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gumpi
United Kingdom
546 Posts |
 Posted - Jan 18 2007 : 11:48:10 AM
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Hello
I sometimes wonder if i am not supposed to be a meditator. Is there such a thing?
These days i can sit up with back support on my bed or lay down in bed easily for 20 minutes completely still.
When i finish meditating i don't feel like talking out loud and i feel depressed.
I tried buddhist meditation by just concentrating on the breath alone. I was having real difficulties accepting the existence of God so one day i decided to forget God in meditation. That day when i got up after meditating, i felt a tangible pleasant sensation in my body and mind with a touch of calmness. I thought for the first time in 4 years of meditating, "yes, this works!" and i didnt consider to be bliss or such like. It was just a nice feeling of relaxation. After that i thought i had "nailed it" and could reproduce that feeling from then on whenever i wanted to meditate. Sadly, i have not reproduced it ever since.
So to the mind. Apart from usual thoughts that come and go as words and images, i also have MUSIC IN MY HEAD THAT WONT STOP. I really want it to stop. But my mind itself is a bundle of thoughts that never stop either. I just want it to shut up.
I believe in God now because of my experiences with synchronicity and dreams that later come true. However, these experiences just HAPPEN to me from nowhere and i do not will them to happen. Also however, my mind doesnt suddenley go quiet when they happen and i have read many times that intuition develops when the mind is calm. What is going on with that?
In Yogananda's SRF Lessons, he teaches that real concentration begins when the heart becomes calm to enable the senses to switch off ie pratyahara. The theory basically says that if you purify your blood by eating non-carbon producing foods (ie fruits and vegetables) only, and you relax in meditation, venous blood doesnt need to be pumped from the heart back to the lungs and consequently the heart becomes calm along with the breath. I havent seen anyone mention this on APY before. It seems like the biggest point in the whole SRF/kriya thing. Kriya speeds up this process of pratyahara when you do the spinal breathing breath, which sends extra oxygen into the blood hence purifying it more quickly. Why hasnt anyone mentioned this?
Not very long after i sit to meditate, my breathing slows down in between the inhale and exhale, i mean, it stops for small periods. This is when the music at the back of my head likes to play.
I tried I AM mantra before quite a few times. I don't understand why this is considered to be special in any way. After all, God didnt invent language, man did. And all the effect i got out of this practice was almost identical to the music that seems to be playing in the back of my mind. How can using the mind to silence the mind even work? It seems like a contradiction.
When people talk about states of conscious awareness without thoughts, i cannot but wonder, "how can you not think?" This is a question and subject that i've never been able to get my head around.
Yogani says that semen goes up the spine. This is a strange teaching to me. I have never read or heard of it before. On the contrary, the only thing i can compare it to is Vivekananda's ojas energy.
So i just don't know if i am suited to meditation. Nothing ever seems to happen. I certainly don't go deep inside ever. It is probably worth my saying that i drink and smoke often. But i think it is unfair to expect me to stop these things (since i seem to have very little will power) and not to meditate at the same time. I knew of lots of people who were alcoholics who started meditation and had bliss states. No fair.
But one of the things that really upsets me is that when i start meditating, i feel a massive pressure in my head like my brain is heating up. It is highly unpleasant. I can feel it now in fact. It is very difficult to describe. After meditating today my head felt like it was a fuse that had blown.
Very sorry to inflict this post. It probably conveys my depressed state of mind wonderfully.:)) |
Edited by - AYPforum on Jan 31 2007 08:17:00 AM |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Jan 18 2007 : 12:19:55 PM
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Hi gumpi,
To help us help you, please let us know what kind of meditating and practices you are currently doing. You mentioned you tried the "I am" deep meditation, are you still doing this now? Are you doing pranayama too? How long have you been doing the specific type of practices you are doing now? Are you changing methods frequetly? Also please include specifics like duration, number of sessions per day etc.
Overall, it sounds like perhaps you are a little "over" in your practices and may need to cut back.
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Jan 18 2007 : 12:20:03 PM
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Hi Gumpi,
Sorry to hear you are having difficulties.I don't think that there is such a thing as not being suitable to be a meditator but I do believe that one needs guidance and support wherever one may get that from and you certainly will here.Let me say that if one is trying to follow the path of Yoga to reach God then I don't believe everyone in this lifetime is suitable at this moment but all will gain benefit from meditation.The path is made more difficult if one is having what they consider 'bad' experiences.We are all different and are at different levels , each requiring different amounts of purification.The thoughts and music that you are experiencing are signs of the purification process and will change in their own good time, one cannot dictate what happens in meditation or else it no longer becomes meditation.Meditation is more about what we don't do, rather than what we do and I prefer not to talk of concentrating on anything as I think it implies we are forcing something to happen rather than to just let it be.
As far as smoking and drinking goes , you will decide for yourself if you wish to stop and nobody should try to force you to. I simply tell my students that the desire for these things will go if they go and it will be their choice.I would advise you to read the lessons closely if you haven' already as they will give you further guidance.
