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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
 Posted - Mar 02 2008 : 02:17:32 AM
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Some time ago I saw a co-relation between samyama and the heart sutra and developed a practice which I would like to share, with the hope that others will try it and see how it works for them. This has increased the effect of my samyama practice greatly.
When practicing walking meditation (slow walking with the breath and awareness in the moment) I would walk and be aware of my foot touching the ground, of my attention drawn to a leaf, a branch, the footpath etc etc.
This was a process of identifying each object as it came into awareness.
One day I started adding the essence of the Heart Sutra to the thoughts, “no foot” after “foot” and “no branch” after “branch”.
So the walk would become, ground – no ground… tree – no tree… person – no person etc.
This changed my experience of walking meditation dramatically. It was a process of identifying something and then dis-identifying it with the second thought.
A while later it occurred to me to try this with samyama using the nine sutras, so it became:
love – no love…. radiance- no radiance….. unity- no unity etc.
I couldn’t believe the difference this made, the effect on my body system was dramatic. What happens to me, is my whole body feels activated; my spine elongates and wants to straighten. And I go into some state, which might be called bliss or not, I don’t really know, but it is a strong altered state.
At the beginning I would estimate the effect of this increased, what I would normally experience in samyama, by about sixfold. Prior to that I never felt much from Akasha for instance, but using Akasha – no Akasha the effect was dramatic.
I have been wondering about posting this for a long time and Shanti’s(Shweta’s) thread about the Siva Sutras and the silent gap between thoughts prompted me to go ahead. See here Something to try...
It feels to me like there is a co-relation between the “gap” and the negative statement of the thought, as above. This may be a stepping stone into the gap and so might be useful for some who have difficulty going straight, for resting in the silent gap.
It is possible also to combine the two techniques to good effect.
Since Shweta pointed out the presence of the gap before the thought, I have been adding as follows: no-akasha---akasha----no-akasha, this is even more powerful.
If you try this with slow walking meditation and just, for instance use the foot and ground as your thoughts. As you step with each foot you might say to yourself:
No-foot__foot__no-foot________no-ground__ground__no-ground, then with the other foot as it touches the ground, the same thing. It is slower doing it like this and if it is too slow just simply do, foot__no-foot etc.
If you rest in the silent gap before the thought and then add no-foot and dwell on this the effect is increased again.
The revelations and insights about the gaps between thoughts has given me a much clearer understanding of the Heart Sutra and I am very thankful for that. It may be that reciting the Heart Sutra, particularly the part that goes,
no eye, ear, nose, tongue, body, or mind,
no sight, sound, scent, taste, tangibles, or dharma,
no field of the eye up to no field of mental consciousness,
no suffering, no cause of suffering,
no ending of suffering, and no path,
no wisdom and also no attainment.
This is part of a translation of the Heart Sutra taken form here:
http://www.holymtn.com/teapots/sutra.htm
is a way of bringing one into the “gap”. It appears to me that this may be what it is about.
I would be grateful for anyone to try this and report back their findings. I would recommend you try it with the normal nine sutras first. This will give a better feel of it, because the inner silence will have been developed through Spinal Breathing and Deep Meditation first.
Thanks in advance
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Mar 03 2008 : 1:07:38 PM
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Hey, has nobody given this a try yet????????  |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Mar 03 2008 : 3:26:52 PM
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I have given it a try, but in a very non-complicated way. I just add after the nine sutras "emc - not emc", and it creates a great energy swooosh and an inward sucking feeling of great power. "A strong altered state" is how I would describe it as well. Due to that and my tendency to always be on the verge of overload, I haven't experimented further. But if I ever get into a less energetic state I sure will try it more!
Thank you for sharing, Louis! |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Mar 05 2008 : 06:15:59 AM
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Thanks emc, very much appreciate you trying this
May your overload be shortlived and contain a lot of learning
For me, as well as being something that is very effective, it also crosses over the boundries between spiritual traditions.
Being able to link such an essential aspect of yoga - inner silence into outer expression, with something like the Heart Sutra in Buddhism is quite exciting to me.
