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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
 Posted - Mar 21 2009 : 09:23:37 AM
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Definitely i think im defferent from lot of people.I have had all my life the feeling that i dont fit.Always,when im knowin new people,all its ok.But whit the passing of time,and i begin to show my self,people look me like a freak boy.I cant be other person.Im just my self´
I have a behavior that lot of eople dont understand.The look at me when being my self and i know they laugh at me inside their selfes.
I lose concentration easily,i often have strange reactions that people dont understand,dreaming all day...
I feel different.I look at them and i speak,and have good moments...but,i cant connect.Always,there is a wall.
I feel really bad sometimes with other people.They think im quite a character.
In the other hand,i have lot of fears to the people.When im begining to have a good relationship with a person,i begin to develope fear about something i see inside that person (maybe pure imaagination),and i experience a block.And i can give that person all that can offer.
This things made me go far from people.I only experience peace on my own.I am my only friend much times.But i need the others as human being,but there is a big wall.
I began in spiritual path for this reason.Trying to understand my self,and all of this suffering.Trying to find my centre,my self,my peace.Who am I.Why im here.Whats beyond all this scenary.
I have fear of boys.I have always very good relations with girls.But i dont have success with girls.I feel and i know they look at me like a girl too (they always say me it).I connect with girls in a female form.Im too developed the female side.I get frustated,because they like the male side.But i cant show that.Im more feminine.
I writing this here trying to find an answer,or some people who feels like me,or felt this in the past.
Thanks.
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Edited by - miguel on May 11 2009 08:37:20 AM |
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YogaIsLife
641 Posts |
Posted - Mar 21 2009 : 09:40:49 AM
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Hi Miguel. 
Just wanted to say that what you feel is very normal, not so uncommon, and will pass with time. It's teh tiranny of the mind. I used to feel like that A LOT but I noticed that all those "worries" start to lose their grip gradually as I grow older (I am now an almost respectful 32 year-old! ). I am much more at easy. That does not mean that there are still no challenges. Life IS challenges!
You say you started spiritual practice to understand that suffering. I think you started for the right reasons. I think you will get there. I think, for your case, because it seems to me to be not so unlike mine, a practice of mantra meditation like AYP can indeed be very useful. It was to me. Stick with it for some months and see how it feels. It disciplinates the mind. It brings it to rest, to focus. You realise that this floods over to your daily life and affect everything around you. You become better able to see your reactions for what they are, form a certain detachment. You also will be able, gradually, to do better, more conscious, choices, having loosen the chain from your "fearful" monkey-mind. Being conscious of the present moment and of all the things that arise in you is another part of the process, enhanced by the mechnaics of deep meditation. On that I can suggest you read Eckhart Tolle's The Power of Now. It helped me. So, on one side you train your mind to stillness with mantra meditation, on the other just be easily aware of your present moment and thoughts. Things will click together 
I wish you all the best and keep sharing to your heart satisfaction. |
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Mar 21 2009 : 10:15:08 AM
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Thanks yogaislife.
I think i fit with spirtual path very well.I feel very comfortable.
Ayp meditation works very fast.
I have peolple around me that accept my self and respect me.Im 26 now,i made lot of preogress in my life with people this last years.Before,it was a horrible nightmare very often.
I have found my path,the path of reaching THAT what i am.
I began spiritual path in part because of lot of confusion in my life.The way of discovering the truth of my self.I feel lot of guide very often.Im reading selfinquiry book.What a great book.Lot of wisdom in that book.It has a studied structure.Yogani takes your hand and guides you along the book.I love it.That book fills me with joy and bliss.The promise of the real state of witness.
When i saw this book for the first time,i felt a connection because o his beautiful tittle and in special the external colour of the book: Dawn of witness,the end of suffering....i love the word "dawn" in the tittle.It sounds it (we),the witness, comes to rescue us from ilusion.And thats the truth.
