|
|
 |
|
| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
jenniferad
47 Posts |
 Posted - Jun 14 2011 : 11:33:06 PM
|
In 2005, I began self-inquiry. I had been on a dedicated spiritual path since my early twenties, and had spent many years in prayer and meditation. I reached a point in 2001/2002 where I felt I didn’t need those practices anymore. I felt the same in everyday life as I did when I prayed, so the practices dropped away. I decided to become “normal” or at least try to. Most people don’t put spiritual development at the center of their life, and I wanted to just “be” for a while.
But then a year after my daughter was born, in 2005, I came to a point where I knew I could have all my questions answered if I worked hard enough at it. I decided to work and look and ask until I was satisfied with the answers I found. The questions that I had were, “Who am I,” and “What is this all around me?” I wanted to know who I am in the most fundamental, ontological way. How did I become aware as Jennifer?
I went to my bookcase full of spiritual books that I and my husband had accumulated over the years and pulled out one I had purchased years before but had never read. It was Vasistha’s Yoga by Swami Venkatesananda. Has anyone else read it? The purpose of the book is to provide a means to eliminate psychological conditioning and to attain liberation. I started reading the book and contemplating the writings, and I began to experience fear.
I was realizing that all of this is actually me. All I experience arises from consciousness, which is my true nature. As I was reading the stories and teachings, it was resonating with me at very deep levels, and awakening the awareness of oneness, that all that seems to be “out there” is not out there at all, that my inner experience and outer experience are manifestations of one thing: consciousness, which is all that I am.
I was beginning to know, and to directly experience, that if I desired, I could move things with my mind and “make” things happen from my own desire and willpower. I found that frightening at the very base of my being, more frightening than anything else. The fear was because if that was true, it seemed to me that I was horribly alone, because everything was me, and there was nothing else. I desperately wanted there to be an “other,” an “other” that was free to be as it was, with no influence whatsoever from me, and then I could know love. How could anything be love if the “other” was simply me, acting under the control and influence of my own will?
This fear only arose as I contemplated and inquired, and it didn’t interfere with my daily life. And I knew it was an illusion, but I felt I couldn’t past the illusion without a guide who could help me. So I looked for a teacher who could understand what I was talking about and help me deal with and get beyond the fear.
The teacher I found was a swami who lived in India, and my experiences with him seemed helpful at first, and then I realized that my interactions with him were having extremely negative effects on me, so I stopped communication with him. I was in a very emotional and unbalanced state at that point, and I looked to swamis in the US for help. All my interactions with teachers from India make for a very long and disturbing story.
My point is that I did come to the answers I was looking for, and I did get beyond the fear. Even though the way was very painful and extreme, like a roller coaster, I can’t say I regret anything. I felt in touch with and guided by the part of me that is not ever touched, but is always in stillness, I guess it is what yogani refers to as the witness. It is my core. I came to the answers which made all questions drop away.
My self is infinite and although it may seem that “I” may be causing things to happen, that is actually part of the illusion I am experiencing called my life as Jennifer. It is all arising in consciousness; and siddhis and powers aren’t really us doing anything. All that we experience is a result of the phenomenon referred to multiple times in Vasistha’s Yoga, called “the crow and the coconut.”
In the story of the crow and the coconut, a crow alights on a coconut tree, and just at that moment a coconut falls. In our mind the two events are joined as one being the cause and one being the effect, but in reality, in the story, the coconut was going to fall whether the crow landed or not. But that doesn’t matter to our mind; in our perception the events are connected. That is at the very root of all we experience.
There is no cause or effect, everything is simply happening all at once, and it is all joined in an intricate pattern of events that match each other and are joined by the mind to make a cohesive experience. Nothing is causing anything, it is all simply happening. It really looks to us and we truly experience things as causing other things, and that is fine, we might as well just sit back and enjoy it.
So that is what I have been doing since 2006, but my experiences were not always pleasant. I would experience sensory and energetic overload when in environments that were loud or a lot was going on. I couldn’t stand being the center of attention, and I was somewhat lonely because I knew of nobody else who could relate to the rather bizarre experiences I had, or who understand life from a similar perspective as my own.
