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Anthem
1608 Posts |
 Posted - Sep 11 2011 : 10:03:29 PM
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Hi Ananda,
Maybe we should start a club then!?! It's been 5 months now, no change here, still no practicing "allowed" either. Learning continues forever onwards.
Hi Nathan,
Have you tried breath meditation or mindfulness meditation as an alternative, if DM isn't working for you?
What do you men by "ojas"?
In regards to your big question, I personally wouldn't be looking for any big breakthrough and certainly not by enduring any suffering from practices. Suffering from practices speaks to me of imbalance. Too much of a good thing is still too much.
This video I recently saw comes to mind:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=29at...yer_embedded |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Sep 12 2011 : 02:00:28 AM
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nearoanoke
USA
525 Posts |
Posted - Sep 12 2011 : 10:45:06 AM
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Hi Nathan,
As Yogani says, "Suffering/Pain is not a pre-requisite for enlightenment".
The whole concept of self-pacing is that. Adjust your practices so that you continue with no pain and continue making progress. We dont need to continue in suffering. Enlightenment doesn't ask us to do that :)
- Near |
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Sep 12 2011 : 11:34:18 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Anthem11
What do you men by "ojas"?
Anthem,
Ojas is part of the Nectar cycle. Ojas seems to effect the brain by supporting higher thinking or insights. It actually feels like a "higher" gear. A few times, I have been convinced that a drop of it has come out of the top of my head and rolled down my hair.
A random question about your not being able to practice... Do you still feel anger?
Thanks, Jeff
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Nathan
47 Posts |
Posted - Sep 12 2011 : 12:30:16 PM
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Hi Anthem,
In the past when I tried breath meditation I would start to think that I was subtly controlling the breath, and would then get fixated on trying not to control the breath, which just makes things worse. Although, I was locating the breath as per instruction (not the instructions here) either in the belly or nostrils; so maybe if I didn't zero in on those locations that problem might not be as bad. My reasoning has also been that if I can't do DM comfortably, I may as well do my attention on Ajna practice, as I can do as much of that as I want, it brings some positive results, and I can do spinal breathing also, which I can't with DM. I was doing a combined practice for a while, where I would look upwards and focus at the point between the eybrows, and at the same time there would be an awareness of the breath repeating "hong sau" or another mantra or word. Since the sole focus wasn't on the breath, the concern didn't arise as to whether I was controlling it or not...but anyway, maybe I'll give just breath awareness a try as my sitting practice.
By ojas I was referring to sexual expenditure of the pranic reserve, which I guess isn't necessarily ojas until it gets converted.
Whether or not suffering can lead to a breakthough, I certainly haven't been able or willing to stay with it for very long. That was a nice video and I see the point you are making that if one is too focused on the goal, and suffering the whole time trying to get there, then they'll miss out on enjoying the ride.
Hi Near,
I hope that quote is true.
I was doing okay for a while (probably on the edge even then) and wanted to add even more time, so I was kind of unwilling to decrease time, which got me into trouble. It seems counter-logical that less time can be better, but I guess I'll have to accept that that might be the way to go. |
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nearoanoke
USA
525 Posts |
Posted - Sep 12 2011 : 12:46:28 PM
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Hi Nathan,
Here you go, I found the lesson where Yogani said that. Now you know I didnt make it up
http://www.aypsite.org/168.html
- Near |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Sep 12 2011 : 4:57:32 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by jeff
quote:
Originally posted by Anthem11
What do you men by "ojas"?
Anthem,
Ojas is part of the Nectar cycle. Ojas seems to effect the brain by supporting higher thinking or insights. It actually feels like a "higher" gear. A few times, I have been convinced that a drop of it has come out of the top of my head and rolled down my hair.
A random question about your not being able to practice... Do you still feel anger?
Thanks, Jeff
Thanks for that definition Jeff.
Yes anger and every emotion. Sort of essential for living from my perspective. How else would I know when I am being "taken advantage" of etc.? Emotions help us to know our preferences and navigate the world.
To elaborate, I don't know about the paths of everyone else here, but mine involved accepting or surrendering to all emotions and the messages/ information that they carry. All emotions are welcomed friends here that help keep my actions in balance.
