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babaram
5 Posts |
 Posted - Dec 05 2006 : 10:54:42 PM
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| I have only been doing the "deep meditation" with "i am" for a few months now. However, I have been doing some type of meditation for many years. Most of the time I have done TM (for over 20 years) but have tried other types at different times. After all these years of meditation, I'm not sure that I have made any progress. I've seen enough glimpses to keep me going, but, looking back, I'm not sure that I've had any cumulative results. I don't really feel any more enlightened. I am not too sure I'm a better or more loving person. And I find that much of my time in meditation I am restless and uncomfortable or I fall asleep. I have to wonder if I even know how to meditate. It may seem foolish that I have continued, but I am familiar enough with spirituality to be convinced that meditation will provide what I seek. I realize this is rather general and vague, but...any suggestions. |
Edited by - AYPforum on Jan 31 2007 08:18:20 AM |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Dec 05 2006 : 11:36:42 PM
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Hi Barbaram,
You seem to have a solid base of meditation why not add in some spinal breathing and eventually related mudras, this can really help accelerate your progress on the path. Start with five minutes of pranayama spinal breathing and monitor yourself for signs that you need to "self-pace". Eventually increase your time and add in related mudras that are outlined in the AYP Main Lessons link above.
Also are you meditating regularly? I have found great acceleration in my progress since I went to twice a day practices.
good luck,
A |
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cosmic_troll
USA
229 Posts |
Posted - Dec 06 2006 : 12:48:21 AM
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Hi babaram
Don't worry, many of us have felt like that at some point or another. Once in a while, I feel like I haven't made much progress. But then, something happens and I react to it in a more positive way than I would have before. And that feeling of not-much-progress usually passes (for me, anyways). Ever since I committed to the 2x a day practice, I had a breakthrough to a higher place. You will too 
My question for you is: how long are you meditating, and how often? and are you doing any other practices (spinal breathing, samyama, etc.)? Giving us some details will help us give you better suggestions. Sometimes feeling stuck is caused by too much purification. But I don't know if that applies to your situation or not.
Good luck  |
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Kirtanman
USA
1651 Posts |
Posted - Dec 06 2006 : 02:34:46 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by babaram
I have only been doing the "deep meditation" with "i am" for a few months now. However, I have been doing some type of meditation for many years. Most of the time I have done TM (for over 20 years) but have tried other types at different times. After all these years ofmeditation, I'm not sure that I have made any progress. I've seen enough glimpses to keep me going, but, looking back, I'm not sure that I've had any cumulative results. I don't really feel any more enlightened. I am not too sure I'm a better or more loving person. And I find that much of my time in meditation I am restless and uncomfortable or I fall asleep. I have to wonder if I even know how to meditate. It may seem foolish that I have continued, but I am familiar enough with spirituality to be convinced that meditation will provide what I seek. I realize this is rather general and vague, but...any suggestions.
Well, with a name like Babaram, you can't go too wrong!
(As In: Ma Sita Devi will surely be delighted to help you!)
And Welcome to AYP -- as someone who has been exposed to many difference yogic / spirituality / meditation practices .... if any group / approach can help you, AYP can.
And I don't say that in an "evangelical" way -- it's more that the specific value that Yogani brings to the world of yoga and meditation, is an extremely well-distilled articulation of suggested practices - including how each phase should be approached.
However -- hm -- to be candid (as a fellow sadhaka, I feel I owe you nothing less) -- it seems as though there's something missing, either from your practice or the information you're providing (and I don't mean that as a criticism -- it's just that maybe, once we - whoever participates in this thread -- gain more information together, via dialog - we'll be able to offer some more specific suggestions.)
To me, this sounds like someone saying "I've worked out regularly for 20 years - but I'm still out of shape!"
Either that person's perception of what "in shape" means, or their perception of the changes in their body / system -- are not accurate - or - something was sorely missing or counterproductive, in terms their exercise practice (as in: yes, they exercised regularly, but they also ate a gallon of ice cream and had a six pack of beer --- every day.)