In just a few weeks my practice of pranayama and deep meditation has been extremely helpful. Over the weekend I attended a full day robotics competition, because my son was competing. In the past, I would come home from these extremely loud, intense, suspenseful events and be completely and utterly braindead. I could not function. I would need at least two days of rest and isolation at home to get back to my normal state of mind. I was extremely sensitive to other people’s energies and emotions, and that kind of environment just wiped me out.
Well last Saturday I attended one of these competitions and I felt completely balanced and normal when the day was over. It was really like a miracle, but one that was so subtle. I am just very thankful.
Anyway, that’s part of my Jennifer story. Has anyone else read Vasistha’s Yoga? Has anyone else had negative effects from working with a spiritual teacher and gotten past them? Has anyone here come to similar awareness of what they are and would like to respond?
In Gratitude,
Jennifer |
|
|
maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Jun 15 2011 : 02:14:01 AM
|
dear Jennifer
what a lovely post ...i am currently reading Yoga Vasistha by
by Swami Venkatesananda
it is so condensed that one cant read more than a couple of pages per day..
despite your difficulties (and we all face them in the spiritual path)...yr end result seem very good and i am sure yr experience will grow more and will be more stable
as for the negative effects from working with this swami...well it seems that they were in your best interest and the proof is that this bad experience helped u to evolve
the example of the crow and coconut is so true....
check this link
http://www.kheper.net/topics/Vedant...reation.html
much Love
maheswari |
 |
|
|
karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Jun 15 2011 : 12:47:06 PM
|
I cam to AYP after undergoing NLP training and working with peoples fears.
Your story reminds me of the first time I really understood the meaning of the NLP presupposition "The map is not the territory". Once I understood the implications of that during one of the training days I suddenly went a bit dizzy. It left me feeling unbalanced for weeks.
You can believe something at some level and then you can know something at one level, even when you don't really understand it, you somehow know it to be true. A little light goes on somewhere beyond the cortex, something primary resonates.
I loved that first experience of that instability and always feel slightly breathless when someone mentions going on a proper NLP training course just knowing that feeling of being out of control. Brilliant. |
|
|
|
jenniferad
47 Posts |
Posted - Jun 16 2011 : 10:08:13 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by maheswari
dear Jennifer
what a lovely post ...i am currently reading Yoga Vasistha by
by Swami Venkatesananda
it is so condensed that one cant read more than a couple of pages per day..
despite your difficulties (and we all face them in the spiritual path)...yr end result seem very good and i am sure yr experience will grow more and will be more stable
as for the negative effects from working with this swami...well it seems that they were in your best interest and the proof is that this bad experience helped u to evolve
the example of the crow and coconut is so true....
check this link
http://www.kheper.net/topics/Vedant...reation.html
much Love
maheswari
Dear maheswari,
Thank you for your kind response! I followed the link and read the teaching of Ramana and it so nice to be able to read such writings now and understand them.
I do love Vasistha's Yoga because it is very intense and rich. I also can only read a small amount at once, and right now it is on my table by the couch, so if I just pick it up and read a few paragraphs, it has a delicious effect. In 2005 when I began reading it, I only read a tiny fraction of it before things started happening.
What drew you to the book?
When I was reading it in 2005, I had this experience: I was in a place using a computer where you had to pay to use it. You put your credit card into a grey box on the side of the computer while using it. When you were finished with the computer, you logged off and the card would come out.
Well the same day I had been contemplating the crow and the coconut, I was writing on the computer. I was almost finished, and the computer froze. It didn't respond at all. I sat there for a while and wondered what to do, and how I was going to get my credit card back. I noticed a green button, and I thought if I pressed it, my card would come out. So I pressed it, and my card came out.
I sat there for a few more seconds and realized I just experienced the crow and the coconut, because it really looked like pressing the green button made the card come out. But it didn't. The card came out because the computer wasn't responding, and it was coming out anyway.
Just then a young woman leaned over to me and asked me how to get her card out, should she press the green button? 
