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Alvin Chan
Hong Kong
407 Posts |
 Posted - Feb 03 2006 : 10:55:11 PM
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hi all,
For more than 2 weeks, my feeling both during and after meditation have been bad. I always follow the simple procedure during meditation, but some thoughts come (actually, many thoughts. As I've said, I can't go deep). And I found the most obvious limiting factor in my case was:
The inner tensions in the area behind my eyes and around my nose. ( I am sorry it is only a rough, subjective description. Anyone who know what it is please help! It is a physical feeling, but is certainly not the facial muscles we usually meant. May be it's the so-called nervous tension.)
By the way, it is the same kind of feeling which will deprive my ability to fall into sleep. I sometimes get this feeling when I drink coffee. But I am not taking coffee now.
Does anyone know how to deal with it? |
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Jim and His Karma
2111 Posts |
Posted - Feb 03 2006 : 11:54:45 PM
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I'm going to guess: trying too hard. Pushing. This can give headaches in just the places you mention.
Do less. Take a moment to be honest with yourself: are you really just intoning "I Am" and letting the mantra process your nervous system in its own way and time? Or are you aiming (even straining) for a particular result or effect or experience? Are you managing or letting go?
It's very easy to build up structures of judging, expectation, and pushiness. Reread Yogani's early lessons. Take to heart the gentle simplicity. Like brushing your teeth. Don't be dramatic, don't "aim" for this or that. Just let the mantra play. |
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Alvin Chan
Hong Kong
407 Posts |
Posted - Feb 04 2006 : 01:31:28 AM
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Thanks for your, Jim. But I have to say I am not trying. At least I am not trying "not to be trying". Anyway, I just follow the simple procedure of intoning "I Am". But the tension does seems to be there. When I am meditating, I didn't notice that on purpose, but I just know that.
When I am well, I can let the mantra play. But recently, it doesn't play! I am not "looking for" experience during meditation, but the signposts show that I do need some adjustments (outside my meditation.) My daily activities also reflect that. |
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Frank-in-SanDiego
USA
363 Posts |
Posted - Feb 04 2006 : 03:54:40 AM
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Hari Om
~~~~~~~~
quote:
Originally posted by Alvin Chan
Does anyone know how to deal with it?
Hello Alvin,
May I suggest a few ideas for your consideration.
- Deep or shallow - doesn't matter; Its not about the subjective experience even though we all appreciate a pleasant ride, yes? . If you have noticed, your experiences are different from AM to PM, from week to week, etc. this is all relative.
- Tension and all that - just be easy about it; some stress comes out; We do not force anything. We can put our attention/awareness there to facilitate the phyical activity that is going on, just notice it - some say 'be with it' without judging, expecting or manipulating, then we easily go back to the mantra. Like that - no strain.
- A simple checklist to consider -
a. When starting, take your time to settle in and pick up the mantra.
b. During meditation there's no expecting - just easy and effortless
c. In Meditation - we take it easy and take it as it comes - lots of thoughts, little thoughts, no thoughts, we just favor the mantra. thoughts are thoughts! In meditation, they are just the product - some say by-product of the mind. It likes to think even about thinking !!! so, We don't mind, just favor the mantra.
d. Exiting Meditation - take a few min more when exiting; this is a time to enjoy/observe the silence that is there. If there is no silence during one meditation period v. another, it just doesn't matter. WE come out and we're more refreshed/alert and can use this new freshness in our daily activity - which in fact helps stablize more and more of the silence during our active hours.
As long as you are not straining, then the tension will pass.
Peace,
Frank In San Diego
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Manipura
USA
870 Posts |
Posted - Feb 04 2006 : 10:48:21 AM
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| Alvin - Consider having some cranial-sacral work done. Even minor adjustments, if done correctly, will make a huge difference. It's a science-based practice; you may find it interesting, and helpful. |
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Frank-in-SanDiego
USA
363 Posts |
Posted - Feb 04 2006 : 3:06:55 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by meg
Consider having some cranial-sacral work done.
Meg, what's this?? sounds like a 'root canal' 
Frank In San Diego
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Jim and His Karma
2111 Posts |
Posted - Feb 04 2006 : 9:51:01 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Alvin Chan
When I am well, I can let the mantra play. But recently, it doesn't play!
No, you mean it doesn't play the way it used to, or the way you'd like it to. Drop expectations. Just say "I am" to yourself over and over. If you lose it, come back to it.
