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emc
2072 Posts |
 Posted - May 26 2009 : 12:49:25 AM
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Yes, Yogani, thanks a lot for that! I had the same question a while back (http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....OPIC_ID=4743) but were mostly confused by the answers I got then which were sort of just encouraging me to stop writing or minding about it as if it was hardly worth discussing, and I'm glad to finally get a really clearcut and elaborated answer. Thank you Carson for bringing the topic up again!
Yogani, your latest lessons are absolutely fabulous!  I enjoy to read immensely!
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Edited by - emc on May 26 2009 02:23:23 AM |
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Yonatan
Israel
849 Posts |
Posted - May 26 2009 : 08:12:22 AM
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Waw, awesome and amazing lesson, thank you Yogani, it was a real wonderful one.
Love, 
Yonatan |
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yogani
USA
5241 Posts |
Posted - May 26 2009 : 09:11:34 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by emc
Yes, Yogani, thanks a lot for that! I had the same question a while back (http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....OPIC_ID=4743) but were mostly confused by the answers I got then which were sort of just encouraging me to stop writing or minding about it as if it was hardly worth discussing, and I'm glad to finally get a really clearcut and elaborated answer. Thank you Carson for bringing the topic up again!
Yogani, your latest lessons are absolutely fabulous! I enjoy to read immensely!
Thanks All...
Hi emc:
The recent lessons are not saying much different than replies I wrote in the topic link you gave, except perhaps becoming more proactive with the mind.
Honestly, I have some reservations about it, because as soon as we begin describing the "nitty gritty" of self-inquiry, many people may run off into mental circles -- non-relational self-inquiry -- at the expense of prerequisite cultivation and natural outward flow of inner silence (witness), which is what naturally produces relational self-inquiry.
For me, self-inquiry has always been an organic process, emerging naturally with the rise of inner silence and ecstatic conductivity over the years. A gradual development. Not the slam-bam-boom kind of enlightenment that is offered by so many advaita teachers these days, which is often chaotic, requiring a lot of backing and filling, and I think not faster than the smoother path that AYP aspires to be, putting in a firm foundation of the witness first. I'm not sure that proactive self-inquiry is suitable for the masses, even though it has obvious mass appeal -- "mind candy."
So I have these reservations about slam-bam-boom "neo-advaita" -- with houses too often built on sand, rather than on the rock of abiding inner silence.
Nevertheless, with so many here moving ahead quickly with clear experiences of abiding inner silence (stage 1), ecstatic conductivity (stage 2), and even unity experiences (stage 3), I felt it was time to do more nitty gritty on self-inquiry in the lessons. I hope it does not produce too much grinding of the gears -- non-relational grinding that is.
Thanks for the opportunity to express these thoughts. We'll keep on and see how it unfolds -- a work in progress. It's a community thing, you know.
May all the flowers bloom in their own way. Enjoy!
The guru is in you.
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brother neil
USA
752 Posts |
Posted - May 26 2009 : 4:40:53 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by CarsonZi
Yes, thank you Yogani....another beautifully written lesson. You're on FIRE! Haha. The extra end part was perfect as well. Thank you.
Love,
Carson
WHo is on fire?
what was perfect? |
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grihastha
USA
184 Posts |
Posted - May 28 2009 : 5:43:48 PM
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If my understanding isn't too shaky, the idea that 'God' or 'Brahman' already knows what we're about to do at any given time, thus making our freedom of choice an illusion, only works if you believe that Brahman's perception is linear, that there's some sort of divine narrative, or really if you believe that Brahman perceives anything. Western traditions teach us that God is an intelligence - the uber-mind, watching us from far above as if we were ants in an experiment. If you take away that concept - take away the observing God, the judging God, the Divine CCTV, we are completely free. Except that we aren't while we accept duality and see Maya as reality. But then, of course, Maya IS reality, because it arises unconsciously or automatically from Brahman, is indistinguishable from God...
The realized Advaitin doesn't reject Maya, with all the implications of choice, but finds him or herself not an accepting observer of Maya's play but simply Maya herself and so one with Brahman, beyond rules, beyond rationality: nameless and formless.
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grihastha
USA
184 Posts |
Posted - May 28 2009 : 5:52:00 PM
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Sorry, didn't mean to subject everyone to a simple-minded Avaita 101 lecture.
Carsonji, I started off making the point of the non-linearity of God, and got carried away. Just trying to get it straight in my own head. But, folding the laundry in an attempt to get some grounding, I wondered if I'd gone on an ego-rampage... If so, please ignore!
Love! |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - May 29 2009 : 11:20:14 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by grihastha
Sorry, didn't mean to subject everyone to a simple-minded Avaita 101 lecture.
Carsonji, I started off making the point of the non-linearity of God, and got carried away. Just trying to get it straight in my own head. But, folding the laundry in an attempt to get some grounding, I wondered if I'd gone on an ego-rampage... If so, please ignore!
Love!
You never have to be sorry for say something that comes from your heart over here, and it's not an ego rampage.. it is just the mind trying to figure it out. Doesn't really matter.. The day you can actually understand the whole non-duality, choiceless living thing.. is the day you will not be able to put it in words.. because words are limited to the mind.. and the day you get non duality.. the understanding will be beyond the mind. You will be fumbling around for words to explain what you are experiencing. It's like explaining to someone how a fruit, that they have never tasted, actually tastes. You can try, but till they taste it, they will never know. That is why Yogani says..
We cannot play this game from the point of view of a state of consciousness we are not in yet.
Thank you for joining us, it's wonderful to have you here. |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - May 29 2009 : 12:42:42 PM
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Hi grihastha......
quote:
Originally posted by grihastha
Sorry, didn't mean to subject everyone to a simple-minded Avaita 101 lecture.
No worries...I needed it!
quote:
Originally posted by grihastha
Carsonji, I started off making the point of the non-linearity of God, and got carried away. Just trying to get it straight in my own head. But, folding the laundry in an attempt to get some grounding, I wondered if I'd gone on an ego-rampage... If so, please ignore!
Hard not to get carried away when talking adviata.....simply because words are inadequate and once we start it's hard to stop trying to make the incomplete complete. Just gotta let go....and dive headfirst into that laundry basket full of warm laundry! Mmmmmmmmm........warm laundry......
Love,
Carson |
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grihastha
USA
184 Posts |
Posted - May 29 2009 : 2:16:04 PM
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Whew, brilliant, thanks Shanti and Carson! I've been my own audience/sounding board/lab rat for my enquiries for so long it's amazingly liberating to have a community of like-minded souls
once we start it's hard to stop trying to make the incomplete complete Yes, no kidding. But it feels good to try...
Love! |
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