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yogani
USA
5241 Posts |
 Posted - May 09 2008 : 12:01:25 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Gnosis
To be honest, I would like to get Yogani's take on this. I have never heard of meditation being used to predict the future with any precision or accuracy. I don't even think you can compare meditation and divination it's like comparing an apple to a screw driver, two completely different things.
Hi Gnosis:
Well, since you asked... 
Nothing that attempts to predict the future in objective terms can be considered to be spiritual practice, regardless of whether it works or not, because all spiritual practice is about living in the continuum of the present. It is fine to read the weather report, but that has little to do with spiritual practices like deep meditation. "Apple versus screw driver," as you say.
Does deep meditation enable us to know the future objectively? No. But deep meditation and related practices do bring the future continuously into our now, meaning, we become harmonized with the flow of karma. Not eliminating karma, but transforming its influence through stillness in action flowing naturally through us. Then there are no threats, no dangers lurking around the corner which we must anticipate. Only the ever-flowing present, and the flow of divine love in the now. In strange (some might say miraculous) ways, seasoned meditators seem to avoid the so-called negatives of life, even when the same things are happening that others may consider negative. The entire perception of life is changed, not able to impinge on who we are -- inner silence. Then we are more able to act in ways that serve the common good, rather than avoid. It is very practical.
A seasoned meditator may lose interest in reading the weather report, because even when it rains the meditator will rarely get wet. And if she does, it will usually be for a good reason, and there will be laughter. That is how it goes. It is a very free life, with minimal calculations. It is also a very responsible approach to life. It takes time in daily sitting practices and in daily activity to gradually cultivate this mode of functioning. It is worth doing.
It is fine to explore divination and such if that is what interests you. Maybe you will tire of it in time. Maybe not. Either way, it has not got much to do with effective spiritual practices, which is what most people are interested in here. To the extent the results of divination distract from spiritual practices and living fully, it can be a liability like any obsession, and that is for you to figure out as you move forward. Time tends to take care of everything, especially for those who meditate.
It is suggested to keep up your daily spiritual practices. That way you get to have your cake and eat it too -- pursuing your present desires, while gradually going beyond them to fulfill your highest ideal. Your spiritual evolution will take care of everything as long as you are cultivating it daily. Do remind yourself every now and then that enlightenment can never be calculated, only cultivated. Enlightenment is the gradual release of calculation, and the natural transcendence of karma.
That is the difference between an apple and a screw driver. Be mindful not to lose one for the sake of the other. 
All the best!
The guru is in you.
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yogibear
409 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2008 : 07:43:06 AM
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Hi Gnosis,
Thanks for the links.
quote:
Shanti wrote:
It is OK to indulge your mind, but just stay open, and you will know when you need to stop taking help of these external crutches. Be open and ready to drop the crutches when your inner guru tells you, "you can walk on your own now".
I think Shanti paraphrased what I said in my last post.
quote:
Gnosis wrote:
Karma is something we all have to deal with, we have committed atrocities in previous lives that we have no knowledge of when they will come back, we never know when our karma will come to fruition and cause suffering, you cannot practice yoga if your karma kills you, how many dead people practice yoga, would you not agree that being alive is essential to practicing yoga?
My understanding is that meditation is one of the most powerful karma burners there is.
quote:
gnosis wrote:
I believe that it is my dharma to be a powerful Magi and yogi
More power to you, gnosis.
quote:
Gnosis wrote:
I think you are stuck on the idea of not using a device
ummmmm.....I don't think so. I hold on tightly but let go lightly when I see that something is better. But I have to really see it before that happens. I keep an open mind but not so open that my brains fall out.
I think we are on the same page, gnosis. One of my favorite quotes is "Using no way as way, having no limitation as limitation. Efficiency is anything that scores."
Whatever works and whatever fits and feels right……for you and for anyone else.
