, there is no dissociating from anything to abide in a purest state, for what manifests is already IT, all manifestation is the Source.
Your word is a true gift here......the seeing of the shine in objects and in space have been consistent for a while....but the seeing of the shine in the pain and in the thought, in the crying and in the sensitivity....this is so much more subtle....and I have not...tasted it.....not truly seen it....until now. The emptiness within pain.....the space within the vulnerability....
I am very grateful....
Beautiful experience/insight.... thanks for sharing :) |
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AnEternalNow
Singapore
9 Posts |
Posted - Sep 08 2009 : 01:27:40 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by alwayson2
quote:
Originally posted by AnEternalNow
I have also conversed with alwayson over a year ago in another forum.
Oh that was you!
I don't believe in any stages anymore. I don't think I did back then either, except you were so insistent on fitting stuff to Thusness's model... if you remember.
Thusness's stages are invalid, IMO
Those stages don't apply for everyone in the same way (though it does for some). Some may skip some stages. That is why Thusness started the page with a note "The stages are nothing authentic" -- it is just his personal experiences. Even in Dzogchen, 1-2 is usually one's introductory experience to pure awareness, Stage 3 is skipped (stage 3 is emphasized in Taoism but not in Buddhism or Dzogchen), usually one comes to Stage 4 but as its teachings and view is really good it's able to combine Stage 5-6 as one, as an Always Is, as spontaneous perfection (Stage 7). Some people may skip Stage 1-2, depending.
Also, it is not to be seen as linear stages, but as different insights. They are all crucial and important insights that one must come upon to make the path complete... just that it should not be mistaken as linear, and it is not that one stage is inferior than the other -- it's just different insights.
I have addressed this in http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot....-linear.html (Are the insight stages strictly linear?) and http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot....insight.html (Recognising the Different Phases of Insights) |
Edited by - AnEternalNow on Sep 08 2009 01:42:32 AM |
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AnEternalNow
Singapore
9 Posts |
Posted - Sep 08 2009 : 01:39:09 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Christi
Hi Aneternalnow,
Beautiful post... thanks for sharing.
quote:
Even though this is an important insight and paves the way to the unfolding of various insights of our nature, however as Vishrant said, this is only the first day in kindergarten, that glimpse alone is far from the end of the journey. However, practicing AWA repeatedly many hours a day alone will not lead to a deeper realisation of non-duality. Practicing AWA for prolonged periods everyday will lead to the ability to remain in absorption in pure consciousness, until one is able to sustain this absorption in our life and be able to enter into total samadhi at a moment's will (not all so called "enlightened persons" are able to achieve this, I believe people like Michael Langford or Ramana Maharshi are clearly there since they are known to be able to enter absorptions for prolonged periods at will. In other words having more insights does not equate to strength of absorption, but the strength of absorption does not necessarily mean the depth of insight)
This reminds me of something that the Buddha once said. It went something like this:
"For enlightenment, it is important to be able to enter samadhi at will and to be able to move in one's consciousness through all the levels of absorption from the lowest to the highest and from the highest to the lowest, so that one can then realize, that is not it either." 
The practice that Vishrant teaches is, as you say, a very good practice for moving from the Witness stage to Oneness. Does he also teach practices to help people come to the realization of the Witness stage, and if so, which ones?
Christi
Yes, in Buddhism we recognize that there are those who mastered insight but not absorptions, those who mastered absorption but not insights, or those who mastered both. Buddha is clearly one who has mastered both. Entering absorptions is able to help to some extent clearing subtle identifications especially with the formless realms. However, it cannot by itself lead to enlightenment, that would be the field of Vipassana (insight meditation) and not Shamatha (meditation that leads to absorption)
Though my friend Thusness who is in my opinion a master of insights, he has admitted that he does not have Ramana's "strength of absorption" (though he does enter deep absorption in meditation, body fades away immediately as he sits).
I'm not really sure about Vishrant, I believe his emphasis is on the Oneness experience. I just chanced upon his video on youtube, I believe. |
Edited by - AnEternalNow on Sep 08 2009 01:45:11 AM |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
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AnEternalNow
Singapore
9 Posts |
Posted - Sep 08 2009 : 02:21:25 AM
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| Nice articles there, thanks Ananda! :) |
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alwayson2
USA
546 Posts |
Posted - Sep 08 2009 : 2:23:50 PM
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AnEternalNow,
I think there is only one insight to make.
That time, yourself, other people exist in your mind as highly flawed thoughtform packets/bundles. For example, go look at clock right now. It is just an object with two pieces of metal pointing at two different spots on a dial. There is no such thing as time.
Therefore, simply abide in the present moment (which does not really exist), letting everything inside your body (thoughts and emotions) and outside your body simply self-liberate. Let everything be. By the way, this doesn't mean you can't think and use your mind.
From a practical point of view, to first get to this state, you need to actively center yourself in the present moment VERY strongly. Once you do this, the rest magically happens without doing anything. AFTER that point you can use your mind for anything, even thinking about past and future. But it will be different. |
Edited by - alwayson2 on Sep 08 2009 3:01:40 PM |
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cosmic
USA
821 Posts |
Posted - Sep 08 2009 : 11:03:37 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by alwayson2
For example, go look at clock right now. It is just an object with two pieces of metal pointing at two different spots on a dial.
