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Vayu
USA
40 Posts |
 Posted - Jun 02 2011 : 8:57:13 PM
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Greetings, I understand that self-pacing is key and we should perform Yoni Mudra Kumbhaka accordingly. But, in this thread, I would like to discuss specifically about internal and external kumbhaka and its mechanics of nadi purification. Not sure if it belongs here or in the Alternative approach forums, as this is more about finding about the effects of kumbhaka.
Even though im a beginner in yoga and practicing AYP for the last few months, I have noticed a few things that happens during Kumbhaka. I should mention that I have not had any Kundalini experiences yet, but im still continuing my practice with great hope and excitement. Besides my self-paced ayp practice, Im "researching"(at other times) the effects of kumbhaka because I feel that SBP and kumbhaka is producing the most progress at the stage i am currently at. Ofcourse, I understand that there are delayed effects but so far, the Kundalini has been completely unresponsive. So, I have been looking for ways to purify my nadis in a slightly faster way and found external kumbhaka to be a possible great tool.
Here is my findings: In Internal Kumbhaka, I noticed that the upper part of the spinal nerve begins to get stimulated with an upward directional force. There is some subtle vibration going on primarily in the ajna region. In External Kumbhaka, i noticed that a vacuum effect happens and the lower parts of the spinal nerve experiences an upward pull. Also, I feel tingling effect in other parts of my body after about 10-12 seconds; these areas include fingertips, palms, tip of the nose. After about 20 seconds, a strange, deathlike sensation begins to happen(and continues to grow rapidly) a little below the navel. At this point, the tingling quickly spread almost throughout the entire body immediately, with sharp buildup of heat at many small points throughout the body(these might be nadi/nerve endings activating but not sure). The whole body heats up, and mild sweating throughout the body soon follows. I noticed that the main, uncomfortable, strange sensation which happens an inch below the navel continues to well up, and if I perform mulabandha, the sensation's acceleration and intensity is amplified. Soon, it almost feels like an orgasm or something is about to occur at this area(right below the navel) and not at the genetal. My question is, is this a prelude to an explosive kundalini awakening? But I never "crossed over" to see where the sensation leads because I usually have to surrender and immediately breathe in quickly. But afterwards, relaxing for a few minutes gives a very relaxed, pleasant, vibrant feeling. I noticed that recently, I notice vibrations occuring at different parts of the body more often and consider these to possibly be prana movement. So, I have a feeling that external kumbhaka greatly accelerates cleansing of the nadis(and that much more aggresive/possibly unsafe) compared to that of internal kumbhaka.
Even Yogani mentions in lession 91: "Put simply, it(Yoni Mudra Kumbhaka) works to open every nook and cranny of our nervous system and draws kundalini (sexual energy) up at the same time. It produces a huge amount of purification in the body. It also cultivates the subtle habits of ecstatic biological functioning in us."
Ofcourse I understand that YMK has more features to it than just the kumbhaka but im guessing that kumbhaka plays one of the major roles in it. And this is internal kumbhaka.
I should also note that while surfing the web for more info on kumbhaka, I came across William Bodri's website where he mentions that the 9-bottled wind (internal) kumbhaka pushes out toxins/poisons and cleans the nadis/channels.
Also, Paramhansa Nithyananda has a part in his enkriya called samana kriya, where inhalation, internal kumbhaka, exhalation, and external kumbhaka should each be done as long as possible comfortably. He says that this process helps the samana vayu(1 of the 5 types of prana) balance, and helps to prepare the system for kundalini awakening.
So, It seems that decreasing oxygen consumption greatly stimulates the system to be more efficient and this favors the nadis to clean itself. Yogani also mentions that the same principle for purification happens during fasting as well. Also, in lesson 46, he mentions: "Also, there will come a time when the breath suspends automatically with the lungs empty in connection with the internal biology of prana being released from its vast storehouse near the base of the spine. This will manifest as an emptying of the lungs and then a drawing up from near the bottom of the spine."
