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Mykal K
Germany
267 Posts |
 Posted - Feb 22 2013 : 12:43:17 PM
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Hello all,
I have had this question in me for quite some time, and it has surfaced again, so...
I am in a tradition in which spiritual aspects are kept hidden, and are not talked about. I was until recently in a very stretched relationship with my teacher, and he is still somewhat suspicious of me. However, there was a time before we were 'at war', and in one moment, since I thought he was mad at me or something(can't remember now), I send him a feeling of love so that he would know that I am not mad at him. Now, the feeling was like he took that feeling, and used it to form a connection. While he was talking with others, I could feel his attention on me. Later that evening, while I was walking home, the feeling intensified, as if something miraculous was about to happen. Since I was at that time pretty much into zazen, I first just put my attention to the body and waited. Later however, I was afraid to become overly attached to my teacher, so I just picked the emotion from the chest with my hand, and released it to the universe. I felt my teacher reel in anger for a second, then quickly recompose himself and go away.
The question is:
What kind of a connection is one with a teacher? I rejected mine primarily because I wanted my wife to be the only one I have 'spiritual' connection to...Maybe it is misguided, I don't know. I wouldn't want to feel my teacher during the day, or for him to feel me. Although I am pretty sure that he can anyway if he tries. Do you become 'one' with the teacher as you do with your wife? So that you can feel them within yourselves? Even without trying (him or you)?
Is it that kind of bond?
If it is such a connection, how do you manage issues like privacy? How does it (or does it) interfere with other bonds you have?
If your teacher is spiritually more advanced, do you feel him more then others you have relationships with? How does it go about?
Mykal |
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Goodway
USA
99 Posts |
Posted - Feb 22 2013 : 2:13:45 PM
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Is your teacher being fair?
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Feb 22 2013 : 2:45:34 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Mykal K
Hello all,
I have had this question in me for quite some time, and it has surfaced again, so...
I am in a tradition in which spiritual aspects are kept hidden, and are not talked about. I was until recently in a very stretched relationship with my teacher, and he is still somewhat suspicious of me. However, there was a time before we were 'at war', and in one moment, since I thought he was mad at me or something(can't remember now), I send him a feeling of love so that he would know that I am not mad at him. Now, the feeling was like he took that feeling, and used it to form a connection. While he was talking with others, I could feel his attention on me. Later that evening, while I was walking home, the feeling intensified, as if something miraculous was about to happen. Since I was at that time pretty much into zazen, I first just put my attention to the body and waited. Later however, I was afraid to become overly attached to my teacher, so I just picked the emotion from the chest with my hand, and released it to the universe. I felt my teacher reel in anger for a second, then quickly recompose himself and go away.
The question is:
What kind of a connection is one with a teacher? I rejected mine primarily because I wanted my wife to be the only one I have 'spiritual' connection to...Maybe it is misguided, I don't know. I wouldn't want to feel my teacher during the day, or for him to feel me. Although I am pretty sure that he can anyway if he tries. Do you become 'one' with the teacher as you do with your wife? So that you can feel them within yourselves? Even without trying (him or you)?
Is it that kind of bond?
If it is such a connection, how do you manage issues like privacy? How does it (or does it) interfere with other bonds you have?
If your teacher is spiritually more advanced, do you feel him more then others you have relationships with? How does it go about?
Mykal
What I am going to write is my personal experience and understanding from where I am. 
A connection with anyone is exactly as you describe it. It depends on how much attention you put on it and how aware you are of the person.
People don't really read your "private matters"... they can pick on your inner state and if they are familiar with you they could conclude on things.
It does not affect your other bonds unless you let it... meaning if you become overly focused on it it will take over all your attention... meaning, your mind will get obsessed with it and put everything else aside.. like when you find a new hobby/interest or even fall newly in love with someone, your mind completely overtakes and your attention stays focused on this one object/task at hand and forgets everything else.
When you are not very open, it is easier to "feel" someone who is more spiritually advanced as more of the cloud covers have moved away from them... however as you open more, it becomes just as easy to "feel" anyone around you, even ones you don't have a personal relationship with.
Hope this helps a bit.
You don't have to be scared of how much control he has over you as he will have as much as you will give him. Again, that means if you "fear" or "obsess" with it, it will be like giving him more power... but finally everything... EVERYTHING is within us. So the more you can put your mind at ease, less control anything will have on you. |
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Goodway
USA
99 Posts |
Posted - Feb 22 2013 : 3:01:27 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Shanti
quote:
Originally posted by Mykal K
Hello all,
I have had this question in me for quite some time, and it has surfaced again, so...
