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bondzai
USA
6 Posts |
 Posted - Jan 06 2007 : 4:26:24 PM
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Hello,
I am new just finding the website today after doing netsurfing on the topic of the mantra So'Ham. I like the website and the teachings. The mantra I Am also seems right to me. I like some of you was raised Catholic/Christian and even though I have been involved with Siddha Yoga for 20 years to some extent, never became a Hindu or understood Shiva exactly so have often had a rough time with mantras such as Om Namah Shivaya. NOt that I have a lot of problem with it but I have never been able to repeat it for very long. I don't know if it is a lack of will or what. I do like the idea of awareness of breath because of the non-sectarean nature of it although that is not a piece of cake either to do all the time.
Remembrance of God is important to me (I like the teachings of Brother Lawrence) and I am wondering what AYP practice is used for remembrance. I was thinking it would be remembering the I Am mantra all the time. I also understand this was the practice of Nisargadatta Maharaj ... and I like to read what all he has said. So is Remembrance of "I AM" an AYP practice? I have begun doing it over the last hour and it seems like it is ok to me. Already I have learned not to necessarily mix the breath and the mantra and that makes sense too to some extent.
The So Ham mantra is about the silent space between the ingoing and out going breaths supposedly but... maybe I need to begin again with something as simple as the I AM mantra and sense of that thought.
any suggestions for a newbie would be appreciated.
I have had tons of yogic/kundalini kriyas in the past ... I just want to keep it simple and come back home to my True Self. |
Edited by - AYPforum on Jan 28 2007 5:43:03 PM |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Jan 06 2007 : 8:14:36 PM
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Not sure if I am understanding "rememberance", but you don't need to think of the mantra except for the two meditation sessions everyday.
It is good however to "remember" or feel devotion to your own understanding of God, or supreme power, or "the force," whatever, as long as it is understood as a power greater than yourself (ego). In other words devotion to God, or bhakti, but I'm sure other people will argue as to the implementation of this.
Personally what I've found is best for Bhakti is remembering that there is a silent power that supersedes all earthly worries. So whenever your mind becomes concerned, worried, or is attracted to something, return it to the feeling that this greater power is the solution to all such things. doesn't matter what religion you get it from, or none at all. It is simplicity itself.
Just begin at the start of the online lessons, and practice twice a day, no rush to add anything more until you want to. It's all there. |
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Swami Vajra
42 Posts |
Posted - Jan 07 2007 : 07:58:34 AM
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Namaste ALL,
Welcome to the forum, bondzai!
I suggest the following:
THY WILL BE DONE (indicating surrender)
GUIDE US TO GRACE (Us meaning all sentient beings)
WE RISE TO GREET THEE (refers to kundalini)
WE ARE THANKFUL (again the plural and staying in the attitude of gratitude)
I use this while engaged in daily activities, driving, etc.
I also do it in sort of a sing-song way, but of course should you choose to do it I'm sure you'll find a way to make it your own! |
Edited by - Swami Vajra on Jan 07 2007 08:22:29 AM |
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bondzai
USA
6 Posts |
Posted - Jan 07 2007 : 1:49:22 PM
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Thanks for the reply. This morning I did a meditation with the 'I AM' mantra and it went well. I would fall into the silence and recall to do the 'I AM' mantra when I remembered. After meditation, I also repeat the 'I AM' mantra within. For instance I did it going to bed at night and whenever I was awake at night. It seems compatible with me for sure.
Japa in Yoga or Dhikr in Sufism is a practice of remembrance of God or 'inner Self'. For example Ghandi did Japa on the name Ram. Sufis do it on the name 'Allah'. Since the name 'I AM' uses a pronoun and is also the revealed name of God in the Bible and in the So'Ham mantra it seems to cross lines and be suitable for anyone, but whats important for me is it works for me so far.
I like that I don't have to think about what it means. In the past, I tried asking the question, "Who Am I" but it seemed to promote thinking. Just saying 'I AM' to myself seems to be quieting things down for me. |
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Jan 07 2007 : 2:12:30 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by bondzai
After meditation, I also repeat the 'I AM' mantra within. For instance I did it going to bed at night and whenever I was awake at night.