You may prefer a reply that satisfies your thirst for detail and complexity. What's needed, though, is simplicity. Let the rest of your life be detailed and complicated. Let AYP be very very simple. Just my suggestion. |
Edited by - Jim and His Karma on Feb 04 2006 9:51:35 PM |
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Alvin Chan
Hong Kong
407 Posts |
Posted - Feb 05 2006 : 12:39:25 AM
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quote:
d. Exiting Meditation - take a few min more when exiting; this is a time to enjoy/observe the silence that is there. If there is no silence during one meditation period v. another, it just doesn't matter. WE come out and we're more refreshed/alert and can use this new freshness in our daily activity - which in fact helps stablize more and more of the silence during our active hours.
As long as you are not straining, then the tension will pass.
I've just found that taking more rest will help. I started my practice with much rest, like 5-10 mins, but not recently. Some people (like David) say that 2 mins are enough. They are probably luckier than me, that they come in and out of meditation fairly quickly. Probably I will need to take more rest.
I have a strong emotional tension again yesterday. But after a 90-min Power yoga class the tension seems to settle down rather nicely, without making me very tired. But it's not possible for me to take such class everyday.
Meg, what's "cranial-sacral"??
I am not "looking for" complicated answer. Rather, I am looking for things that work well for relieving such subtle tension, and as simple and quick as possible. Foods like coffee will make it much much worse, as I've experimented that many times. So life-style can really affect the quality of meditation much. I am just trying to pick those factors out to help me. During meditation, of course, I will keep it simple. |
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Manipura
USA
870 Posts |
Posted - Feb 05 2006 : 12:07:21 PM
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Frank and Alvin - For the science behind cranial sacral work, you'd do better to Google, as there's a lot of info on it. This, tho, is an adequate overview:
Cranial sacral therapy is based on the premise that the spinal fluid travels in a rhythmic flow, and that flow should remain constant for optimum health. When the flow is interrupted, it manifests in different ways; for me, there is a general malaise and an inability to go deep in meditation. That's not all, tho - there are connective membranes in the skull that are "fed" by the spinal fluid, and they too are affected by the lack of flow. This is what made me think to suggest cranial sacral to Alvin, as many of the membranes are located directly behind the eyes and nose.
I'm pretty skeptical about these things, so I don't expect anyone to run out and make an appointment, but maybe eventually someone will give it a try and let me know how it affected them. If nothing else, it's an amazing experience to feel one's spinal fluids running in their natural rhythm, without obstruction, right on up into the brain. Pure bliss!
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Frank-in-SanDiego
USA
363 Posts |
Posted - Feb 05 2006 : 5:01:28 PM
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Hari Om
~~~~~~~
quote:
Originally posted by Alvin Chan
[quote] I've just found that taking more rest will help.
Hello Alvin,
Rest, really does make a difference, and its simple...the approach is to always start simple and see the effects. Good to hear also, that some of your power yoga activities are also contributing to your health.
satya rtam brhat
Frank In San Diego
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fifounet
2 Posts |
Posted - Mar 25 2006 : 02:58:05 AM
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Hello Alvin
I have got exactly the same problem one year ago, especially during yoga nidra. I did jala neti (cleaning of the nose)twice a day, and then I get rid of this trouble after 2-3 weeks. And I still continue to do it every day. For me, it is just some inflammation of the sinus (pollution, etc.). |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Mar 25 2006 : 10:06:26 AM
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| Welcome fifounet. Thank you for sharing.. |
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Alvin Chan
Hong Kong
407 Posts |
Posted - Mar 26 2006 : 08:52:49 AM
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Thanks fifounet. I will try to see if it works. I do Neti too, but very occasionally, like once or twice a month.
Twice a day is quite a lot. Do you feel dry in your nose from that? |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Mar 26 2006 : 10:30:50 AM
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Meg wrote:
"Cranial sacral therapy is based on the premise that the spinal fluid travels in a rhythmic flow"
That much of it is scientific fact. I don't know about the rest.
Your head pulsates as a sort of pump to move spinal fluid up and
down the spine. Weird, huh?
When I do neti it actually stimulates more moisture from inside, and
I live in a very dry climate. It makes my nose feel less dry.
