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Balance
USA
967 Posts |
 Posted - May 13 2008 : 10:41:34 PM
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Nisargadatta could be one example of the shadow thing.
He continued to smoke, be loud and argumentative, and majorly intense. But the personality that continued didn't stop the directness of Self coming through and touching others in helpful ways.
I don't know for sure but I would guess those personality traits existed "before", but without the full on direct expression of Satchitananda shining through. |
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Nancy
USA
71 Posts |
Posted - May 13 2008 : 10:47:28 PM
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| So How about them Yankees |
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jthabuddha
22 Posts |
Posted - May 13 2008 : 11:00:36 PM
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before, you have ideas about yourself
after, you no longer have ideas about yourself
all the while you remained yourself |
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jthabuddha
22 Posts |
Posted - May 13 2008 : 11:18:25 PM
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the awareness shining through your eyes is the same awareness that everything rises from, is sustained by, and falls back to. for any "state" to be there has to be an awareness of that state. the states appear to change but the awareness is ever present, all pervasive, eternal, unchanging. before an infant learns language and is able to have ideas about himself (I am so and so, I am this body), the infant is aware. the good news is that the quality of the unborn child and the quality of the born child are the same--and you are ALREADY that. before your "birth" during your "life" and after your "death"--that prevails now.
"what you are looking for is what is looking"
"know yourself and you know the kingdom"
"be a light unto yourself"
"if you cant find the truth where you are where do you expect to find it?"
pay attention to what is paying attention ; )
there are no higher or lower or different states of consciousness in the truth
you either see it, or you dont. if you dont see it how can you talk about it? if you see it, then it doesnt matter of you talk about it or not
all above and all below are concepts
awareness is a concept
only pointers not the truth |
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Balance
USA
967 Posts |
Posted - May 13 2008 : 11:22:13 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Nancy
So How about them Yankees
Ah-ha! I KNEW the Yankees were enlightened!
And check it out, before enlightenment, play ball...after enlightenment, play ball.
Uh-huh! Now I get it! |
Edited by - Balance on May 14 2008 12:05:19 AM |
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 12:15:16 AM
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Meg said:
... if it's possible to hang onto negative patterns of behaviour once one has reached a level of enlightenment.
Hi Meg, that would again depend on what we mean with enlightenment. If we work with the term as to what extent it is realized in an individual's conscious awareness, enlightenment is not a definite stage, "on" or "off". Inner silence in itself, as Yogani has described, is an aspect of enlightenment, which gradually increases on our spiritual path. Many have testified here how this inner silence, even in minor amounts, has affected their outer approach to life and to others, and how others have found these changes to be positive.
Some habit patterns like the ones you described are based on attachments of the ego and lack of awareness about what is going on in one's own psyche, as well as others. With enlightenment, at least as I see it, comes more and more freedom from attachments and profoundly heightened awareness of what is going on, both in ourselves and in others. If we add in "outpouring divine love", which Yogani describes as a major aspect of enlightenment, I think it makes sense that many habits like these would likely be dropped spontaneously, probably gradually over time. There may of course be traces left. However, there may also be cases, like Balance described, with Nisargadatta, where he chose to keep some behaviors that maybe some objected to.
Even if we work with the concept that enlightenment is (mainly) about perception, that perception will have an effect on how a person chooses to express themselves toward others. What we do is usually a reflection of our perceptions, conscious or subconscious.
emc said:
... that the "shadow" in Jungean meaning - that is our suppressed thoughts and emotions that influence us from the unconscious, creating annoying behaviours - will still be left after enlightenment! Since we continue to create karma, and we continue to have feelings and thoughts (even if they are seen as objects) it is argued that we also continue to have blind spots!
Hi, emc, very interesting considerations! Yes, there will be blind spots, at least temporarily, but with the heightened awareness of enlightenment there will be greater ability to deal with them, as Etherfish also talks about. So, I would make it part of my definition of enlightenment, as the extent to which an individual chooses to deal with these blind spots and chooses to transcend them, as they appear. I would consider it quite unenlightened to let them sit there and cause stuff to happen that would be less than the highest ishta, or chosen ideal that that person can envision.
For example, the phenomenon of awakened gurus that speak about celibacy and claim they are celibate and then are discovered in scandals to have had a vivid hidden sexlife could perhaps be a result of a such shadow that is hanging on???