I think AYP is the best. I just love it. It resonates so deeply with me. I can't think of anything in it that I disagree with. I know that other people wouldn’t agree with me because of where they are at in their own personal journey and predilections. It is so individual.
quote:
Gnosis wrote:
Meditation does not lead to enlightenment. Enlightenment leads to enlightenment. You either are, or you aren't. It happens in an instant, there is no in between.
Boy, I don’t think I can agree with that. In my world, meditation leads to enlightenment. It creates the conditions for enlightenment to occur. I think the whole AYP package leads to enlightenment.
But to think like a martial artist, meditation is my main weapon to deliver the knockout punch to my karma. The supporting weapons in my arsenal are hatha yoga, and by that I mean the higher degree of it that Yogani teaches as well as the lower degree, the postures, and Self Inquiry, Karma and Bhakti Yoga. Some might say that devotion is the main weapon.
Ether,
I think there is a static state. I just think that few people have attained it. And that people who think they have are mistaken often times. They may be very high but they have not burned all the seeds in their unconscious and are therefore still within the wheel of their karma and fallible.
So I think that is a permanent achievement. Freedom from the bondage of karma. What there is beyond that I don't know. There could be more. This is my current model, anyways.
Elisabeth Haich gave an interesting explanation of prognostication. She said that someone who can see the future is like a person at the top of a hill in a tower, looking down over a city. From there, they can see that Jack is heading up one street and and Jill is coming up another. From this viewpoint, the person in the tower can see the point at which their two paths will intersect.
Just thought I would throw that in since we are on the topic.
Best, yb.
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Edited by - yogibear on May 13 2008 08:16:55 AM |
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Gnosis
USA
68 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2008 : 1:29:42 PM
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I personally feel that meditation is a tool for spiritual cultivation, just like Yogani said. I am a HUGE fan of meditation, and meditate daily, and have for a very long time.
I am just saying that divination and yoga are not the same at all, and you cannot replace one with the other, it's not possible.
I personally don't feel that meditation leads to enlightenment, I think that enlightenment can happen as a result of meditation, but it's a completely independent phenomena, this is not my belief many great enlightened men like J. Krishnamurti and Huang Po said the same thing. Meditation is important, but it too can be an attachment. Some times people get so caught up on the details of practicing a system, that it can impede enlightenment, a dzogchen monk told me that. He said enlightenment is simple, we make it complicated. Enlightenment is our natural state, meditation helps us to see that, but it doesn't make it happen. Look at how many thousands of people meditate around the world, what percentage of them become enlightened, that's what the monk told me. Eventually even the technique of meditation it self must be shed. He told me when one is able to meditate without meditating, then that's enlightenment.
There are many stories of Zen teachers who are huge on meditation, meditation is basically what Zen is, saying that meditation does not lead to enlightenment, it leads you to the water, but it's up to you to drink or not. These are not my words, but the words of one of the greatest Zen meditators Huang Po, many people meditate their entire lives, and never reach enlightenment, some meditate for a few years, and reach enlightenment, because they understood what meditation was trying to teach them, that enlightenment is our natural state of mind not some altered state of consciousness that we must force on ourselves. When we stop trying, all is accomplished. The art of fighting without fighting is the highest gung fu.
Here is a Zen story:
Ma-Tsu was dedicating himself to the practice of meditation when one day Huai-jang came to Ma-Tsu’s hermitage while Ma-Tsu was mediating and asked him, "What do you seek by doing zazen?" Ma-Tsu said, "I’m seeking to become a Buddha [or I’m trying to get enlightened]." (Why else would he be meditating all day?) So Huai-jang took a tile that had fallen off the roof and began to rub it on a stone in front of the hermitage, imitating Ma-Tsu’s activity. The act of rubbing or polishing represents the cultivation or refining of practice. After awhile, Ma-Tsu asked, "Master, what are you doing?" referring the essential meaning of Huai-jang’s activity. Huai-jang replied, "I’m polishing this tile to make it into a mirror." The mirror represents enlightenment or the still, reflective quality of the mind when it’s free of discursive thought, when it simply reflects things as they are. Ma-Tsu then asked, "How can you make a mirror by polishing a tile?" Huai-jang replied: "How can you make a Buddha by sitting in meditation?"
