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the_watcher
United Kingdom
3 Posts |
 Posted - May 30 2008 : 12:23:46 PM
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Namaste fellow Sadhaks.
I have recently been thinking of practicing microcosmic orbit (aka small heavenly circuit in some chi kung school) as per Taoist Yoga practices which seek to circulate Chi from the Tan Tien (Manipura) down to Mooladhara, round and up the back to ajna/sahasrara and back down the front to the Manipurak.
I thought practicing the Microcosmic orbit would be a useful tool to help circulate energy at the end of a yoga practice to ensure it doesn't get stuck too high up at the higher chakras but instead circulates throughout and then returns to Manipura or anahata.
The only problem I have is that whereas Taoist Yogis have perceived that Chi (Prana? Shakti?) circulates DOWNWARDS when following a channel on the FRONT of the body and UPWARDS through a channel running up the BACK of the body, Kriya Yoga (as per Bihar School of Yog) teaches that energy runs via two Nadis - Arohan and Awarohan. Here the first runs upwards and the latter runs downwards.
However, it is OPPOSITE to the Taoist viewpoint where they advise focusing the mind of perceiving the energy flowing UPWARDS along the front of the body and DOWNWARDS along the back of the body.
Anyone have any experience with either method and know which is correct? I don't want to cause damage by doing the opposite to what is the natural flow, but I find it hard to believe that this most fundamental Taoist/Qigong method could be incorrect (we learnt it in our first qigong class) but I also find it hard that Bihar School of Yoga could be off too (or Kriya yog in general if this is the accepted view).
I also noticed a thread further down on Prana flow during spinal breathing where the people were noticing the prana following a circuit in the same direction as the Taoist view, as opposed to the Indian Yogic view/perception.
Many thanks
The Watcher
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Thokar
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - May 30 2008 : 9:23:20 PM
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Hi watcher,
Technically you can circulate energy in either direction in these two channel's. The direction the energy flows the strongest is downwards through the front channel and up through the back channel. However you can reverse the circulation and move energy upwards through the front and down through the back, or you can try to feel it as flowing through just one channel in the middle.. Each method is has it's own uses.. The spinal breathing process taught in ayp uses just the feeling of the middle channel as this bypasses unnecessary visualization on the part of the practitioner.. However, for people that feel the distinct difference between channels, the microcosmic orbit and reversing the orbit have very good uses.. I also practice kriya yoga as you and in my own practice and how I was taught I rotate the energy up the back and down the front in standard kriya pranayam (1st kriya)and when I move to omkar pranayama(2d kriya) I move the energy straight up and down the central channel while performing the mantra. hope this answers your questions.. |
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Bhawandeep
India
1 Posts |
Posted - May 31 2008 : 04:07:34 AM
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| Well, this is a practice to be followed by those persons who want to explore the inner energy. There is a synonym for ‘chi’ or ‘ki’ and that is ‘prana energy’. I think this <a href=†http://www.gurumaa.com/videos/categ...ga-pranayamaâ€>; link </a> will be helpful for you to understand the basic thing about this ‘chi’ or ‘prana’ energy more appropriately. |
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AYPforum
351 Posts |
Posted - May 31 2008 : 09:26:42 AM
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| Moderator note: Topic moved for better placement |
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the_watcher
United Kingdom
3 Posts |
Posted - May 31 2008 : 3:01:23 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Thokar
Hi watcher,
Technically you can circulate energy in either direction in these two channel's. The direction the energy flows the strongest is downwards through the front channel and up through the back channel. However you can reverse the circulation and move energy upwards through the front and down through the back, or you can try to feel it as flowing through just one channel in the middle.. Each method is has it's own uses.. The spinal breathing process taught in ayp uses just the feeling of the middle channel as this bypasses unnecessary visualization on the part of the practitioner.. However, for people that feel the distinct difference between channels, the microcosmic orbit and reversing the orbit have very good uses.. I also practice kriya yoga as you and in my own practice and how I was taught I rotate the energy up the back and down the front in standard kriya pranayam (1st kriya)and when I move to omkar pranayama(2d kriya) I move the energy straight up and down the central channel while performing the mantra. hope this answers your questions..
Thanks very much for the informative reply. I was just a bit apprehensive since I thought that maybe energy flows naturally in a certain direction and it would be wrong to go against the flow.
I am still intrigued as to why Kriya yog and Taoist Yog both use opposite directions. Maybe it's just a matter that the masters of each school had found that it worked best for themselves in that manner, and passed that down through the ages.