I would not call any individual involved in things like this enlightened. Deception is not part of enlightenment. Deception is connected to delusion and openness and truthfulness are connected to Reality. A case like this would also indicate that there are still attachments involved, for example wanting to appear in a certain way publicly that doesn't reflect what is real.
It could be that when awake... there's just awareness about what the shadow does, but it still does it! 
How about telling the shadow: "Now that I can see you, the light is on you and you are no more!" |
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Nancy
USA
71 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 12:45:02 AM
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Hi Balance
That's It
Let's Just Play Ball
quote:
Originally posted by Balance
quote:
Originally posted by Nancy
So How about them Yankees
Ah-ha! I KNEW the Yankees were enlightened!
And check it out, before enlightenment, play ball...after enlightenment, play ball.
Uh-huh! Now I get it!
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 01:05:52 AM
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Etherfish, I really enjoy your posts in this topic! And your latest post here weaver is also interesting. I'm taking a part of both here and mix them:
quote:
emc: For example, the phenomenon of awakened gurus that speak about celibacy and claim they are celibate and then are discovered in scandals to have had a vivid hidden sexlife could perhaps be a result of a such shadow that is hanging on???
weaver: I would not call any individual involved in things like this enlightened. Deception is not part of enlightenment. Deception is connected to delusion and openness and truthfulness are connected to Reality. A case like this would also indicate that there are still attachments involved, for example wanting to appear in a certain way publicly that doesn't reflect what is real.
And Etherfish wrote:
quote:
God sometimes makes things happen that have the exact outcome you wanted, but don't necessarily make you look good. It's like he couldn't care less about your ego! This has happened several times to me lately.
So it's possible that some stories that make a guru look bad may not be true, but may be serving some other purpose we don't know about.
Ether... Could your suggestion be the case in the example above? Could it stretch that far, so to speak? I'm more prone to believe that such guru's indeed are not so well washed as they and others think. They must still have great pendulum swings between an awareness and mindyness. |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 01:23:06 AM
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"Heaven on
earth" with a lot of laughter inside and out that's smthg perhaps lolz.
just take things easy and explore them yourself, there are no limits and no one's experience is exactly the same as the other.
Free yourself, from yourself.
Namaste |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 07:36:29 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by emc
And Etherfish wrote:
quote:
God sometimes makes things happen that have the exact outcome you wanted, but don't necessarily make you look good. It's like he couldn't care less about your ego! This has happened several times to me lately.
So it's possible that some stories that make a guru look bad may not be true, but may be serving some other purpose we don't know about.
Ether... Could your suggestion be the case in the example above? Could it stretch that far, so to speak? I'm more prone to believe that such guru's indeed are not so well washed as they and others think. They must still have great pendulum swings between an awareness and mindyness.
Thanks emc i enjoy your posts also.
I tend to think as you do also about gurus, but what I'm saying is we don't know for sure. Every story has two sides and it is quite common today for the news to be manipulated by incomplete journalism. The common man is too distracted with entertainment to investigate anything. He thinks if he hears something from a major news source, then it must be true.
I recently had a former friend make false accusations about me, tell several other people about it, then cut off all communication. Those other people believed what they said without asking me about it.
So I'm saying how do we know what the real story is?
A powerful person is likely to be followed by a couple egotistical parasites with an agenda. If they are ignored, they could easily create negative stories, and be eager to talk to the news. Who knows how many times this has happened? a realized guru would probably just ignore it rather than have to go on the news and defend himself. |
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VIL
USA
586 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 07:52:16 AM
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quote:
VIL--you miss the point--"chop wood carry water" is not to be taken literally--of course, most people no longer literally do either, unless they may be on a camping trip. It means that whatever it was we did before, we still need to do after--whether that was to chop our wood, scrub the kitchen floors (mine currently do need to be done!) load the dishwasher, weed the garden, file the taxes, balance the checkbook, pay the bills, etc--the trivial performances of daily life remain the same. DOES ANYthing change then? Ahhh, details...
Michael
Before enlightenment: Chop wood, carry water
After enlightenment: Higher a good house keeper
Maybe the zen person should have just said:
Before enlightenment: Do laundry, pay cable bill
After enlightenment: Do laundry, pay cable bill
That way, people of the future would not be confused. Unless it's both literal and symbolic, since people of the time would understand chopping wood and carrying water, and they knew people of the future are able to discern a concept from the latter. Although, the reverse is impossible without spiritual evolution.
