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Mike
United Kingdom
77 Posts |
 Posted - Oct 11 2006 : 09:15:31 AM
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Hi gang and as this is my first post maximum respect to Yogani for his splendid work and generosity to all in sharing such teachings :bow: - I have only recently got into the whole AYP site, have been lurking and browsing the forum for some time, loved the meditation book and have only dipped into the lessons book. Maybe I'll get round to introducing myself fully in the Satsang Cafe sometime...but in the mean time a question... I am considering 'converting' to AYP meditation but (as a long term practitionerof qigong/Buddhism (but not so much meditation) am wary of the mind's tendency to grab some 'new' 'shiny' technique or school just when the existing practice is presenting problems (which is often just prior to some break through).
So long waffle intro 
I am a typical "westerner" which is why I generally in the past 'failed' at meditation of various sorts (as generally sitting still and trying to keep my eyes shut was never my forte). However some years of qigong (and most recently Zhan Zhuang) - and a judicious amount of aging  - have given me enough of a platform to start meditation. This I did doing 1/2hr a day for a few months of a standing meditation based on the anchor being the point of contact with the ground... that seemed to go fine. After a summer retreat I upped it to an hour a day... and produced tiredness and a real feeling of "excess energy" stuck in the head... Recently someone with these sort of abilities looked at my and said my head chakras were blocked. Also noticed a real feeling of huge tiredness in the eyes [stale energy trying to leak out of head somehow?!]
Now to be clear its not AYP meditation, nor am I seeking a diagnosis of what went wrong (I am taking it up with the teacher I learned from). As I am thinking of changing techniques though you will appreciate it if I remain a bit coy on this topic.
I guess the things that fascinate me are:
i) some types of meditation seem to be healthy and some not so healthy... I am thinking here of long-term results [eg some incredibly advanced Buddhist teachers (eg Ajahn Chah had diabetes)]and ideas that "in the body" meditation systems are more healthy than "out of the body" health systems. Any comments? Am I trying to project by seeing Deep Meditation as an "in the body" meditation system?
ii)in my case an obvious point is the "too enthusiastic" (aka "pretty dumb" lol) increase in meditation time - I am impressed by the degree to which steady increases in time are emphasised in these parts... I guess I had been failing to see meditation as having energetic consequences [putting that in the 'qigong' box label]. So any comments on whether one should view meditation as no different to say qigong or hatha yoga in terms of really hitting the energy flows within the body?
iii) as I am where I am any suggestions for simple way of draining 'stuck'/'stale' energy in the head out? [I stopped meditating a couple of weeks ago and its sloooooooowly improving. Slowly lol].
OK the usual sort of bad post  - too long, unfocused and multiple questions... Probably an over-reaction to a parallel life as a forum moderator myself  SO apologies and apologies fro starting with a Q - but any thoughts on (iii) would make it all worthwhile.
Thanks once again to all posters in this forum - I have learned a lot from you already and once again maximum respect to Yogani.
Peace&love
Mike |
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Richard
United Kingdom
857 Posts |
Posted - Oct 11 2006 : 09:32:28 AM
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Welcome to the forum Mike
I am not going to try to answer all your individual questions here all i can say is it was problems of this nature (energy excesses kundalini symptoms blockage's ) that first brought me to AYP over two years ago, the combination of spinal breathing and deep meditation resolved them for me and I haven't looked back since, spinal breathing is usually enough to smooth out these energy problems.See here  I think it would be a good idea for you to give AYP a chance as a stand alone practise for a while and see where it takes you. Trying to combine it with other practices could have the opposite effect and make things worse everyone on the forum is here to help so keep coming with the questions.
Richard |
Edited by - Richard on Oct 11 2006 10:20:35 AM |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Oct 11 2006 : 10:09:11 AM
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Welcome Mike,
Great advice from Richard.
Question 1 is a very interesting question. In the body v. out of the body, I have never thought of it that way. There is no doubt AYP involves the whole body in many of its practices.
First mantra meditation also has a vibrational component to it which stimulates the spinal nerve in particular ways. This is definitely mind/ body in nature. Then spinal breathing itself helps smooth energy out and reduce blockages throughout the body and mind. Then of course the various mudras also stimulate energy movement and openings in the body/ mind too.
ii- I don't know qigong, but in regards to hatha yoga, I find there is energy release etc. which occurs for me but always seemingly in the lower centers of the body. This could be unique to my individual blockages, but for me meditation is far more encompassing and I am aware of energy throughout the whole body and mind during practices.
iii- Like Richard mentions, spinal breathing is an excellent tool to smooth out energy blockages over time. Maybe add some prior to meditation.
good luck,
A
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Scott
USA
969 Posts |
Posted - Oct 11 2006 : 10:21:54 AM
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Mike,
Welcome.
