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trip1
USA
739 Posts |
 Posted - Jan 11 2008 : 5:27:38 PM
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Anybody have any experience with Polyphasic Sleep? I've been looking into it a bit and wanted to see if I could find anyone that has tried and/or is currently practicing it. It's definitely something that interests me, but I wouldn't want to jump into anything that will have a negative effect on my AYP practices. This is my main concern.
For those unfamiliar with Polyphasic Sleep, the gist of it is taking six 20-30 minute naps per day, in four hour intervals, as opposed to a regular night's sleep. The idea behind it is that over time, you can train your body to enter REM sleep almost immediately, allowing for much faster rejuvenation of the body and less time needed sleeping.
It also crossed my mind that a daily meditation practice could already be helping with this process, which could be part of the reason why long time meditators have been known to require less sleep than their non-meditating counterparts.
Anyways, thanks for reading and I'll be looking forward to any responses on the subject before beginning my experiment. 
-Brett |
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anthony574
USA
549 Posts |
Posted - Jan 11 2008 : 10:49:29 PM
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I read in Yoga and Psychotherapy by Swami Rama that after years of yoga practice one's need for REM sleep, which serves the purpose of what could be considered a decompression of unconcious material which is accomplished through meditation, decreases so that a yogi requires only non-REM sleep which is usually about 4 hours.
Polyphasic sleep sounds interesting, but it would be very impractical I think for most people. |
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trip1
USA
739 Posts |
Posted - Jan 11 2008 : 11:42:58 PM
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Hi Anthony,
Thanks for the response. I'm sure Swami Rama knows more about the subject than I, so I'll take his word for it until direct experience tells me otherwise. 
Regarding the impracticality of polyphasic sleep for most, it would really depend on the individual I'd think. Seeing as it allows for over 20 hours of waking time per day, even a very busy individual could benefit from it as they would spend less time sleeping and more time doing. The major downside for most I'd think would be the first two weeks or so, where the body and mind are making the adjustment to the new sleep cycle. Another prerequisite of course would be a fairly flexible daily schedule & lifestyle in order to maintain the sleep schedule.
I should also mention that I am certainly not promoting this way of sleep, nor do I think that it is for everyone, as I am just starting to learn about it now. From what I've gathered thus far, the whole idea of polyphasic sleep is currently just a theory without any scientific data to back it up. I've just been recently kicking around some thoughts on how to safely sleep less, and theories without any scientific data to back them up tend to be right up my alley.
I've started reading a blog which covers one man's journey into the practice and throughout. It starts with the decision to try polyphasic sleep, is recorded (intermittently) over 5 1/2 months, and ends with his decision to return to monophasic sleep, with all the reasons why. Very interesting reading even if you aren't interested in trying it yourself.
http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/20...hasic-sleep/
-Brett |
Edited by - trip1 on Jan 12 2008 12:57:54 AM |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Jan 12 2008 : 12:59:44 AM
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Brett, thanks a lot for bringing this up. I'm very interested in looking into it at some point.
I've been diagnosed with sleep apnea very recently and I want to see how the treatment for that plays out before I try anything like this. But it sounds like something I'd be interested in looking into.
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trip1
USA
739 Posts |
Posted - Jan 12 2008 : 02:01:00 AM
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Hi David,
Great to see some more interest! I haven't read much yet regarding the use of polyphasic sleep in the treatment of sleep disorders, but will keep the thread updated with any more info which I happen across on that side of things.
Maybe I'm just looking for a new challenge, but I've decided to take the plunge in the name of exploration and just took my second nap at 12:00AM. Reading more about it all has really sparked my curiosity, and I think that the overall waking/sleeping schedule could work very well with my current lifestyle. I also consider myself to be a fairly disciplined person, and am interested to see if I can make it past the initial adjustment phase.
Watch this space. |
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tadeas
Czech Republic
314 Posts |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Jan 12 2008 : 07:57:56 AM
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I would be interested in hearing more about this and maybe trying a variation of it, as some stage.
My sleep would generally be four to five hours and the rest of the time would be spent relaxing. This is way it has been since my teens and it seems to work ok.
I have tried getting up around 4.30 to 5am when I usually wake, but by the end of the day I'm pretty wreaked.
My Father was great at what was called "cat napping". He used to do some "lone sailing" on yachts and would cat nap his way around the clock, maybe it was polyphasic sleep he was doing
So maybe four hours sleep and then a few naps during the day might be worth a try.
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trip1
USA
739 Posts |
Posted - Jan 12 2008 : 09:21:44 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by tadeas
Hi, there's an interesting article I've read some years ago and Steve Pavlina also (unfavourably) mentioned it at some point.
http://supermemo.com/articles/polyphasic.htm
Hi tadeas,
I saw that article linked in Steve Pavlina's blog as well, but I'm pretty sure that he only mentioned it "unfavorably" due to the fact that he received it about 4 months (and very well settled) into his sleep schedule and the article states: "Whoever claims to be on a perpetual polyphasic schedule must be either suffering from a sleep disorder, or be a liar, a mutant, or a person with a mulishly stubborn iron-will that lets him plod through the daily torture of sleep deprivation". Steve's unfavorable mentioning was all in fun I think, as the article basically says that what he had done is impossible.