Anyway, thanks for writing and have a nice day.
Love,
Jennifer |
|
|
|
jenniferad
47 Posts |
Posted - Jun 16 2011 : 10:11:23 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by karl
I cam to AYP after undergoing NLP training and working with peoples fears.
Your story reminds me of the first time I really understood the meaning of the NLP presupposition "The map is not the territory". Once I understood the implications of that during one of the training days I suddenly went a bit dizzy. It left me feeling unbalanced for weeks.
You can believe something at some level and then you can know something at one level, even when you don't really understand it, you somehow know it to be true. A little light goes on somewhere beyond the cortex, something primary resonates.
I loved that first experience of that instability and always feel slightly breathless when someone mentions going on a proper NLP training course just knowing that feeling of being out of control. Brilliant.
Hi Karl!
I think perhaps what is happening when we come to "know" something at a deeper level is that our neurons are actually shifting physically in our brains and that is what causes the unbalance when it happens suddenly. When such realizations happen gradually you don't even notice them happening, but when it is sudden it can be traumatic. I am ready for the gradual AYP approach.
Thanks for writing!
Jennifer |
|
|
|
bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Jun 16 2011 : 2:35:23 PM
|
quote:
Originally posted by jenniferad
I was beginning to know, and to directly experience, that if I desired, I could move things with my mind and “make” things happen from my own desire and willpower.
Hi Jennifer,
Thanks for sharing. There is a lot that I would like to ask you about, but I will stick with one question for now. What do you mean you could move things with your mind? Could you give an example?
Thanks again,
Be |
|
|
|
jenniferad
47 Posts |
Posted - Jun 16 2011 : 8:14:09 PM
|
quote:
Originally posted by bewell
quote:
Originally posted by jenniferad
I was beginning to know, and to directly experience, that if I desired, I could move things with my mind and “make” things happen from my own desire and willpower.
Hi Jennifer,
Thanks for sharing. There is a lot that I would like to ask you about, but I will stick with one question for now. What do you mean you could move things with your mind? Could you give an example?
Thanks again,
Be
Hi Bewell!
I never actually moved anything with my mind, but I came to a place where I knew I could if I put a lot of time, energy, emotion and intention into developing that ability. I also was having many dreams where I could move things with my mind and do all kinds of other things and in the dreams it felt so real. I especially remember having dreams that I was manifesting beautiful gems and crystals in my hands, and it felt so wonderful. It also felt familiar and quite realistic.
I knew I was entering into a consciousness where if I decided I was going to do it, it would happen, and it scared me.
I did have an experience later on where something I intended to happen did happen. I decided to try an experiment and imagine an event with the intention of making it happen. I would clear my mind and let a clear random event come to my mind, and I would focus my energy and emotion to see if it would happen. Throughout the day, I would focus on the picture of this event and put lots of energy into intending it to happen.
What came to my mind was a vivid picture of people laughing and lots of happy energy, and someone passing me an orange ball. My plans for the day included nothing that would indicate this kind of scene would take place, so I went with it, because I felt if it happened it would be a verification that the experiment worked.
During the course of that day, I was invited to go with a group of people to a talk by Masuro Emoto who had written a book titled "Messages From Water." I entered the lobby where the talk was being held, and there were many people talking. There were books on tables and I went to the tables. There was a book there based on the movie "What the Bleep do we Know," and I opened it up. Right there in front of me was the exact picture that had come to my mind earlier, although it was in a book rather than someone actually handing me the ball. The picture I turned to was of two hands holding a basketball and handing it to the person reading the book. There was happy energy and laughter, and right then a woman called out, "Jennifer! You're almost there!" It was so funny. Of course the woman wasn't actually talking to me and my thought earlier in the day didn't actually "cause" anything.
Anyway I hope that answers your question. It was a matter of truly knowing in an experiential way that I could do these things if I wanted to. I just never felt drawn to do it after that one experiment. Just living life is miracle enough, and it is rather nice to just relax and not bother with trying to make things bend to my will.