Hi bondzai and welcome to the forum!
It's good to hear that your meditation works well with 'I AM'. I will just put in a caution about doing the mantra outside of the regular meditation sessions. In AYP it's recommended to do the practice only during the sessions and not otherwise. The reason is that, since the practices themselves are so powerful, there is a chance of overdoing and that excessive symptoms can appear, often with a delayed effect. This goes for the meditation as well. It's also a good idea to read the AYP Lessons, if you haven't already, there are several on meditation, and this is the first one: http://www.aypsite.org/13.html
Best wishes! 
. |
Edited by - weaver on Jan 07 2007 2:24:38 PM |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4514 Posts |
Posted - Jan 08 2007 : 05:04:35 AM
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Hi Bondzai,
Welcome to the forum, and good question.
Yogani wrote a novel about a fictitional character called John Wilder. The novel is called secrets of Wilder and is an amazing read. In the novel Wilder teaches yoga (surprise surprise!), and towards the end he describes a practice called the I AM presence. He says (if I remember rightly) that as we progress, we will feel the continual presence of I AM both inside and outside of practices. Not really something that we directly cultivate, but something that comes as a result of the continual practice of meditation over the long term.
Personally, I am feeling it more and more.
Christi |
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bondzai
USA
6 Posts |
Posted - Jan 08 2007 : 10:34:26 AM
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Hi Christi,
I am happy to hear that the 'I AM' presence becomes more and more familiar. I hear what you are saying about how you don't necessarily directly cultivate this presence except during the two daily meditation periods. Maybe it is not a part of AYP to do meditation outside of the meditation period, but it is something I do and have done for years so I guess I can do that if I want. As far as Kundalini goes, I had a lot of that happen years ago. It was in fact too much probably because I was meditating too much. What happened after that was the Guru let me live in the Ashram and that meant I had to work my ass off. Because of all the work, the meditation was a lot less. I was not able to maintain the same level of bliss that I had before I went into the ashram really... although still it was a lot. So for most people being around the Guru gives them Shakti or Bliss, for me it took it away. I had it more when living alone and meditating a lot. Nevertheless at that time I also did the So'Ham mantra more or less continually and that brought a lot of bliss with it. Somehow I lost that though and stopped doing it. I would like to return to some form of Japa. (remembrance).
One of the things I do is to return to the moment as a practice. I don't know if it is in the lessons because I have only read up to lesson 35 so far. At one time I participated in the Diamond Approach and in that practice there is a recommendation to cultivate presence in the hands and body.
I know its true that having a good meditation practice also cultivates presence. It is easy for me to do a morning meditation because it has been my habit for many years. I meditated daily for twenty years and only recently abandoned it in favor of sleep. But to meditate daily in the morning is a piece of cake for me. What is difficult is meditating in the afternoon. I think the reason is because in the morning there is no one around--they are all still sleeping.
But I will give it a shot somehow. I don't know exactly how to carve out that space, but I may be able to find a way.
I also am curious about Chanting. Is there a Chanting practice in AYP? As you may or may not know, Japa and Chanting are similar.
As a Yoga practitioner, and an imitator of other Yogis, I know that the essence is the Name. Many many yogis have said their attainment IS repetition of the name. Sing the name of the beloved.
The essence of Yoga is love yourself, God lives within you as you. What I have found is another similar mantra to 'I AM' that is non-sectarean and also a pronoun and also sounds like other ancient names of God is 'You'. Maybe that is a good mantra to sing during times that are not the half our meditation time.
One thing that is interesting that I learned in NLP is there is some unconscious resistance to affirmations that use the pronoun 'I'. But if a person uses 'You'... then that filter is bypassed and the unconscious mind takes everything personally anyway so that makes sense to me.
One practice I have tried which I like is using a Plain English version of the Bible, the CEV and in particular the Psalms. In the Psalms recognizing an aspect or name of God and then making a "breath prayer" with it. A breath prayer is a short prayer that can be said in one breath (in catholicism they are called ejaculatory prayers or ejaculations). I guess one of the simplest short prayers is 'Praise God'. Maybe 'You' can also be a way of focusing the mind on the source.
