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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
 Posted - Apr 07 2009 : 11:53:19 AM
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Namaste Friends....
Have been thinking about posting this thread for quite some time now....Have always struggled with this personally....I have never been a quitter. And I think sometimes this has been the cause of me being drug through the mud unneccesarily. So my question is this: How do you know when is an appropriate time to quit something?
I often get the advice from people (and give it myself) that we are where we need to be at any given time...But when I think about this I wonder if there is ever a time to quit something and "cut your losses" and if this can ever be appropriate. I have always felt guilty after choosing to quit something....whether that be a relationship, a job, a habit, or anything else. I always feel like I was too weak to perservere. I value perserverance highly I guess. So with all that in mind, how would you all suggest learning to understand when it is time to quit trying for an outcome and just let go into full surrender? Hope I am explaining this well enough....please ask for clarification if I am not coming across very clearly. Thanks for any and all input.
Love,
Carson |
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onomatopoios
23 Posts |
Posted - Apr 07 2009 : 2:56:37 PM
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Hi Carson,
quote:
And I think sometimes this has been the cause of me being drug through the mud unneccesarily.
Nothing that transpires is unnecessary. Only the conditions of mind introduce unnecessary limitations that create the misery.
quote:
how would you all suggest learning to understand when it is time to quit trying for an outcome and just let go into full surrender?
We people rationalize too much. Uncertainty and thinking about quitting is also rationalizing. Our sentiments and emotions are fine as such, but it is the clinging to the notion that quitting should mean anything beyond what it is which creates the attachment.
If you are trying to limit yourself into two exclusive modes of action - engagement and quitting - then you are already entrapped. In reality, there is no exclusion. There is a fuller path beyond both struggle and non-struggle: the spectator who is present. Observing, but not frustrating; waiting, but not longing for an outcome.
Cheers!  |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Apr 07 2009 : 3:09:16 PM
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Yeah I figured I wasn't explaining myself very clearly.
I will use an example to help clarify what I am trying to talk about.
Lets make it a hypothetical situation using myself as an example:
I am married. I married for the wrong reasons. But I "am where I am supposed to be" right? Well, say at some point I get the feeling that this marriage is not right for me anymore. My instinct has always been to stay and try to work things out. Say I have done that for 10 years now and things aren't getting any better. At what point do I say enough is enough, get a divorce and move on? How can one know whether it is time to let go of the idea that perserverence is more valuable then happiness? Or that happiness is (or is not) located in a certain situation? I understand that I can be happy in any and every situation, that is not what I am meaning. What I am trying to say is that at what point is it appropriate to cut your losses and stop trying to fit a square peg in a round hole?
Love,
Carson |
Edited by - CarsonZi on Apr 07 2009 3:09:54 PM |
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onomatopoios
23 Posts |
Posted - Apr 07 2009 : 4:12:08 PM
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Hi Carson,
quote:
How can one know whether it is time to let go of the idea that perserverence is more valuable then happiness? Or that happiness is (or is not) located in a certain situation? I understand that I can be happy in any and every situation, that is not what I am meaning. What I am trying to say is that at what point is it appropriate to cut your losses and stop trying to fit a square peg in a round hole?
Nature is driven by teleology, a sense of purpose or design. Eat pebbles and your stomach hurts. Eat a foreign dish for the first time and your sense of taste is offended.
If you were constantly fitting a square peg into a round hole, that I would call eating pebbles. If you were disappointed in marriage, that could be a case of eating pebbles. Though it also could be a chronically offended taste: it is impossible to discern from this point of view with the meager data.
Being in connection never ends, so endings are not often endings at all. Perhaps it is simply a paradigm change you were looking for? Indeed, with fitting peg pieces the child's play might turn into more rewarding and less effortless.
Cheers! |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Apr 07 2009 : 4:22:01 PM
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Hello my Friend....
quote:
Originally posted by onomatopoios
Nature is driven by teleology, a sense of purpose or design. Eat pebbles and your stomach hurts. Eat a foreign dish for the first time and your sense of taste is offended.
If you were constantly fitting a square peg into a round hole, that I would call eating pebbles. If you were disappointed in marriage, that could be a case of eating pebbles. Though it also could be a chronically offended taste: it is impossible to discern from this point of view with the meager data.