Thanks and love. |
Edited by - miguel on Mar 21 2009 10:23:27 AM |
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markern
Norway
171 Posts |
Posted - Mar 21 2009 : 1:16:10 PM
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maybe try this: www.charismaarts.com
It works realy well for most people |
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Mar 21 2009 : 2:52:55 PM
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Thanks markern.I looked that website, But i preffer to cultivate the witness for go beyond the mental limitations.I tried in the past things like this,and helps.But i think they are more mental stuff over the mind.And i have lot of this.But thanks.
Yogaislife,i read the power of now,and practicing the power of now too,in the past.I liked it very much.
Thanks. |
Edited by - miguel on Mar 21 2009 2:57:32 PM |
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markern
Norway
171 Posts |
Posted - Mar 21 2009 : 3:29:14 PM
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| OK just be aware that cultivating witness etc. do not remove all sorts of psychological problems etc. a lot of problems just disapear and all problems seemed to be lessened but there is a danger to think that somehow all pains and problems of ordinary life will be solved by spiritual life and that is never the case. |
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Mar 21 2009 : 4:30:05 PM
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Yes,i know.
When i began with spiritual path,i had an attitude of using it like a drug,triying to forget the problems.It ended in much frustation and pain.
Yoga is a tool,not the end,"That" is the end.
Now I accept life,trying to bring consciousness to life (in good and bad moments) by my self.Im in a process now of returning to the world slowly.Its not easy.But now i return with yoga practices as a tool and all that i learned in spiritual path in the past.
Thanks for that important advice. |
Edited by - miguel on Mar 21 2009 4:33:27 PM |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Mar 21 2009 : 8:26:21 PM
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The spiritual path can't be depended on to end all problems, but if you straighten out the rest of your life at the same time as twice daily practices, YOU can end your suffering.
You sound very much like me, Miguel only I'm 59 and have ended most of those problems you write about. You just need to change your focus a little and those things won't bother you anymore.
You need to strengthen your self mentally so that you don't care what other people think. This will happen automatically from yoga practice. just make the decision that you will always be different from other people, and you are going to ignore how other people feel about that.
Then put that in practice. Ignore them. Just be the weird guy you are, and don't try to change, and don't care if anyone likes you or not.
You are "needing" them too much now, and that makes people act weird.
You could be the strangest guy in the world, and if you ignore everybody's reaction to that,
you will find some people like you anyway. So, be a little tougher in your treatment of them,
and ironically they will soften their treatment of you. It doesn't make sense, but just try it.
The reason they act weird toward you is because you are projecting a fear that you are not OK.
How can you not be OK? I assume you are not doing things that are grossly illegal or immoral, right?
So just decide that you are doing the best you can, and if people don't like that, they can stay away. You will be surprised at the results of this attitude.
Once you decide you are fine on your own, and don't need people, they will treat you better.
It's a hard transition to make because we all need people. But what can you lose? You don't have what you need right now, so you have nothing to lose.
Here is the key: People react to how you feel about yourself.
First you MUST learn to be strong and accept yourself without anyone liking you.
Then people will feel comfortable around you, and treat you better. |
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Mar 22 2009 : 03:09:34 AM
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| Thanks etherfish. |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Mar 22 2009 : 10:58:32 AM
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Hi Miguel and All...
I am kinda going through something similar Miguel, and I wrote about it here: http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....OPIC_ID=5342
But I have found, and I think one of the things Miguel is trying to say, is that in social settings it's difficult not to "pick up" on other peoples "energy" and "issues". And we end up wondering if they are our own. Being male, yet more in touch with the feminine side, combined with advanced Yoga practices, can enhance this issue I think. Is there anything I, and Miguel can do to keep from picking up on other's energy so easily and identifying with it so strongly? (Please forgive me Miguel if I have intuited wrong how you are feeling)
Love,
Carson
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Mar 22 2009 : 1:25:01 PM
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| Yes it's what I wrote above, by strengthening your image of yourself. It is not a problem identifying empathetically with other people when you are strong within yourself. |
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Mar 22 2009 : 2:08:58 PM
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Hi Carson,and thanks for answering.Very Good vibrations from you,men,in this and other posts i read in the forum.