So, I understand that from the AYP standpoint, this process will happen naturally and that we should self-pace to get there. But keeping that in mind, I was wondering what everyone have found about kumbhaka and its nadi purification process. I know this whole process that I mentioned sounds rather aggresive, unsafe and totally opposite to the self-pacing that we value, but I really wanted to know more about the purificatory applications of kumbhaka and also where it leads. So, it would be great if people can share their experiences. Thank you :)
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Edited by - Vayu on Jun 02 2011 8:58:24 PM |
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Jun 03 2011 : 01:11:34 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Vayu
My question is, is this a prelude to an explosive kundalini awakening?
No, this process actually prevents any kind of explosions.
I made a post few days ago here:
http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....D=9660#83451
Explosions are for stars that go supernova.
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Jun 03 2011 : 08:03:39 AM
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Sounds like good things are happening.
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Vayu
USA
40 Posts |
Posted - Jun 03 2011 : 3:46:21 PM
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Yea I just read that thread yesterday while posting this thread. In there, you mentioned that the feeling of death was happening was actually a process of transformation. I wasn't sure if that feeling is localized a little below the navel for you as it is for me. Also, it discusses on internal kumbhaka(with breath held inside). So I made the general external kumbhaka thread, which was the only thing so far that gave me that death-like sensation.
I can say that after holding the lungs empty for 20 or more seconds, it almost feels like death is creeping in really fast in a timespan of 3-4 seconds when I have to give up and inhale right away. It almost feels like something will explode inside if I hold just a bit longer. But right after breathing in, the entire body begins to tingle/subtly vibrate inside. Is this nadis or something prana related?
Honestly, I have had similar situations happen while taking exams. When the exam time is up, and teachers say "All pencils down. If anyone is still writing, you will receive an F", I secretly try to write down as fast and secretly as possible. During these times, the same sensation starts in the genetals. Its like, my whole body recognizes that im doing something really risky and it will affect my whole life or something. Emberassing to say, I remember even ejaculating from this sensation after a C++ Programming exam ended, and I was writing out the last lines of code even though time was up 20 seconds ago and papers were being collected. It was the strangest and funniest thing; ejaculation within a timespan of 20 seconds after an C++ exam without any physical stimulation. Needless to say, the sensation also occured a little below the navel, and included the genetals. Not sure if this is the swadhisthana chakra, since different schools differ in its location). Either way, I should mention that automatic mulabandha and clenching of the toes also happened. And those many years ago, I didnt even know what mulabandha was. Its like a gut-wrenching sensation. This same thing becomes accesable during external kumbhaka held too long, and becomes amplified with mulabandha. However I haven't had ejaculation from this (via kumbhaka) yet because I haven't gone that far over what I think might be "the edge". |
Edited by - Vayu on Jun 03 2011 4:13:07 PM |
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Jun 04 2011 : 01:32:00 AM
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YMK can be done even without helding or emptying the air in lungs.
Ever heard of Seppuku?
According to Buddhism the abdomen is where the soul lives and contrary to popular belief almost all forms of seppeku do not involve suicide. It was usually carried out by the Kaishakunin (usually a close friend of the samurai committing seppeku) who would behead the person cleanly and quickly after the samurai inflicted a fatal injury to his abdomen.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seppuku
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Jun 04 2011 : 03:30:15 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Vayu
When the exam time is up, and teachers say "All pencils down....
It somehow reminded me of this breath technique by Lord Shiva:
WHEN BREATH IS ALL OUT (UP) AND STOPPED OF ITSELF, OR ALL IN (DOWN) AND STOPPED -- IN SUCH UNIVERSAL PAUSE, ONE'S SMALL SELF VANISHES. THIS IS DIFFICULT ONLY FOR THE IMPURE.