When you breathe, let it be in the lower abdomen and not in the chest. This means relax your musculature. Try to notice if you're tensing your abs throughout the day....let it all hang loose. This will cause energy to stop going up so much.
Also, go on daily walks where you absorb the tension in your feet rather than in your knees, hips or torso. Your body should be relaxed during this too...breathe through the belly here as well.
For the walking, it helps if you're barefoot but sometimes it's hard to walk around barefoot...I mean most of us live in the Western society where that would be seen as very odd and kind of dangerous for our health...so just focus on the feet.
When Richard said: quote:
"Trying to combine it with other practices could have the opposite effect and make things worse everyone on the forum is here to help so keep coming with the questions."
He was absolutely right about combining it with other practices being not the thing to do. The AYP lessons are what you need to progress safely, steadily and surely. I know this from personal experience. Don't believe me? Don't take my word for it but give it a shot for a while.
Good luck. |
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snake
United Kingdom
277 Posts |
Posted - Oct 11 2006 : 10:28:11 AM
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welcome Mike,I think I had a similar problem to yours,I couldnt sleep either.
Mantak Chia advises to think down to the soles of the feet and also the navel and dont forget the tongue to roof of mouth,
also gardening and walking anything earthing may help.
I am also a fan of Zhaung Zhaung but I found Chia's tips to help the most.
Also you might try a chiropractor type practitioner.
good luck
snake
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Edited by - snake on Oct 11 2006 10:32:27 AM |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Oct 11 2006 : 1:31:27 PM
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Hi Mike,
Welcome to the forum. 
Excess energy in the head .. well 1 hr of meditation will do that.. does it feel like it will explode.. that is what I felt before I started AYP. It may not just be excess energy.. it could symptoms of excess purification and/or crown chakra activity.
Some stuff to read up on.. may help..
Kundalini symptoms, imbalances, and remedies
Enlightenment milestones revisited
Still more on chakras
Managing the opening of the crown
In AYP we try to stay away from the crown chakra in the beginning.. and later too we don't consciously work at the crown. You have done the right thing by "I stopped meditating a couple of weeks ago "... but completely stopping it may not be the best idea.
Richard and Andrew have given great advice. Spinal breathing is a great energy equalizer. So add spinal breathing to your routine. Pranayama – Spinal Breathing Make sure you gradually add stuff to your practice.. Don't stop meditation.. do deep meditation for 10 min twice a day and increase it when you feel comfortable. But not more than 20 min. And Don't mix practices.. once you have all the excess energy under control.. you can experiment with other things..
Being active during the day.. and the favorite of may here at the forum.. take long walks.. these will help ground the excess energy and excess symptoms of purification.
I hope these help.
All the best in your path. |
Edited by - Shanti on Oct 11 2006 1:33:34 PM |
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Mike
United Kingdom
77 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2006 : 04:35:26 AM
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Richard/A/Scott/snake/Shanti
Many thanks indeed for your time and gracious offerings of thoughts [bow]
I did indeed kind of note in the back of my mind this interesting 'balancing' impact of spinal breathing [and actually on a seminar recently was taught this (altho back down thru a central bodily channel not the spine and no ujjayi]. I think I was holding off just "dipping in" to the AYP book at a "random" topic and trying one tool... but as you guys have mentioned it I will give it a gentle and modest go and see what I get. I entirely appreciate the point that of course ditching all other practices and doing just AYP is the "money-back-guarantee" approach but that's not practical (/wise?) right now and I am happy just absorbing AYP & Yogani's ideas (I found some much wisdom in the Deep Meditation book very portable to other practices) for a while and really am just after the equivalent of a couple of aspirin ;-) ZZhuang is great at sorting my energy systems out but doesn't seem so effective re the head - so spinal breathing may be a useful ad hoc technique - and don't worry I wont come back complaining when mixing techniques from different disciplines makes things worse  LoL!
In-the-body vs out-of-body is a big topic (and rather off-tangent here maybe..)... but arguably a healer (of others) needs a model of disease [eg "all diseases are problems of the spine", "all diseases are biochemical", "all diseases are energy obstructions" etc etc]. The really impressive healers I have met [as in people fly around the world to see them] tend to have this "disease is caused by absence" [of spirit/shen/consciousness (from the body)]. Funnily enough Tolle says the same. [/tangent ]
And just for the record, as for clarification of the feeling "excess energy in the head" is just kind of a metaphor... sure it could be excess cleansing... or prior disease like symptoms returning before disappearing for good (a fairly common thing)... crown chakra I do not know enough to comment. Feeling is of "excess pressure" - kind of like if you had connected a hosepipe to my head sometime and just left it running lol. And sure when ones car is skidding all over the place the emergency stop (aka lob an anchor out of the window) isn't the most controlled way to slow down  and metaphors apart may prolong the recovery.