I am in a tradition in which spiritual aspects are kept hidden, and are not talked about. I was until recently in a very stretched relationship with my teacher, and he is still somewhat suspicious of me. However, there was a time before we were 'at war', and in one moment, since I thought he was mad at me or something(can't remember now), I send him a feeling of love so that he would know that I am not mad at him. Now, the feeling was like he took that feeling, and used it to form a connection. While he was talking with others, I could feel his attention on me. Later that evening, while I was walking home, the feeling intensified, as if something miraculous was about to happen. Since I was at that time pretty much into zazen, I first just put my attention to the body and waited. Later however, I was afraid to become overly attached to my teacher, so I just picked the emotion from the chest with my hand, and released it to the universe. I felt my teacher reel in anger for a second, then quickly recompose himself and go away.
The question is:
What kind of a connection is one with a teacher? I rejected mine primarily because I wanted my wife to be the only one I have 'spiritual' connection to...Maybe it is misguided, I don't know. I wouldn't want to feel my teacher during the day, or for him to feel me. Although I am pretty sure that he can anyway if he tries. Do you become 'one' with the teacher as you do with your wife? So that you can feel them within yourselves? Even without trying (him or you)?
Is it that kind of bond?
If it is such a connection, how do you manage issues like privacy? How does it (or does it) interfere with other bonds you have?
If your teacher is spiritually more advanced, do you feel him more then others you have relationships with? How does it go about?
Mykal
What I am going to write is my personal experience and understanding from where I am.
A connection with anyone is exactly as you describe it. It depends on how much attention you put on it and how aware you are of the person.
People don't really read your "private matters"... they can pick on your inner state and if they are familiar with you they could conclude on things.
It does not affect your other bonds unless you let it... meaning if you become overly focused on it it will take over all your attention... meaning, your mind will get obsessed with it and put everything else aside.. like when you find a new hobby/interest or even fall newly in love with someone, your mind completely overtakes and your attention stays focused on this one object/task at hand and forgets everything else.
When you are not very open, it is easier to "find" someone who is more spiritually advanced as more of the cloud covers have moved away from them... however as you open more, it becomes just as easy to "feel" anyone around you, even ones you don't have a personal relationship with.
Hope this helps a bit.
You don't have to be scared of how much control he has over you as he will have as much as you will give him. Again, that means if you "fear" or "obsess" with it, it will be like giving him more power... but finally everything... EVERYTHING is within us. So the more you can put your mind at ease, less control anything will have on you.
Yes, but sometimes the mind seeks good things.
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Mykal K
Germany
267 Posts |
Posted - Feb 22 2013 : 3:29:04 PM
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To Goodway:
I don't know. Good question. I know that he is manipulative and dishonest. But I think that in his mind he tries to be fair. Though honestly I can not say. Because of the excessive manipulation I do not know why he does what he does. He is very jealous of his teaching, and is quite a 'control freak'.
To Shanti:
Yes I know you can feel anyone you know 'by feeling' . I just read this stories that when you become someone's disciple that the bond is eternal and cannot be broken etc. I am not sure that I would like that kind of bond with him, since he and I are on different wavelengths.
quote:
You don't have to be scared of how much control he has over you as he will have as much as you will give him.
Thank you for your reassurance, it is deeply appreciated. |
Edited by - Mykal K on Feb 23 2013 04:20:15 AM |
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Feb 22 2013 : 3:47:01 PM
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Hi Mykal,
I would agree with Shanti's description. But, I would also say that if you felt anger from your teacher through the connection, it is worth looking in to. A teacher/guru should not experience or respond with anger in such a situation. It should just be a gentle release (with love).
Also, depending on the type of connection the teacher is using, the strength you feel is combination to the persons "energy" and your openness/trust. Your trust forms sort of the "size of the pipe". If the teacher is very advanced, he can sort of overwhelm the system (and skip the pipe).
Best, Jeff |
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Goodway
USA
99 Posts |
Posted - Feb 22 2013 : 3:53:41 PM
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He needs to be fair. This idea that a guru or teacher does not need to be fair is unwise. It leads to all kinds of misery.
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Mykal K
Germany
267 Posts |
Posted - Feb 23 2013 : 04:54:49 AM
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Hi Jeff,
thank you for your answer.
I know that a teacher can overwhelm your system so to speak, but even then, if he uses that to create a connection you do not want, you can end it, no? Free will?
Hello Goodwill,
I will keep in mind what you've said.
Shanti:
Thank you for your kind presence.
I thought through what you've said, and, well I think there is not much to fear. If something happens that I do not want, I can always end it.
And there needs to be a redefining of the current relationship, I think.
Thank you all for support.