There is not even that... |
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alwayson2
USA
546 Posts |
Posted - Sep 09 2009 : 4:37:41 PM
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Exactly so.
By the way, I am not representing Buddhism with my statements.
But the Dalai Lama has said a high level understanding is simply understanding that there is a discrepancy between how phenomenon appear and how phenomenon really are. And when he says "appear" he is not talking visually of course.
P.S. Note here, interestingly the Dalai Lama talks about the thought "I", Michael Langford style (if you read Langford's book):
http://www.katinkahesselink.net/tibet/dalai2.html |
Edited by - alwayson2 on Sep 09 2009 5:20:49 PM |
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ThisIsTruth
41 Posts |
Posted - Sep 12 2009 : 4:12:43 PM
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Yes, this is truth - there are more techniques to look into you.
All they are called pratiahara.
"This is the question - to be or not to be?"
To be is pure existing/beeing. Not to be is the illusion caused by thoughts, when we aren't now but in "the time mashine" of the mind.
I can exist only now. When I am into the my existing/beeing, I am
into sensations, not into thoughts. Each thought often make successfull attempt to hide sensation from me. By this way I am not at the now, but in the "time mashine".
I again remember the words:
"Look into you, because the soul is the key to the Universe and if you can't see into you - you can't see nothing out of you.
And when into you wake up the Fire Snake that hiss and twist himself like a propeller - keep yourself from the Snake biting. Catch the Snake by the head and look her exactly into the eyes. The Snake will fall asleep and when she wake up again - she will be submissive to you."
Yes, this is truth - there are more techniques to look into you.
Yes, this is truth - that the suitable thoughts processing guide as to the sensations ((to the Snake)to the now).
The Unconditioned Love In You.
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Edited by - ThisIsTruth on Sep 12 2009 4:33:01 PM |
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Sep 12 2009 : 4:48:28 PM
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This is truth,this lyrics from the doors came to mind after reading your message:
"Ride the snake, ride the snake
To the lake, the ancient lake, baby
The snake is long, seven miles
Ride the snake...hes old, and his skin is cold"
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
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ThisIsTruth
41 Posts |
Posted - Sep 13 2009 : 10:46:05 AM
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miguel
Ha ha
Just 7 miles  |
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Sep 13 2009 : 12:44:34 PM
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alwayson2
USA
546 Posts |
Posted - Sep 17 2009 : 4:17:33 PM
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When Advaita, Bhagavad Gita, Dzogchen talks about "my" and "mine" and how they are delusions, I believe I know how that works.
"My" and "Mine" are literally thoughts. Realizing this, how can the human mind own anything? |
Edited by - alwayson2 on Sep 17 2009 4:21:36 PM |
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jonesboy
USA
594 Posts |
Posted - Apr 08 2014 : 12:28:40 PM
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| Any long term reviews? |
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riju
India
193 Posts |
Posted - Apr 15 2014 : 11:42:11 PM
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There are 32 planes of AWARENES. We live in 5th plane.
In meditation we can move to any higher plane.
This movement upward happens in quantum jumps and invariably we come down to
5th plane when we deal activily in surroundings with other life.
One can develop AWARENESS watching AWARENESS from a few higher up planes.
AWARENESS is ABSOLUTE GOD who has dissolved in all life. In Awareness we
are connected to this cosmic energy.
I have written a lot on AWARENESS in my two threads on this forum in the name of
Riju.The names of the thread are "Guatam Buddha vs yoga" and "Inflows and outflows"
I intend to write on these threads further on AWARENESS as per LOTUS SUTRA of
Guatam Buddha.
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riju
India
193 Posts |
Posted - May 07 2014 : 06:38:41 AM
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Glimpses of Awareness watching awareness is a high stage of achievement for any one in meditation.
But after this the path bifurcates in two distinct different directions.
One path leads to bliss, powers and in the end to Arhatship.
Second path leads to CREATOR. The CREATORS take active part in designing future UNIVERSE SYSTEMS.
For further understanding please join our discussions on two threads named "Guatam Buddha vs. yoga" and "INFLOWS AND OUTFLOWS".
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - May 07 2014 : 08:09:31 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by riju
Glimpses of Awareness watching awareness is a high stage of achievement for any one in meditation.
But after this the path bifurcates in two distinct different directions.
One path leads to bliss, powers and in the end to Arhatship.
Second path leads to CREATOR. The CREATORS take active part in designing future UNIVERSE SYSTEMS.
For further understanding please join our discussions on two threads named "Guatam Buddha vs. yoga" and "INFLOWS AND OUTFLOWS".
These two paths are more often known as the path of the Taoist "immortal" and the path of the Buddha/Christ. Overcoming the difference between the two is why Buddha created the "vow". |
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kami
USA
921 Posts |
Posted - May 07 2014 : 10:57:24 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by jonesboy
Any long term reviews?
Hi Jonesboy,
Sharing how things progress from the AYP perspective, which might be helpful to others on the AYP path.
