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VIL
USA
586 Posts |
 Posted - Apr 15 2008 : 2:53:20 PM
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Hey, emc, sorry, I don't recall the name, it was from an interpersonal communications course I took in college years ago:
VIL |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Apr 15 2008 : 3:58:56 PM
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Oh, oh... look at this (bold made by me)! I found it when I added a note in an old topic. Yogani has already given me the answer... just wasn't ready to take it in! THANK YOU, YOGANI!!! 
quote:
You are really talking about "automatic yoga," which tends to happen more for some folks than for others. It is a karmic thing and it can make the journey seem a bit more complicated while figuring out what to do (if anything) about all the experiences that are going on. But the underlying mechanics of purification and opening are the same for everyone, so it boils down to navigation. Not always easy with so much going on. At the same time, it is very easy as long as we are favoring our center in stillness , including the means that reliably establish us there. All the rest is, yes, scenery!
/http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....page=2#29598
VIL, okidoki! |
Edited by - emc on Apr 15 2008 3:59:26 PM |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Apr 16 2008 : 12:23:13 AM
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Lot's of great perspectives in this thread. I don't see it as being in our best interests to view pain as something that is to be avoided at all costs or exclusively as something that is negative in life. Pain is a positive message to change. Of course I'm not suggesting leaving our hand in a fire or not doing what we can to avoid imminent danger, but when we are in pain, we can be sure that change is imminent or already happening.
When I do exercise and I feel pain from my efforts, I know my body is changing, improving. When I feel pain from going over in practices, I self-pace and remember that the pain is a sign of change and purification taking place, makes it easier to accept. I remember complaining to Miguel Ruiz at a retreat of his that all the energy was burning and he looked at me and said “good, then let it burn”.
Without pain there wouldn't be a lot of motivation (movement) to change. Pain is a blessing in life, if we look for its message. |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4513 Posts |
Posted - Apr 17 2008 : 4:51:51 PM
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Hi emc,
I don’t really understand all this advanced level self-pacing stuff, but I feel like you may have missed something in the basic self-pacing process.
In the basic process, if you feel uncomfortable during the day because of your spiritual practices, then you should cut back on practices (starting with the most recently added practice if you added one recently). If you still feel uncomfortable then you should cut back more, and if necessary stop practices altogether for a time. This would include all spiritual practices such as reading spiritual books, listening to beautiful music, watching a sunset in rapture, or going to Ki-Aikido or Tai Chi classes. Then, when you feel a sense of stability has returned, you can start adding practices again slowly, and build up over time (weeks or months if necessary), making sure that you are stable before adding more.
I don’t agree with what has been written above about using Samadhi (in any way), or using silence as methods for reducing overload symptoms. In my experience this only makes things worse.
I have a feeling that you are cutting back on some spiritual practices, but not on all and then are wondering why you stay on the edge of overload constantly, giving rise to feelings of fear.
I hope that helps
Christi
p.s. Some smileys from my daughter (age 5)
  
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Edited by - Christi on Apr 17 2008 4:55:00 PM |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Apr 18 2008 : 07:29:19 AM
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It seems to be two distinctly different approaches here. I have always seen it the way you explain it, Christi... and... now it seems as if something new is on its way... Some sort of dizzy shift where stillness is no longer something overwhelming, but rather a constant base bringing no harm - it's my resistance and attempts to get away from it (from fear of overload) that causes symptoms... I don't know. This discussion just altered my approach to overload symptoms. In fact, it's much more in accordance to what I wrote after the retreat. Read for example these posts:
quote:
So what is grounding really? I begin to believe it is something for the body-mind vehicle, not for my real self. Just as overload symptoms is only attached to the identity of ego. As soon as ego goes, overload symptoms go.
http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....D=2395#25223
quote:
(I have come to realize that it's only the ego that has overload symptoms, headaches, heat etc. Staying in the presence gives no symptoms at all. I feel that quite clearly when I flip-flop in and out of time. Heat and headaches disappear in an instant when I become real and true.)
http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....D=2794#24891
I just somehow kept my old attitude towards overload symptoms since these posts above didn't receive any response or confirmation at all!!! So I trusted this non-response and interpreted that as if it was not quite right, and slowly dropped it... I've always been falling into this trap of listening more to others whom I think have authority instead of listening to my inner guru....