If anger or any other emotion arises, it is not me/ not what I am, and I can put the label of anger on it or not. Its just energy arising. So the information is there and it facilitates learning which is ongoing.
I think it is a myth that emotional reactions like anger, fear etc should ever go away completely. They may arise on top of a sea of well-being, and will no longer dictate action or make sense to label, but the energy and information that they carry is a guiding force for balanced living in my opinion.
Thanks for asking.
All the best!
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Edited by - Anthem on Sep 12 2011 5:18:38 PM |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Sep 12 2011 : 5:07:11 PM
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Hi Nathan,
Thanks for clarifying what you meant by ojas.
I would say if anything, not preserving sexual energy would help make it easier to self-pace rather than harder. Preserving sexual energy certainly has an additive effect on inner energy levels in my experience.
I guess the bottom line about practice is sticking to one thing that works for you. I simply suggested breath only meditation (no mantra or localization of the breath) as a lighter alternative than DM. Whatever works best for you.
Wishing you all the best on your path! |
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2011 : 10:58:23 AM
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Anthem & Ananda,
I now truly understand what you mean. I was able to spend Friday with the AYP retreat. In the second session, I was incapable of spinal breathing. No energy flow allowed. I was full. I spent some time tracing it and then went on to DM. DM was fine, unless I gave any "intent energy" to the mantra. If I did, back to the wall...
Inner silence seems to be capacity. Energy is potential. The retreat taught me that I have more energy than silence. It may be helpful to see if you might be putting intent or some energy in your DM.
Enjoy the day...
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nearoanoke
USA
525 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2011 : 5:17:13 PM
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Hi Anthem,
Few Questions:
- What about emotions like Jealousy/Greed? Do they arise still?
- What in you changes after enlightenment? Does anything in you change at all or will you be as is but accept yourself and others completely as is?
- What doesnt change? Especially things like conditioning (being introvert etc..)
- Does one see an increase in perceptual abilities like say reading speed etc..
- When they say that the world disappears upon awakening, is it in a literal sense? Do others exist only in my imagination?
- Does being morally correct have any value/karmic effect? For a seeker, if they do something morally incorrect, does it then take them longer to reach enlightenment?
- When we do what we do because we are conditioned so; how does anything we do (including spiritual practices) matter? We give our conditioned responses to others' conditioned actions, so isnt it all laid out/pre-planned? What do you believe more; free will or destiny?
- Near |
Edited by - nearoanoke on Sep 18 2011 11:04:27 PM |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2011 : 9:34:45 PM
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Hi Near,
I can't speak about post enlightenment as it doesn't apply to me. I have lots to learn in life and will always be undergoing a process of becoming more aware and more balanced in action through form.
Awareness is in a continual process of deepening here and I imagine will always be for all of us. I see terms such as enlightenment as serving only to create separation in our minds and painting ourselves into a corner of limitation. I really don't think there is any such thing as becoming enlightened, there is only continuous change. A person may feel like they have become enlightened with a sudden jump in awareness, but one thing I am certain of is that this will never be the end. Life is constant learning, an expanding and deepening of perception.
The term enlightenment creates a false picture in the mind and no living person will ever be this imagined picture.
We all have an equal amount to offer each other, we are all equals with the same thoughts and challenges in being fully human.
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nearoanoke
USA
525 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2011 : 11:06:55 PM
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| Thanks for your views anthem. They are always insightful. |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Nov 27 2011 : 08:19:05 AM
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Hi all,
I would like to note that something have changed during the last 2\3 weeks or so. I can sit and practice meditation and spinal breathing now like before but with much better results. I think that the main reason behind this is that i've started lifting weights 3 weeks back and the results are really good to my sadhana. I am not overdoing the whole weight lifting business, just some gentle light weight lifting during the day and night time after practices.
Light weights for an increased number of cycles really helps in grounding. Plus you consume more food than usual which is also self pacing.
Love,
Ananda |
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jean
Germany
107 Posts |
Posted - Nov 29 2011 : 6:10:26 PM
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I had to stop practices for a while too, for about 2 month now. Things got a bit too much on the energetic side.
