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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
 Posted - Aug 29 2011 : 2:02:46 PM
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Hi Nathan 
I wouldn't say that putting attention on the third eye outside of practices times will "interfere" with the results of DM. What I *would* say however, is that in my experience, putting attention on the third eye during regular activity "takes me away from myself." For me, it is important to keep a balance between my "Divine nature" and my "human nature" and that to focus too much on "spiritual stuff" in between practice times takes me away from my "human nature." That may not be the best way of explaining what I'm try to here, but I'm not sure how else to say it. I guess I could say that to focus on the spiritual eye during daily activity puts me "up in the clouds" and takes me away from "the here and now." I find it more advantageous to be here, in my human body when in between practice times and to do all that "spiritual stuff" during my practice times. Just my 2 cents.
Much Love!
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Nathan
47 Posts |
Posted - Aug 29 2011 : 7:46:34 PM
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Hi Carson
Thanks for the response. I think I know what you mean about being "up in the clouds." But for me putting attention on the third eye brings relaxation and a sense of well-being, and might even make me more present, because my attention and energy is less free to get lost in thoughts. It also seems to relieve stress and depression, because the energy that was going towards those gets put to a better use.
I can see though that if someone was already getting a lot of results from their sitting practice, that outside of it they might like to just focus on being grounded. |
Edited by - Nathan on Aug 29 2011 7:54:14 PM |
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - Aug 29 2011 : 11:15:23 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Nathan
Hi Carson
Thanks for the response. I think I know what you mean about being "up in the clouds." But for me putting attention on the third eye brings relaxation and a sense of well-being, and might even make me more present, because my attention and energy is less free to get lost in thoughts. It also seems to relieve stress and depression, because the energy that was going towards those gets put to a better use.
I can see though that if someone was already getting a lot of results from their sitting practice, that outside of it they might like to just focus on being grounded.
Hi Nathan,:)
Here is another opinion.
I love the third eye. I love the magnetic pressure. I love that it becomes active whenever I am concentrating on certain topics and that it serves as a barometer. Also, seeing the world through it is a new and exciting experience. I wish it were fully active all of the time, and that is what I strive for.
Here is a quote from Samuel Sagan's awakening the third eye:
link: http://www.clairvision.org/ckb/ckbe...SaganATE.pdf
quote:
So, this is a first extension of your spiritual quest into your daily
activities. Now, each time you walk, you can be a seeker. You can
either wander without any awareness, swallowed by your
thoughts, or you can be totally in the vibration between the
eyebrows.
Driving is another activity that you will find easy to marry with
your awareness in the eye. Driving from the eye is harmonious
and immensely satisfying for the soul. The focus keeps you aware
and centred, and you can drive for longer periods of time with
less tension and less fatigue. Moreover, you remain vigilant and
your angle of vision is wider, which improves the safety of your
driving.
Then the purpose is to extend your awareness to more and more of
your activities, until you reach a constant focus in the eye.
At one stage this eye-centred awareness will become automatic and
effortless. It will be integrated into all your actions. Then you
become a candidate for initiation.
Think of all the monks who spend their lives in a monastery with
nothing else to do than pray or meditate from morning to night.
Only a small percentage of them will reach the enlightenment
they are after. How then could you hope to have a chance, just by
meditating 20 minutes twice a day and being caught in the turmoil
of modern life the rest of the time?
The answer lies in extending your awareness to every situation of
your daily life. Start using the world to become more aware. Then
the world becomes your teacher instead of your adversary. The
most insignificant circumstances turn into beautiful opportunities
to test and enhance your centredness and your vigilance. For it is
very possible to slumber in a monastery, to withdraw into a
disconnected inner life that avoids key issues and leads nowhere.
Whereas if you accept facing the world, then the world will make
sure that you face yourself.
Now please do not make being in the eye a painstaking process –
have fun! The Clairvision techniques have been designed for you to
play with. There can be a foolish way of remaining in your head
all day, only remembering your purpose of vigilance from time to
time and getting angry at yourself for letting your mind wander.
Instead of being swallowed by your daily routines and
remembering the focus in the eye only now and then, I would
suggest that in the beginning, you apply yourself to performing
certain actions with a total awareness between the eyebrows.
For instance, do the dishes being 100% in the eye. If you put all of
yourself into it, after a few times it will become automatic: each
time you start washing up the presence in the eye will come by
itself. Incidentally, note that washing up can become a very
refreshing activity if you use a flow of running water and release
your tensions and wrong energies into it as you process the dishes
(technique 4.12).