A Buddha has no fixed form or practice and no fixed principle or formula. Enlightenment is realizing true nature, or essence of mind, not just holding still. It isn’t something we gradually develop over time by refining our zazen (meditation) practice, nor is our practice limited to what happens when we cross our legs. If you leave your practice behind when you stand up after zazen, you are dividing your experience into practice and non-practice. I hope that makes sense.
I personally feel that divination is a tool that can be used by anyone, but like anything, we can easily form an attachment to it, and if that is the case, then it's unhealthy. I believe we can use something, without being used by it.
I see what Yogani is saying, but the Shaolin monks were "seasoned" meditators, and almost all of them were killed but 5 of them when their temple was burned, so meditation is no guarantee that karma won't affect you, it can help, but astrology is a much smarter way. If they had only had astrology like the Tibetans, they could have fled before the impending result, or neutralized the threat some how. The Dalai Lama, is a great advocate of astrology.
I became a student of astrology after reading autobiography of a Yogi, seeing how Sri Yukteshwar saved Yogananda by using an astrological amulet. Maharishi Mahesh, which I am also a huge fan of is a big advocate of using jyotish and yagyas to help create world peace. Meditation is also one of those keys to create harmony and coherence, to stop yourself from creating more bad karma that you have to neutralize with astrology. Meditation is also a way to mitigate karma.
Although all of your comments on this post are well intentioned, it is to say the least a pointless endeavor to speak about a subject that you have little to no experience in. How can you taste my tea, when your cup is already full with your own tea. None of you on this forum have ANY experience with astrology, yet all of you speak as though you are experts in the field, this is not wise to speak on a subject you have completely no experience with. This will be my last post on this topic, as I see now that explaining astrology to a non initiate is like trying to explain colors to a blind man. I am done casting pearls.
It would be better for you to experience the power of astrology, then come back and continue this conversation, until that happens, the point of this debate is fruitless.
Astrology is a science not for predicting the future, but the return of past actions that we set into action in this life or the last. It predicts when past karma will come to fruition and what you can do about it. Sri Yukteshwar was one of the most powerful yogis that ever walked the face of the Earth, and was a firm advocate of jyotish until his mahasamadhi, it didn't serve to distract him in anyway, actually it was the exact opposite.
There is a SECOND side to astrology that deals with remedies. With the proper usage of mantras, particularly astrological mantras, we can neutralize negative karma. One can also use another ancient technique dealing with gems worn touching the skin, creating a bangle called a navaratna that balances the chakras. It is said that gems have a specific electromagnetic frequency that is used to activate different chakras that attract a different set of circumstances to you, it’s like changing the pitch of an instrument.
Indeed one can use yoga through the practice of japa to neutralize negative affects, or increase good effects. There is a whole science behind neutralizing karma from the vedic tradition, it's called a yagya. Astrology is not a doomsday science, rather, it’s a method of transformation similar to yoga, but the transformation occurs on a different level.
Here is a link on how yagyas work, the link below is about how gems work to accelerate spiritual development by balancing the chakras, which actually are our internal zodiac. Astrology is the ancient science that figured out man is the microcosm of the macrocosm by seeing how the Brahamns kalpa moved the stars, and how that’s analogous to the changes within our own being, because we and Brahman are one.
http://maharishi-programmes.globalg...c-astrology/
http://www.astrogems.com/yoga_masters.php |
Edited by - Gnosis on May 09 2008 2:16:57 PM |
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yogani
USA
5241 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2008 : 3:13:04 PM
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Hi Gnosis:
What you may not know is that some with opinions on divination have formed those opinions based on long experience in the same tracks you are mentioning, and more. So what you think you know exclusively may well have been let go (or is still used) by others after much previous exposure. Don't be so quick to rule out other opinions for convenience. Most people here speak from hard-won experience.