I probably underestimated the impact of the practices when living a pretty quiet live. Might need a bit more activity. I always had the tendency to be in stillness alone, this might have accelerated things a bit.  |
Edited by - jean on Nov 29 2011 6:37:16 PM |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2520 Posts |
Posted - Nov 30 2011 : 02:01:50 AM
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| Jean did you incorporate too many practices at the same time? |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Nov 30 2011 : 11:01:42 AM
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| Thanks for sharing Jean |
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jean
Germany
107 Posts |
Posted - Nov 30 2011 : 1:28:25 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by maheswari
Jean did you incorporate too many practices at the same time?
I don't think I have. Guess once you got the train rolling it doesn't need so much energy to keep it going like at the beginning.
Energies have settled down so far, but will wait a bit until I pick up the practices again.
I don't regret it that I got a bit ahead with the energies, I think it's good to know how far you could go without shooting yourself to the moon and beyond 
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Nov 30 2011 : 2:29:10 PM
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I was pretty much at the same place you were dear Jean... But I kept on trying to get back to practices every now and then... And kept on self pacing... What have done me real good is lifting light weighs...
My practice now is very gentle and beautiful. I don't overdo it though... Don't want to push my luck just yet...
All I am saying is, keep on trying...
All the best
Love,
Ananda |
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jean
Germany
107 Posts |
Posted - Dec 01 2011 : 08:52:21 AM
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Thank you, will keep on of course.
All the best to you as well. |
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img
United Kingdom
45 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2012 : 12:53:34 PM
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Dear Anthem,
I read your thread and thought to offer a potential solution: why not just ask God to show you the way and follow His signs?
This has worked faultlessly for over 30 years now, so I don't hesitate to recommend it.
All the best. |
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gatito
United Kingdom
179 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2012 : 3:02:19 PM
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Dear Anthem
This thread's popped-up at an interesting time, when I was intending to self-pace back to 5/5 SBP/DM once per day, or only breath meditation or even no formal sitting practice at all - just Bhakti/Karma/Jnana as it arose naturally.
Thank you for starting the thread.
It's been extremely helpful in helping me to reach a considered decision.
With Love
gatito |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2012 : 10:26:54 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by img
Dear Anthem,
I read your thread and thought to offer a potential solution: why not just ask God to show you the way and follow His signs?
This has worked faultlessly for over 30 years now, so I don't hesitate to recommend it.
All the best.
Thanks for the recommendation img, that's pretty much how it works, Life shows the way.
Hi Gatito,
Could be worthwhile for you to stop doing the pranayama entirely and seeing if that allows you to continue with just the meditation and your other practices?
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Edited by - Anthem on Feb 09 2012 10:30:01 PM |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2012 : 10:59:19 PM
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An update:
9 months later and even just a few minutes meditation (of any kind) is still enough for release to occur at a rate that leads to overload. Living without formal practices, there is still "purification" from time to time which continues onwards at a comfortable rate and there is an underlying balance.
One likely contributor to the easily encountered overload which occurred in the past when I was doing AYP sitting practices regularly, was that there was a host of concurrent mental programs running. The mind had become "programmed" to fix itself and it ran those programs likely 24/7. For example, I continuously brought myself back to the here and now consciously, repeatedly brought awareness into the body, repeatedly centered myself in the heart, etc. and there was a large variety of inquiry that was happening at all times. There is a good chance this was a contributor to overload though so much of it wasn't considered to be a factor at the time.
All these programs have since stopped. There becomes little choice in these actions as the rules change, making the way forward very clear and straightforward. Pain is a persistant teacher. |
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gatito
United Kingdom
179 Posts |
Posted - Feb 10 2012 : 3:31:53 PM
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Hi Anthem
Thanks for the reply and for the update.
Like you (by the sound of it) I've undertaken a lot of spiritual practice in this lifetime, including several thousand hours of formal sitting practice before AYP, so I think that there may a certain momentum that I need to self-pace.
Your thread has by no means put me off AYP. I continue to view this as the most complete, comprehensive and easy-to-follow system that I've ever come across. You've made a very valuable and valued contribution to my understanding yourself and I'm very grateful.
Thank you.
With Love |
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yogesh
USA
153 Posts |
Posted - Feb 11 2012 : 09:35:28 AM
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My conclusion after seeing so many people here having a hard time with 'overload' and experiencing 1st hand myself is that there is a fair amount of repression that is affecting people, I don't agree that it is simply people experiencing purification and unstressing.
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Can no longer meditate or do any practices