Anyway, I'm under the suspicion that most sages were drunk when they said half the the things they did. And the above saying may have been employed by a harsh task master upon his students.
In other words, maybe there was a ruthless zen master who really despised chores, but understood that people needed to provide for themselves, since that's what they did, before and after enlightenment, but when a person claimed enlightenment after chopping wood and carrying water and decided to dig a hole, the outraged master said to this student, "What on earth are you doing?!" And maybe the student replied, "I'm digging a ditch from the stream to the hut, so that we no longer have to carry water, Master" - Whack! The master hit him in the head with his cane. And so the student understood what was more important, which was to continue to chop wood and carry water.
Namaste:
VIL |
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Manipura
USA
870 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 10:10:08 AM
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Great point, Ether. It's an act of ignorance to believe any kind of vicious or unkind rumors, simply because we have NO idea if they're true. Even if the rumors can be substantiated, we don't know what the motivation behind them was.
Regarding the shadow, some Jungian scholars write that in order to reach the higher states of consciousness, you have to become comfortable with larger portions of your shadow. In other words, to fly high, you have to dig deep. Shamans, for ex., have to go through rituals which bring them to some very dark places within themselves in order to attain their powers. Undoubtedly some of the great gurus, in their path toward the higher levels of awareness, had to do the same, and some of their 'digging' may have been perceived as unseemly for a 'holy' person. As for the swelling of ego that sometimes accompanies adoration, what better way to smash the ego than public disgrace? Ya just never know what's going on behind the curtain. |
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Balance
USA
967 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 12:06:23 PM
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This morning I ran across an interview with Joan Tollifson and thought it might be good to add to this discussion. I like Joan, she's groovy:
"One of my main teachers, Nisargadatta Maharaj, smoked cigarettes and died of throat cancer. He sold cigarettes for a living. He ate meat. He lived in (or near) a red-light district in Bombay. He got angry, yelled at people, threw them out of his satsang. I never knew him in person, but this is what I hear. I think that's part of what drew me to him. It was instantly clear that awakening did not mean a person had to resemble Ramana Maharshi or Thich Nhat Hanh. You did not have to be soft-spoken, beatific, gentle and vegetarian.
Another person who has been very important to me is Tony Parsons. He joked once that the people who were coming to him were giving up vegetarianism, putting on weight, and dying of heart failure. He thought that was just fine. He said, 'You can't not be in grace. Everything about you is totally absolutely perfectly appropriate. All the things you think are wrong with you are absolutely right.' That was enormously liberating to hear. I realized how caught up I had been for such a long time in trying to perfect the character, trying to have some Big Bang awakening experience, trying to get rid of all Joan's neurotic little habits, trying to turn into somebody better, trying to make something (other than this) happen."
http://www.ods.nl/am1gos/am1gos7/index.html
I can't get a link direct to the article, you will have to go to the link and click on Joan Tollifson at the top of the page.
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Edited by - Balance on May 14 2008 12:11:19 PM |
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Wilder
12 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 12:18:37 PM
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Even the guru of Paramahamsa yogananda, had his positives and negatives as a teacher. In his book "Autobiography of a Yogi" yogananda mentions this about his guru, saying that he would have been a better teacher if he overcame his negatives.
-wilder |
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HathaTeacher
Sweden
382 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 12:33:48 PM
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emc,
in zen, it's a long staircase rather than just one step up. What's most deeply rooted in the shadow will take most steps to let loose. When you skip your sadhana, you skid a step or three back, no matter how high up the stairs you are. Also, it makes no sense to count the steps or estimate how long you've come because:
1. the path is the destination. A key idea from tantra, picked up by zen later, is detaching from the need of completing/achieving objectives and milestones in life.
2. comparisons would create just another "excellent" opportunity for the ego to recapture control.
It's a pretty funny fact of life that quite a few new-age people continue with self-destructive habits (such as smoking, caffeine - or worse) after a Kundalini experience, but still refuse to see that these come from their allegedly dead ego... :-) I don't know if any pain is like that but the pain of quitting bad habits is definitely the pain side of universal love, the best choice possible - despite the friction an resistance of the ego.