One thing is for sure. A sage (or entire tradition) may offer effective knowledge with one hand and not so effective knowledge with the other. It is always going to be a mixed bag. It is up to us to intuit what is true for us and move ahead, leaving the rest behind. This is most effectively done in stillness, which is an important benefit of deep meditation -- the rise of spiritual discrimination. The more we rely on others to make these choices for us, the more stuck and vulnerable we will become. That is not divination -- it is fact.
We can only become self-reliant by cultivating realization of our silent Self. The same will be true for those who come to us for advice, and we have a responsibility to give clear guidance that will minimize codependent relationships.
Realization is not an over-night event. Those who say it is instant are speaking only for themselves (maybe), and certainly not for anyone else. The answer cannot be found in words, books, or calculated opinions. It is within us, and is known in stillness as we advance in practices. In the end, it is an outpouring of divine love that answers all questions before they are asked, which is life in natural flow, always in the present. That is real divination.
Practice wisely, and enjoy!
The guru is in you.
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Suryakant
USA
259 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2008 : 3:22:52 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Gnosis
None of you on this forum have ANY experience with astrology...
I have been practicing astrology for 28 years. |
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Gnosis
USA
68 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2008 : 3:38:55 PM
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That may be the case Yogani, maybe there are people on this forum with years of experience in divination, but the comments that they left are not from someone with years of experience, the comments are that of novices. Even if someone did have experience in a particular style of divination, that cannot speak for all systems. I am not speaking of everybody that is a member of this forum, I am only speaking of those that made comments on astrology thus far. I see that there are people on here that practice astrology like Suryakant. I wasn't speaking of everyone, I meant just the comments that have been left on this thread, thus far. There is no way that I can say no one on this forum practices astrology, as I don't know any of you personally.
There are as many systems of divination as there are systems of spirituality like ayp, kriya, dzogchen, neikung etc..., there is no way that one can speak of the entire scope of every practice of divination, it would take a lifetime to study all the systems. Most people on this forum have little to no experience with true divination, I can tell by their comments that they do not posses deep knowledge on the subject. I have never seen someone truly master astrology and then just throw it away, and start practicing yoga, if anything; they would simply use astrology in conjunction with yoga, as it was intended by the originator of all systems of spirituality, Hermes Trismegistus.
Maybe the experience they had with that particular system did not yield the results that they wanted, so they decided to abandon the entire science, this is throwing the baby out with the bath water. I have never seen or heard anyone master a true system of divination and have to disregard the system, that would be a great disservice to the adept. Spiritualist have been practicing divination since the beginning of time with texts such as the i-ching.
Astrology is no more a distraction from yoga than practicing naturopathic medicine, you would not abandon naturopathic medicine just to study yoga because you can heal the body with yogic practices, you would combine the two, as health is important to practice yoga. Astrology is used to neutralize karma and skillfully navigate along the path of life, I see astrology in no way shape or form a distraction or in replacement of spiritual practices like ayp, they are separate sciences that can be use symbiotic ally to enhance the life of the adept.
Yogani, I have great respect for you, and all the people of this forum, and I apologize if I have disrespected anyone, as that was not my intent. My intent was to share something that is very near and dear to my heart, and it has been met with opposition, so for that reason I will not mention it anymore. I wanted to share this sacred science with the people on this forum to help fulfill their goal of enlightenment, but it seems that anything not having to do with ayp is looked upon a superfluous, without any proper experience or investigation.
"It is only when a traveler has reached his goal that he is justified in discarding his maps. During the journey, he takes advantage of ANY convenient short cut."