Yes,what you describe happens to me frecuently.I feel like being absorved by other people.I lose my centre frecuently.It has created lot of problems in my life,because i do things that i dont like really.This is called by others "lack of personality".
I always have felt that others rule my life.Im always dominated by others (mens and womens).
I really feel in peace in loneliness.I love a great natural spaces outside the city and without people.I feel people hurt me...i take their feelings,toughts,and i begin to act like them.And then i run away from them.Is to dificult to me the stability in relations with riends,girlfriends,parents...society...
Etherfish is right what you talk about.You have experience in life i think,i thought about it,but its not easy for me puttig in to practice what you talk about.Its impossible being an island-man and strenght your self...
"You are "needing" them too much now, and that makes people act weird.". Thats the central problem too.I like to be alone,but when im with the others is difficult for me leave them after having a good time.In fact,i feel two different personalities inside me.One with the other,and the other personality alone.each They are very different(more in the past,now is balancing).Sometimes i feel i have some mental issue,but in the past i was in psyquiatrist for two months because i was wondering what happens inside me (and i had great depression and anxiety) and he didnt detected serious issues.Only "soft2 issues,like upset of personality,border-line...but noting serious like skizo or similar.
I think me (and Carson) need something more practical,more...i dont know what...
I know all this problems carried me to yoga,and i know yoga will help me a lot in reaching my own peace in life.I was born for discover my real self.
Know,this problems are softer than in the past.Imagine how was my teenage...
Thanks guys.
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Edited by - miguel on Mar 22 2009 2:36:23 PM |
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Jack
United Kingdom
305 Posts |
Posted - Mar 22 2009 : 2:32:11 PM
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Consider reading "No More Mr Nice Guy" by Robert Glover.
Despite the garish title, this book sheds a LOT of light on the kind of issues you appear to be demonstrating, and goes into the cause of this behaviour, how it affects you, and what you can do to bring yourself back to integration.
Jack |
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Mar 22 2009 : 3:14:37 PM
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| Hi jack and Thanks.Ill take a look to that book. |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Mar 22 2009 : 11:42:00 PM
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What worked well for me is finding an activity that i really like, and put a lot of effort into it. For me it is dance, common for guys with a strong feminine side, but pick whatever is best for you. preferably something that helps you express yourself.
then you can imagine an image of what kind of person you could be if you were good at that thing and could express yourself very well.
I decided I would be a good dancer, and people may admire me for expressing myself and I wouldn;t care if I had no close friends. I would be absorbed in my dance.
So I put a lot of constant effort into it, and it has transformed me. Of course all the while i was meditating regularly also.
So the activity has to be something you really like. |
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Mar 23 2009 : 06:36:42 AM
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Great advice ether and thanks for sharing your experiences and ideas.For me i think is teathre,music,(and yoga! )....that direction,that style of things.But i dont have clearly what is the best,or maybe i havent discovered it yet...one practice that attracts my like my spititual practices...Ill think about it.
Thanks! |
Edited by - miguel on Mar 23 2009 06:55:33 AM |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Mar 23 2009 : 11:28:22 AM
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Hi Etherfish.....
quote:
Originally posted by CarsonZi
Is there anything I, and Miguel can do to keep from picking up on other's energy so easily and identifying with it so strongly?
quote:
Originally posted by Etherfish
Yes it's what I wrote above(*now below*), by strengthening your image of yourself. It is not a problem identifying empathetically with other people when you are strong within yourself.
Well sir....I don't know if I totally agree with you. I am pretty darn secure with who I am. But the longer I continue a twice daily sadhana, the more I notice that I have difficulties not "tuning" in to other's energies. And over the past year or so I have only grown stronger and more independent as an individual, not less.
quote:
Originally posted by Etherfish
You need to strengthen your self mentally so that you don't care what other people think.