You might take a look at the psychosythesis school (Assagioli, Ferucci - they were disciples of CGJ); rather than just a single "shadow", they take a composite view where several subpersonalities within you interact while none of them is plain black or plain white. They also recommend a daily introspective, like a "sadhana".
I think the CGJ community should point out clearly that the shadow has layers, particularly when you go for daily meditation as your primary tool: you proceed slowly through the layers, rather than hoping for a weekend of silver-bullet hip therapies "quick-fixing" it for you. I agree with the zen posts above, there's definitely no single on-off switch (marked Fix All, in bold :-) |
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Balance
USA
967 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 12:42:39 PM
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| Perhaps our ideas of perfection are just that; ideas. There is no such thing in the world of forms that can be labelled as perfect. It doesn't exist. Who would want that? No-thing could "be" in an idealized manifestation because so-called perfection would negate everything. It is why the ideas of a perfect after-life, or heaven are "over there". They are unreal in our experience of life. |
Edited by - Balance on May 14 2008 1:31:32 PM |
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Eitherway
USA
100 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 3:17:29 PM
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A year and a half or so into ayp, some things about my personal journey are obvious. The inner silence and the increasing amount of witnessing allows passive observation of conduct/behavior/habits/personality traits, etc... At the start of the journey, the realization and the conduct were one and the same but as months have gone by this has definitely changed.
The initial change was the realization that whatever I just did or even had done in the distant past (judging, condemning, anger,a whole boatload of wrongdoings etc....) was not consistent with a spiritual life. Subsequently, I (conventional non-enlightened, non-advaitic, small self, etc...) would sort of have emotional pain at repeating the said actions or even recollection of such memories. This seemed to lead to a conscious decision that feels deeper than an intellectual or societally provoked one to watch out for such actions in the future and stop/ just be silent/observe passively, instead of acting them out. Inner silence and accompanying space at play.
This slowly has lead to a definite reduction in negative or harmful behavior with the feeling that the said behaviors were there to help me learn and move on. An increase in energy/bliss, which doesn't feel coincedental, in direct proportion to leaving the less serving behaviors behind potently reinforces the process.
I believe this kind of evolution is part and parcel of a systematic approach such as Ayp. The aspirant, atleast I have been, will be forced to observe their behaviors (current and past) etc... and most likely will rise to a higher level of conduct and wisdom through the process. This process should theoretically continue till perfection is reached, in another words more than a lifetime for almost anyone not of avatar status.
The issue seems to be that a continued experience of enlightenment or self realization is tied more closely to a change in perception or identity BUT DOES NOT require the wholesale cleansing of maladaptive behavior patterns/karma etc.... Upon closer reflection, this makes sense because the aforementioned patterns/karma seem to reside in the sub/unconscious until particular situations are caused by them or until they flood the conscious mind due to circumstances.
These unwholesome behaviors/thoughts would make it very unlikely for even an advanced practitioner to confuse themselves as being enlightened unless a profound change in identity/perception has taken place. A profound change (with the model being that the ripening takes place over time but the fruit falls at a particular time or from a more neural perspective, circuitry is being rewired over time but the full current flow is perceived at a eureka type moment) with its accompanying energetics can easily confuse the practitioner because now they are without a shadow of a doubt no longer the same. Cue the proclamations of being completely awake!
The only problem is that even though God's own light is now flowing through them and they are more closely aligned with the source in identity than the rest of us, they are still communicating/teaching/living through the use of the body and brain which is still undergoing purification.
This leads me to believe that the neural circuitry needed for the change in perception/identity (commonly what most of us refer to as being self realized or enlightened) is independent (but ofcourse related, as in its all in the brain!) and will preceed the eventual cleansing/rewiring of the rest of the circuitry. I would hazard to guess that the change in identity can unleash forces (for a lack of a better word) that can greatly speed up the purification of the rest of the body/brain.
The caveat seems to be that the practitioner, who now identifies with a new being of a glorious and unfathomable nature, must still observe and pay attention, learn, read, gain skills, etc.... Why? Not because he will improve in identity but because this is the only way to learn more about him/her self and continue the purification, all the while being a sun to the rest of humanity.