-Sri Yukteshwar |
Edited by - Gnosis on May 09 2008 3:47:04 PM |
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Suryakant
USA
259 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2008 : 4:41:38 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Gnosis
I have never seen someone truly master astrology and then just throw it away, and start practicing yoga, if anything; they would simply use astrology in conjunction with yoga, as it was intended by the originator of all systems of spirituality, Hermes Trismegistus.
I began my practice of astrology in 1980. In 1990, I experienced shaktipat initiation and began practicing Kundalini Maha Yoga. My spiritual teachers are from a Hindu tradition that considers jyotish to be an adjunct to spiritual practice. Astrology helps me increase my conscious understanding of samskaras and vasanas.
quote:
Originally posted by Gnosis
Astrology is no more a distraction from yoga than practicing naturopathic medicine, you would not abandon naturopathic medicine just to study yoga because you can heal the body with yogic practices, you would combine the two, as health is important to practice yoga. Astrology is used to neutralize karma and skillfully navigate along the path of life, I see astrology in no way shape or form a distraction or in replacement of spiritual practices like ayp, they are separate sciences that can be use symbiotic ally to enhance the life of the adept.
I agree that astrology, rightly understood, is not a distraction, and has the potential to play a role in widening one's spiritual perspective.
quote:
Originally posted by Gnosis
I wanted to share this sacred science with the people on this forum to help fulfill their goal of enlightenment, but it seems that anything not having to do with ayp is looked upon a superfluous, without any proper experience or investigation.
Even though I am not a practitioner of yogani's AYP system, I have always been welcomed here with kindness, courtesy, and friendship.
quote:
Originally posted by Gnosis
"It is only when a traveler has reached his goal that he is justified in discarding his maps. During the journey, he takes advantage of ANY convenient short cut."
-Sri Yukteshwar
I agree with Sri Yukteswar's opinions regarding astrology. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sri_Yukteswar_Giri
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Gnosis
USA
68 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2008 : 6:20:05 PM
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Thank you for your post. What form of astrology do you practice. I practice medieval astrology from Robert Zoller. I have also studied some of renaissance astrology via William Lilly's Christian Astrology. I am currently work on gettting my Adeptus Medievalis Astrologiae in Robert Zoller predictive medieval astrology mystery school.
I have also received shaktipat from Gurumayi but from the Siddha Yoga tradition. Interesting similarities.
I am not a student of the ayp system, even though I do practice the deep meditation portion of ayp, use it to access the stillness to perform my internal alchemy practices. I consider daoist internal alchemy to be more my style since it's a very balanced systme of fire and water, I heard kundalini maha is a more of a fire path, which I also heard is quite powerful as well.
The tarot deck was my first encounter with divination. I am a student of Michael Tsarions mystery school. From him I learned tarot, numerology, kabbalah, and basic astrology. I am currently advancing my knowledge in predictive medieval astrology, I was going to study jyotish, but I believe medieval astrology is more precise and accurate as far as deductive calculations.
I also practice remote viewing. I am a very very busy person, always researching studying and practicing. I am not as serious with rv as I am with astrology, but I still practice targets 2-4 times a week to develop my skills.
Robert Zoller is a true genius, thank goodness to him for interpreting the works of Guido Bonatti. I may not too long from now want to learn astrological magick to make talismans, I think this is a very interesting aspect of astrology, but I am not sure as of yet, I am already quite busy with what's on my plate right now. Since using the sacred sciences I have generated enough money to not have to work, so I am kind of having a spiritual heyday, practicing and learning what I please. The flood gates have been opened.
I also am a HUGE fan of Sri Kaleshwar's Vaastu and Christian Hummel's Energetic Feng Shui, both of these people have made huge advances in the realm of directionology. I bought Sri Kaleshwar's book Victory through Vaastu and Christian's DIY space clearing, and I am so happy with my new place. Vaastu principles combined with space clearing make for a dwelling the is very well energetically balanced, very conducive to spiritual and magickal practices. |
Edited by - Gnosis on May 09 2008 6:53:46 PM |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2008 : 7:40:22 PM
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Gnosis, the meditation and quotes you speak of are derived primarily from the zen tradition, which often tries to distract the mind so that inner silence will come out. The zen stories are usually of this nature, to make the mind think it just has to let go and enlightenment will be there already.