It's interesting that the way you were taught the first Kriya, it is to rotate energy up the back and down the front which is identical to the taoist technique. Whilst Bihar's Kriya requires it to go in the opposite direction. Also on a side note, I have not seen mention of Arohan (Ascending nadi in the front) and Awarohan (descending nadi in the back) mentioned by anyone else except for teachers from Bihar school.
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kuma
United Kingdom
3 Posts |
Posted - Oct 19 2011 : 6:23:24 PM
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Howdy folks--1st post on this site! I was called out by this marvelous topic and have some real good info for you!
Yukteswar lineage and even SRF taught the arohan route described as an optional way to the standard one as related in "kundalini tantra" book by Swami Satyananda...alternate way for Satya: you go up front to vishuddi and then to forehead, then up and over sahasrar to bindu and down back.
This was in the SRF lessons 1923 to 1951--if you have any of their kriya lessons from then you can see the drawings of this and read the descriptions to same effect.
In 1951 Yogananda, as described by Kriyananda, decided to change it to middle passage to affect simplicity. He said the technique is still the same, but easier to understand for most (unless you feel the orbits).
A Durgamite (student of Durga Mata--a close student of Yoganana) told a friend recently that women especially in 1:1 kriya counseling were told they could go up back and down front. Men too, but they are seldom seen that like it that way. Note that Durga said that the most basic elements of kriya and its variations were put on paper and this counsel was priceless.
I tend to start to go up the front and down the back until I do higher kriyas and they are all on the back. Benefit? Supposedly the chakra energy moves from back out the front of body, so until we are in perception of sushumna it forces pran back into sushumna when you go with the chakra kshetra in front. Also placing into chakras from back enlivens them. The Path around head triangulates and hones point of ajna chakra. I feel a big rush of pran coming into medulla when I take the orbit over the back of head on way down.
eager for some response on this...may all feel and do what is best for them
hint: FOLLOW THE PRAN!
Kuma
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kuma
United Kingdom
3 Posts |
Posted - Oct 19 2011 : 6:33:52 PM
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perhaps flowing down the front and up back is better for health
Taoists were sticklers for all round health before liberation be attempted.
Kuma |
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Amfreenow
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - Oct 21 2011 : 08:51:11 AM
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In my experience, and for many years in fact, the prana flow has always been perceived as being up the front channel on the in breath, and down the rear channel on the out breath. This is the way it flows naturally, without visualizing anything. It's not forced to move a certain way, nor imagined. That's just the way it is. In fact, this is happening with every single breath, and one will be especially aware of this during entire meditation sessions.
I don't think you need any particular training in this, because the prana circulates just like blood in veins and arteries, in the natural direction. However, through meditative practice, and over years of practice, one becomes still and it;s actual movement comes into conscious awareness for the yogi practitioner. That's my take on it, not speaking from one yogic system of thought or another, but just purely from a personal yogic experience. Hope this helps. |
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kuma
United Kingdom
3 Posts |
Posted - Oct 21 2011 : 12:27:30 PM
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PY and SRF as per Yukteswar taught that the frontal path was in spinal column, not on surface of skin or on front of body. The 1923-29-31 drawings depict the front channel as being an inch or so forward of the back one.
I just got out 1923 kriya lesson written in PY's own hand from Copley plaza in NYC--current is breathed to kutasta at brow, let flow over skull, and is resumed breathing down at medulla. Later in 1931 he said breathe it in exhale over crown to medulla. 1951--the current method--up and down from kutasta from central position only.
I find SRF current method is easiest, then move to 1931 and 1923 method as reps go on.
I agree--it is easier on front on way up (slightly in front) but many feel differently. Some like it up back and down front--others up back and down back.
Kuma |
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Amfreenow
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - Oct 21 2011 : 10:47:37 PM
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OK, in the spinal space but on the front of that space. Nevertheless, it goes up the front on the in breath and down the rear channel on the outbreath. There are doctrinal directions on what to visualize and imagine, but I'm just talking as a practitioner who experiences how it moves thats all.
P.S. And now, several days later, and after further thought about it, during meditations, on the in breath, the prana rises up the front half of the body, right into and through the heart, with a rush, and up the front of the neck, then there's throbbing in the head(pleasant beyond words) , and from there, an incredibly pleasant rush down the back of the head, into the entire back to the pelvic area.
Initially, this flow was just a trickle, but now after a few years of daily practice, it can be overpowering in a good way, surrendering to it. You need to be sitting up straight, like a stack of coins, without any back support. Hope this helps. |
Edited by - Amfreenow on Oct 24 2011 08:58:50 AM |
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Kriya Yog vs Taoist Yog Nadis/circuits(microcosmic