I might suggest literally reviewing the AYP lessons from Lesson 1 (or close to) - and for that, I'd suggest getting the book, if you don't have it (*I* wouldn't want to try to read nearly 300 lessons on a computer screen ....!) - and - plus - the book has info that the online lessons do not.
Also - let me ask directly:
How bad to you want it?
How much does realization mean to you?
I consider myself to have been graced with the great good fortune of being utterly unable to turn away from the trajectory of realization.
My serious practice only started about seven years ago - and since then, I've messed up, gotten side tracked, taken a few wrong turns, plateau'd, gotten frustrated, gotten depressed, been derailed by my own ego and karma --- but - I *know* full realization is possible - I've tasted it -- and therefore, my life (including, but not limited to, incarnation on this physical plane) cannot - cannot - be dedicated to anything else.
I hear the refrain
Chid ananda rupah shivo’ ham shivo’ ham
(I am consciousness and bliss. I am Shiva, I am Shiva)
-- and I get tears in my eyes, while driving down the freeway in Silicon Valley -- because this isn't just a snippet of exotic language - or the lofty expressions of a happily stoned ascetic deity with blue skin and three eyes ----- this is REALITY --- EXPERIENCED in THIS body-mind, writing these words - and I have been given the unspeakable privilege of having those glimpses of this reality --- and a map clearing showing the way to the awareness of living as satchidananda, always.
As Adyashanti says - at a certain point - a sadhaka becomes like "a hound who has caught the scent" -- and then --- you catch FIRE.
It took me a few years of solid practice to catch fire.
Materially, 2006 has been one of the worst years of my life.
Spiritually, it's been worth TEN of any other year (and I discovered AYP in 2005 -- and no, these two facts are not coincidence).
And come to thing of it, the last several years have been pretty bad, materially.
Would I do it all over again, to be here ---- here being the _doorstep_ which leads onto the path of realization?
Only a thousand times over.
It sounds like you need just a little taste of what is possible -- and in my experience, if anything can take you there - AYP practice can.
(And if it doesn't seem to be doing so for you - all of us - and Yogani -- are here to help, in every way we can.)
Search around on some keywords in the forum - terms like kechari, bliss, ecstacy, etc. being good ones --- and you'll see:
It's really happening here -- people from all walks of life, all over the world, are having amazing experiences.
And then gently setting them aside as the "scenery" that these experiences are -- and moving forward into Reality.
We'd love nothing more than to have you join us.
My highest single recommendation would be to get brutally honest with yourself:
What do you feel is really holding you back?
Peace & Namaste,
Kirtanman
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Chiron
Russia
397 Posts |
Posted - Dec 08 2006 : 12:42:26 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by babaram
I have only been doing the "deep meditation" with "i am" for a few months now. However, I have been doing some type of meditation for many years. Most of the time I have done TM (for over 20 years) but have tried other types at different times. After all these years of meditation, I'm not sure that I have made any progress. I've seen enough glimpses to keep me going, but, looking back, I'm not sure that I've had any cumulative results. I don't really feel any more enlightened. I am not too sure I'm a better or more loving person. And I find that much of my time in meditation I am restless and uncomfortable or I fall asleep. I have to wonder if I even know how to meditate. It may seem foolish that I have continued, but I am familiar enough with spirituality to be convinced that meditation will provide what I seek. I realize this is rather general and vague, but...any suggestions.
I support Anthem11's advice in that you should try adding pranayama.
If you want to become a more loving person (enlightenment=infinite love) try this meditation after your AYP practices:
Sit down on the floor in the most comfortable position for you with hands placed in Dharmadhatu mudra (http://www.wwzc.org/translations/Th...image010.jpg). Now in your mind bring up the faces of the people that you have/had personal connections with, starting from family and friends and ending with anyone you may not like saying "I love you, I wish for you to be enlightened". Try that for 20 minutes for a few days and see how it feels. This is kind of a manual approach while the AYP practices will do this for you automatically if you do them regularly and correctly.
Also during your daily activities or idle moments try to keep your mind constantly one-pointed on God/Love/Truth/Peace/infinity/Enlightenment/Ultimate Now/your highest ideal. That means instead of letting your mind run wild, keep thinking the same thought eg. "I love you dear Lord" or "I am infinite love" etc.. But this will require alot of bhakti or faith and it seems you are lacking some right now.
