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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
 Posted - Oct 18 2011 : 1:33:39 PM
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i have been practising this sutra in my samyama... the lesson that explains it is:
quote:
http://www.aypsite.org/351.html
but today i found a quote that really explains more simply and deeply (at least for me ) the first part of the sutra( ie the I thought)...
"I think signifies association with the faculty of thinking,similarly also in others instances,association with the body,the senses etc...is meant.If on the other hand "I" be identical with them how many I's are there? You are mistaking a superimposition for the reality (Crumbs from His table/Ramananada Swarnagiri)
which made me understand more deeply what Ramana always talks about,
the I-I
thought about sharing this....hope you dont mind dear Yogani
ps:moderators if you think it is better to move this thread for better placement (the quotes forum maybe?) ,please do so |
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bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Oct 18 2011 : 5:38:10 PM
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| A lot of thought, insightful thought, but where is the bhakti? Desire is the wind under the wings of my glider. |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Oct 19 2011 : 01:27:41 AM
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| without bhakti how can there be enquiry? |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Oct 19 2011 : 09:42:09 AM
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Hi Maheswari,
Here is something I had written about my experience with the "I sense" a while back, never really posted about it, but it is very similar to what you write.
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"I began to notice the moments that caused me discomfort. There was a very sudden presence of "I". A "I" that needed to be protected becasue someone said something that threatened this "I". It was like a cobra suddenly fanning out its head, making it's presence known and then gone the next moment when seen. This "I" came in as a mother, daughter, friend, mentor, care giver, provider, colleague, employee. As I sat and contemplated the situations, nothing stood out but the "I". It was so beautifully clear. In each case the "I" was so very distinct.
Ahh... this is what is call ahamkara... the aham.. the me.. the kara.. the doer.
So one morning after meditation I felt drawn to do samyama on this... was not sure what it was that I was to do samyama on... so I collected all the moments the "I" announced its presence... a general and distinct sense of "I" that needed protecting... put all those together and released it is silence... for the next round the word "I sense" came up... so again I picked the word "I sense" and the subtle collective "I sense" I had formed through those moments of discomfort and let it go in silence.
Now I need all these words to explain this, but is reality it is something that happens in one swoop... the sutra, the subtle experience of the collective "I sense"... all of it happens in a quick flash and takes less than a few seconds to pick up and drop.
The first time I did it, it felt huge. I realized why Yogani's sutra is not just "who am I". it is "I-thought – Who am I?"... similar to the "I sense" that I was experiencing. " |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Oct 19 2011 : 3:13:14 PM
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quote:
I began to notice the moments that caused me discomfort. There was a very sudden presence of "I". A "I" that needed to be protected becasue someone said something that threatened this "I".
if one catches it from the begining,one will avoid feeling carried away by all the mental construction,the ever present silence will shine...
quote:
I realized why Yogani's sutra is not just "who am I". it is "I-thought – Who am I?"... similar to the "I sense" that I was experiencing.
"
true,both parts are essential...
i have a question...
the other sutras,i easily drop them into silence,no thinking over ,no dwelling on the words meaning...very easily i drop the sutras into silence...
but for "I-thought,who am I?" sutra...there is some thinking going on...first i realize that I is different from thoughts , i ask "who am I",then only i go into silence....
is that normal? maybe there is some thinking because this sutra is formed of many words unlike the other ones?
thank you Shanti |
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Oct 19 2011 : 9:21:03 PM
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Maheswari,
Sorry, if i am jumping in on your conversation with Shanti. What you are feeling is very common. It is not the number of the words, but the multiple steps.
In Samyama, it is a word with light intent released into silence. What you are probably doing is unconsciously defining "I-thought" and giving energy to it. That energy is the percieved thinking starting. Then you add the "who am I?" to it and release into silence. The way you are doing shouldn't be an issue and sounds similar to what Shanti described above (You are just sensing the components). The key is releasing it all into silence as you have been doing. If you find it distracting, just don't define the "I-thought" part or you can just skip it, because for you it is already implied.
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Oct 20 2011 : 01:40:17 AM
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thank you Jeff for your reply (all replies are always welcomed)
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i am not finding the "i-thought"part distracting....just wanted to make sure i was not missing something
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Edited by - maheswari on Oct 20 2011 01:40:51 AM |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Oct 20 2011 : 08:04:23 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by maheswari
[quote]i have a question...
the other sutras,i easily drop them into silence,no thinking over ,no dwelling on the words meaning...very easily i drop the sutras into silence...
but for "I-thought,who am I?" sutra...there is some thinking going on...first i realize that I is different from thoughts , i ask "who am I",then only i go into silence....
is that normal? maybe there is some thinking because this sutra is formed of many words unlike the other ones?
thank you Shanti
Hi Maheswari,
It is normal, and yet, it will change over time. The long sutra will also become just a slight reference... it will be picked up just like any of the other sutras and dropped.
What Jeff was trying to say (correct me if I am wrong Jeff ) is that when we still have a bit of thinking involved, there is a slight holding on to the words before they are released... and the longer they are held on to, the more defined they get. As we continue, the slight holding on to the words falls away and just the inner knowing of the meaning remains... so when the words are picked up and let go in silence, the mind is not involved, becasue there is no thinking and analyzing the words, there is only the sense of the meaning of the words on the inside.
Does this help?
Before we attach words and meaning to the sense arising from stillness, it is unformed thoughts, just potential, it is still at the level of "thy will"... when the mind jumps in and attaches a meaning to that sense it becomes "my will"...
That is why in the group healing samyama, we ask only for the name of the person who requests healing, if there is too much info on why the person needs healing... then the healing becomes "my will" , but the most effective healing can happen at the level of "thy will"... so when we know nothing about the person's probems, we can just pick the name and let "thy will" be done.
So the trick of samyama is to pick up and let go the sutras before they become "my will".
It is a very subtle difference and will keep refining itself over time.
Does this make sense? |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Oct 20 2011 : 1:04:44 PM
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yep it does
thank you |
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bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Oct 20 2011 : 2:01:39 PM
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| Thanks for this discussion! |
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I thought who am i sutra in samayama