Several activities that would usually be regarded as plain and
boring will become unexpectedly fascinating if you perform them
from the eye. As more and more seeingness and vision are added to
the focus in your eye, the world turns into a constant source of
wonder. You can very well implement this path where you are,
here and now. Leaving your job and fleeing into a cave would not
necessarily be an advantage. The problem is not so much to change
your activities but to achieve them with the new awareness.
:)
TI
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Aug 30 2011 : 07:24:18 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Nathan
But for me putting attention on the third eye brings relaxation and a sense of well-being, and might even make me more present, because my attention and energy is less free to get lost in thoughts. It also seems to relieve stress and depression, because the energy that was going towards those gets put to a better use.
You got some good advice from both Carson and TI.
Please remember that Third Eye is not Ajana Chakra, its an extension of the Ajana chakra.
Keeping attention on third eye outside meditation/practices for long can sometimes create complexities. But if you are comfortable with it, you are gifted.
Don't get surprised if people/things start acting strangely around you.
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Nathan
47 Posts |
Posted - Aug 30 2011 : 2:43:36 PM
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Hi TI
Thanks for your response and link. To clarify, there is a tingling/magnetic/energetic type of feeling between, and slightly above my eyebrows on the surface of the forehead, and it is just this sensation that I hold attention on. So for me it's not yet associated with extrasensory or spiritual vision. But anyways, I can relate to that excerpt you included, like when he talks about putting attention into the eyebrow center instead of tension and thought. I'm going to go through that book, but does what I do sound basically like what he's talking about in the excerpt?
Do you find that the center sometimes needs a rest? Previously, I would keep attention on the center up to hours a day outside of formal meditation, and after sometime, maybe weeks, the center wouldn't feel as "fresh" or energetic. So I'm not sure if the area needed to rest, or the mind starts to get bored with it and needs a little break.
In your opinion, do you think this would interfere with the DM practice?
Thanks,
Nathan
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Nathan
47 Posts |
Posted - Aug 30 2011 : 2:47:21 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by manigma
Please remember that Third Eye is not Ajana Chakra, its an extension of the Ajana chakra.
Don't get surprised if people/things start acting strangely around you.
Hi Manigma
Yes, I should probably just call it Ajna for now.
How might people and things act strange? |
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Holy
796 Posts |
Posted - Aug 30 2011 : 8:06:29 PM
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Nathan :)
your intention is good, but most probably it will become unstable over some weeks to months.
You can still give it a go. It will surely give great insights which will make your house-cleaning decisions wiser and wiser ;) |
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - Aug 31 2011 : 01:00:01 AM
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Hi Nathan, :)
You know, this is a wonderful thread. It contains allot of good information and insight.
quote:
Originally posted by Nathan
Hi TI
Thanks for your response and link. To clarify, there is a tingling/magnetic/energetic type of feeling between, and slightly above my eyebrows on the surface of the forehead, and it is just this sensation that I hold attention on. So for me it's not yet associated with extrasensory or spiritual vision.
If you focus just on the sensation, then you aren't going to develop the visions or learn more about the third eye.
When I first started experiencing the magnetic pull, I would experiment with it. I tried various things with it like trying to control the pressure and direct it. I would suck in on the in breath and push out on the out breath. I learned that if you do that with very gentle breath, the magnetic pull follows. Then I learned that, when sitting in "sensing the inner body" and the dream state would present itself before my forehead, by controlling the breath, I could keep from getting sucked into a dream.
So, the next step would be to try the same exercises. Experiment. See how it relates and how slow you have to make the breath before the magentic pull follows it.
quote:
But anyways, I can relate to that excerpt you included, like when he talks about putting attention into the eyebrow center instead of tension and thought. I'm going to go through that book, but does what I do sound basically like what he's talking about in the excerpt?
The attention on the brow, the tingling, the pressure, that is all just the first step in Samuel Sagan's book. Well, actually, he starts by training your hands to feel the vibrations/tingles. Then he points out that when you feel that, the brow also tingles. Then he shows you how to increase the vibrations by using raspy breathing, which connects the throat chakra to the brow. After that, he explains the colored light you see and then how to bypass that to get into the astral planes. (The astral planes are a distraction, but very interesting nontheless.)
quote:
Do you find that the center sometimes needs a rest? Previously, I would keep attention on the center up to hours a day outside of formal meditation, and after sometime, maybe weeks, the center wouldn't feel as "fresh" or energetic.
I can't remember ever thinking that the third eye needed a rest, but I did notice that it is more sensitive on some days than others. I believe this is based on the body's cycles, diet and other cyclical factors (time of year, time of day etc). Also, to charge the third eye up, I just inhale very slowly through the nose and feel the air as it passes by the top of the sinus cavities. Within seconds the magnetic pull is activated. The more I do that the stronger it gets.
quote:
So I'm not sure if the area needed to rest, or the mind starts to get bored with it and needs a little break.