The problem is that many seem to have confused the change in identity as an all encompassing frution of the process and thus actually halting completion of it. This leads to masters that can be grumpy, angry, abusive, dismissive of paths other than theirs, etc...... We will have no shortage of students that will be overwhelmed by the aura/charisma/prescence of the masters pervasive identity and rush to rationalize their behaviors as necessary for the growth of the student. Surely, we will learn from such actions but I shudder at giving credit to the master in question who berates his student but rather see this as lessons from the one behind the curtain. The question is will the master learn or is he/she too enlightened?
So in the final analysis, enlightenment needs to be defined with the idea in mind of a change in identity as being different and preceeding wholesale purification of the rest of the body/brain. Yogani has thus consistently advocated a dynamic enlightenment in which purification continues and our wisdom is proportional to our understanding of our limitations. This also ties in neatly with the discussion about the necessity of practices after the change in identity (enlightenment). Continued meditation will most likely not have much of an effect on identity (as the current in the wiring is already optimum and a solid durable connection has been made) but the practices will help the master continue to learn, make mistakes, learn, communicate better just like they do for the students with conventional identity, and lead the rest of us to the promised land, etc....
So what changes after enlightenment? Of course, a change in identity with its accompanying fruits (much less or no suffering) has already taken place before so really the rest is up to the practitioner. If they continue to practice, they will continue to learn and improve with regards to whatever they do on a day to day basis at a fast pace. If they don't practice, the purification will still continue but at a slower pace (ofcourse much faster than the unenlightened by the virtue of the identity change cirucit being complete).
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Balance
USA
967 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 4:44:01 PM
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Eitherway said:
"The problem is that many seem to have confused the change in identity as an all encompassing frution of the process and thus actually halting completion of it. This leads to masters that can be grumpy, angry, abusive, dismissive of paths other than theirs, etc...... We will have no shortage of students that will be overwhelmed by the aura/charisma/prescence of the masters pervasive identity and rush to rationalize their behaviors as necessary for the growth of the student. Surely, we will learn from such actions but I shudder at giving credit to the master in question who berates his student but rather see this as lessons from the one behind the curtain. The question is will the master learn or is he/she too enlightened?"
Perhaps you are correct in your assumptions, but maybe the particular expressions by truly "God-absorbed masters" is just the way their vehicles operate. Maybe there are some characteristics that just don't change in the "karma-created vehicle." Perhaps the more peaceful, vegetarian, kind and gentle, etc. "God-absorbed masters" are expressing through vehicles that were that way before enlightenment. And maybe the treatment dished out to a particular student in a particular moment is a correct energetic response on some level for the recipient.
By your questioning "Are they too enlightened?" I take it that you are saying such masters did not purify the vehicle enough before dissolving into the infinite?
I have looked at a handful of masters lives somewhat, the ones who became realized (as opposed to the ones who were born realized, like Bhagavan Nityananda and etc.) and see that they appear to carry over certain personality characteristics. The vehicle is an energetic conglomeration of karmic events that seems to have an expression, a life of its own to live out, even if the Divine Self is shining through in full force.
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Edited by - Balance on May 14 2008 4:52:32 PM |
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Eitherway
USA
100 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 5:42:19 PM
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Hi Alan,
I agree that it seems that certain characteristics don't seem to change in the "karma-created vehicle" but my question is can the God absorbed master change those characteristics? Are they adaptable? I have typically heard that there is no free will and that it is God's Will but this seems like rationalization for the inability to change or rather simply a lack of knowledge about whatever attribute or action might be under discussion.
I'm leaning towards a two fold neural mechanism (i can hear the advaitists cringe but don't worry we're all one) in order to explain the identity change (classical enlightenment) and further purification necessary to get to all the shadows (dynamic enlightenment) as well as improve in myriad ways, e.g, politely explaining the nuances of the spiritual journey,instead of wacking upside the head with a stick .
I'm not suggesting that all enlightened masters should or will act the same way. I believe personality traits will remain, after all they keep the spice in existence.
"And maybe the treatment dished out to a particular student in a particular moment is a correct energetic response on some level for the recipient" Sure, but I think this might be giving a little too much slack to the master. What I'm saying is that there might be a better response for the student at this time (even deliverable by the same master) but the master won't learn or concede this because he is overwhelmed by the identity change/God Absorption. I'm suggesting the God Absorption is related to a particular neural circuit which because of its overwhelming nature can make the master unlikely to continue in making progress by learning new skills or continuing purification through practices. Just thoughts of course. |
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Balance
USA
967 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 5:59:16 PM
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Hi Eitherway.
