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 Variant of AYP lesson 13
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selfonlypath

France
297 Posts

Posted - Feb 17 2008 :  02:05:24 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Message
Hi,

I'm still hesitating to practice AYP 13 for different personal reasons and was wondering if it is possible to replace the inner mantra part by just gazing a candle. I mean, the rest of this lesson would remained totally inchanged (i.e. observing the mind loosing the focus on the candle then reconnect).

In fact, the candle method I'm interested is a bit shamanic: setting a triangle with 3 candles (2 white and 1 purple) where I would sit inside the triangle and gaze the pruple one.

P.S. I was not sure were to post this question so please move it to the appropriate area ?

Albert

selfonlypath

France
297 Posts

Posted - Mar 14 2008 :  12:38:22 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi,

Is it possible to use another mantra than I AM to practice successfully this meditation ?

Thank you, Albert
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LittleTurtle

USA
342 Posts

Posted - Mar 14 2008 :  2:23:39 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
If you feel drawn to candle gazing (tratak) instead of mantra, I say go for it. Tratak is a very good method, and especially powerful for some folks (myself included). Although Yogani teaches AYP using certain methods and in a particular order according to how the individual is progressing, it is an open system and if I read Yogani correctly the whole point is to be your own guru, use methods that work and stick with it, self pacing all the way.
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Shanti

USA
4854 Posts

Posted - Mar 14 2008 :  10:08:18 PM  Show Profile  Visit Shanti's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Albert,
Have you tried the AYP deep meditation as described in lesson 13? If not, maybe worth giving it a try.
In lesson Lesson 21 - Meditation Q&A – Objects of meditation Yogani says:

quote:
What is the difference between meditating with our technique using a
mantra, versus using chakras (energy centers in the body), a
religious icon or other physical objects? Again, it is a matter of
simplicity and efficiency. The goal is to bring the attention beyond
the thinking process, and, in doing so, take the attention beyond
outer sensory experience. The mind is the neurological process in us
that links consciousness with the outer world. It is a very intimate
connection. Our attention, engaged in the dynamics of the mind, is
always an inch away from experiencing the divine bliss of pure
consciousness. When the mind is allowed to come to rest, we are
there. So we begin with the mind, the most intimate connection to
bliss consciousness we have. We begin inside, so we can quickly and
easily go deeply inside. If we were to begin with a physical location
in the body or a physical object, we could still go deep. No question
about it. But it is a longer journey, a more complicated journey. The
further outside we are when we start, the more physical, intellectual
and emotional baggage we have to shed on the way in. This is also why
we do not verbally utter the mantra during meditation, or give any
attention to meanings while meditating. It is an inner process right
from the start. By beginning meditation with a thought, using the
specific procedure, we bypass external obstacles in the nervous
system that can bind our attention. Ultimately we dissolve them
naturally from the inside going out, rather than trying to dissolve
them from the outside going in, which is not easy.

We begin with a thought, not focusing on any meaning, just picking up
the repetition of the thought of the mantra's sound easily, on the
edge of letting go. We let the mantra go its own way naturally to
less and less – this is the simplest and most efficient way to dive
into the infinite sea of bliss consciousness within us. Having done
so repeatedly, we come back out after twenty minutes soaked with
peace and bliss, achieving much purification during the process.

In time, the distance between consciousness and outside experiences
evaporates as the obstructions become less and less. There was really
no distance at all! Then it becomes natural to experience many shades
of bliss consciousness while gazing upon chakras, religious icons,
our loved ones, beautiful landscapes, scriptures, or even a book on
theoretical physics. When bliss consciousness has arisen, everything
is seen in terms of that. But this is not the procedure of
meditation. This is enjoying the fruit of meditation – living life
with an increasing appreciation of its many gifts. The rise of this
appreciation inspires us all the more to carry on with our practice.



And to answer your second question... in Lesson 59 - Q&A – Some mantra particulars Yogani says:
quote:
The I AM mantra is similar to OM, but not exactly the same, so the
effects are somewhat different. I AM has both linear and circular
qualities contained within it, while OM is circular. "I" is the
linear quality in I AM. "AM" is the circular quality in I AM. So you
can see I AM has something extra. What is that something extra? It is
a polarity. OM is well known to be the sound of kundalini moving
through the body, the nervous system becoming enlivened as sexual
essences circulate higher up and a new biology emerges. Many can hear
it. OM is the sound of Mother Nature in us, and she is ecstatic
bliss. Ahhh…

OM is mother. But where is father? As we become enlightened, a divine
romance occurs in us, a joining. In the I AM mantra, "I" is the
father vibration, and "AM" is the mother vibration. Recall that yoga
means "to join." This happens on many levels in many ways. In
meditation, we are refining the vibrations of the mantra every day to
stillness, to silence, to pure bliss consciousness, over and over
again. Using I AM as mantra, we are cultivating pure bliss
consciousness fully through the nervous system, permeating the
natural polarity that exists within us. We are enlivening both divine
masculine and divine feminine qualities within us at the same time.
This has a direct relationship to the dynamics in the spinal nerve,
and to the dynamics of kundalini. More on that later. The thing to
understand here is that I AM has some special characteristics. This
may sound theoretical, but it becomes very experiential in time. As
your experience advances, you will find that the vibrational quality
of the mantra has a direct correspondence with inner ecstatic
experiences that constitute a consummation of polarities going on in
the nervous system. It is a complex, but automatic, process we
stimulate with our daily practice.


Hope these help.

Like LT said above, you are welcome to try what you feel comfortable with.
Wish you all the best.