1. Meditation practice remains "separate" from life and the practice is about getting it right. We may have a zillion questions of whether it is being done right, where the attention should be, etc.
2. The practice settles on its own, and there are periods of time during sessions where there is a sense of being "gone". We return again and again to the practice. It may seem that we are refining the practice, but actually the practice is refining us.
3. The sense of returning to the mantra begins to creep into daily activities, with periods of time where we become "one" with the task with no discursive thoughts. But the discursive thoughts return due to conditioning.
4. With the cultivation of the witness, there is a sense of being watched, or watching oneself. This gradually extends to all daily activities and to the dream/deep sleep state.
5. At some point, there is a turning back of the witness upon itself. From watching thoughts, actions and events, there is a 180-degree turn where the witness begins to "look" at itself. This is the "awareness watching awareness" that is being talked about. In my experience, forcing this "practice" is less useful than when it happens spontaneously as the result of practices.
6. Either coinciding with #5 or thereafter, there is a subtle shift of identity. While previously we identified with the thought of being the conglomeration of body/mind/thoughts/emotions, we now see we are not those things, and our real identity is this awareness - I AM. The body, mind, thoughts, emotions are seen clearly to arise in this spacious awareness and dissolve into it.
7. Resting now in practice and daily life as I AM, it is then seen that everything that arises within (internally as thoughts, emotions, etc) and without (externally as interactions, others, events, the world, etc) are inherently empty. This, in Buddhism is called two-fold emptiness. Inherently empty means there is no labeling, no characteristic that any phenomenon is attached to. All of that is added by the mind. The seeing of emptiness begins a new phase on the journey - of absolute joy and bliss. Energy previously leaking in labeling and creating is freed to express and explodes in various ways.
8. Further, it is seen that the body, mind, etc arise from awareness as awareness. In this arising, there is no "other". It is ONE. This is Advaita or nondual reality. All are directly seen as waves of the ocean. All arisings "self-liberate" (another Buddhist term) when resting as awareness.
9. Continued exploration of awareness or the I Am demonstrates that even the "I AM" is an ad hoc addition to pristine awareness. First we see that in fact, there is no "I", just "Am-ness" and then that even this is an arising. Awareness is pristine, primordial, luminous, naked, empty. We then see that in fact, all of creation is this. There is no other. This is Brahaman. To clarify that there is nothing added ad hoc, Ramana Maharshi and others called it "One without a second". But that does not mean there is some "one" there - a common, erroneous understanding among Buddhists about Advaita. "One" in this means with no other, i.e., the pristine, primordial, luminous, naked, empty awareness. All of maya arises from it and dissolves into it. Brahma, Vishnu, Shiva are simply the phenomena of manifestation, sustenance and dissolution of each moment in this timeless One.
10. Great insights occur with direct knowing of emptiness of awareness. Gradually, there is greater and greater abidance as awareness. The identity as this or that is gradually (or suddenly in some cases) is shed. The energy to defend one's stand fizzles out because it is directed to greater treasures. Life becomes one long meditation of awareness resting as itself. Everything is seen "within" rather than externally. Discursive thoughts begin to fade, as do fears and anxieties. Actions are more spontaneous and in line with the whole. The past has lesser and lesser of a hold, the future not thought about and everything in the now lived in fully. The senses become more and more refined as each sensation is savored while it lasts. Love overflows at unexpected times and places, intuition sharpens and synchronicities become the norm. Greater knowledge about the workings of the cosmos begins to descend, more so when it is not sought..
In fact, it is a blessing to remain in society, relationships and responsibilities to see how they are transformed just by abiding as awareness.
This is just my experience thus far. Hope it is helpful.
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Edited by - kami on May 07 2014 11:06:16 AM |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - May 07 2014 : 11:51:41 AM
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I can't say I practice this method intentionally any more... it just is along with my sufi practices... I just had a click recently where awareness realized itself and my individuality was seen as an illusion... it melted entirely... there was no witness or witness... all were one but then the illusion of the small self came back... but there's no fooling around ... it's realized and it's clear... in reality there is only awareness watching awareness... so this method in a way is pointing toward the highest truth... I wish all a safe and enjoyable journey... mine is still happening also... yet non happening :-)
much love to all [img]icon_heart.gif[/img] |
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jonesboy
USA
594 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2014 : 11:04:15 AM
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Wow,
Thank you Kami 
I see I have a long ways to go. Exciting because what I am experiencing is very good. To know it will only get better is reassuring and a little ego sad that I still have a long ways to go. Or is that just a thought limiting me from that which I already am |
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kami
USA
921 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2014 : 5:58:06 PM
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2014 : 6:52:54 PM
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Yes beautiful descriptions kami and ananda
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - May 10 2014 : 07:13:38 AM
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| Dear Sparkle and all, not to seem too optimistic... This happening or realization is changing things as Kami puts it but I am finding myself still very much sensitive to certain circumstances... Maybe Kami is more detached than I am... God knows... I still feel like I have a long way to go... Obviously until this body falls... Or maybe more... Salam and much love to all |
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The Awareness Watching Awareness Method