The thing is that while it may seem reasonbable to only meditate twice a day, it is clear in the Bhagavad Gita, at least for us Bhaktis, that a person can reach God by concentrating on God all the time. I don't know how many times it says this in the Bhagavad Gita. 'Whatever you do, "make it an offering to me"..... that is a challenge......
One of my favorite passages is this one:
The Bhagavad Gita
Whatever You Do
A leaf, a flower, a fruit, or even
Water, offered to me in devotion,
I will accept as the loving gift
Of a dedicated heart. Whatever you do,
Make it an offering to me –
The food you eat or worship you perform,
The help you give, even your suffering.
Thus will you be free from karma's bondage,
From the results of action, good and bad.
I am the same to all beings. My love
Is the same always. Nevertheless, those
Who meditate on me with devotion,
They dwell in me, and I shine forth in them.
Even the worst sinner becomes a saint
When he loves me with all his heart. This love
Will soon transform his personality
And fill his heart with peace profound.
O son of Kunti, this is my promise:
Those who love me, they shall never perish.
Even those who are handicapped by birth
Have reached the supreme goal in life
By taking refuge in me. How much more
The pure brahmins and royal sages who love me!
Give not your love to this transient world
Of suffering, but give all your love to me.
Give me your mind, your heart, all your worship.
Long for me always, live for me always,
And you shall be united with me.
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bondzai
USA
6 Posts |
Posted - Jan 08 2007 : 10:51:38 AM
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| well, I am finding that the desire to use the 'I AM' mantra at times other than sitting meditation times is too strong to resist. I don't want to do any of the other mantras right now. So I am going with it. |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4514 Posts |
Posted - Jan 08 2007 : 12:06:55 PM
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Hi Bondzai,
quote:
I am happy to hear that the 'I AM' presence becomes more and more familiar. I hear what you are saying about how you don't necessarily directly cultivate this presence except during the two daily meditation periods.
Actually, it wasn't me that said that, I was simply paraphrazing something that the fictitional character John Wilder said in the novel by Yogani. I can see now that that wasn't clear. And yes, it is the official AYP position to not do practices outside of practice times.
Personally I side with Sri Aurobindo on this one when he said:
quote:
If all you want is enlightenment then all you need is an open heart, a silent mind, and the continual rememberance of the divine.
Well, I have an open heart, so all I need now are the other two .
quote:
As far as Kundalini goes, I had a lot of that happen years ago. It was in fact too much probably because I was meditating too much. What happened after that was the Guru let me live in the Ashram and that meant I had to work my ass off. Because of all the work, the meditation was a lot less. I was not able to maintain the same level of bliss that I had before I went into the ashram really... although still it was a lot. So for most people being around the Guru gives them Shakti or Bliss, for me it took it away.
Of course the role of a Guru is not to bring about the maximum amout of bliss at all times in their diciples. It is about establishing a stable path of spiritual progress, so if you needed your energies stabilized through physical action at that time, then I am sure that was the right thing for your Guru to do.
quote:
One of the things I do is to return to the moment as a practice. I don't know if it is in the lessons because I have only read up to lesson 35 so far.
I don't know if this is in the lessons either, but I have not seen anything in the lessons to sudgest that is is not a good practice. In fact Yogani says fairly early on that at some point that we will be blessed by being in a continual state of bliss. In my experience, when I am in bliss it takes a lot of effort to drag me away from an awareness of the present moment. It's like, "why would you want to be anywhere else?". I get this more of the time also. There is a great thread going on about "being in the present (precence) all the time" here in the forum, started by Anthem:
http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....D=1886#15538
quote:
Remembrance of God is important to me (I like the teachings of Brother Lawrence) and I am wondering what AYP practice is used for remembrance. I was thinking it would be remembering the I Am mantra all the time.