Edited by - Shanti on Mar 14 2008 10:18:03 PM
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Guy_51

USA
170 Posts

Posted - Mar 15 2008 :  12:13:22 AM  Show Profile  Visit Guy_51's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Dear Shanti:

Thanks for taking the time to point out these lessons. You have a wonderful sense of timing.
Guy

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selfonlypath

France
297 Posts

Posted - Mar 15 2008 :  02:48:43 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Dear Shanti,

I did read a few weeks lessons 1 through 38 but did not fully grasp what you've just clarified which i thank you so much. After, I did tried a bit I AM mantra then tried tratak but spirit told me to stop and rather focus on another mantra used through AYP 13 meditation.

Your explanation about mantra design and embedded information is really connected to quechua shamanism views of crossing the two energies to create consciousness.

Do you think using another mantra with two syllables will be compatible with AYP 13 medidation. I mean, OM mantra is one syllable, I AM mantra has two syllables to charge father-mather polarities. Spirit is whispering me a two syllables shamanic mantra i received 4 years ago but when writing this mantra, it is only one word hence no space between the two syllables whereas writing I AM is via writing two words with a space between.

Namaste, Albert

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Shanti

USA
4854 Posts

Posted - Mar 15 2008 :  08:23:41 AM  Show Profile  Visit Shanti's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by selfonlypath

Do you think using another mantra with two syllables will be compatible with AYP 13 medidation. I mean, OM mantra is one syllable, I AM mantra has two syllables to charge father-mather polarities. Spirit is whispering me a two syllables shamanic mantra i received 4 years ago but when writing this mantra, it is only one word hence no space between the two syllables whereas writing I AM is via writing two words with a space between.


Hi Albert,
I am not very good at analyzing the vibration of mantras etc. In AYP, we suggest I AM because Yogani has done a lot of work with it and has found it to be the safest and most effective mantra to get started with. In Lesson 188 - Q&A – Mantra Design 101 Yogani says:
quote:
Mantra syllables are like tuning forks in the nervous system. Each
vibration resonates in a different part of our inner circuitry. This
is true with or without ecstatic conductivity previously awakened.
The difference is that, when the nervous system is ecstatically
awakened, the effects become experiential, and can be observed in the
body. The effects are experienced with the inner senses and have an
ecstatic overtone. The resonating effect of a syllable deep in the
silence of the mind loosens obstructions in a particular way unique
to that syllable. With that experience-based feedback, and knowing
the most effective and safest order of awakening the nervous system,
especially the spinal nerve, the mantras can be suitably assembled.
Let's get more specific.

I AM (by any spelling) resonates in the full length of the spinal
nerve from the third eye to the root.

This has not been said before in the lessons. It has only been hinted
at. It has not been mentioned because I don't want to encourage
anyone to think the mantra in any particular location in the body.
The mantra resonates naturally with the particular part of the
nervous system it is attuned to. We don't have to help it by
directing it here or there. In fact, we can interfere with the
natural resonance by doing that. So, don't locate the mantra, okay?
Just pick it up easily and effortlessly wherever it may be, as
always, and let it refine. If I AM is coming up in the feet, or
anywhere else, it will resonate from the third eye to the root. Just
as a tuning fork will vibrate the corresponding string of an
instrument if brought anywhere in the vicinity.

Having said that, now you can do an experiment and observe if you
want. If you think the sound "I," maybe you can feel the subtle
neurology in the head reaching out through the center of the brow. If
not, no matter. That is where it naturally vibrates. No need to help
it or feel it. That is where it is. Now, if you think the sound "AM,"
maybe you can feel it going naturally down through the center of the
body. If not, well, no matter. When ecstatic conductivity comes up
you will. Feeling it has no bearing on the effectiveness of the
mantra. Feeling it is only a symptom of the degree of purification we
have in the nervous system, and the degree of ecstatic conductivity
(kundalini) we have coming up. It will come to all of us as we
continue with daily practices. When we do feel the mantra
ecstatically like that, and notice our attention off in thoughts
about the sensation, location in the body, etc., we treat it like any
other experience that comes up in meditation and easily go back to
the mantra. Nothing changes in the procedure of meditation. Only the
experiences change to become more ecstatic and divine, so we have to
be mindful not to get preoccupied with them during meditation and our
other practices.

As has been said in earlier lessons, I AM is a "dual pole" mantra.
The resonance of it in the spinal nerve is the reason why. "I" is the
shiva component, and "AM" is the shakti component. With this mantra
we are bringing the mind to stillness in such a way so as to purify
the full length of the spinal nerve. By using a mantra that resonates
between the third eye and the root, we are following the safest and
most balanced path of awakening, just as we do in spinal breathing
pranayama. The two practices are parallel methods, both working to
purify the spinal nerve on their respective levels in the nervous
system. Both practices, done in sequence (spinal breathing and then
meditation), awaken and stabilize our ecstatic energies and inner
silence. Together, these emanate out naturally from the spinal nerve.


In AYP, we do not tell people what to do, we just make suggestions and let your inner guru be your guide.
Wish you all the best. May you find what you are looking for.
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Sparkle

Ireland
1457 Posts

Posted - Mar 15 2008 :  10:49:53 AM  Show Profile  Visit Sparkle's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Just to expand a little on what Shanti has said through Yogani's words.
In using the I AM which automatically operating from root to brow, it corresponds with the spinal breathing pranayama which also goes from root to brow.

There is a very good reason for this, it is safety.
It means the practitioner is keeping the energy away from the crown. It has been found that premature crown opening can cause a lot of problems once the kundalini has started.
In fact unregulated practice through the crown is probably the reason why so many people go from dramatic highs to dramatic lows even without the kundalini.
There is a common belief out there that pain is a natural consequence of spiritual growth. This belief has come about most probably through people working with the crown.

So no matter what system you adopt, please bear these things in mind and don't forget to self-pace http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....OPIC_ID=2139
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