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willie
United Kingdom
36 Posts |
 Posted - May 05 2012 : 8:10:10 PM
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Hi Folks
I've been doing DM for a little while after a break but I have to confess that the "I am" or "Ayam" mantra doesn't really come easily to me. For some reason I find it clunky and can't get over this.
I find it a real effort trying to enunciate this mantra in my mind and it seems to take distract me from simply focusing on the mantra itself.
I find the sound of "eeeyom" much easier to cope with and intend to use this from now on unless there is a good reason not to.
The other idea I have is to try breath meditation instead.
What are your views. I'd be grateful to hear them
Willie |
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AumNaturel
Canada
687 Posts |
Posted - May 05 2012 : 10:14:52 PM
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When I switched from breath to DM, I overly 'vocalized' the mantra almost as if pronouncing it but still in my mind. Over time I found it becoming easier to lightly pick it up at the more subtle level, where there's more mantra impulse and less overly-deliberate intent to repeat it.
Have a look at the instructions again if it helps, as far as you got with them. Maybe it is the right time to do so and see if anything new comes up that might help your DM go smoother and easier. |
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willie
United Kingdom
36 Posts |
Posted - May 06 2012 : 5:40:39 PM
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Thanks AumNaturel. I have tried to look again at how I'm doing but this mantra does seem to be unnatural to me. I aim to try the breath and/or change the mantra to the "eeeeom", which might work better for me.
If I understand the meditation principle right, this shouldn't really matter in terms of the effectiveness of the practice. There seems to be so many ways of doing it that it comes down to personal choice. At least this is my understanding and I realise I might be wrong. Have I missed something?
Willie |
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AumNaturel
Canada
687 Posts |
Posted - May 06 2012 : 5:58:19 PM
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Have a look at lesson 22.
Later on when it comes to adding mantra enhancements, using another mantra would also mean changing it, and the lessons suggest against changing the mantra after it has worked its way in for so long. 'Dig one deep well instead of many shallow ones.' Just something to keep in mind. |
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willie
United Kingdom
36 Posts |
Posted - May 06 2012 : 7:59:59 PM
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Thanks for the link to the lesson, AumNaturel. It does outline the particular nature of the IAM sound. But it also says that, even though the IAM mantra has purpose, that any sound can be used to meditate. If I'm not finding the IAM too comfortable I'm still wondering if it might be best to try another.
Can I ask why you changed to DM? I'm assuming that you find it more useful than the breath meditation. I'd be really interested to know what DM gives that breath meditation did not? The reason I'm asking is that I had assumed all practices were pretty alike and differed in superficial ways only.
I am really interested in this even though you can tell I'm not an expert 
Thanks for your help 
Willie |
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AumNaturel
Canada
687 Posts |
Posted - May 06 2012 : 11:01:32 PM
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Hi willie,
perhaps someone else will chime in for an alternate take on what it might mean that the mantra for now isn't too comfortable in your experience.
I changed to DM because after some desperate searching and practicing in other systems, all of that has led me to AYP. That's not without saying a good deal of that prior experience did transfer over (ex. breath regulation with minimal effort, leading attention through body, etc.), since the principles you find anywhere are really part of you. I had some reservations giving up the fairly silent sitting in favor of a mantra. Now I see plenty of silence throughout the practices, including mantra meditation. Doing it twice a day every day it really adds up.
As to what DM gives and how it compares to breath meditation, my experience is too limited to say, and even then it wouldn't really matter. Also, breath meditation here is recommended in case the practitioner is too sensitive with the mantra or its enhancements. With ecstatic conductivity, the mantra's effects are said to become more evident, and either way it will continue to do its thing. |
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willie
United Kingdom
36 Posts |
Posted - May 08 2012 : 06:07:52 AM
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Hello again. I've reviewed my use of the mantra. I stuck with ayam/iam and said it normally but softly. Before I was trying to make it run smoothly into a sort of hypnotic yaaammmeeeyaamm noise. This time I just thought it the way I would say it quietly and it seemed to work a lot better.