The type of meditation we do is quite different, even though having a common goal.
The combination of mantra meditation, then pranayama is a more energetic based system, and probably would be more attractive to someone like yourself interested in divination.
in order for enlightenment to occur, one needs more than just being "led to the water". Our nervous systems contain impurities and blockages that must be removed and cleared. This is where the karma is stored that you talk about, and other emotional blocks. The pranayama is quite effective at clearing this, and the mantra meditation twice a day quiets the mind so "inner silence" becomes apparent.
Inner silence is necessary for all kinds of abilities that can't happen with normal consciousness.
This is a very powerful combination, and like your zen quote, there is no division between practice and no practice, as Yogani teaches us to carry what we have gained from practices into the world every day.
Re: the quote about so many people meditating, and who has become enlightened? Actually quite a few people are becoming enlightened all over the world at an increasing rate. The spiritual energy around us is increasing greatly; that's why you will find evidence of this all over the internet as it multiplies.
Don't expect enlightened people to walk around performing miracles; that only happens in legends. Don't get me wrong; they DO perform miracles, but usually they are not meant for the average person to witness. As you become enlightened you see why things are set up this way. When an unenlightened person witnesses a miracle all it does is attract his ego and make him want to be powerful like the person he just witnessed.
But God is interested in people clearing their karma and treating others well, and he couldn't care less about ego boosting stuff. So these enlightened people generally keep a low profile and perform quiet miracles daily. They bask in the great power of God and are awe struck at the power he gives them but in order to keep this state they know they can't get their egos involved.
This is the same reason science doesn't recognize such powers. God doesn't allow them to be performed on cue and repeatedly just so someone can use the scientific method to "prove" something. But he does give the right people the power whenever they NEED it to help others. So he finds enlightened people who are concentrating on helping others, and gives them the power. All the people who are asking God to give them the power first then they will help others, are ignored.
I think it is quite possible that the spectacular miracles in the bible are embellished stories designed to attract people to the church, because I have seen lots of miracles, and they never happen that way! Just my opinion. Of course it's possible that God only wants me to see a certain kind of miracle; I don't know,
but I am always amazed no matter what kind they are. I'm just thankful I get to see such amazing things, then I realize "OMG, that was just for me; nobody else saw that!!" |
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Gnosis
USA
68 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2008 : 9:41:39 PM
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J. Krishnamurti thought the same way as the quotes that I mentioned, and he is not a practitioner of zen.
I do agree that spiritual energy is escalating, and more enlightened people than before. I don't believe the stories in the bible are embellished, they may be allegorical or symbolic in nature.
I will agree practices like zen are very different from energy based systems like yoga, but even Osho agrees with me, meditation does not generate enlightenment, it simply opens the door that allows it to occur, similar to opening a window lets sunlight in, but the window being open does make the sunlight come in, it only opens you up to the opportunity. The light decides to come in of it's own accord. Meditation is more of a skill of allowishing than effort. The taoist call is wu wei, effortless effort. You cannot make your self enlightened, but you can allow it to occur. It is not a daily increase towards spirituality, but a daily decrease away from separation which produces the illusion of egoism.
What I mean is not that meditation doesn't work, it does, it's just when we try to hard, we prevent it from manifesting in our lives. Many people try way to hard to make enlightenment happen, it will not work, I hope that clears up some confusion.
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Edited by - Gnosis on May 09 2008 9:54:11 PM |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - May 10 2008 : 12:11:04 AM
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Gnosis said:
but even Osho agrees with me, meditation does not generate enlightenment
I don't know anyone anywhere who believes meditation 'generates' enlightenment, so I don't know who is being disagreed with, if anyone. It's more like a catalyst, and works best as a sustained catalyst. A catalyst in a chemical reaction never changes the product of the reaction -- it just speeds it up.