It's hypothetical so I don't have "data". But what I would be talking about in this example would be classified as "lack of connection". That's how it ended up in my previous relationship anyways. We had great connection for the first few years, and then we fought for 6 more because we no longer had it. It would have been smarter for me to have ended it sooner. But I am not a "quitter" so I keep hashing stuff out, over and over until it's more then obvious that I am bashing a "square peg in a round hole". How can I learn to "see clearer" so that I can stop earlier?
quote:
Originally posted by onomatopoios
Being in connection never ends, so endings are not often endings at all. Perhaps it is simply a paradigm change you were looking for? Indeed, with fitting peg pieces the child's play might turn into more rewarding and less effortless.
Or I might find myself back in the same situation right away again as life's way of giving me a chance to do things differently this time.
Thanks for discussing!
Love,
Carson |
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skorpion63
India
17 Posts |
Posted - Apr 08 2009 : 05:34:19 AM
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Brother Carson
The way i see it is that different people come in our lives because we need to learn some lessons through interacting with them and once the learning and that stage of evolution is over it's time to move on with love and no ill feelings at all.As we very well know everything has to end sooner or later so it's no use trying to cling on to relationships that have lived out their purpose in the bigger scheme of things.
Your innerself guides you when it's time to move on and one should just flow with it without any regrets or remorse.Just be grateful and love the other for helping you learn the lessons that had to be learned and move on with love in your heart.
Regrets,sorrow,anger,hatred or blame game towards the other or the feeling of being or not being a quitter is just ego playing it's drama.
I have been through this situation and believe me once u separate the ego out of this and let your inner silence guide you all you feel is a great sense of peace and bliss instead of all the negative emotions that your mind will throw up should you give it a chance 
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Peter
Italy
25 Posts |
Posted - Apr 10 2009 : 10:47:01 AM
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Hi Carson,
I'm sorry, I know this is of utterly no help, but it seems to me this is the kind of thing I (for one) would want to sit down over a couple of beers (over a few sittings) and hash out with a close friend. I'm not sure it's possible to do in an online forum.... But that's likely just me....
In any case, FWIW, every quitting is different, since the original commitment that got you into the "project" you want to quit from is different. Obviously marrying is way different from getting a job is way different from raising kids is way different from etc... So I find it difficult to discuss this topic in the abstract, as you've presented it.
But meeting abstraction with abstraction, here are a couple of abstract questions that might be worth considering:
How deep was your original commitment? How deep would the original commitment need to have been in order to sustain the "project"? How important to you is commitment? Why? How important to you is the project? Why? Do you think you want to quit because you didn't make an appropriate or strong enough commitment to begin with, or because you have changed since you made the commitment, or because the situation has changed (for instance, having kids within a marriage vastly changes the project and the commitment necessary to sustain it)? What is the actual underlying "meaning" to you of the project? How did you come about desiring that "meaning" or finding that it was important in your life? Are there other forms of the project or ways of engaging it that might allow you to fulfill that "meaning" or something similar to it? Are you certain you want or need to fulfill that meaning...?
HIH, and I wish you the very best Carson! You're a wonderful person with a huge heart - and you're doing a great job following it!
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brother neil
USA
752 Posts |
Posted - Apr 13 2009 : 8:56:33 PM
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carson, a question
are you thinking too much, talking too much, making things more then they are? sometimes we do that
my best to you brother
with love
Neil
PS, how is the weather |
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lucidinterval1
USA
193 Posts |
Posted - Apr 13 2009 : 9:45:32 PM
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Carson,
Take your time man. There is no rush to an answer. It could be that you are going through some inner changes. I remember after a few months of practicing AYP, everyone around me began to irritate me. It was as if they were living in a fog and I was seeing things more clearly. People that I love were getting to me.
After a short time I began to realize that it was me with a problem with my perspective. I was changing and I needed to adjust my mindset to fit in with the everyday world.
Maybe this has nothing to do with what you are going through but I thought that I would offer what I went through. These days - Everything is beautiful, in it's own way.