In the end, with any question that you have, you yourself can answer it, only you have to try asking yourself. Sit down with eyes closed and keep asking yourself the questions that bother you. Discuss things with your self, or in other words, contemplate. After a while the answers are bound to come. There is no need to seek answers on the outside, all the answers that you need are already inside you. The guru is in you!
PS. This message came from deep inside yourself ;) |
Edited by - Chiron on Dec 08 2006 06:35:40 AM |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Dec 08 2006 : 1:32:13 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by babaram
I have only been doing the "deep meditation" with "i am" for a few months now.
I have to wonder if I even know how to meditate.
Hi Babaram, welcome to the forum.
You have started the "i am" meditation right? Well, if you can...
quote:
Find a quiet, comfortable place where you can sit, preferably with
back support. We want to remove unnecessary distractions. Just sit
and relax somewhere where you can close your eyes for twenty minutes
without interruptions.
Once you have gotten comfortable, slowly close your eyes. You will
notice thoughts, streams of thoughts. That is fine. Just observe them
without minding them. After about a minute, gently introduce the
thought …I AM… and begin to repeat it easily and effortlessly in your
mind. If your mind wanders off into other thoughts, you will
eventually realize this has happened. Don't be concerned about it. It
is natural. When you realize you are not repeating the mantra, gently
go back to it. This is all you have to do. Easily repeat the mantra
silently inside. When you realize you are not thinking it, then
easily come back to it. The goal is not to stay on it. The goal is to
follow the simple procedure of thinking the mantra, losing it, and
coming back to it when you find you have lost it. Do not resist if
the mantra tends to become less distinct. Thinking the mantra does
not have to be with clear pronunciation. I AM can be experienced at
many levels in your mind and nervous system. When you come back to
it, come back to a level that is comfortable, not straining for
either a clear or fuzzy pronunciation.
Do this procedure for twenty minutes, and, then, with your eyes
closed, take a few minutes to rest before you get up.
-Lesson 13 - Meditation -- Awakening the Silent Seed
.... you know how to do deep meditation the AYP way:-)
quote:
Originally posted by babaram
And I find that much of my time in meditation I am restless and uncomfortable or I fall asleep. I
If you go through Lesson 15 - Restlessness and Lesson 17 - Was I asleep? you will know that these are good signs. It means a lot of purification is going on... it also means you are doing your meditation the right way.. 
quote:
Originally posted by babaram
but I am familiar enough with spirituality to be convinced that meditation will provide what I seek. I realize this is rather general and vague, but...any suggestions.
Well if you believe in that, half your work is done.. Bhakti (Lesson12) is the most important ingredient in this path.. I think you are doing great Babaram. Just read up the lessons I have talked about or better still.. start from the beginning..
If you do want to add spinal breathing as suggested by the others above.. make sure you read these lessons...
Lesson 39 - Pranayama – Cultivating the soil of the nervous system and Lesson 41 - Pranayama – Spinal Breathing
Wish you all the best.
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Edited by - Shanti on Dec 08 2006 1:32:57 PM |
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babaram
5 Posts |
Posted - Dec 09 2006 : 9:00:22 PM
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Thank you very much, everyone, for your thoughtful suggestions. Sorry I've taken so long to respond, but I have been having a problem with my computer.
I try to meditate for two 20 minute periods every day. I have done this almost every day for many years. The past couple weeks, I have been doing spinal breathing for 5 minutes before at least one of my daily sessions. It's too soon to say for sure, but it seems to be helping. In the past I have experimented with chanting before meditation, or doing alternate nostril breathing. For years I did some hatha yoga daily, though a couple injuries have limited that in recent years. I was a lacto-vegetarian for several years, too. None of these pracatices seemed to help my meditations appreciably, though I admittedly did not do them for that long a time when experimenting with them.