In the same vein, I could probably pull up 50x as many articles that say something similar about meditation and other spiritual practices (or global warming for that matter). 
Sparkle: I had initially been working on a similar schedule of my own consisting of roughly 4 hours sleep and a few catnaps throughout the day, but after a google search led me to these methods and I learned a bit more about how sleep and its cycles work, it seemed to make more sense to sleep less. I'd highly recommend reading through the blog that I posted a link to a few messages up. It is an extremely comprehensive documentation of the entire process, including a ton of information on the sleep cycles and why/how this method works. Also, it definitely sounds like your father may have been a polyphasic sleeper.
Just wrapped up my 8:00AM nap following my morning practices and feeling better than I thought I would. The next few days will be the real test, though. Onward! |
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yogani
USA
5201 Posts |
Posted - Jan 12 2008 : 10:13:54 AM
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Hi Brett:
Thomas Edison kept a cot in his laboratory and was known to work around the clock for extended periods, taking cat naps every few hours. Not sure if he did this all his life. It must have driven his employees crazy.
Haven't tried it myself. My sleep cycle goes from very short to very long, with naps being rare. It seems to have a life of its own. Good thing I am "retired" ... Ha!
The guru is in you.
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trip1
USA
739 Posts |
Posted - Jan 12 2008 : 11:40:11 AM
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Hi Yogani,
Thanks for the response. Regarding Thomas Edison, it's certainly nice to know that I'm in good company.
I figure at the least this will be a very interesting experiment with the possibility of many benefits. I'll also be documenting the process and keeping a close tab on any effects in my AYP practices.
Almost naptime... |
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tadeas
Czech Republic
314 Posts |
Posted - Jan 13 2008 : 2:52:00 PM
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Do you have dreams Yogani? I'm interested in your (or anyone else's) experience of what Anthony mentioned.
quote:
Originally posted by anthony574
I read in Yoga and Psychotherapy by Swami Rama that after years of yoga practice one's need for REM sleep, which serves the purpose of what could be considered a decompression of unconcious material which is accomplished through meditation, decreases so that a yogi requires only non-REM sleep which is usually about 4 hours.
I think in the book they say the 4 hours would be spent in yoga nidra which gets one straight to the deep sleep phase. Anyone with that experience? I think it can be a good technique for someone who's already purified the nervous system to a high level, therefore without the need to "decompress". I believe they call this "clear light" in tibetian buddhism. |
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yogani
USA
5201 Posts |
Posted - Jan 13 2008 : 3:50:16 PM
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Hi Tadeas:
My sleep cycle is normal as far as I can tell, with the variations mentioned above. However, my perception of it is very different than it was years ago. Much more presence of inner silence/witness now.
That is pretty much the message of yoga. Life's experiences will go on. However, our relationship to them will change dramatically over time.
There is an issue with "sleep techniques" which is seldom highlighted by those who promote them. If they are undertaken before there is sufficient inner silence/witness to support them, there can be the hazards of sleep deprivation. It is the same with premature self-inquiry (non-relational - without witness), which also has hazards.
The guru is in you.
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cosmic_troll
USA
229 Posts |
Posted - Feb 01 2008 : 01:18:36 AM
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Interesting topic, Trip. I haven't tried polyphasic sleep, although I've read about it with curiosity. Buckminster Fuller advocated 30 minute naps every 6 hours (4x per day). This is probably more practical for many people than every 4 hours. But as you alluded to, it depends on the individual and their lifestyle.
How is it working out for you?
It seems like a lot of the people who advocate polyphasic sleep are people we normally consider "geniuses". Don't know if there's a direct correlation.
Considering that one full sleep cycle lasts about 90 minutes, I wonder if this can be done 2 or 3 times per day, with similar effectiveness. This would give about 3 to 4.5 hours of sleep per day.
On a side note, I've been working the night shift for the past week or so. Personally, I find that by sleeping during the day, I seem to be able to function on less sleep than normal (I get about 6 hours instead of 8). I don't understand how it all works though.
Let us know how it goes.
Peace
cosmic |
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insideout
USA
44 Posts |
Posted - Feb 01 2008 : 11:27:16 PM
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quote:
I'll also be documenting the process and keeping a close tab on any effects in my AYP practices.
I've tried polyphasic sleep when I was a student but never made it through the adaptation period. In my opinion it will completely derail your practices during the first 2 weeks because of the huge sleep debt you accumulate while adapting. Any sort of relaxation with closed eyes will call the sandman within a split second. At least that was the case with me.