Much Peace,
Paul |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Apr 14 2009 : 4:07:22 PM
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Hello skorpion63...
quote:
Originally posted by skorpion63
The way i see it is that different people come in our lives because we need to learn some lessons through interacting with them and once the learning and that stage of evolution is over it's time to move on with love and no ill feelings at all.As we very well know everything has to end sooner or later so it's no use trying to cling on to relationships that have lived out their purpose in the bigger scheme of things.
Yes I agree...but how would you know when "that stage of learning is done"? There is always more to learn, even in cyclical situations that keep repeating themselves...how can you know that you are not going to gain any benefit in the future from continuing down a certain path?
quote:
Originally posted by skorpion63
Your innerself guides you when it's time to move on and one should just flow with it without any regrets or remorse.Just be grateful and love the other for helping you learn the lessons that had to be learned and move on with love in your heart.
Sometimes those inner voices can be tricky...the ego can sound awfully similar to other inner voices. At least in my head. Distinguishing between them is sometimes harder then it seems .
quote:
Originally posted by skorpion63
Regrets,sorrow,anger,hatred or blame game towards the other or the feeling of being or not being a quitter is just ego playing it's drama.
Yes and no...I dunno, I'm on the fence on part of your sentence there... Lots of people quit things before they get the full benefits of what they are doing. People do this because they are lazy, because they are scared, for lots of reasons. I don't know if it is always the ego playing games when one doesn't want to quit, or does for that matter as well.
quote:
Originally posted by skorpion63
I have been through this situation and believe me once u separate the ego out of this and let your inner silence guide you all you feel is a great sense of peace and bliss instead of all the negative emotions that your mind will throw up should you give it a chance
Thank you skorpion....I appreciate the advice very much. Namaste.
Love,
Carson |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Apr 14 2009 : 5:24:54 PM
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Hi Peter....
quote:
Originally posted by Peter
I'm sorry, I know this is of utterly no help, but it seems to me this is the kind of thing I (for one) would want to sit down over a couple of beers (over a few sittings) and hash out with a close friend. I'm not sure it's possible to do in an online forum.... But that's likely just me....
Yeah I hear ya... My only problem with that is that all the friends I would normally do this with are living abroad these days for various reasons. I just spent the weekend with one of my best friends and his wife, baby and their family, so I was able to discuss a bit with him, but it can be complicated with so many resposibilities all the time, to get some decent uninterupted time to talk at length.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter
In any case, FWIW, every quitting is different, since the original commitment that got you into the "project" you want to quit from is different. Obviously marrying is way different from getting a job is way different from raising kids is way different from etc... So I find it difficult to discuss this topic in the abstract, as you've presented it.
Yes I realize the limitations I have created in possible advice that can be given due to the fact we aren't discussing any specific thing that needs to be quit. And yes, every situation will require a different approach even if only slightly.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter
But meeting abstraction with abstraction, here are a couple of abstract questions that might be worth considering:
I will answer these questions in regards to my previous relationship which should have ended sooner then it did.....just as an example/for discussions sake...
quote:
Originally posted by Peter
How deep was your original commitment?
Emotionally...complete.
On paper/legally...we were only common-law.
Spiritually...I thought of her as my soulmate, still do.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter
How deep would the original commitment need to have been in order to sustain the "project"?
I honestly don't think any level of commitment would have sustained the project.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter
How important to you is commitment? Why?
Important for what? In general I think once committing to something it is important to see it through, but isn't committment just another form of attachment? I don't know what I think here.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter
How important to you is the project?
At that time, with this example, my relationship was everything to me. Everything I was doing in life was building for the future in regards to that relationship. The project was of the utmost importance.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter
Why?
Hmmmmm.....GREAT question. And I don't know the answer. I have to think hard about this one.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter
Do you think you want to quit because you didn't make an appropriate or strong enough commitment to begin with, or because you have changed since you made the commitment, or because the situation has changed (for instance, having kids within a marriage vastly changes the project and the commitment necessary to sustain it)?
Honestly I didn't ever WANT to quit. I wanted things to change. So I quit. I couldn't understand at that time that it was ME that needed to change and not her.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter
What is the actual underlying "meaning" to you of the project?
That the connection we had was deeper then I would ever feel with anyone else.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter
How did you come about desiring that "meaning" or finding that it was important in your life?
Simply by seeing her. It was literally love at first sight.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter
Are there other forms of the project or ways of engaging it that might allow you to fulfill that "meaning" or something similar to it?