You see, this is not an issue in any way for me personally. I truly do not care what others think of me. I enjoy hearing other people's opinions and I enjoy taking them all into perspective, but I also enjoy having my own point of view independent of anyone elses. I am a very independent thinker and don't really find I am very influenced at all by other people and their thoughts. The issue I am trying to highlight here is something a little different I think. What I am trying to say is that when in social circumstances, it is difficult for me to not become "energetically involved" with those around me. For example....I am having dinner and drinks with about 10 friends at a pub. Most of them are there to watch a Pay-Per-View UFC fight. I am there for the company and conversation. But I notice after about 5 minutes of being there, that I am soon overcome with a tremendous sense of fear of hostility towards me...then an overwhelming sensation of needing/wanting to hide, etc etc. These types of feelings. These are not things I normally feel in any situation. Then I realize that I can feel these sensations stronger in the front right side of my body. Almost a pulling sensation. I notice who is sitting in that direction and instantly realize that these feelings are not my own, but the feelings of the girl sitting across and to the right of me at the table. This is a girl who I know has had some problems with being physically abused by her former partner, and if very timid and shy and doesn't speak much in social situations. I watch her a little out of the corner of my eye once I realize I am picking up on her feelings and notice a few things. I notice that when her eyes turn to one of the TV's in the room displaying the UFC fight, the fear and sense of a need to hide increase rapidly, as does my heartbeat. I assume hers was as well. The sensations diminish somewhat when I observe her in conversation with one of the people around her. At one point, (and this is when I realized that this may become an issue in the future for me) when one of the fighters on TV got knocked out and was flailing a bit on the canvas from the severe blow to the head, I saw her catch her breath at the exact same time I did, and then tears well up in both our eyes and I had to leave quickly before anyone noticed I was about to start balling. I'm not sure if she left the table or not at this time, or if she just suppressed the tears. I couldn't. It was too overwhelming. Anyways, this happens pretty regularly to me these days. Especially strong in the past week or two. I really don't think that this is a case of me not having a strong enough sense of myself, or that I am weak mentally or something. I really don't think that is the case.
quote:
Originally posted by Etherfish
This will happen automatically from yoga practice. just make the decision that you will always be different from other people, and you are going to ignore how other people feel about that.
For me it isn't really an issue of being "different" from other people. Are you capable of knowing that someone is suffering deeply and not feel a little bit of that yourself? Or a little bit of helplessness that you can't do anything? These "states" Miguel and I are talking about, are just amplified versions of that same sense of connection. And I don't think I necessarily want to turn it off completely. I would like to be able to control it a little more though. I wish that I could pick up on how people are feeling, but not identify with it to the point of losing my own state of emotion or lack-there-of. Make sense?
Hope this clarifies a little.
Love,
Carson |
Edited by - CarsonZi on Mar 23 2009 11:35:09 AM |
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Mar 23 2009 : 2:00:31 PM
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Hi.
I think not the same thing that carson talks about,but simmilar in some points.
Thanks. |
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markern
Norway
171 Posts |
Posted - Mar 23 2009 : 5:07:42 PM
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| The advice I got from my meditation teacher about pciking up on other peoples energy was to truly and minfully realize for myself that this is not my energy. Before I used my skills at controling my energy to block other peoples incoming energy or perhaps even try to transform it for them. But that is tiresome compared to when I realy get that this is not mine and let it go through me. THen it does not bother me anymore. If this becomes a serious problem for you CarZonsi and you don`t manage to deal well with it I can give you his email. He is extreemly wise and knows these things in and out. |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Mar 23 2009 : 7:45:20 PM
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Thank you Markern.....I will let you know if this continues to be an ongoing struggle I can't seem to resolve and get his email then. Thank you for all your wise advice.
Love,
Carson |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Mar 23 2009 : 8:59:03 PM
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Carson this is something different than i was talking about for miguel. But yes I notice much of the same thing also but I think not as bad. When it starts I turn my attention to something else.
But for miguel, the first part is about wondering if you are gay; I have gone through this same thing. It comes from having a strong feminine side and feeling a kinship with gay guys because they do too. But if you examine it closer, you can tell the difference. it is quite common for a hetero man to have a little gay feeling and not be gay. For instance, I am hetero, but if guy takes his shirt off who is very buff, my heart will beat faster, and i will feel "Wow, that guy looks good."