So once again many thanks dudes for your thoughts and time - good karma for you all.
peace
Mike |
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Richard
United Kingdom
857 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2006 : 06:45:42 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Mike
Richard/A/Scott/snake/Shanti
Many thanks indeed for your time and gracious offerings of thoughts [bow]
Your very welcome Mike and on another note its good to see more people from the UK posting were a bit thin on the ground here,so don't be a stranger
Richard |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2006 : 1:09:36 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Mike
I entirely appreciate the point that of course ditching all other practices and doing just AYP is the "money-back-guarantee" approach but that's not practical (/wise?) right now and I am happy just absorbing AYP & Yogani's ideas (I found some much wisdom in the Deep Meditation book very portable to other practices) for a while and really am just after the equivalent of a couple of aspirin ;-) ZZhuang is great at sorting my energy systems out but doesn't seem so effective re the head - so spinal breathing may be a useful ad hoc technique - and don't worry I wont come back complaining when mixing techniques from different disciplines makes things worse LoL!
You are welcome Mike.
Guess I misunderstood you when you said..
"I am considering 'converting' to AYP meditation"
Hey anything that works for you is great..
Have a safe journey.. |
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Mike
United Kingdom
77 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2006 : 5:03:05 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Shanti
Guess I misunderstood you when you said..
"I am considering 'converting' to AYP meditation"
No misunderstanding... I am considering converting to what I always remember as the Ayam (which means chicken in indonesian/malay ) meditation...
...first though I want to start with a clean sheet if possible.
I think my mixing systems thing is perhaps more sticking with the ZZ for energy purposes and then doing Deep Meditation on top for 'spirit'/'mind' purposes... may be crazy.. may be not.. [and I read the interesting thread you guys had on Taoist vs Yoga and mixing stuff].
In principle one the one hand its not a lot of difference really between doing asanas and then meditation (lets not attach too much to 'hermetically sealed' discrete pigeon holes like "qigong" and "yoga"...?). On the other hand it might be like trying to cook a recipe half chinese, half indian style
If I survive to tell the tale I'll write it up |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2006 : 7:04:28 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Mike
In principle one the one hand its not a lot of difference really between doing asanas and then meditation (lets not attach too much to 'hermetically sealed' discrete pigeon holes like "qigong" and "yoga"...?). On the other hand it might be like trying to cook a recipe half chinese, half indian style
If I survive to tell the tale I'll write it up
Sounds good.. hey if cooked right.. Indian style Chinese food is very delicious.. he he
Yes.. do tell us.. |
Edited by - Shanti on Oct 12 2006 7:05:07 PM |
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sboney
18 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2006 : 1:08:36 PM
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I have a lot of energy in my head as I meditate and it often lasts uncomfortably all day. The post above about focusing on deep breathing was very helpful. When I pull away from my daily activity just slightly and breathe deeply from the diaphragm I notice the feeling of fullness in my head subsides.
Thanks for the reminder!
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Scott
USA
969 Posts |
Posted - Oct 16 2006 : 3:30:22 PM
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| I think that was me....if so, AWESOME. I love it when I'm right! Good for you, sboney. |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Dec 03 2006 : 3:42:27 PM
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Hm. I have practiced qi gong this autumn, and felt really good. I have thought like you, Mike, if asanas + meditation is fine, why not qi gong + meditation, since I cannot do many of the yoga asanas. My body protests wildly and my arms are too short somehow. Very strange.
Lately also felt this pressure in my head and symptoms of energy overload. Self-pacing and grounding with earth energies works fine, but today I experienced something new. I got help from the qi gong teacher to expand the consciousness and not keep all energy in my head. I was a direct relief to just let it expand into the universe. I also had too much energy in my stomach and did the same - let it expand out to the horison and suddenly I was okey.
I felt how I was like a boiling caseroll trying to keep everything inside, which caused a great pressure and lots of strange symptoms, cramps etc. When I just felt myself without borders and allowed myself to have no limits so that the energy could take all the place it needed, I was fine! Immediately.
I don't know if it was just a one time happening or if I adopted a new self-pacing trick that will work in the future... |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Dec 03 2006 : 4:53:15 PM
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Mike,
I've also had what I would call 'excess energy in the head', and probably still do to an extent. The best correctives for me were:
(i) exercise in general
(ii) social activities in general
(iii) social dancing especially
(iv) kechari mudra significantly, but really only when the tongue entered the nasal pharynx.
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Topic |
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Meditation and Excess Energy in the Head?