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Gnosis
USA
68 Posts |
Posted - May 10 2008 : 01:51:39 AM
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| I simply mean that you can't make yourself enlightened with meditation, so much as you allow your self to be enlightened, there is a big difference. Generate was not the right word, sorry for the confusion. |
Edited by - Gnosis on May 10 2008 02:33:57 AM |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - May 10 2008 : 7:58:57 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by david_obsidian
I don't know anyone anywhere who believes meditation 'generates' enlightenment, so I don't know who is being disagreed with, if anyone. It's more like a catalyst, and works best as a sustained catalyst. A catalyst in a chemical reaction never changes the product of the reaction -- it just speeds it up.
Absolutely, and like many catalytic reactions used in industry, without the catalyst the reaction would be so darned slow that it just doesn't seem to work at all.
I can't believe that gurus who claim to be enlightened are telling people they don't need to take action to become enlightened. meditation and spinal breathing are incredibly effective "catalysts". |
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Gnosis
USA
68 Posts |
Posted - May 10 2008 : 11:35:24 PM
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Etherfish, you are misinterpreting what the masters are saying. They are not saying don't meditate. They are just saying that you can't force yourself to be enlightened with meditation, people tend to try and do that, that is not the way.
Yes meditation and different energy training methods like spinal breathing, microcosmic orbit etc... do act as a catalyst, but they are tools to allow enlightenment to manifest. You could practice meditation your whole life trying to force enlightenment, it will not happen. These exercises are designed to cleanse the nadis and chakras to ALLOW the enlightened energy to be sustained within the body. It's not so much that these tools build up to enlightenment, rather it is more that the inessentials are removed through meditation and energy exercises to allow the seed of enlightenment to sprout. The usefulness of a cup is it's emptiness. We are the cup, and enlightenment is the beverage, we have to clear everything out of the way, to create a spot for enlightenment to take seat.
If we practice meditation and alchemy diligently, it helps to allow this enlightened consciousness take place. Truth be told, we are already enlightened, but we are in a state of forgetting. These techniques allow us to remember our true nature. These techniques are not designed to sustain a altered state of consciousness, rather they are designed to allow for a clearer perception without being tainted by our ego. The ego knows only separation, and with these techniques we can shatter that belief in separation, and return to our sovereign and integrated state that we always were.
Meditation allows for this inner light to shine out, not just during meditation, but into the world. We have to practice spreading love in every second of everyday, to everyone. This is a secret of yoga. Carry that love you feel during meditation into the world. No sense in meditating, and then stopping and bringing discordant energies to our fellowman, enlightenment will not manifest that way.
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - May 11 2008 : 03:39:59 AM
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About using cards... If it's not a beneficial tool in the long run for our own spiritual development, I have at least found it very efficient and helpful when helping others on their way. If I sense what their problem is I can try to tell them, but they will not always be ready to listen. They will not believe that what I say is "true about them" but rather some "everyday psychological truths that would fit anyone" - and of course it does not apply to them at the moment. In such cases, using the cards are great. I hold the energies, and then THEY pick the cards, and the cards always extremely accurate pinpoint their problem, which brings them astonished. They often say "I knew deep down this is true, but if you had told me this I would have denied it. Now I know this is no mumbojumbo coming from YOU: You are not telling me what the cards mean. They speak for themselves". From there I can pick up and start guiding them with The Work formula that almost always brings them to tears, relief and making amends with whomever is concerned.
Three couples I know, on the verge of breaking up/getting divorced, have been helped by this procedure, and many others have become curious about spirituality since they see it's "working". So I'd say cards definitely have their place in this mystery.
And, Gnosis, I also think this shows that I may be a total beginner at cards, and don't know very much about tarot at all... it still works great. The Self communicates via the cards without me having to do anything, so... what has my knowledge got to do with it anyway? 