Mantras are quite powerful things, especially the way they are used in AYP where we cultivate ecstacy in the body using pranayama, and then bring the mind to stillness in deep meditation whilst using the mantra as both a meditation object, and as a subtle vibrational quality to bring about purification in the subtle nervous system on a very deep level. This is the Deep Magic (as C.S.S. Lewis would say). When we use a mantra in this way, we have to be careful to limit the amout of time a day that we are doing this stuff for, or we could overload the way you did before with the Kundalini stuff. In fact, this is the Kundalini stuff. This is why Yogani recomends not more than about 20 minutes twice a day.
I know that many yogis chant mantras all the time that they are awake (or at least they say they do ), but they are not in deep meditation all that time (at least most of them aren't).
Yogani is not against the chanting or singing of mantras/ bajhans etc. outside of practices, but (personally) I wouldn't recommend using the I AM mantra as a continual japa mantra during the day if you are using it during deep meditation. Yogani may want to comment on this if I have got it wrong.
quote:
What is difficult is meditating in the afternoon. I think the reason is because in the morning there is no one around--they are all still sleeping.
But I will give it a shot somehow. I don't know exactly how to carve out that space, but I may be able to find a way.
I do most of my meditation between midnight and three in the morning. It's usually the only time I get free with no kids screaming .
quote:
The essence of Yoga is love yourself, God lives within you as you. What I have found is another similar mantra to 'I AM' that is non-sectarean and also a pronoun and also sounds like other ancient names of God is 'You'. Maybe that is a good mantra to sing during times that are not the half our meditation time.
Sounds great... I would go with it. With all those clues I should be able to work out what mantra it is... but I can't.
quote:
The thing is that while it may seem reasonbable to only meditate twice a day, it is clear in the Bhagavad Gita, at least for us Bhaktis, that a person can reach God by concentrating on God all the time. I don't know how many times it says this in the Bhagavad Gita. 'Whatever you do, "make it an offering to me"..... that is a challenge......
I am sure it is true. Of course, actually remembering God all the time really is a challenge. I can't even remember wher I left my car keys half the time . Until we have a reasonable level of silence (and bliss) in our minds, and there are enough spaces in the clouds, it is hard to remember the divine continuously. When the silence (and inevitably the love) are present as part of our normal awareness, then it is difficult to remember anything other than God. This is how I find it anyway. And of course, in AYP we use practices to cultivate silence, ecstacy, love and bliss.
So I guess, whether we try to continually remember God or not, it will happen anyway if we are practicing yoga.
Good luck.
Christi
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Edited by - Christi on Jan 08 2007 12:16:12 PM |
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Athma_Shakti
India
81 Posts |
Posted - Jan 08 2007 : 2:13:29 PM
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not only the mantras, any sound vibrations when produced mentally gives rise to stillness of mind.
like the electricity(mantra) is passed through an object(mind) all the particles(thoughts) are aligned in same direction and we can experience the full force of the magnet.
different mantras produces different effects in our system. i have noticed any vibration produces stillness. but certain mantras like 'I Am', 'om' are powerful for opening the chakras plus it has many advantages for our spiritual progress.
iam not sure about chanting mantra in free times. mantra meditation can increase inner silence, ecstatic conductivity and energy too, also it can take us to detachment of senses from the body and breathless state. in such cases we have to prepare our body carefully to withstand the power, by doing asanas, spinal breathing, self pacing and other techniques.
quote:
The thing is that while it may seem reasonbable to only meditate twice a day, it is clear in the Bhagavad Gita, at least for us Bhaktis, that a person can reach God by concentrating on God all the time. I don't know how many times it says this in the Bhagavad Gita. 'Whatever you do, "make it an offering to me"..... that is a challenge......
this means detachment of senses from every action we do. of course its a challenge, but its achievable. |
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bondzai
USA
6 Posts |
Posted - Jan 08 2007 : 8:42:07 PM
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Christi, the mantra I was referring to that sounds like "YOU" is "HU"... for example the first half of the word "human" and also the name of Jesus Ya Hu Shua and also a lot of Jewish names like Netanya HOO. The website Yahoo! and the name of God in Sufism 'HU'. Granted Hoo is not the same as You. The Eckankar folks do pronounce it that way though. But Yahoo is I believe the first half of the Tetragrammaton or Yahweh, Yahooway.
