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tamasaburo
USA
136 Posts |
 Posted - Jun 24 2010 : 1:49:14 PM
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Lately, I've been very interested in the idea of devotion to a deity or ideal and also the technique of transforming emotions that Yogani describes. However, I'm having some problems:
For most of my life I've been fairly a-religious; not an atheist per se, but more like an agnostic. Thus it's hard for me to pick any one religious figure or symbol to devote myself to. It's not that they have no resonance for me, but that they all have an approximately equal, lukewarmish resonance. I could say "my ideal is Jesus, Buddha, the cross, the om symbol, Shiva, Krishna, etc." but they all feel about the same to me--all worthy symbols but none jumping out at me as "right" for me. Similarly, if I consider some kind of conceptual ideal like "un-conditional love," or "truth," or what have you, no particular ideal jumps out at me as the thing for me. They all sound nice and resonate with me a little. None resonates very strongly. Even the concept of my own spiritual development is tough since, although I'm very serious about that and, in a sense, devoted to it as a cause, I feel a little like I can't "put a face" on something like that since I don't know where it will go myself. Sort of like, how to be devoted to the concept of enlightenment when one can't really understand it till one is enligtened?
Somewhat related is the technique Yogani gives for transforming emotional energy, which I'd really like to master. Certainly the idea of putting negative emotions to some practical use in spiritual development is very appealing.
But, I'm not quite sure I get how to do it, especially given my lack of a clear ishta. If I was 100% devoted to say, Jesus, then maybe I could turn my anger into "oh Jesus, why have I not yet become like you?" (although being mad at Jesus also seems kind of strange--though maybe it is the type of intimacy one is supposed to feel towards an ishta?). But how can you get mad at "un-conditional love" or "spiritual development"? And if I try to it just seems to turn into a kind of self-recrimination--like "why can't I get serious about meditation? Why can't I ever concentrate on anything? Why am I a selfish, un-loving person," etc. which seems to make me feel worse. And all of this is assuming I was any good at shifting the focus of a negative emotion, which seems pretty hard in and of itself. If one is nervous about a big job interview can one really change that into nervousness about when one will be enlightened? Might it not just result in "now I'm nervous about the job interview and mad at myself for my slow spiritual progress"?
Thanks for any advice or insight. |
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cosmic
USA
821 Posts |
Posted - Jun 25 2010 : 01:29:45 AM
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Hi tamasaburo 
Not being the devotional type myself, I can totally relate to your questions. Obviously choosing an ishta is very personal and nobody can really help you there.
Are you having any trouble staying motivated to practice? From a practical standpoint, I don't see why an ishta would be necessary if motivation is present (and consistent). I don't have a clear ishta (kinda sorta), and am probably not alone in this.
Also, just an idea... Have you tried letting your ishta choose you? Maybe putting a prayer/thought out to the universe like "Who is my ishta?" and see what happens... watch your dreams... just an idea...
As a side note, something I found interesting: During bhakti-ful phases, I would pray 100% exclusively to God and Jesus Christ. But in my dreams, I always call out to Buddha or Shiva. Always. Sometimes I see Buddha in my dreams, but never Jesus. Go figure 
Regarding transformation of emotional energy... don't know if this is what Yogani meant, but you can use emotions and thoughts to fuel awareness. Self-inquiry can be an effective way to release thoughts and emotions. You can also use emotions to practice acceptance/surrender and become more aware.
For example, when I'm giving a speech and feeling fear/anxiety, I will just watch the emotion and allow it, rather than retreat into my mind. This usually results in the emotion dissolving and I feel more present and peaceful (and alive, really).
So yeah. There are a bunch of ways to use emotions as practice (if not transform them), these are just the ones I find useful.
Hope this helps.