But i don't have a sexual attraction to him. I don't like looking at gay porno, and don't get aroused hugging a gay guy. That's how you can tell. I still hug gay guys though, and it doesn't bother me.
The other issue is about needing people too much and trying to be more secure within yourself. Here is a motivation to be tougher with people: It is a huge turn-on for women when you are secure.
It is built into them hormonally to be attracted to secure men.
This is the reason women stay with men who abuse them. It is also the reason women are attracted to men who treat them badly. And it is the reason they are attracted to sports stars, politicians, rich men etc. All the same thing; they think they are more secure with themselves, and so therefore would be better mates for procreating.
Here's the good news: Men like us with a sensitive side are actually much better for women if we learn to be secure with ourselves. We treat them better and understand them better.
The funny thing is, the big ego guys who act so secure are actually less secure than us usually. But they have learned to act secure because they know they are better accepted that way. It's all a big show.
So we need to learn to act that way too for more acceptance, but we can do it for real instead of faking it. We can be secure from a spiritual foundation which is real, and build our personality off of that. Meditation is the foundation, and then you decide what kind of person you want to be and create that. |
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Mar 24 2009 : 03:49:57 AM
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wow ether!
I felt much identifyed whith your words!
Yes,altought im not gay ,i think that i feel great conection with gays.I think they are more sensible persons and maybe better persons,with a more open hearth.I feel it in that way.
And i like very much girls,but when i look one girls who i like,i get insecure,like asking for her permission for getting "mambo" with her.The girl look this as insecurity (it is),and i became his little dog.She rules the situation,in my case,totally.And no kiss,no sex.Only a close and lovely little friend.Andd for me side,i feel agressive "asking" for sex with girls.I feel agressive.I onl can give sex with love,not only sex like other guys do.And maybe this is good (to be a lovely friend),but me,like a man,I feel a castrated boy in that situations.Not complete a man.
It always leaves me with great disatisfaction and frustrating feeling.
They (girls) dont like for sex ONLY a lovely man.They want the masculine side of men too.Boys with big feminine side atract them,but as a close friend.
And for ther side,when i like a girl,i look around afraid of other guys atracted for that girl.I ask for the permisson of other guys too.
Love
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Edited by - miguel on Mar 30 2009 1:49:16 PM |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Mar 24 2009 : 10:24:20 PM
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Yes, sensitive guys should find a woman to love. Casual sex isn't very good anyway, and ultimately a tantric partner is best spiritually.
but just a hint about women:
You should not ask for permission to have sex. Women's minds do not work like ours. Their sexual attraction is a feeling in their body, and they follow their feelings. If you talk about it, it makes an unnatural connection for them and breaks the charm.
You can joke about sex, but don't talk about it being between you and her. Don't act so easy.
Women like you to show them a range of different feelings, not intellectual words like men do.
Then if they are close to you and trying to look sexy, just kiss them without asking, and see where it goes. You have to act like you don't care if they reject you.
And sometimes they will even reject you and not mean no forever. They are testing to see how secure you are, so just ignore it and act normal.
You have to watch women and see how they react to things. They don't think like men at all, and it won't make any sense to you, but you can learn what they want. Just don't expect it to be logical!
They make decisions based on feelings, not logic. And if you try to analyze their feelings with logic, it pushes them away. |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Mar 25 2009 : 12:20:14 AM
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Damn women! Always playing "games"
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Mar 25 2009 : 03:33:32 AM
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Thanks ether You are answering all my questions perfectly.
im agree with you. |
Edited by - miguel on Mar 25 2009 03:37:29 AM |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Mar 25 2009 : 06:48:16 AM
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| I know Carson is joking - none of it is intentional; that's the way women are. It is a perfect compliment to the way men are. |
Edited by - Etherfish on Mar 25 2009 8:41:18 PM |
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Fear of people.Boys and girls.