The mind usually gets bored very easily. Isn't just sitting in a hot sports car exciting at first, but if you don't get to drive it, the excitement wears out? What fun is there in just feeling the steering wheel, the contour of the seat over and over and over again?
quote:
In your opinion, do you think this would interfere with the DM practice?
Yes and no. If you never see visions, there is less to distract you during deep meditation. However, sooner or later you are going to hit the dream world as you relax in meditation, you will see visions too, and based on the development of your witness or watcher, if you already know how to stay out of dreams and have lost interest in the visions, that is an advantage.
Also, sambhavi is a part of Spinal Breathing, and that will also develop the third eye. Actually, it will energize the third eye quite a bit. Lots, in fact. In Spinal Breathing you are taking prana from the base of your spine directly to the brow, the third eye.
If you read the "Secrets of Wilder", you will also notice that John Wilder eventually adds sambhavi to his deep meditation practice (with the conviction of putting more emphasis on the mantra).
So, I guess what I'm saying is that I believe that as you progress, the awakening of the third eye plays an integral role in AYP.
It is not a standalone practice, but there are allot of teachings that say it can be (like Christi mentioned earlier in this thread, and the notes about Yogananda etc).
If you want to get the spiritual vision or activate the third eye sight, you have to keep going. Learn the techniques, like the repositioning of your attention to look through the third eye. Or not. It will develop on it's own if you simply keep doing DM and Spinal Breathing. But it might take longer..
These are the new discoveries that I have found concerning the Third Eye, or ajna, or the point about 1 1/2 inches behind the brows towards the center of the head:
1) Saraswati says that if you can see a black flame there, your third eye is very developed. I first started seeing the black flame there about 4 years ago. I wrote about it back then on this forum.
2) If I do bhastrika just on the section from the brow to the center of the head, it is extremely ecstatic. If I breathe in very slowly from the brow to the center of the head, and then send the breath out through the top of the head, it is also extremely ecstatic. Sort of like Spinal Breathing, but with a different path.
3) Just by holding my attention on the black flame, or even in the space surrounding that area, my body does the root lock all by itself. Well, it used to do just that. Now the whole lower torso also tenses, waves come up and my head starts nodding up and down. Not just a bit, it is more like my head swings back and then all the way down to my chest and then back again. Or, sometimes, my head will shake back and forth. It is a highly ecstatic experience and I'm not really comfortable with all that so I haven't been doing it much lately. Yes (emc), I am getting kriyas. I think the head rocking is actually some kind of chin pump!
4) Just by focusing on the third eye, at night, as I lay in bed before falling asleep, my breathing will stop. This has happened twice now. My whole body becomes very still and I become afraid that I will die. I have not resolved that yet. Or rather, thank God that that hasn't happened for a while now! I still have to get the mind used to the idea that it isn't going to die if I let that happen. Those experiences made me cool down my third eye focus for a while.
5) If I suck inwards from the brow, roll my eyes up, breath like I was sleeping and pretend to be falling asleep while pulling the magnetic pull into the center of the head and then downwards towards the heart, I can see the dream world and visions within seconds. If I pull the magnetic pulse further down towards the heart, by the time I get to the base of the skull, everything goes black and it feels like I will die. Then, when I come out of that state, it makes me feel sick. I think I have to do that gradually, otherwise it shocks the system. It would be nice to read about someone else's experience with that 'method'. I kind of discovered it on my own so I have no confidence in it. Who knows, maybe I would really die (but probably not).
6) The third eye is hole where you can send thoughts to other people's minds through the same place (or at the back of the head). It is this phenomenon that hypnotists prey upon. Also, it is also one of the major centers through which to recieve shaktipat. It is like an open hole to the mind and inner biology.
I have a CD of Dhyanyogi singing various mantras and prayers. His instructions are to do deep breathing, focus the attention on the third eye and just listen to him singing. By performing sambhavi like that, it lets you really tune in and bathe yourself in Dhyanyogi's vibrations. Many people go into samadhi just by listening to his songs in that way. I did that a couple weeks ago and it took 4 days to get kundalini settled back down..
Did you know that Dyhanyogi used to water-witch bodies from people's homes? I learned this from a DVD workshop called Chakra Bhedan 1 by Sri Anandi Ma and Diljeep. Apparently, Dhyanyogi could see through objects. He trained a woman on how to look through the ground. He would bury an item in the ground and then get the woman to tell him what it was. Anyway, Dhyanyogi would get requests from people to help them with their problems. In one household, the new-borns were dying shortly after birth. Dhyanyogi went over to their place, checked out the yard and told them to dig precisely in one location. They found a set of bones, someone whom had been murdered. Once they moved the illicit grave and performed some cleasning rituals, the babies born in that house survived..