With Love 
cosmic |
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Clear White Light
USA
229 Posts |
Posted - Jun 25 2010 : 07:51:31 AM
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| It seems to me that you're struggling to identify with something that you already have realized is not right for you. It's not right for me to be devotional to some finite, personalized form of God either, and that's okay. We just have to find alternative ways of fueling our bhakti. For me, I get this by studying spirituality in a more comparative way, never getting so "into it" that I find myself actually identifying as being Hindu, or Buddhist or whatever. I extract whatever truths I may be able to glean from any spiritual system and incorporate it into my own understanding and comprehension of reality. Aside from that I enjoy studying the sciences immensely. I've gotten more bhakti studying things like astronomy and biology from a spiritual standpoint than I have ever received from any strictly "spiritual" means. You just have to identify what those things are that provide you with a sense of wonder and mystery for life and spend time doing them. |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Jun 25 2010 : 2:54:37 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by tamasaburo
But, I'm not quite sure I get how to do it, especially given my lack of a clear ishta. If I was 100% devoted to say, Jesus, then maybe I could turn my anger into "oh Jesus, why have I not yet become like you?" (although being mad at Jesus also seems kind of strange--though maybe it is the type of intimacy one is supposed to feel towards an ishta?). But how can you get mad at "un-conditional love" or "spiritual development"? And if I try to it just seems to turn into a kind of self-recrimination--like "why can't I get serious about meditation? Why can't I ever concentrate on anything? Why am I a selfish, un-loving person," etc. which seems to make me feel worse. And all of this is assuming I was any good at shifting the focus of a negative emotion, which seems pretty hard in and of itself. If one is nervous about a big job interview can one really change that into nervousness about when one will be enlightened? Might it not just result in "now I'm nervous about the job interview and mad at myself for my slow spiritual progress"?
Thanks for any advice or insight.
Hi Tamasaburo,
Do you practice samyama?
If yes, you know how you pick a sutra and drop it into stillness? The same way, pick the feeling nervousness and drop it into stillness. Feel the nervousness, now stop and feel like you are expanding, open, open, open. Then you feel nervousness again feel it then consciously stop and open.
I always had an ishta, but have lost connection with her. It took me a while to realize, my ishta was just an extension of stillness, and when we cannot connect directly to the stillness we need a form.
However, you may be able to connect with the stillness without going through a form. Worth a try you know. The more you get mindy with the concept that the ishta has to be a certain way, the more you will get entangled it the stories of the mind. Just relax into the process of samyama and it will all fall into place.
Here is something I posted about this.http://the-journey-inward.blogspot....w-ishta.html |
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tamasaburo
USA
136 Posts |
Posted - Jun 27 2010 : 12:32:41 AM
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Thanks for the advice, everyone. I will give it a try releasing emotions into silence as if they were a mantra in samyama practice.
As for the motivation question, I do have enough motivation to practice twice daily as I have seen too many good benefits thus far and am also curious to see what is next/beyond where I am now. Still, I do feel my motivation waning somewhat in that lately I find I often treat my practice, especially deep meditation as if it were just another chore I have to get out of the way each day, like brushing my teeth. I do it, but I find myself often rushing through it with more thoughts about grocery list-type stuff intruding than usual. Perhaps things are just at a bit of an ebb--one can't expect to be having dramatic openings all the time (worse, I think sometimes I just take things for granted too much--even though I feel much better now than a year or two ago and my practice is also much deeper, once I've been at a given level for a while a certain boredom sets in and my mind starts being hungry for something new and dramatic).
Anyway, the idea was that if I had an ishta it would strengthen my motivation to take things more seriously and focus, but maybe it's not necessary or maybe one will "find me" in time, so to speak. |
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rkishan
USA
102 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2010 : 10:36:28 PM
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I was a believer, atheist, agnostic and back as a believer now. I have an ishta ideal which is a diety.
Your question is very valid. Whatever resonates deeply within us can easily become our ishta. We can feel and know it. But if everything feels the same and nothing resonates that deeply, we are confused in choosing our ishta.
The following are not my words, but something that I heard on a spiritual talk given by a religious person. He mentioned to start with whatever or whoever feels right to you initially, even though you do not feel that deep connection and emotion. Like, Jesus, Buddha, Krisha, Allah or Om, whatever is familiar and feels right to you. You many not feel the deep emotional connection and the burning devotion initially. But keep thinking about the ishta that you chose and repeat the name of your ishta whenever possible. This is a mechanical process and an intellectual mind will immediately rebel against something like that. But it works. Also if the ishta that you chose is a deity or prophets like Jesus, Buddha, Krishna, etc., read about their stories. Dwell/meditate on their teachings or qualities. Listen to their stories. Eventually the bhakti becomes stronger. The initial mechanical repetition eventually becomes automatic, then it is more like a meditation and your bhakti towards that ishta will grow into a burning devotion.
So, that is what this person mentioned. It worked in my case. Hope it may be of some help to you. |
Edited by - rkishan on Sep 19 2010 03:42:27 AM |
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Choosing an ishta and transforming emotions