L&L
Dave |
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VIL
USA
586 Posts |
Posted - Jan 18 2007 : 2:18:41 PM
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gumpi,
You're not as far from God as you think. The symbol on the top of the AYP Forum, that looks like a three, as I'm sure you are aware, represents AUM:
1: A - Vaishvanara - Waking State - Conscious Mind - Gross World
2: U - Taijasa - Dream State - Active Unconscious - Subtle Plane
3: M - Prajna - Deep Sleep State - Latent Unconscious - Causal Plane
4: SILENCE - God Realization - Bindu [mustard seed] - Fourth State - Absolute Consciousness - Pure consciousness - Atman/Brahman/Self
I would listen to the music. I mean, really pay attention to it. Maybe you will gain addt'l insight about yourself or maybe the background music/noise will disappear, since the mind tends to become easily bored and will eventually find it's place within silence. Or maybe what you're hearing isn't really music, but the HUM [AUM] of the Universe:
http://www.swamij.com/om.htm
quote:
The Yoga of AUM
It might be said that the ultimate aim of Yoga is to enter this third dreamless realm while awake. Yoga means "yoke" or "join." Through yoga we "join" our waking consciousness to its "source" in the world of pure, qualitiless unconsciousness.
http://www.spiritsound.com/aum.html
VIL |
Edited by - VIL on Jan 18 2007 2:54:51 PM |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Jan 18 2007 : 6:02:19 PM
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Hi Gumpi,
You are being too impatient for results.
You have to practice consistently twice a day without any expectation of "special" results. Just do it as a natural routine.
When you are too worried about results, your focus is on yourself, and what you are going to "get" from it, and this slows down results. The focus has to be more outside yourself, and letting go, and not expecting something.
If you feel that uncomfortable doing AYP practices, then cut back and just try Zen "sitting" without any mantra or reason or purpose. They just sit quietly for 30 minutes or more. then add on mantra later.
If it is still uncomfortable, then do it shorter, but the way to get results is consistently doing something twice a day, 15 minutes or more if you can. and remove any anxiety about "when am I going to get something?". Just be quiet for no reason. once you decide you are going to be quiet twice a day for a long time to see what effect this has on you, you may begin to see what's behind it.
Don't worry about ANYTHING going on in your head; music, thoughts, whatever. Just let it do whatever it wants as you peacefully try to be quiet. Even if you can't be quiet at all, still sit there and do your best for a while. It is CONSISTENCY AND TIME that makes it work. |
Edited by - Etherfish on Jan 18 2007 6:05:47 PM |
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VIL
USA
586 Posts |
Posted - Jan 18 2007 : 7:23:39 PM
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I agree with Etherfish that practice without expectation is important and understand that there are various schools of thought when it comes to quieting the mind.
What I would do is experiment and if you are still experiencing an overload of thoughts, musical symptoms, et al, and trying to be quiet isn't working then I would focus on your thoughts/musical symptoms, until the mind becomes exhausted and relents to silence. A form of reverse psychology. In other words, it's like telling a child that he can have all of the cookies he wants, until he doesn't want them anymore - rather than sitting the child down in front of a cookie jar explaining that he'll no longer want a cookie once the craving subsides. Both work, and it depends on the person. But again, the most important thing is consistency of practice.
I just wanted to explain the rationale behind my previous post:
VIL |
Edited by - VIL on Jan 18 2007 7:53:41 PM |
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gumpi
United Kingdom
546 Posts |
Posted - Jan 19 2007 : 07:45:39 AM
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Thank you all for your replies.
I just did a 20 min I AM meditation. I think it worked! I've discovered a few things i would like to share.
Firstly, the most important point i've discovered is patience. When i have expectations in meditation i cannot relax and become impatient. This time, i just sat for sitting, rather like doing something routine like brushing teeth. It works!
Secondly, i changed the music that i can't seem to get rid of in my mind to making I AM musical instead. This was effective enough to block out the background music.
Thirdly, i didn't realise i had such a restless wandering mind before! EASING back to mentally intoning I AM in a relaxed way is really rather easy. But oh how my mind wanders!!
So after i got up i felt 3 distinct things. (a) a tangible calmness with (b) a plesant feeling of relaxation that was also tangible. (c) i smiled a REAL smile and felt happy.
If this is meditation, i want more!
I am sorry i inflicted this post on everybody. I have no right to moan and complain to others. My Impatience really was the problem.
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Jan 19 2007 : 1:14:02 PM
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Dear Gumpi,
Nobody will mind you complaining,thats what forums are for, to support others.Patience is one thing you really do need for the path as it can take years to experience tangible results.I find that by having no expectations I am seldom disappointed and often delighted.
L&L
Dave |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Jan 19 2007 : 3:09:24 PM
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So... now that you have experienced this wonderful meditation: DON'T EXPECT IT TO HAPPEN EVER AGAIN!  Don't get dissapointed if it doesn't feel the same again!
In my experience, no meditation session is ever the same. Sometimes it is wonderful, sometimes it is only restlessness. But remember: even the restless sessions are "doing the job" if you continue to come back to the I AM mantra! I have had long periods of restless, unfocused, mind babbling sessions, and just sort of finishing the session with one or two I AM... and it still works! The development is showing later. Just have faith in the method!
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Edited by - emc on Jan 19 2007 3:15:59 PM |
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sadhak
India
604 Posts |
Posted - Jan 20 2007 : 02:20:13 AM
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Hi Gumpi,
Glad to see you've begun on your sessions. As Emc points out, no two sessions will be the same. True, as others have said, that having no expectations is the best way to approach it.
I noted that you have substance dependance. As Dave says, forcing doesn't help. But having a strong desire and intention to kick the habit does, when you couple it with the practices. And when you do get rid of it... 'pop' will come up a whole new perspective, which will transfer you to another level altogether.
My partner was strongly addicted to smoking, and holding on to the desire to kick the addiction, along with sticking to the practices, lead him to kick a 30-year old habit, (within three months of beginning the AYP meditation) which he'd been otherwise trying to unsuccessfully, for the last 10 or so years. I'm not saying it was a cakewalk, but then no gain without pain, they say, don't they?
The best to you on the path. Keep walking traveller, you will arrive! |
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AYPforum
351 Posts |
Posted - Jan 31 2007 : 08:17:00 AM
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| Moderator note: Topic moved for better placement |
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Really upset