You could be right, maybe they can change their behaviors.
I'm with Joan Tollifson though. I like the quirks of the different personalitiy expressions as it is. Keeps things fun for me. It honors things as it is; already perfect in the transitoriness of it all. I think if the absolute enjoys anything it is infinite diversity and uniqueness! |
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Lila
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 6:24:14 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by emc
could perhaps be a result of a such shadow that is hanging on???
The suggestion of the 'shadow surviving enlightenment' comes (according to the other discussion) from a pretty awake zen master, Genpo Roshi.
It could be that when awake... there's just awareness about what the shadow does, but it still does it!
Wow, this is a great discussion. Now I want to add my opinion too!
First of all, I am also of the opinion that enlightenment is a journey and people can be at different degrees of enlightenment, but if they were ever fully realized, I think they would cease to exist on this level of experience that we are on.
Having met some individuals that I think many would agree have reached some level of enlightenment I believe they have cleared much of their stuff, meaning their issues or neurosis that caused the annoying behavior. However, I have seen actions, comments or behavior that tells me they still have blind spots and have not yet cleared everything.
So there is my two cents.... |
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Divineis
Canada
420 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 6:37:18 PM
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yeah, I rather like the stories of Zen masters beating their students with a stick. Gets me laughing haha. Or burning Buddha's statues to keep warm... anything like that haha, human nature is so awesome.
I know I was a little harsh with Eric earlier, it's all meant in love though. It's easy to get caught up in stuff, even if it's nothing. I didn't say it just for him, I said it for me too... maybe he'll get nothing out of it (haha), maybe it doesn't matter, maybe it didn't need to be said, maybe nothing needs to be said, maybe I just don't care more about one side or the other, I dunno haha. I could go on for days like this haha, I think it's awesome, human nature is freaking beautiful... just as it is.
oh and, I'm more enlightened, because I don't care about enlightenment. yeah, I went there. I don't really mean that though. or do I? haha, see, there it is again hahaha :). |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 6:52:08 PM
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Eitherway wrote:
quote:
I agree that it seems that certain characteristics don't seem to change in the "karma-created vehicle" but my question is can the God absorbed master change those characteristics? Are they adaptable? I have typically heard that there is no free will and that it is God's Will but this seems like rationalization for the inability to change or rather simply a lack of knowledge about whatever attribute or action might be under discussion.
Of course a master could change if there was reason to. In my opinion God's will isn't something that is bland and makes everyone the same. To the contrary, each of us is unique, and this uniqueness fits perfectly in God's plan. When a person becomes realized, they don't get rid of their uniqueness. They just get rid of superfluous ego stuff that they mistakenly thought was part of them.
I firmly believe that a fully realized person will still make choices using their free will. I think God is like the navigation system in your car. If you deviate from the path that is given to you, the navigator says "You are not on the designated path. I am recalculating your new route."
----------------
Lila, I don't think we would cease to exist on this level of experience. God's plan is for all souls, and a fully realized person is the best tool God has for helping other people. |
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Eitherway
USA
100 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 6:59:51 PM
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Agreed, existence is beautiful in its imperfection.
Thank you Yogani for AYP (ofcourse this means giving due credit to past masters, warts and all) |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 8:30:26 PM
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Yogani has thus consistently advocated a dynamic enlightenment in which purification continues and our wisdom is proportional to our understanding of our limitations.
Agreed with this. I'd take it even further -- there is no 'fully enlightened' -- no more than there is 'fully educated', or 'fully intelligent' or 'fully skilled'.
When this is understood, there's nothing particularly to be resolved in our view of Nisagardatta's bad habits and negative inclinations, any more than there is about any of ours. If we mythologize him, and/or believe in complete enlightenment, we have some explaining to do. And sometimes these explanations are tortuous, merely rationalizations ultimately. I think some of that is going on in this thread because, in one way or another, people just won't let 'perfectly enlightened' go.
He yelled and he got angry and he smoked (which he knew was bad for him) because he had some imperfections. Stop imagining 'perfectly enlightened' and there's nothing to explain. Behold Nisagardatta!
If anything, I like the guy more for letting some of his imperfections hang out! Sounds like he could be fun to be with!  He'd be a better man to share a pint of Guinness with than some other enlightenment icons!
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What does NOT change after enlightenment