But then it is difficult for everyone because, he says, THIS IS DIFFICULT ONLY FOR THE IMPURE. But who is the pure one? It is difficult for you; you cannot practice it. But you can feel it sometimes suddenly. You are driving a car and suddenly you feel there is going to be an accident. Breathing will stop. If it is out, it will remain out. If it is in, it will remain in. You cannot breathe in such an emergency; you cannot afford it. Everything stops, departs.
IN SUCH UNIVERSAL PAUSE, ONE'S SMALL SELF VANISHES: Your small self is only a daily utility. In emergencies you cannot remember it. Who you are -- the name, the bank balance, the prestige, everything -- just evaporates. Your car is just heading toward another car; another moment and there will be death. In this moment there will be a pause. Even for the impure there will be a pause. Suddenly breathing stops. If you can be aware in that moment, you can reach the goal. Zen monks have tried this method very much in Japan. That is why their methods seem very weird, absurd, strange. They have done many inconceivable things.
A master will throw someone out of the house. Suddenly the master will begin slapping the disciple without any rhyme or reason, without any cause. You were sitting with your master and everything was okay. You were just chit-chatting, and he will begin to beat you in order to create the pause. That is sudden; that will create the pause. You cannot understand it. If you cannot understand the mind stops, and when the mind stops, breathing stops. Either way -- if breathing stops, mind stops; if mind stops, breathing stops.
There are many stories that someone attained buddhahood because the teacher suddenly started beating him. You cannot understand it -- what nonsense! How can one attain buddhahood by being beaten by someone, or by being thrown out of the window by someone? The whole Zen technique is based on the fourth technique of Shiva.
The Book of Secrets
http://www.livingworkshop.net/ob-bo...ec-comp.html
You are lucky!
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Vayu
USA
40 Posts |
Posted - Jun 05 2011 : 11:30:46 AM
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Hello Manigma, yes I read parts of Book of Secrets like a year ago and I completely forgot about this one. At the time, I thought it was talking about general kumbhaka. But now, in retrospect, it makes sense. And when it says, its difficult for the impure, that too makes sense because maybe, the impurity of the nadis/nervous system is an aspect. Compared to a few months ago, when I meditate nowdays, the vibrations in the nervous system is more noticable and more throughout the body. Especially in generic yoga nidra, the vibrations are more intense and longer lasting as I circulate the awareness throughout the different points. I have yet to try AYP samyama and yoga nidra; I have to read both of them in more detail and figure out differences before I add them to practices.
Thank you everyone for replying and providing insights.
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Victor
USA
910 Posts |
Posted - Jun 06 2011 : 05:33:48 AM
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| I would not advise doing external kumbhaka for more than a few seconds and Yogani does not suggest it at all in AYP. Just because one is having interesting sensations is no indication that good things are happening. Rather than focusing on these intense sensation (deathlike doesn't sound good to me), I would focus on smooth and comfortable flow of pranayama throughout the entire practice session. I too find external breath suspension helpful but briefly and only as long as one can still feel the prana moving in the body. If there is a feeling of the energy stopping then that is s sign to begin the inhalation. Also, if there is any strain at all felt beginning inhalation or a gasping feeling then you have extended the retention too long. Do it to comfort, but a rule of thumb should be not to externally suspend the breath in pranayama for longer than the length of your inhalation. Internal retention can be much longer as can exhalation but please be very cautious in suspending the breath with empty lungs. Another tip is that to begin inhalation squeeze a little bit of breath out first to initiate inhalation. Same advise goes for begining exhalation from retention where you inhale just a little bit before exhaling. |
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nodoubt
India
90 Posts |
Posted - Jun 06 2011 : 2:54:56 PM
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The reason why pranayama is purification is a very profound question. In old yogic it goes back to our five elements (akasha, earth, wind, fire and water) and our karma. Basically, our past habits, one by one over infinite lifetimes have carved out this body from the elements. All the habits are rooted in ignorance of the ultimate truth, which is stillness in action. Because we were unaware of the truth we formed so many evolutionary behaviors. Over the eons things get worse. Now we are in the Kali Yuga, the degenerate age. Our body-minds have gotten quite gunked. Our body-minds are nothing more than the elements molded into channels by prana-wind. There are five pranas each corresponding to the elements. When we do pranayama, we are bringing fresh pranas in and pushing gunk pranas out. But this is not enough to be a purification, we must join our pranayama to a stable meditation practice where we cultivate inner silence so that the new prana can begin to form a new enlightened body. We must replace karmic prana with enlightened prana. The two steps of pranayama and deep meditation do that.