I will persevere with it for the time being and do the same.
Thanks for your help AumNaturel I am grateful for your suggestions.
Willie |
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mathurs
United Kingdom
197 Posts |
Posted - May 08 2012 : 07:57:28 AM
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Willie,
I think you are over-intellectualising about this. Just do it. Dont put too much attention to how clunky it feels, how something else would / might feel better. Just trust the process and go for it. Slowly the mantra will become second nature... during DM. |
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willie
United Kingdom
36 Posts |
Posted - May 08 2012 : 5:31:38 PM
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I will do my best :)
Willie |
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SeySorciere
Seychelles
1553 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2012 : 01:26:55 AM
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Dear Willie
There is no right way to think the mantra, just think it back to back and keep gently favouring it above all thoughts, feelings that arise. The Thought AYAM has the vibratory quality - forget the sound. AYAM becomes fuzzy and refined after a while.
Enjoy your practices
Sey
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axelschlotzhauer
Germany
150 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2012 : 01:50:25 AM
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Look at the present string with expert Victor allowing himself with similar aim to aum any variation he likes to do. The mantra knows himself what to do.
Why not here?
My Lama having myself craziest difficulties with the newly initiated mantra said nothing against false pronounciation. Having his frequency is sufficient beyond all syllables uttered. There are sufficient stories in each tradition of misunderstood mantras leading nevertheless to success. Faith shall be sufficient.
But doing the mantra negligently with bad pronouciation may hinder success by insufficient concentration. If this is built up it is usual for certain mantras for getting quicker a big amount for howling them in the frequencies in most bad pronouciation of syllables if any.
Axel |
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Victor
USA
910 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2012 : 04:14:43 AM
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Axelschlotzhauer, I am far from a professed mantra expert. When it comes to mantra meditation my main practice has been AYP. I have read a number of posts here questioning if the AYP IAM mantra is authentic or traditional. I have never doubted Yogani's teaching on this issue.
What prompted me to post was remembering some chants that a teacher of mine had had us do about 30 years ago. I realized that IAM was included in that chant. OK, it was Ayim, rather than Ayam. To my ear ( mind) they are very much the same when repeated silently so I chose to post that. If the subtlety of the sounds differs I am not very aware of it unless one deliberately elongates the sound such as ayaaaam. It is my understanding and experience that once you do the mantra regularly that it does find its own sound and that many beginners tend to get bogged down with too much worry about pronunciation.Ayoumm might be just as comfortable for some as well. Isn't the main idea to go into silence? |
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axelschlotzhauer
Germany
150 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2012 : 05:07:34 AM
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I presently do not have the experience of the I am mantra but of silence connected with it and the astral channel of the spine behind it Yogananda is speaking of presumably creating it.
As my experience for third eye and open crown did not touch to my knowledge the pituitory gland or as the center for sweet secretion into the mouth and nirvikalpa in dead man sawasana position or concentrated everyday life of advanced practitioners and leaders I have no hurry till I have sufficient information.
Last night I saw a video for the mantra soham instructing also returning to it when thinking let the mantra and its syllables forget. Not much energy work this way as the performing person also showed.
A direct way into silence whereas the Tibetan practice in the group loudly chants creating an energyfield and a phase of the preferred and more powerfully silent rezitation as an preferred advanced state not possible in the beginning. The mantra develops concentration you have later also without it but can be replenished with it on a higher stage.
Listen how the master pronounces is important. Without one and sufficient experience you follow your intuition and how it develops.
Deviations from the original can be explained especially by aum containing all existing sounds by special needs of cleansing and creating channels.
So I had big difficulties with my first fully initiated mantra to remember it and syllables were so blocked that I could not utter or think it stopping the rezitation.
Axel
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Victor
USA
910 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2012 : 1:33:05 PM
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| It seems to me that these tibetan mantras are long and more complex. This would require more attention to detail and pronunciation (especially when chanted out loud), as well as the possibility of forgetting portions. The IAM mantra is short and simple and repeated silently so would seem quite different in that way |
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Alternative Mantra