It must be said though, that it is not something for the beginner at AYP to try. This would not be recommended as it would confuse the practice of the beautiful and highly effective system that is in place.
Just something for the more seasoned practitioner. |
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Maatsuah
USA
33 Posts |
Posted - Mar 06 2008 : 12:51:54 PM
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Thanks for the info Sparkle.
I have been practicing the i am mantra and adding to the practice as I assimilated techniques. I started doing Samyama about 6 months ago. I have had a great deal of difficulty bringing up the past remembrance of how I feel about most of the words(Sutras) because in the past I did not put very much focus on how I felt about anything. The minute I tried to bring up a feeling, the word seemes to pop up before I can catch it.
I have perservered and noticed that I could imagine a feeling I might have but the suggestion that Shanti brought up, regarding prethougths, thoughts, and the destruction of thoughts, was so helpful to me regarding the subtle nuance of a feeling versus saying the word faintly that I latched onto her thread and read it over many times. I as even more encouraged with Yogani's input. I feel better about doing her suggestion because I don't have to make it part of the actual practice of Samyama and can do it throughout the day.
Your suggestion of saying no (repeat sutra) seems to bring even more clarification regarding what I perceive to be a difficult procedure. I am slowly starting to feel something when I do Samyama, however, I have not felt a lot up till recently. I would love to put your suggestion into practice but I am hoping Yogani will comment on this before I do anything even as harmless as this sounds. I just want to make sure your suggestion won't change anything substantial about Samyama the way we are doing it here. |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Mar 09 2008 : 8:15:30 PM
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Hi Maatsuah
The method described above is not an AYP practice and that's why it was put in the "Other Systems of Spiritual Practice" forum.
So because you are just getting to grips with samyama it would not be recommended that you start experimenting like this. Of course it's always up to you - the guru is in you.
You said:
quote:
I have had a great deal of difficulty bringing up the past remembrance of how I feel about most of the words(Sutras) because in the past I did not put very much focus on how I felt about anything. The minute I tried to bring up a feeling, the word seemes to pop up before I can catch it.
I think you may be getting confused about using samyama with the sutras. You just say the word faintly, but you don't need to have a feeling with it. The unconscious associations we have with these words takes care of that. When we have inner silence the faint saying of the word of say "love" may be accompanied by the feeling of love and it may be difficult to distinguish one from the other, but we don't try and bring up the feeling.
Using samyama in the way Shanti describes for dealing with strong feeling that arise is different. These are thoughts already laden with strong feelings and the samyama is used to purify these in a very efficient way. This is different than the normal use of the sutras where we don't attempt to latch on a feeling or image to the word.
Yogani said in lesson http://www.aypsite.com/150.html
quote:
In your easy silence, pick up, just once, the fuzziest feeling of the
word "Love" in your own language. Don't deliberately make a clear
pronunciation, or mental images of this or that scene or situation
that represent Love to you. Just have a faint remembrance of Love,
and then let go into your silence, the easy silence you are in as you
pick up the faint meaning of Love. Don't contemplate Love or analyze
it during samyama. Don't think about it at all. Just come to it once
in a faint, subtle way, and then let go into silence. It is a subtle
feeling of Love we are coming to, nothing more, and letting it go.
Like that.
Shanti's suggestions are more in line with, and an extension of the AYP practices so this is probably the way to go if you find it helpful outside of normal practice.
My 2 cents |
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Maatsuah
USA
33 Posts |
Posted - Mar 11 2008 : 08:39:49 AM
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Thanks for your response Sparkle.
I forgot this is the other spiritual practices thread so I guess I will experiment with your suggestion after I spend a few more weeks doing Samyama. I feel as though I am getting more out of Samyama over the past week of practice because I read the instructions a few more times and stopped worrying about doing it perfectly. Now when I do Akasha I feel so light I actually feel as though I am flying through the darkness in my head although I have to admit that I don't actually levitate physically.
