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lufa1212
India
45 Posts |
 Posted - Mar 13 2014 : 06:07:39 AM
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Hi all,
An oft repeated question that I am asking again.
As I sail through this life with all its highs and lows, ups and downs I have observed in these last few days that I have been hankering for all that was not there. With my partner around, I have been looking for solitude/freedom/space for the MY time, for meditation, for n number of things. With him not around I have all the MY time, all the freedom, all the space but after a while that doesn't interest me. I look forward to his return and spending time with him, filling my days with his presence.
What is it that I am seeking ? Any help ? Any advice ?
Love and peace
lufa |
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jonesboy
USA
594 Posts |
Posted - Mar 13 2014 : 2:06:09 PM
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Maybe it is because I just finished the book but I do recommend "Loving What Is" by Byron Katie.
I think it will help. |
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Mar 13 2014 : 4:07:40 PM
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Hi Lufa,
This may sound trite, but many are seeking "the end of seeking".
Best,
Jeff |
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cosmic
USA
821 Posts |
Posted - Mar 13 2014 : 9:18:58 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by lufa1212
What is it that I am seeking ?
This is an important question. If you can answer it, I think you will save yourself much suffering and fruitless searching. Hope you find it soon! |
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lufa1212
India
45 Posts |
Posted - Mar 17 2014 : 05:15:04 AM
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Thank you, Dear Jonesboy, Jeff and Cosmic for your kind responses. Each response carrying a wisdom of its own..
Jeff, till the time we are kept engaged by the ego self there is no end to seeking. There is no end to queries and that is it. Who is seeking ? The Ego. You are right...many (including me) are seeking end of seeking.
Jonesboy, "Loving What Is' is sure shot answer to all our worldly entanglements. An abiding stillness, a 24 x 7 awareness is the matrix to be in for the humble acceptance of whatever it is. I am on a roller coaster ride.
Cosmic, Thank you for your kind words. I hope to find the answer too :)
Love |
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kami
USA
921 Posts |
Posted - Mar 17 2014 : 10:06:03 AM
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Hi Lufa,
Yes I agree that we seek the end of seeking but that can be far too esoteric (and not helpful), particularly if we are being pushed to seek anyway.
All seeking, spiritual or material, arises from a sense of lack. The deep-rooted feeling of being incomplete leads us to try to find completion. We think (erroneously) that it lies in wealth, relationships, fame, spirituality.. Most of us who come to spirituality have figured out that seeking material things isn't "it". Unknowingly, we transfer that longing for completeness to a firm identity of being a spiritual "seeker". This can be ok for a while and we feel a bit better that we are not seeking the "lower" stuff and we are "better than the average Joe". But then, the continued sense of lack catches up with us and we are no longer satisfied with this seeking either.
The root of the issue lies in the false belief that there is something "out there" that will complete "me". Whether it is a new car, a relationship or a new spiritual practice is irrelevant. In telling the story of the "spiritual me", we have simply moved from collecting cars/homes/relationships to collecting "spiritual experiences" - the next energy/light/astral/samadhi/surrender/tantric "thing". That is all. Nothing will be enough until we have the shift of perception that lets us see through the story of the "me". Once the me is seen to be merely a mirage, that story is dropped and we find that we have been complete, whole, peaceful and joyful all along. Just that the ongoing story of "me" has kept us from seeing it.
Also (very importantly), the very nature of this "story of me" is a sense of lack; it can never feel or be complete. Trying to fulfill its wants is therefore futile. As long as there is a story of "me", there will be seeking. Conversely, as long as there is seeking, the story of "me" will be held tight. The paradox is that to get to this place of not seeking, there will be seeking/desire, i.e., bhakti that fuels all practices and openings. As Yogani says, it is a journey from here to here.
Thus, what every (spiritual, materialistic, good/bad/ugly) being seeks (knowingly or unknowingly) is their true identity. 