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Edited by - Mykal K on Feb 23 2013 06:02:26 AM |
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kami
USA
921 Posts |
Posted - Feb 23 2013 : 06:54:18 AM
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Hi Mykal,
Shanti is right - this has been my experience too.
quote:
Originally posted by Mykal K
I know that a teacher can overwhelm your system so to speak, but even then, if he uses that to create a connection you do not want, you can end it, no? Free will?
A teacher (or anyone) can overwhelm you only if you let them. No connection can be formed if there is no recipient at the other end. Teachers that work like that know this and leave you alone once they are shown you are not interested. It isn't just fear that plays into it - thinking excessively about someone who has the ability to form "connections" is enough to keep that in place. Another way that teachers maintain bonds with their students is through specific "trademarked" and "secret" spiritual practices, particularly those involving energy and transmission. If one truly wants to break away, it might be necessary to stop those..
Also, in such "connections", it is not possible to read your private thoughts or see into your private things in an exact manner. It is just a feel for it. It is possible to have those abilities however - siddhis. But people that have those abilities have no interest in using them (generally).
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Edited by - kami on Feb 23 2013 07:03:00 AM |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Feb 23 2013 : 08:26:20 AM
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Hi Mykal,
Here is something that came to me a few years ago... feel it may help here...
http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....OPIC_ID=6402
quote:
Originally posted by Shanti
Fall in love with the gift being given to you
Not the box it comes in.
Fall in love with the silence
Not the practices that bring you silence.
Fall in love with the truth being revealed to you
Not the guru or system that is delivering the truth.
We miss so much by focusing on the form that delivers the truth to us.
The ego will analyze, judge, defend, a guru or a system.
That is what the ego loves to do.. engage itself in something.
But when we let go the judgment, the analyzing, the defending...
We let the actual teachings in.
These teachings are real subtle and beyond the mind.
Hence the mind does not get it.
Be....
....silent......
Let go the attachment to the gift box
And start enjoying the gift.
The truths being sent to us
The blessings being poured into our lives.
Fall in love with....
The guru in you...
The silence.
Shhhhhhhhhhhh......
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Feb 23 2013 : 10:30:58 AM
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Tquote:
Originally posted by Mykal K
Hi Jeff,
thank you for your answer.
I know that a teacher can overwhelm your system so to speak, but even then, if he uses that to create a connection you do not want, you can end it, no? Free will?
Hi Mykal,
Yes, you can always end it. But, it is possible for a "not so nice" guru type to hide a connection behind one of your deep fears in the energy body. It can be a little like a computer virus. Prayer and faith in your Ishta is always the best "cleanser" for a situation like that. Also, your guru did compose himself and left, so it sounds like there should be no concerns.
Best wishes, Jeff |
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Mykal K
Germany
267 Posts |
Posted - Feb 23 2013 : 1:00:14 PM
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Hi kami,
quote:
It is possible to have those abilities however - siddhis. But people that have those abilities have no interest in using them (generally)
That is what they tell you  .
quote:
Another way that teachers maintain bonds with their students is through specific "trademarked" and "secret" spiritual practices, particularly those involving energy and transmission. If one truly wants to break away, it might be necessary to stop those..
Thank you for sharing that.
Shanti,
Thank you for the song. I think I know where you're heading with it. You already kind of hinted that before .
Jeff,
I think I see that pattern in some relationships people make with 'ordinary' people. If I understand what you think that is. I also do not think that is the case here, problem here was only in that I thought that I would become dependant and subservient to my teacher, but you people have shifted my perception a bit to a more 'down to earth' view.
Anyway, thank you all for your voices, nice to be here.
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Namath
350 Posts |
Posted - Feb 24 2013 : 04:21:46 AM
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Hi Mykal,
Love what everyone shared with you so far.
Would love to add from my humble little experience,Love is a strong bond & if he's a real guru it's eternal.If the link is psychic link,it will break.
Sometimes we may misjudge or misinterpret the guru based on abnormalities and darkness in our ego.or else what's there to fear?
Your post touched me and i could relate to your experience.Having said that,I haven't received not even once anger vibes from brothers,sisters and mentors I loved,trusted & dealt with from different paths...even though i intentionally pulled their legs sometimes & waited for their reactions ....
Love
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Mykal K
Germany
267 Posts |
Posted - Feb 25 2013 : 03:05:48 AM
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Thank you Namath,
quote:
Love is a strong bond & if he's a real guru it's eternal
You know, my 'problem' with a guru would be in my wish that my wife is the most important person to me in my life. My companion. I don't know how to fit a 'guru' in that. Could you please comment on that? If it is not to personal that is.