There are people who teach people how to do such things, though, like Heather Ash Amara. She has workshops on spoonbending.
http://www.toci.org/video
Love to you,
Jennifer |
Edited by - jenniferad on Jun 16 2011 8:19:39 PM |
|
|
|
bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Jun 17 2011 : 04:23:17 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by jenniferad
I decided to try an experiment and imagine an event with the intention of making it happen. I would clear my mind and let a clear random event come to my mind, and I would focus my energy and emotion to see if it would happen. Throughout the day, I would focus on the picture of this event and put lots of energy into intending it to happen.
What came to my mind was a vivid picture of people laughing and lots of happy energy, and someone passing me an orange ball. My plans for the day included nothing that would indicate this kind of scene would take place, so I went with it, because I felt if it happened it would be a verification that the experiment worked.
During the course of that day, I was invited to go with a group of people to a talk by Masuro Emoto who had written a book titled "Messages From Water." I entered the lobby where the talk was being held, and there were many people talking. There were books on tables and I went to the tables. There was a book there based on the movie "What the Bleep do we Know," and I opened it up. Right there in front of me was the exact picture that had come to my mind earlier, although it was in a book rather than someone actually handing me the ball. The picture I turned to was of two hands holding a basketball and handing it to the person reading the book. There was happy energy and laughter, and right then a woman called out, "Jennifer! You're almost there!" It was so funny. Of course the woman wasn't actually talking to me and my thought earlier in the day didn't actually "cause" anything.
Hi Jennifer,
Thanks for sharing an example of what you were talking about. I have quoted the story above. I appreciate your straight honesty about what happened.
I have had many experiences like that, and I have an interpretation that I would like to share with you. I am curious if it rings true to you.
The vivid mental picture that came to your mind that day was a picture that you received telepathically from the book. You "saw" a actual image at a distance. You did not so much see the future as you saw the image at a distance in the present, and then over time, circumstances conspired to bring you and the image together.
It is an example of telepathic remote viewing. There are many examples of that sort of thing in books by the scientist Dale Graff:
http://www.dalegraff.com/sem-rv.htm
What do you think of that interpretation?
Be
|
|
|
|
maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Jun 17 2011 : 08:21:04 AM
|
[what drew you to the book?]
the same Self that drew us to Yoga |
|
|
|
jenniferad
47 Posts |
Posted - Jun 17 2011 : 12:13:10 PM
|
quote:
Originally posted by bewell
The vivid mental picture that came to your mind that day was a picture that you received telepathically from the book. You "saw" a actual image at a distance. You did not so much see the future as you saw the image at a distance in the present, and then over time, circumstances conspired to bring you and the image together.
It is an example of telepathic remote viewing. There are many examples of that sort of thing in books by the scientist Dale Graff:
http://www.dalegraff.com/sem-rv.htm
What do you think of that interpretation?
Be
Hi Bewell,
Thank you for sharing that link. I just looked at Dale Graff's website, and it is fascinating. I think it is great he is giving training to law enforcement personnel on how to be increase awareness of their environment.
As for the interpretation you gave of what happened to me, it could very well be accurate. I think there are so many way to look at things like this.
For example, we think of the past as causing present events. But why couldn't the future be causing present events just as easily? According to the interpreation you outlined, I "remotely viewed" the image in the book and this "caused" me to come together with the image in the future. But why not the event of me seeing the image in the book causing me to have the image in my mind in the first place?
There is a scientist at Cornell University who has done an experiment showing people who study for a test AFTER they take it do better than those who don't.
http://dbem.ws/FeelingFuture.pdf
Ultimately, for me, the most satisfying and useful way of looking at this is to understand that nothing is ever causing anything, it just looks that way. Life is one big coincidence. Our mind has a wonderful way of generating a coherent and predictable experience for us, and it is just very nice. Time and space are illusions, and very useful ones.
Thank you for writing.