Kirtanman, I'm not sure what has held me back, or I would have done something about it. When I first started meditating (TM), I had very blissful experiences. Perhaps expectations got in the way. I have also heard that meditation only helps certain people and is dependent on the level of serotonin in an individual's blood. Someone once told me that I tried to hard to be a "good meditator," and that that kept me from relaxing enough. I do sometimes think that my meditations are not "effortless," which has caused me to spend a lot of time pondering what indeed it means to be "effortless."
I could go on and on, but let me stop there. |
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aditya
82 Posts |
Posted - Dec 09 2006 : 10:42:46 PM
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Hi Babaram,
You have a very good background on meditation. I used to feel same when I started it all. I stopped several times(until last year). But then I realized that you need to prepare for meditation. It takes a while. Different people do it differently. I was restless one and I used to find everyone gets into mode with utmost ease, this was kind of surprising to me. I changed my ways. I added breath control techniques as I was loosing my concentration in spinal breathing as well. I started with simple pranayams - Bhastrika, Kapalbhati, Vahya(with three bandhs), Anulom Vilom, Bhramari and Udgeet. Some people need more effort - I am one of those kinds. I would do it morning and evening for hour to hour and half for 6-8 months. In addition, I started doing Neti and did Shankha Prakshanlan a few times. It is dirt in your body that makes you restless. I was able to control my anger in big way. I was real hot tempered guy and had few tiffs in life - but Pranayam cooled me down. Then you can take up any chanting for a while - I suggest one of ten Mahavidyas. That enhances your concentration in big way. Do not stop/break your efforts till you have completed it - whatever number you think you will do with a little streching yourself. (you need to stretch to know your capabilities). A chant everyday will help too. Then you can setp days for special efforts like Tratak - it is great booster for your meditative effort. Along with this - keep doing exercise that you like from AYP site. It has tons of diamonds. I like Spinal breathing - I do it before getting in meditation. It helps align your body and thoughts accumulate in one line.
Let me share beauty of concentration. I had a very bad cold few days ago. My routine was disrupted in big way. Usually I would get up at 5 AM. I was unable to do that. My throat was hurting like anything. I was unable to do proper meditation, then something popped in my mind. I placed my concentration on the places where it was hurting. I felt some liquid flow out of those regions. After 10 mins or less my pain subsided to maybe 10% or even less. It came from Chakra meditation (static part) and spinal breathing(dynamic part).
You may like to check Yoni Mudra Kumbhak/chin pump - that is awesome. You can see lights in no time - I was maybe 3-4 weeks old here when I tried it first time. Khechari helps build your inner energy - that is must. In addition a good practice of dhyan on Agya chakra is big step. I do it whenever I am free - in past I did it hours. I am a slow learner - I need to do it more than anyone else.
When the feeling of desparation will die, when urge to rush will end, you will feel the difference.
I am myself newbie so I generally prefer reading people, but your post made me write my experiences. Take whatever suits you - leave whatever you do not like. But surely try Pranayam for a while - until your breathe is controlled. |
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gouri
USA
1 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2006 : 1:59:11 PM
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Hi A,
I am a novice at meditation.I was told that I need to do 2 rounds of meditation morning and night , each of 30 minutes duration.However I got a severe neck pain after 2 rounds and also I am pretty sure everyday my mediattion time will not be the same.What should be done in such cases?
Thank You
Gouri |
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2006 : 2:28:59 PM
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Hi gouri and welcome to the forum!
If you have started with AYP deep meditation then 30 minutes is too much. If you read Shanti's excellent description in blue above, you will see that it says 20 minutes. The time doesn't need to be exact, but if uncertain, then it's better to do less rather than more.
I hope that works! |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2006 : 6:14:34 PM
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Hi Gouri,
Welcome to the forum, I second what Weaver posts above.
Practicing AYP twice a day has really accelerated my own progress along the path and some practitioners here have indicated achieving far greater results with a year of AYP than they had in many years of practice under other systems. This was certainly the case for me.
I would recommend reading the main lessons as laid out by Yogani which do an excellent job in answering most questions. You can find the link here:
http://www.aypsite.org/MainDirectory.html
Best of luck to you,
A
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AYPforum
351 Posts |
Posted - Jan 31 2007 : 08:18:20 AM
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| Moderator note: Topic moved for better placement |
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problems with meditation