That's it. I talk too much! :)
Good Luck and God Bless you.
:)
TI
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Edited by - Tibetan_Ice on Aug 31 2011 02:26:30 AM |
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Aug 31 2011 : 03:53:45 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Nathan
quote:
Originally posted by manigma
Please remember that Third Eye is not Ajana Chakra, its an extension of the Ajana chakra.
Don't get surprised if people/things start acting strangely around you.
Hi Manigma
Yes, I should probably just call it Ajna for now.
How might people and things act strange?
Yes, the Third Eye is not called 'Eye' without reason. It actually feels and works like the two eyes we have on our face. Its just that the Third Eye is not visible to the physical world. When fully developed, you can actually feel the Third Eye move inside your forehead like the physical eyes do.
Its like having a real eyeball inside your forehead.
If you keep the Third Eye open all the time without first purifying yourself fully, you might unconsciously connect with everything around you. This will effect the energy of every being/object around you in a negative or positive way depending upon on what level of purification you yourself are. And you can be affected by their energy as well.
Third Eye is God's eye. Its very powerful. You can not imagine its powers. But you have it! So play with it and discover its limitless wonders.
But rememebr, it will show you what you deserve, neither less, nor more.
Have fun!
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Nathan
47 Posts |
Posted - Aug 31 2011 : 12:26:50 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Holy
Nathan :)
your intention is good, but most probably it will become unstable over some weeks to months.
You can still give it a go. It will surely give great insights which will make your house-cleaning decisions wiser and wiser ;)
Hi Holy :)
You may be right about the combination not being sustainable, but my main concern is that the DM practice will be affected. Like if I've been keeping attention on Ajna for an hour and then go to practice DM, the depth or quality might be affected because the attention has to be disengaged from Ajna temporarily and it might be harder to go inside.
It would be great though if I can integrate the two and get the benefits of both.
My renewed interest in focusing on Ajna has been brought about from a desire to ease emotional pain that has been coming up, very possibly as a result of DM. I've been thinking of your words in another thread that if one has the time (which I do), the kriya yoga practice will be smoother. Right now, I can only sustainably do DM for 10 minutes, twice a day, and I can't do spinal breathing, whereas I was doing about 7 minutes twice a day for months when I used Ajna as a focus for meditation. But for now I'm going to stick with DM, and see if I can integrate attention on Ajna outside of formal practice. |
Edited by - Nathan on Aug 31 2011 12:57:34 PM |
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Nathan
47 Posts |
Posted - Aug 31 2011 : 12:49:23 PM
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Hi TI :)
I sometimes breath in and out through the forehead also to boost the feeling.
You mentioned that attention on the brow is just the first step in Sagan's book. That may be true, but it's my belief that in just doing that, thing will evolve without further methods. Even so, I might try some of the methods to evolve the center faster. The purple space at the eyebrow center that he mentions sounds appealing.
Thanks for sharing some of your experiences also. |
Edited by - Nathan on Sep 01 2011 7:46:52 PM |
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Nathan
47 Posts |
Posted - Aug 31 2011 : 1:07:01 PM
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Hi again manigma :)
I will sometimes think of or try to feel the Ajna as an eye, and that feels good.
I'm certainly not fully purified. But according to the book TI mentioned, Ajna is a switch that can be used to make ones aura protective, hopefully keeping out the negative baggage of others. |
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Sep 01 2011 : 01:12:09 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Nathan
Hi again manigma :)
I will sometimes think of or try to feel the Ajna as an eye, and that feels good.
I'm certainly not fully purified. But according to the book TI mentioned, Ajna is a switch that can be used to make ones aura protective, hopefully keeping out the negative baggage of others.
Yes, its a great book. There is a checklist of things before using the eye to protect your aura. Its in chapter 17.
My favorite part from the book:
In one of the retreat centres of our school in the tablelands of NSW, an eagle used to come and watch us when we were working outside. When you tuned into the eagle, the eagle would stop 20 metres above your head and gaze at you. It was a complete standstill, a moment of truth. If you raised your arms towards the eagle and started turning slowly, the eagle would turn with you. Slowly, as if it was suspended in the air, the eagle followed you in a motionless dance. Then, if you 'became' the eagle, it was an inner explosion. There are simply no words to describe that. People who have never experienced anything of the kind may be clever and successful, nevertheless they live in nothing other than a cage.
Marvelous!
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Meditation on ajna chakra.