Love.   |
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lufa1212
India
45 Posts |
Posted - Mar 19 2014 : 12:59:21 PM
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Hello Kami
That is a beautiful response to my query.
originally quoted by kami
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In telling the story of the "spiritual me", we have simply moved from collecting cars/homes/relationships to collecting "spiritual experiences" - the next energy/light/astral/samadhi/surrender/tantric "thing".
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Also (very importantly), the very nature of this "story of me" is a sense of lack; it can never feel or be complete. Trying to fulfill its wants is therefore futile. As long as there is a story of "me", there will be seeking. Conversely, as long as there is seeking, the story of "me" will be held tight. The paradox is that to get to this place of not seeking, there will be seeking/desire, i.e., bhakti that fuels all practices and openings. As Yogani says, it is a journey from here to here.
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I agree completely. The 'story of me' will perish completely and finally only when the self attains awareness and resides there. Just glimpses of 'this place of not seeking', as has happened with many of us, are not enough. The ego-self aspires to attain the state of awareness/beyond mind 24x7..a state where seeking stops on its own and all the questions disappear with no desire for any answers. Till then it is an ongoing play of hide and seek so 
originally quoted by kami
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Thus, what every (spiritual, materialistic, good/bad/ugly) being seeks (knowingly or unknowingly) is their true identity.
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That is so very true again. WE are all seeking our own true identity...The WHO AM I ? It all is understood so very well at the intellectual level. The sense of lack, the incomplete feel, the unending yearning for the FULFILLMENT, all show us that the completeness lies within us but yet again it is on an intellectual level. The KNOWING is awaited. AWAITED ?  
Miles to go....
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tonightsthenight
846 Posts |
Posted - Mar 19 2014 : 2:55:28 PM
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Io experience that, and not just to conceptualize it, requires a giving up. Giving up attachments and judgments. When we identify as the Self, nothing can phase us. We realize we don't have a dog in the fight.
This is a challenge to do as an outsider. Yet the true test is whether one can do this while living in the world, confronted by illusion. |
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AumNaturel
Canada
687 Posts |
Posted - Mar 20 2014 : 12:18:27 PM
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As points to add to the original observation and questions, I can't help but wonder if, in addition to or in the absence of having a foothold in taking it up relationally in self-inquiry, that it may be a sign the relationship really needs to be brought up a few notches higher to a more tantric level?
By that I mean not just the tantric partner practices aspects, but the holistic and all-encompassing principle of offering up natural sources of attachment and aversion as they translate nearly-automatically into qualities of pleasure and pain - beginning here with the joy and fulfillment of being together, and the pain and loss of being apart even if only momentarily. This 'offering up' is bhakti, devotion and surrender to the divine in and within the partner.
Taking it up here would be ensuring (more precisely, facilitating and nurturing a natural and inherent tendency) that this is done not just in a balanced way, but as a mutual 'giving' to one another, so the net result to the quality of the relationship is much higher, possibly endless, as compared to an ordinary (non-tantric) give-and-take transaction.
We know the power in shared presence as in satsang sadhana, and of bhakti in converting the existential crisis of separation into effective methods towards unity, but maya is both the source of this disconnect, the illusion, and the mirror by which that divine Self of which the accomplished masters and rishis hint to us at can re-emerge.
I speculate it is not just the pain of isolation, loss, and parting of ways, but also the pleasures, fortunes, and all immanent forms of the divine, especially romantic relationships or maybe soul partnerships, that stand as gifts to help the journey if we so choose or dare to try.
The lessons highlight active surrender, and of learning to make the most out of every situation to serve us on our chosen path. I will omit my personal example in this, since that is as far as I've been able to experience and explore despite all hope to take it beyond, and so release that possibility in samyama, and as a point in discussion here. |
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lufa1212
India
45 Posts |
Posted - Mar 21 2014 : 12:58:56 PM
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Quoted by tonightsthenight
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Io experience that, and not just to conceptualize it, requires a giving up. Giving up attachments and judgments. When we identify as the Self, nothing can phase us. We realize we don't have a dog in the fight.