And on top of all of the Muslim, Jewish and Christian for Hoo... In Buddhism and Hinduism I believe some people use the So Ham mantra saying So Hung. So, hung or hu is a mantra that should have a lot of power.
In the Diamond Approach before meditation the mantra Hoo is chanted. Likewise the Sufis chant YaHu like the SoHam mantra and....
if you ever have been to the Zoo, you might notice that even the gorillas chant HOO a lot!
That reminds me, Yah is not a bad mantra either. Ya is the end of the mantra Om Namah Shiva-ya! and according to one Guru I know, she says, The Ya takes you across!. Now in English and German 'Ya' means 'Yes' which is a POWERFUL PRAYER because it is 'acceptance' plus its an english word so it just resonates.
Recently in a newsgroup Awareness the way to Love ... the teachings of Anthony De Mello, Tony talks about Yes and Thanks.....
Thanks and Yes
What does it mean to love God? One does not love him the
way one loves the people one sees and hears and touches,
for God is not a person in our sense of the word. He is the
Unknown. He is the wholly Other. He is above terms like
he and she, person and thing.
When we say an audience fills the hall and a singer's voice
fills the hall, we use the same word to refer to two totally
distinct realities. When we say we love God with our whole
heart and we love our friend with our whole heart, we also
use the same words to express two totally distinct realities.
The singer's voice does not really fill the hall. And we can
not really love God in the usual sense of the word.
To love God with one's whole heart means to say a whole-
hearted Yes to life and all that life brings with it. To accept,
without reservations, all that God has ordained for one's
life. To have the attitude that Jesus had when he said, "Not
my will, but yours be done." To love God with one's whole
heart is to make one's own the words made famous by Dag
Hammarskjold:
For all that has been, Thanks.
To all that shall be, Yes.
This is the kind of thing one can give to God alone. In this
he has no rivals. To understand that this is what it means to
love God is to see at once that it doesn't come in the way of
your loving your friends wholeheartedly, tenderly, passionately.
The singer's voice remains in undisputed possession of the
hall, no matter how packed the hall is with people. those
people are no rival to it. The only rival is a person or a thing
that causes you to weaken your attitude of Yes and Thanks.
Anthony de Mello
Yahoo! |
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bondzai
USA
6 Posts |
Posted - Jan 08 2007 : 8:45:03 PM
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| and Yes.... |
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Wolfgang
Germany
470 Posts |
Posted - Jan 09 2007 : 03:21:55 AM
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quote:
from Wipipedia
Yahoo! started out as "Jerry's Guide to the World Wide Web", a web site featuring a directory of other sites, organized in a hierarchy (rather than a searchable index of pages). It was renamed "Yahoo!" shortly thereafter. "Yet Another Hierarchical Officious Oracle" is a backronym for this name, but Filo and Yang insist they selected the name because they liked the word's general definition, as in Gulliver's Travels by Jonathan Swift: "rude, unsophisticated, uncouth."
I wonder if the founders of yahoo are yogis  |
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Ingwer
France
4 Posts |
Posted - Jan 09 2007 : 6:24:14 PM
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Hi bondzai, hi Wolfgang,
From a singer's point of view, here's what happens when you pronounce or chant the word "yahoo":
- the "y" in the beginning acts as a springboard leading toward the "a" - and a maximal opening of the mouth
- the exhale of the "h" triggers the closing of the lips culminating into "oo" - and the minimal opening of the mouth
If you sustain "oo", staying on the edge - lips not quite open but not closed yet - you will achieve a quite interesting level of sonic vibration which you can verify easily by placing one hand on top of your head...
Now, close in a little further and you find yourself with a perfect "m"!
Yam?
...the bija of the heart-chakra...
Oh and, bondzai, thanks for bringing it up, - as for me "YA" definitely "takes me across" :-)))
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AYPforum
351 Posts |
Posted - Jan 28 2007 : 5:43:03 PM
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| Moderator note: Topic moved for better placement |
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Newcomer and Japa Yoga, 'I AM mantra