Thanks again for your insight. |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Mar 11 2008 : 09:27:55 AM
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quote:
although I have to admit that I don't actually levitate physically.
Ah, don't worry about it, a few more weeks and you'll be grand (joke)
I havn't read of anyone here actually levitating, but when you do get round to trying the above technique you never know |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Mar 12 2008 : 07:41:31 AM
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I'm realising now that this may be quite an advanced practice so if you have tried it and it doesn't work for you, don't worry, it might come in time
What I didn't realise is that, the more inner silence one has, the more effective it is. It seems to amplify everything including the effect on the sutra and also the inner silence.
It also demonstrates very effectively the fact that inner silence is independant of the positive and negitive. In fact the introduction of the other pole of the thought brings more balance to that "mental formation" and is probably the reason everything is amplified.
It is probably best to leave this out of the routine AYP practices and try it as an outside practice. But be careful, it can be powerful and lead to overload if you are on the edge.
A simple evercise is one that emc described above. With inner silence just simply say your own name and then say the negitive of it.
Like; emc/not emc or Sparkle/not Sparkle
an alternative is; emc/no emc or Sparkle/no Sparkle
If you don't get it first time, try it at different occasions and sometime you might be lifted out of it - don't say I didn't warn you
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Mar 12 2008 : 2:04:19 PM
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Hi Louis,
Thanks for sharing this. After I read your post, I was kinda confused with what was going on with the "thing".."no thing".
So I went back and read the Heart Sutra commentaries by Thich Nhat Hanh .. and picked the line:
"Form is empty, Emptiness is form."..
"form=shakti/movement" and
"no-form/emptiness=Shiva/silence/stillness".
OK.. so now your post makes sense..
no-akasha---akasha----no-akasha ...
no-form---form---no-from .... or
Shiva---Shakti---Shiva... Or
gap---thought---gap..
no breath---breath---no breath.
Thanks Louis.. it all ties up nicely now.
Honestly, I have not tried your technique seriously.. I still find it too mindy to implement.. too many words for samyama (for me  ).. but since you worked with the Heart Sutra before, and have a Zen Buddhist background.. I can see why it was easy for you to implement. Like you said.. it maybe too advanced for me to "get". Will give it a fair shot and report back if I "get" it.
Thanks for sharing Louis.
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Mar 13 2008 : 11:15:02 AM
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Thanks Shweta for the research and giving it a try.
Obviously I didn't do a good job in explaining it.
The thing is, I'm not sure if any explanations are necessary. It grew in me as an organic number of insights over time and just happened. So not sure if someone could just simply apply the simple technique and have it work. I would love to know this.
Now that you are happy with some form of intellectual explanation. It might be best to forget about it and sometime it might occur to you to use it. It really is not to mindy when you don't try and attach any explanation to it.
For me sometimes there is not much difference when using it and then other times it elevates the practice onto a different level.
How it actually works is not obvious to me, the above are some possible explanations I have come up with.
quote:
"Form is empty, Emptiness is form."..
"form=shakti/movement" and
"no-form/emptiness=Shiva/silence/stillness".
Thanks for pointing that out about emptiness is form and form is emptiness. I think it provides a missing link in my explanations
In a poem I wrote some time ago, it might go further, towards explaining how it developed for me, but again it does not account for the dramatic difference it can make to my practice, just by simply applying it.
I am looking at a rose
and realise I am not looking at a rose
the word rose is something I have learned from the past, a memory, I am not looking at a memory.
I am looking at the petals
and realise I am not looking at the petals
I am looking at the beautiful shades and textures and know there are no such things.
I am looking at the colours
and realise that colours don't exist.
I am looking, and realise that the concept of looking
does not exist.
I am three months old again
and know no words, no colours, no textures, no shapes, no concepts.
I am ........................................................................
.................................................................................
This could also read
rose/no rose
petals/no petals
shades/no shades
textures/no textures
colours/no colours
looking/no looking
I am..................
btw. I had "tongue in cheek" when commenting on advanced practices |
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Samyama and The Heart Sutra