After the adaptation though it would be a very useful to be awake for 20 hours out of every 24. You could probably do 3 or even 4 sitting practices per day without it seeming like meditation is taking up any more time than it is now. |
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trip1
USA
739 Posts |
Posted - Feb 07 2008 : 01:55:38 AM
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Hi Everyone,
Guess I'm due for an update here. I've now been on a polyphasic sleep schedule for 4 weeks, and with some adjustments along the way have found a schedule that has ended up working great with my lifestyle.
As mentioned in my original posts, I started out with what is called the "Uberman" schedule, consisting of 20 minute naps every 4 hours. The adaptation period is definitely not for the weak, as to make this work you have to seriously deprive your body of sleep until it agrees to move directly into REM during your naps. Using this schedule, any type of oversleep (longer then 20 minutes) is pretty much suicide, as I found out the hard way on day five. I had attempted my sitting practices leading into the naps, and apparently one time went into a nap a bit too deep and slept for a few extra hours. I didn't have much of a chance after this and after trying to get back on schedule, ended up delirious the following morning and crashed hard.
After an "extended nap", I woke up feeling better and figured I would try again after a few days recovery until I noticed that my body was still getting tired right on schedule. This led me to believe that progress had been made so after reading a bit more online about something called the "Everyman" schedule, decided to jump right back in and give it a shot. The main difference between this schedule and the Uberman is the use of a three hour core sleep in addition to the naps. At this point my schedule looked like this:
Core Sleep: 4AM-7AM
Nap1: 11:00-11:20AM
Nap2: 4:00-4:20PM
Nap3: 8:00-8:20PM
Nap4: 12:00-12:20AM
I started hitting REM sleep pretty quickly with this schedule, likely due to my bout with Uberman, and have been going ever since. I somehow managed not to oversleep for two weeks straight and after a some serious battles with mind and body, now feel completely adjusted. Since the beginning I have made a few small adjustments to the schedule including sliding my core sleep back a half hour and dropping one of the naps. My current and hopefully final schedule looks like this:
Core: 3:30-6:30AM
Nap1: 12:00-12:20PM
Nap2: 5:00-5:20PM
Nap3: 10:00-10:20PM
At this point I enter into REM sleep within a few minutes of laying down and at times even wake up before the alarm goes off. I'm always very refreshed following the naps and liken it to a robot plugging itself into an outlet for 20 minutes to recharge. The benefit of being awake 20 hours per day has been a huge boon to my productivity, as I'm currently involved in five large scale projects in addition to my home business. While before I would always feel rushed and that there wasn't enough time, with this schedule I've found that everything gets the attention it needs, and that there are certain times of the day when I work better at certain things. Not to mention the fact that I get to stay up late and still be a morning person!
There are a few side effects that I've noticed which I wasn't expecting, but at the same time aren't surprising in the least. The main one is that healing time seems to be much slower using this schedule. For instance, I helped a friend move about week ago and ended up with a few cuts and bruises along the way. Four days later I noticed that nothing was healing and actually starting to hurt a bit more, possibly from infection, so I enlisted the help of a few supplements and a bit of neosporin which seemed to do the trick. I'm now taking a few supplements daily including vitamin C as an immune booster for this purpose. Of course, if I were to fall ill I'd would sleep accordingly and go back to the schedule once better, which is also recommended by others using this schedule.
Other than that and some minor muscle cramps, everything is going great and I really can't see myself going back to a regular sleep schedule unless either needed for health reasons, or if it simply no longer fit my lifestyle. Heck, there might even come a time when I won't have enough work to keep me busy for 20 hours straight (yeah right ). For now though, I'm gonna keep on truckin until the universe decides otherwise.
If anyone has any questions, please feel free to ask.
Brett |
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insideout
USA
44 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2008 : 01:12:57 AM
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Hi Brett.
Can you say a little more on the effect of this sleeping schedule on your yoga practices? Are your inner energy levels about the same? Is it more difficult to concentrate? Has it affected your sexual drive at all?
Thanks |
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AYPforum
351 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2008 : 10:58:25 AM
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| Moderator note: Topic moved for better placement |
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selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
Posted - Feb 10 2008 : 01:48:21 AM
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Hey,
The book "Tibetan Yogas of Dream and Sleep" written by Tenzin Wangyal Rinpoche is one of best on this subject:
http://www.amazon.fr/Tibetan-Yogas-...25059&sr=1-1
This approach is also used in non tibetan shamanism under *ascetic path" in the case of sleep deprivation.
This yoga has many subsets, one of them being lucid dreaming as very powerful healing system in particular if an energy rush comes while in that state.
I'm personnaly experiencing for a few years sleeping very very very little everyday. My wife says i'm a mutant but have in mind I did not choose this yoga, the all thing came naturally. At the beginning I thought it was impossible to still be OK on mundane situations (I'm father of 2 children of respective age 7 and 9, i work as a full time engineer).
N.B. I still do need lucid and non lucid flash naps in the afternoon which can be a problem with my samsaric activities.
Albert |
Edited by - selfonlypath on Feb 10 2008 02:59:51 AM |
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Polyphasic Sleep