I completely agree with Frank's analysis above. Another thing you can do is when you feel that tension, just relax and put all your attention on it for a little while. Don't allow any other thought in your mind but the tension. Become absorbed in it. Don't try to do anything but be aware of it. Then return to the mantra. That will tend to relax it. I have the same thing; usually from coffee, but also without it. I have noticed that the effect of coffee lasts a couple days though. |
Edited by - Etherfish on Mar 26 2006 6:18:42 PM |
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fifounet
2 Posts |
Posted - Mar 26 2006 : 12:49:14 PM
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Hi Alvin,
No problem. I bend over a sink and I gently chase the water away from each nostril. Each day it becomes easier as your nose gets cleaner. This simple neti cured me from the tensions you decribe so well. I hope it will work also for you. |
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Leo
Italy
16 Posts |
Posted - Jan 09 2007 : 08:01:47 AM
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Hi Alvin and everyone,
I'm new to AYP and relatively new to meditation subjects .
For most of my life (I mean since when I was in my teen,and I'm 38 now) i've been fighting with a problem which is very similar to yours. I experienced muscular tension between my jawbone, temples, and face, and I always felt something
"pushing" behind my nose and eyes . It took years to identify the right sensation, since it started gradually, and I had
gotten used to it. The tension propagated to my neck and spine, sometimes. At the same time I had some breathing problem,
which I thought was caused by sinusitis .
My guess is that this kind of muscular tension is linked to nervous tension , but I can't say which one of them causes the
other. To me, muscular tension can come from nervous tension, but can cause it as well... I read once that one of the tricks
the yogins use to calm their mind, is relaxing their face muscles : to do this, simply contract all your face's muscles and
keep the contraction as long as you can. Once you release the tension,you could realize that your mind is a bit more relaxed. From that moment on, try to keep your face's muscles as relaxed as you can . Check yourself during the day, and relax those muscles any time you can and need. I realized, more than once, that, when I relax (I mean really, totally, relax) my face's muscles, my breathing problems simply disappear, and I feel a lot better. Sure , it is not easy to keep relaxed , since when you're cronically tensed, as I am, tension always tries to come back, if you allow it . You (and I)should develop the habit of being relaxed, become "cronically relaxed". Tension blocks the energy, and the thought, and you
experience problems in concentrating and remembering too. More, I 'm quite convinved that , keeping tension in you head
muscles, expecially, behind the nose and eyes, causes mucus not to flow properly, to accumulate and dry up, causing pressure, pain, nervousness , anxiety and any kind of disturbances . Jala Neti sure is an excellent way of cleansing the
nasal and sinusal cavities . I did it a lot in the past and still do, mixing warm water with a small amount of sea salt.
You should not do it too often, since salt irritates the nasal linings : two or three times a week can be enough. If you need more,try to alternate self massage with Jala Neti. Self massage is another excellent remedy, if done properly, and hasn't the side effect of irritating the linings. Try light pressure in various parts of your head, find the right spots and pressure (->shiatsu, follow the instructions in a good book if you think it can help): trust your sensations, sometimes
you'll feel something moving in your head, generally a sensationg of unblocking, be it the breath or whatever. You should
follow these sensations. Try to apply even rotating massages (for instance, I recently found that massaging the cheek bones
right besides my ears, in a rotating , gentle ,and prolonged way, seems to help a lot).
Keep in mind that with time, the situation could change and you could need to change the pressure points.
Join all these with breathing properly, slowly without forcing it, with you belly .
As I said, I always had similar problems : today I'm still nowhere near perfect, but I'm very much better now than when I was 20 . I started meditation some months ago , in a regular way , and I really think the only way to succed is not to expect anything : they say , "what you crave for, will run from you ..."
Good Luck
Leo
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Jim and His Karma
2111 Posts |
Posted - Jan 09 2007 : 11:47:36 AM
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See these two lessons for practices that clear and balance energies in the head:
http://www.aypsite.org/281.html
and
http://www.aypsite.org/288.html
....noting that there are prerequisites for these practices (mentioned in the lessons), so you ought to do your homework and go back and check out the precursor stuff
FWIW, I feel like there's construction work going on in the sinuses as I meditate. It's a lot like you describe, but I don't find it unpleasant; it just feels like more purification. For one thing, I keep hearing flapping and snapping sounds back there as passages dilate from energy coming through. But for whatever reason, I'm not experiencing it as disomfort.
If anyone has the problem you describe to the point of discomfort, or a feeeling of trapped energy in the head, you might want to check my postings in this thread for some simple aids: http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....rchTerms=tmj |
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limiting factor(s) for going deep