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Namath
350 Posts |
Posted - Feb 25 2013 : 04:22:56 AM
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Hey
I don't have a physical guru but for me the guru is not the person you see in front of you.In Quran "Surah Omran" God brought up the level of "those who have knowledge <Spiritual teachers> " & Angels to his witness level...to his consciousness level.So Guru becomes God...God's deputy on Earth.
It's been clearly said in Quran that a prophet,saint,people of Allah will never come and ask to follow them and worship them as idols..A real guru will keep directing you again and again to the God within you.You are God as much as he's God.If otherwise...then forget him...his magic will fade sooner or later!
keep your attention on the formless God within you...Love yourself,love God & love your wife in God!
Your wife is God's gift as much as you're God's gift to her .You're right to consider her the most important "Person".
All Love.
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Mykal K
Germany
267 Posts |
Posted - Feb 25 2013 : 06:18:52 AM
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quote:
keep your attention on the formless God within you...Love yourself,love God & love your wife in God!
Your wife is God's gift as much as you're God's gift to her .You're right to consider her the most important "Person".
Thank you Namath. |
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Holy
796 Posts |
Posted - Feb 27 2013 : 7:23:01 PM
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Hi Mykal K,
Shanti already explained the mechanics. Here some experiences that might expand the perspective:
This body-mind here has met many teachers and some masters. Those teachers had often some nice things to say or to teach, but only those few masters were able to become one with this body-mind here. The experience was always most beautifully or veery funny and always godly in all ways.
One of them loves to be "me" fully and while this happens, all is love, all is majestic and beautiful. It feels like merging and being love and when interaction with other body-minds happen while being one with the master, the effects are beyond understanding, like the master is physically present.
This one master was even able to become one with this body-mind here and through that showing another body-mind the continuity of bliss in such a way, that this and the other body-mind and the master were one big love =P
If it is a true master, one with eternal love, why would you not like to be one with him? :) This master was from the Ramana - Papaji - lineage and still lives and is known as Madhukar. Papaji does this too, but he is more funny, godly funny :)
Another master from the Ramana-lineage also likes to look by, mostly smiling and looking what this body-mind is doing and by that being highly amused often times =P That one is also known as Nithyananda ^^
Because of the affinity to the kriya lineage and the practice, most of them come and become one here aswell.
All always start from the space in the braincenter or a little above , showing up in face or presence and then becoming one with the whole body-mind, making godly jokes or just being love, sometimes just being silent-peace or a mixture of these.
If this body-mind here remembers a master or consiously brings up his face in the head or tunes into that master, the same happens after some moments to minutes. some masters are more responsive to this, some like to remain more in the backround, like e.g. Gurunath from the kriya masters, only becoming one and heightening your state to his when the intention to become one is clearly there. Otherwise (to take him as the more in the backround-example) he keeps silent, always present but silent and only sometimes smiles out because of some funny situation or whatever and through that becoming visible for a moment as one with the body-mind =P ..
Fusing with the master has a different degree and intensity to fusing with e.g. the girl-friend of this body-mind. Sometimes the master is one while being one with the partner and all enjoy and become this love, sometimes and mostly the master skips to the backround and the partner dominates for a while. Don't know how this will evolve over time, but all in all the master being one with god, being one with love is always welcome fully and completely here.
To that part of seing and knowing what the other does: here it's clear that the master knows and sees it all while this body-mind only sees that much of the master's body-mind as it is capable of in that moment. Sometimes more, sometimes less. So the Connection is in both directions, one looking through two body-minds.
The witness merges more and more with the whole universe, so becoming more and more one with all, seing more and more through all is totally natural.
When it comes to your teacher-situation, who gets angry and is jelous and so on, don't know what you really learn from this teacher, but this body-mind here was never happy with most teachers =P A master is happiness and love itself, so there is no other way else than to become happy and love. Would skip the teacher and go to a master, but in parallel do some effective practices to remain independant at the same time when it comes to purifying the body-mind to let more and more of the eternal best shine through :)
Happy being one with all and happy keeping up the practice =) |
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Mykal K
Germany
267 Posts |
Posted - Mar 01 2013 : 03:07:56 AM
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Holy:
quote:
If it is a true master, one with eternal love, why would you not like to be one with him?
I wouldn't have anything against this master, don't get me wrong. I just wouldn't place him on the first place, priority wise. Anything else would feel like cheating to me. I was just worried that such a thing wouldn't be possible. But, the way I see it now, master/teacher is human after all, and human connections all have to work the same way. You should be able to define/decide who you like most, and with whom your connection is the strongest.
Thank you very much for sharing your experiences, I appreciate that very much.
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Teacher and other bonds