I don't know for sure, but maybe. Even my current friendship with her is fulfilling for me. She now has a husband and a kid, and is due next Friday with her second, and I am honestly happy for her. I think she is happy, she always wanted to be a Mom, and we can still have meaningful conversations etc. And I don't really desire her sexually either...so that isn't really an issue. I guess for me it was like losing your best friend. I don't know if it is possible to have the depth of connection I had with her, with someone else. If it is, I have yet to find it.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter
Are you certain you want or need to fulfill that meaning...?
No I'm not certain I need to fill this desire for deeper human connection, but I sometimes long for it. I had it before, and sometimes I wish it still existed for me. I know this is living in the past though and I need to let go and live in the now. Thank you for your caring post.
Love,
Carson
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Edited by - CarsonZi on Apr 14 2009 5:27:07 PM |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Apr 14 2009 : 5:34:02 PM
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Hello Brother Neil....
quote:
Originally posted by brother neil
carson, a question
are you thinking too much,
Yes, of course.
quote:
Originally posted by brother neil
talking too much,
(sheepishly) yes.....
quote:
Originally posted by brother neil
making things more then they are?
again, probably yes....no, yes, I am totally making things more then they are. Mostly for discussions sake though. A little bit of nostalgia mixed in perhaps, not totally sure. Again
quote:
Originally posted by brother neil
PS, how is the weather
We got snow in Calgary again today. It was supposedly 20 degrees celcius the whole time I was gone, but I arrived back in Calgary at 10:30pm last night and it was just starting to snow. I love it haha.
Love,
Carson |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Apr 14 2009 : 5:38:34 PM
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Hi Paul....
quote:
Originally posted by lucidinterval1
Take your time man. There is no rush to an answer. It could be that you are going through some inner changes. I remember after a few months of practicing AYP, everyone around me began to irritate me. It was as if they were living in a fog and I was seeing things more clearly. People that I love were getting to me.
Yeah I hear ya.... I think my problem is that I never appreciate what I have until it is gone. Over and over and over and over again. I never seem to learn this lesson. Maybe that is what this is all about here...
quote:
Originally posted by lucidinterval1
After a short time I began to realize that it was me with a problem with my perspective. I was changing and I needed to adjust my mindset to fit in with the everyday world.
Yes, so true. I need to cut people some slack a lot of the time. I know I am hard on the people I love. I expect a lot and I have no right to expect anything. Still learning....
quote:
Originally posted by lucidinterval1
Maybe this has nothing to do with what you are going through but I thought that I would offer what I went through. These days - Everything is beautiful, in it's own way.
Thank you for chiming in....I can use all the advice I can get. "Everything is beautiful, in it's own way."
Love,
Carson |
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brother neil
USA
752 Posts |
Posted - Apr 15 2009 : 9:07:56 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by CarsonZi
Hello Brother Neil....
quote:
Originally posted by brother neil
carson, a question
are you thinking too much,
Yes, of course.
quote:
Originally posted by brother neil
talking too much,
(sheepishly) yes.....
quote:
Originally posted by brother neil
making things more then they are?
again, probably yes....no, yes, I am totally making things more then they are. Mostly for discussions sake though. A little bit of nostalgia mixed in perhaps, not totally sure. Again
quote:
Originally posted by brother neil
PS, how is the weather
We got snow in Calgary again today. It was supposedly 20 degrees celcius the whole time I was gone, but I arrived back in Calgary at 10:30pm last night and it was just starting to snow. I love it haha.
Love,
Carson
one more question
fjkdfjk asfj kjdsf jfjksaufipdsufjkwrausufdsjfkljsal fsafjsfkljsafoiaufjojfldgnfdlajklgjdsfu j09dsautrljeatkljmnlaf jdsjfds0furajfkljdsafkljds fodsuf09ewufrkljrafkljdsl vjds0ibvure0a9ut543tjmrfjvdf09uatj4qtjrefklvjdg uf9reautop43tjrefjksfjkldsjfkljat09rjgfkdjvfdskfa
?
answer that and all your problems are solved
with love
Brother Neil
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Apr 15 2009 : 11:30:35 PM
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The answer is "silence".......
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How to know when to quit....