See the symbol of the Nataraj, Shivaji standing on a little dwarf, representing ignorance. This is the great yogic symbol of the process of self-perfection. |
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Jun 09 2011 : 05:50:58 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by manigma
YMK can be done even without helding or emptying the air in lungs.
Just wanted to clarify what I said. This form of kumbhaka is actually called Kevala Kumbhaka.
Kumbhaka is of two kinds, viz., Sahita and Kevala. That which is coupled with inhalation and exhalation is termed Sahita. That which is devoid of these is called Kevala (alone). When you get mastery in Sahita, then you can attempt for this Kevala. When in due course of practice, the Kumbhaka subsists in many places without exhalation and inhalation, unconditioned by place, time and number -then that Kumbhaka is called absolute and pure (Kevala Kumbhaka), the fourth form of 'Regulation of breath'. Such powers as that of roaming about in space unseen, follow this last form of Pranayama.
In Vasishtha Samhita it is said: "When after giving up inhalation and exhalation, one holds his breath with ease, it is absolute Kumbhaka (Kevala)." In this Pranayama the breath is suddenly stopped without Puraka and Rechaka. The student can retain his breath as long as he likes through this Kumbhaka. He attains the state of Raja Yoga. Through Kevala Kumbhaka, the knowledge of Kundalini arises. Kundalini is aroused and the Sushumna is free from all sorts of obstacles. He attains perfection in Hatha Yoga.
~ Sivananda
http://www.sivanandaonline.org/publ...tion_id=1326
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Victor
USA
910 Posts |
Posted - Jun 09 2011 : 5:01:50 PM
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| Kevala kumbhaka is quite different than breath suspension with empty lungs. In kevala the suspension is effortless and the throat is not sealed. The breath simply suspends. In Bahya Kumbhaka (suspension with empty lungs) there is effort of will involved and the throat is sealed. This is done during Uddiyana Bandha practice and as long as there are several normal breaths in between cycles then there is no problem. Adding empty lungs suspension to continuous pranayama practice is a very advanced technique and not for someone with less than several years daily practice at minimum. Breath suspension with empty lungs begins as a very subtle deepening of the exhalation and gentle squeezing out of the last bits or air in the lungs followed by a deep refreshing sensation of the inhalation flowing from deep inside. Once daily practice with breath retention with full lungs becomes comfortable and the deep subtle exhalation becomes very comfortable then only a brief suspension with empty lungs can naturall follow. This should never become an strong effort of will or struggle but rather a natural and enjoyable extention of the pranayama practice. Please be careful with this stuff. |
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JDH
USA
331 Posts |
Posted - Jun 10 2011 : 01:29:53 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Victor
Another tip is that to begin inhalation squeeze a little bit of breath out first to initiate inhalation. Same advise goes for begining exhalation from retention where you inhale just a little bit before exhaling.
Thanks for that, Victor. That feels much better for ending an external kumbhaka. Not much difference for internal. |
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Jun 10 2011 : 02:11:18 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Victor
In kevala the suspension is effortless and the throat is not sealed.
Yes, the whole body is sealed instead. Like a computer in hibernation mode.
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nodoubt
India
90 Posts |
Posted - Jun 10 2011 : 11:02:49 AM
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| There is purak, in breath, rechak, out breath, and kumbhak, hold. If you combine purak and kumbhak, you have what people usually call "kumbhak." But there is also kumbhak rechak, which is sometimes called "empty hold." This is done willfully, not automatic. |
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Kumbhaka and its relationship to purification