Jennifer
|
|
|
|
jenniferad
47 Posts |
Posted - Jun 17 2011 : 12:30:38 PM
|
quote:
Originally posted by maheswari
[what drew you to the book?]
the same Self that drew us to Yoga
Yes. Of course. |
|
|
|
bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Jun 18 2011 : 3:40:39 PM
|
quote:
Originally posted by jenniferad
But why not the event of me seeing the image in the book causing me to have the image in my mind in the first place?
There is a scientist at Cornell University who has done an experiment showing people who study for a test AFTER they take it do better than those who don't.
http://dbem.ws/FeelingFuture.pdf
I had not considered the future influencing the present in that way. I am very impressed with that hard headed scientific research you cited in support of such a mind boggling possibility.
So if I understand where you are coming from, your "path of self-inquiry" goes something like this: You have experiences that seem to defy ordinary time/space limitations of causality, and you reflect on those experiences, examining what has happened in light of the best science you can find, and then ultimately, you say, "nothing is ever causing anything, it just looks that way. Life is one big coincidence" --- "Who am I?" --consciousness experiencing time and space.
Am I understanding?
|
|
|
|
jenniferad
47 Posts |
Posted - Jun 18 2011 : 5:46:10 PM
|
quote:
[i]
So if I understand where you are coming from, your "path of self-inquiry" goes something like this: You have experiences that seem to defy ordinary time/space limitations of causality, and you reflect on those experiences, examining what has happened in light of the best science you can find, and then ultimately, you say, "nothing is ever causing anything, it just looks that way. Life is one big coincidence" --- "Who am I?" --consciousness experiencing time and space.
Am I understanding?
Yes, that is basically it. Although the process of getting there was a lot more emotional and traumatic than how you describe it above. I wasn't quite as rational as "examining what has happened in light of the best science I could find." I only read about this scientific research in the past few months, but I had contemplated the idea that the future is actually causing the present when I was having my shift.
At times what I experienced later was pure torture. I am in a much better state of mind these days. I hope that the simple, clear, direct and down to earth teachings that yogani has written can be spread to everyone so that people are aware that maturation of the nervous system doesn't have to be painful. That would be very nice. I didn't really know much about kundalini when these kinds of things started happening in my life. I didn't know it was perfectly natural, or that it really was just a progression of the process of growing up.
So what happens for me now is I can go into a state of mind where I am Jennifer, moving and doing in the world, thinking, feeling, driving, talking, listening, etc. And I am just being Jennifer, a person, who is separate from experiences that she is having.
Then at any time, when I remember or choose to go back to the other perspective, what happens is a shift and I am aware that I am all of this, my thoughts, feelings and sensory experiences of all that seems to be happening around me are all that I am. It is a shift in perception. I would guess neither one is actually more correct than another but the one where I experience myself as completely whole and infinite feels like home, and it feels solid, real, and complete. And it is isn't anything mindblowing, although before I got to that shift it seemed like it would be. Also, there are lots more areas where I need further balancing and healing.
But I did reach my goal. I wanted to know what I am in the most fundamental way, and I realized I am consciousness of experiences. I found that satisfying and my questions stopped.
What has your path been like, and what is it like now? Of course please only answer if you wish, but I would be interested to know.
Have a nice day, bewell.
|
|
|
|
bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Jun 19 2011 : 04:43:15 AM
|
Hi Jennifer,
Thanks for sharing, and for your question.
I am very aware of temporal, spacial causality. I type this message and when I "Submit Reply," this message will go out under the name "Bewell." I am mortal. When my body dies, there will be no more posts by "Bewell." Short term, if I choose not to send any more messages under the name "Bewell" then none will be sent.
As I was reflecting on your question, I played with the coconut story. I enjoyed seeing the story evolve as I made it up.
Peace,
Be
A boy climbed a coconut tree, and for the first time he had ever done so, he picked a coconut. He brought it down and shared with his friends. They asked him how he got the coconut. He replied, "I picked it." They were all impressed.