This is a challenge to do as an outsider. Yet the true test is whether one can do this while living in the world, confronted by illusion.
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I have mentioned this elsewhere that one finds oneself operating at three levels - the witness wherein the actions, reactions, the pleasure and pain, the ups and downs are seen and known for what they are. 2) 'The place of no seeking' (of course one is not resting there for long and only has had glimpses thereof).
3) And finally, the Ego-self wherein one gets overpowered by the going-ons of life, the emotional and mental constructs taking over the wheel thereby pulling one in the vortex of the life situations.
I agree with your observation tonightsthenight that 'giving up on attachments and judgements' is the doorway to the field of awareness. And further as you say living in this world, confronted with the illusion it can be quite a challenging task. For me, giving up on judgements has been way much easier but attachments ? I have failed miserably.
To take relationships as illusions becomes all the more difficult especially in the case of parents-child, romantic/soul partnerships or any other relationship which may vary from individual to individual. It seems easier said than done.
Quoted by AumNaturel
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By that I mean not just the tantric partner practices aspects, but the holistic and all-encompassing principle of offering up natural sources of attachment and aversion as they translate nearly-automatically into qualities of pleasure and pain - beginning here with the joy and fulfillment of being together, and the pain and loss of being apart even if only momentarily. This 'offering up' is bhakti, devotion and surrender to the divine in and within the partner.
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Forgive me, AumNaturel but I could not really get the 'offering up' part. Would you kindly make it a little simpler and more clear for me to understand.
Quoted by AumNaturel
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I speculate it is not just the pain of isolation, loss, and parting of ways, but also the pleasures, fortunes, and all immanent forms of the divine, especially romantic relationships or maybe soul partnerships, that stand as gifts to help the journey if we so choose or dare to try.
The lessons highlight active surrender, and of learning to make the most out of every situation to serve us on our chosen path.
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It resonates completely.
Love & peace
lufa
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AumNaturel
Canada
687 Posts |
Posted - Mar 21 2014 : 2:44:37 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by lufa1212
the 'offering up' part. Would you kindly make it a little simpler and more clear for me to understand.
As a word to describe it, I'd say it is bhakti or devotion within the relationship, and not diverted from it. Devotion as to the limitless potential within, of breaking free from limitations, or as the lessons describe it, to a higher ideal or ishta in any form or quality that is meaningful enough to the person. To paraphrase passage 1410 of Sri Atmananda, bhakti is using an object as means to direct attention beyond it to Consciousness within. In doing so, as Yogani explains, an effect is exerted that both amplifies and motivates one's sadhana or spiritual practice. You are already seeing this principle in practice, since the relationship is providing a foundation for engaging with your spiritual practice "solidute/freedom/space/time/meditation" except that you need to be at a specific distance away "solitude/my time" from it for the motivating effect of the relationship to carry through. I am suggesting that perhaps if there is bhakti from or in the partner, maybe even group practice, the positive aspects of the relationship can be 'offered up' or converted into bhakti without having to seek solitude and a certain level of distance. On the opposite end, one can be isolated and alone, and 'offer up' or convert with bhakti the sense of isolation, since as the accomplished teachers tell us it is really a symptom of a much deeper disconnection, in a dual sense from the divine, on all levels of being. So for that, there are the methods of yoga and tantra.
That's my current understanding of why I suggest maybe raising the relationship on a more tantric and yogic levels could be what the situation is calling for, if that is indeed the case. At least, that is how it's been for me for a time, and I don't any more about your specific situation beyond the principle you too have observed and outlined. |
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lufa1212
India
45 Posts |
Posted - Mar 23 2014 : 12:46:31 PM
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Thank you, AumNaturel, for your kind effort in explaining it so clearly.
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What am I seeking ?