PS: Lovely post above, by the way about meditation, Gnosis! |
Edited by - emc on May 11 2008 03:40:39 AM |
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Gnosis
USA
68 Posts |
Posted - May 12 2008 : 6:25:24 PM
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EMC, I think that it's great that you have had success with the cards, how ever I strongly recommend that you learn how to use the tarot deck properly.
The tarot deck is an immeasurably powerful and sacred tool. It goes all the way back to ancient Egypt, the birthplace of spiritual knowledge. The Magi of old not only possessed deep experience with meditation and different systems of internal alchemy, they also possessed a powerful knowledge of the cosmology and cosmogony of the world we live in. The tarot is one of the first tools designed for depth psychology.
We are an amalgamation between spirit and matter. It is essential that we know both the inner and outer knowledge for a whole brained holistic approach. Yoga is the science of the soul, but magick is the science of the universe or Adam Kadman also known as the universal self.
We all have an inner guru or Atman, but magick puts us in contact with the intelligence that runs this universe also known as the Tao. In order to live in this world we have to come in direct contact with this intelligence to learn rightful living. Things like astrology, vaastu, space clearing, , vegetarianism, yoga etc... are tools to understand the macro and microcosmic man and perpetuate rightful living.
"The tarot and the zodiac are not external phenomena, they are not out there, and should be considered living essences or archetypes within each individual. You are a living, breathing zodiac."
Michael Tsarion
The zodiac is not only an external phenomena, it is an internal one as well. The 12 signs of the zodiac relate to the 6 chakras within the body, remember we are created in Gods image. There are 7 chakras total, but the 7th is above the head also known as the Ka or Atman.
The 6 spinal centers are dual fold in nature due to the law of gender, so that means 12 in total. The tarot deck is a way to access the internal zodiac and get you into direct contact with your higher self. The ancient term for consulting the tarot oracle was known as communion with the holy guardian angel, it was an immensely powerful rite of passage in the days of Egypt.
Tools like the tarot deck were designed to perpetuate psychic sovereignty, so you don't need a Guru, Priest, Bible etc.... In life we have so many questions the beset us each day. What is the purpose of my life, why am I here, where am I going. The tarot deck is the original emerald tablets of Hermes, the book of life, and the sacred mirrors of the soul. Once in contact with our inner oracle, we can proceed in life in a fashion that is free from the ignorance that hinders most people, and creates tremendous amounts of wastage, pain, and suffering that creates more negative thought patterns within. We all go to elders and people of experience to make important decisions everyday, why not ask the most ancient and wisest of persons, your own higher self.
We all agree that the spiritual sciences like yoga are essential tools for rightful living. No one disagrees with the studying of the anatomy, physiology, diet etc..., to understand it's mechanisms to create better health. Everyone has seen the resurrection of mysticism under the guise of quantum physics. By studying the universe, they realized something special, that we are all connected, and we are all one. And even though this knowledge does not bring enlightenment, it brings hope to those who view the universe as a very cold place as it can be sometimes when we do not have the appropriate guides.
The tarot deck helps to facilitate a meeting with the divine intelligence known as the Tao. Once we are in step with the tao, life becomes exceedingly easier, and your movements are so efficient, that it makes the choices of other seem disconnected and sordid. When using powerful tools like magick, yoga, and astrology, your life comes alive, and you will just look like and extremely blessed person, little do they know that you walk with God, using the knowledge of the universe as your guide. True skill comes without effort, but it takes hard work to get to this level, hence the paradox of life.
I can honestly say that even though the mystery school seems expensive, not having this knowledge is even more expensive. There is no need to walk through life ignorant and unsure of your purpose or what you should do next, with these tools, you remove the darkness from your life, and life becomes constant unfoldment of the divine, rather than the alternative which most people live in. They are disconnected and tools like yoga and divination put us back on track. I can't even begin to explain how powerful your life becomes when you combine divination with yoga, it's a true blessing.
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