After that, he picked many more coconuts the same way. Then one day, the boy was wishing for a coconut, and just then, one dropped from the tree right in front of him. He looked up and there did not seem to be a cause. There was no bird on the tree, no high winds. The coconut just dropped just when he was wishing for a coconut. His friends did not ask how he got it, they just assumed he got it in the usual way. But he was all excited because he had acquired the coconut in a very unusual way. He wondered if he had caused it to drop by wishing. He tested. He wished again, but no coconut dropped. He decided that he had not caused it to drop. He reasoned that coconuts drop all the time, and this was just another instance of the same force of gravity. But what made it different was the fact that it had dropped just when he was wishing for it. And here is where he made a great discovery. He began to desire to be in harmony with all that happens naturally.
More and more there was harmony between his wishes and all that naturally happened. And then one day when he became very angry at his father, in that same hour, his father died. He became very afraid. Had he caused his father's death? He deeply regretted being angry. But he remembered the lesson of the coconut. He comforted himself with the awareness that just as coconuts fall every day, so also people die every day. His father's death happened when it happened for reasons beyond him, not because he was angry. After all, he had been angry before and his father had not died.
Still, the boy wanted to align his wishes with the good that happens naturally: with love rather than hate, with health rather than sickness. He mourned deeply for the loss of his father, and then something happened that he had never considered possible. He was meditating on the death of his father when somehow, he died too. He became totally detached from time and space, from body and soul, from desire and thought. When he came back to his usual daily activities, everything was outwardly as it had been before, but he knew he had changed. He was now departed like his father, but he was also fully here in his living, breathing body.
He went to a wise woman and told her what had happened. She smiled with understanding, and she told him her secret: she had learned to die daily. Every day, twice a day, she stilled and quieted her body, and stilled and quieted her mind by saying one word over and over.
The boy did the same. He practiced dying every day by sitting in silence, repeating his word, and in so doing he became stable in calm awareness. He noticed that he could not claim the calm awareness as his own. It was a gift, and to receive the gift, he needed to cultivate receptivity with his daily practice.
One day the boy climbed a tree and picked a coconut with calm awareness. With calm awareness, he cracked it open and shared it with his friends. His friends commented that it tasted especially delicious. He smiled, and with tears in his eyes, he agreed, saying that their food that day, and their ability to taste it was a divine gift. |
|
|
|
maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Jun 19 2011 : 06:27:33 AM
|
bewell ..first the boy reminded me of Newton and the apple
then at the add he reminded me of Jesus when He shared the bread and wine wth disciple...
thank u lovely story |
|
|
|
jenniferad
47 Posts |
Posted - Jun 19 2011 : 2:52:06 PM
|
| Thank you bewell. I love your story. |
|
|
|
hemanthks
Canada
59 Posts |
Posted - Jun 19 2011 : 11:13:41 PM
|
| Thank you Bewell...It was a wonderful story. |
|
|
|
bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Jul 31 2011 : 08:42:22 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by maheswari
bewell ..first the boy reminded me of Newton and the apple
then at the add he reminded me of Jesus when He shared the bread and wine wth disciple...
thank u lovely story
Maheswari,
You have an excellent eye for my sources in the history of ideas. I thought of your comment today when I read this beautiful and inspirational poem by William Blake:
You don't believe
You don't believe — I won't attempt to make ye.
You are asleep — I won't attempt to wake ye.
Sleep on, sleep on, while in your pleasant dreams
Of reason you may drink of life's clear streams
Reason and Newton, they are quite two things,
For so the swallow and the sparrow sings.
Reason says 'Miracle', Newton says 'Doubt'.
Aye, that's the way to make all Nature out:
Doubt, doubt, and don't believe without experiment.
That is the very thing that Jesus meant
When he said: 'Only believe." Believe and try,
Try, try, and never mind the reason why.
|
|
|
|
maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Jul 31 2011 : 08:46:17 AM
|
| i love Blake....he was a big inspiration to world famous lebanese author Khalil Gibran |
|
|
|
marcplatters
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - Aug 01 2011 : 3:10:26 PM
|
| hey jeniffer, great posts thanks for sharing the information i loved your posts and I am looking forward for more. |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
|
|
| AYP Public Forum |
© Contributing Authors (opinions and advice belong to the respective authors) |
|
|
|
|
My path of self-inquiry