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Edited by - emc on Apr 18 2008 07:38:23 AM |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4513 Posts |
Posted - Apr 18 2008 : 1:22:32 PM
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Hi emc,
Well, I am always open to new things... but I'd rather you tried it first and then let me know!
Why not try just falling into the silence and stillness and have no resistance at all to any overload symptoms and see how it goes for a while? Then if it works and the headaches and the itching go, let me know, and I'll try it too.
Actually I do thingk there is some truth in the idea that if we have no resistance to pain then we don't experience it as pain. But getting to the point of having no resistance to extreme pain can take time... and practice!
Good luck.
Christi |
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Steve
277 Posts |
Posted - Apr 18 2008 : 1:33:19 PM
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Hi emc and Christi,
And maybe your both right ha..ha like the old Doublemint chewing gum commercial.
Just a maturation of the self-pacing process as inner silence grows and becomes stabilized ... no different from relational and non-relational self-inquiry. One can worsen the situation and the other improve it, vice versa ... depending on ...
Love and Light,
Steve |
Edited by - Steve on Apr 18 2008 1:37:29 PM |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Apr 18 2008 : 4:25:56 PM
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Christi, I'd be glad to go first and be the guinea pig! What I have noticed only during these days is an increased relaxation and sense of "being home" again. Itching is bearable and not so much in focus - I'm letting the root chakra expand, and it is closely connected to earth on every inhale.
You wrote:
"I have a feeling that you are cutting back on some spiritual practices, but not on all"
Since January I haven't attended my qi gong or aikido classes (more than once to do the "trial and error"-journey back and see where it lead). I have noticed I am drawn out of meditation after shorter time now. I only do max 5 min pranayama (without rootlock, and sambhavi occurring only now and then), and often 10 min, max 15 min meditation, and 1 rep samyama in mornings and 2 reps in evenings. That's all. I have NEVER even tried sidhasana, chin lock or pump or whatever... I don't even know what it is! I tried the mantra enhancement for a couple of days in what... November???... and quit that almost immediately!!! I honestly don't know what to cut back on. I could quit samyama, but I have been stable in that over several months now, and I don't think that's what causing the overload.
I think it was the ki-aikido classes during the Autumn that slowly built up this last overload, shown by increasing automatic breath suspensions in and out of practices, and that build up exploded in January.
Now things are getting smoother and smoother. Still, my ideas and fear of how overload works probably added to it! And it's those ideas I'm getting sorted out here with a little help from my dear forum friends. Thank you all! There's a dropping of ideas here... We'll see if it increases or decreases symptoms... |
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Steve
277 Posts |
Posted - Apr 18 2008 : 5:03:08 PM
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Hi Emc,
I love the way you just put it out there, your frankness and honesty. I have found that as I let go of my fears, ideas and concepts, it is tantamount to 'trusting more'. This letting go and trusting lets one's inner guru, the inherent intelligence in the energy and the direct help from Divine Source work much better. It does not have as much of our self-imposed limitations, restrictions (ie. resistance) to get through.
By asking the question and getting all the wonderful feedback from your forum friends, it helped put your mind at ease and remove the edge from some of your fears. Fear is powerful and can really shutdown our God-given operating system. Trust and Love are its anecdotes. We are fortunate to have our friends and support here on the forum. If you begin to fear, remember the best is offered to us in each moment ... we are loved completely ... if we just get out of the way and let it happen.
Please keep us informed of your progress. Thanks sweet Heart of the Divine Source.
Love and Light,
Steve |
Edited by - Steve on Apr 18 2008 5:09:35 PM |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4513 Posts |
Posted - Apr 19 2008 : 10:43:40 AM
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Hi emc
quote:
I only do max 5 min pranayama (without rootlock, and sambhavi occurring only now and then), and often 10 min, max 15 min meditation, and 1 rep samyama in mornings and 2 reps in evenings. That's all.
That doesn’t sound like self pacing to me... that sounds like my normal practice! But hey... each to their own.
I know I sound like old school, but I still think if I was over so much that I was getting headaches, I would cut right back to like nothing for a few days until the headaches are gone, and then build up from there again. A few times I have had headaches turn into that experience where it feels like someone has an iron band around your forehead and they are tightening it slowly with a screw. Once it gets to that, it isn’t so easily managed by self pacing.
But I don’t want to put the fear in you... just some friendly advice.
Christi
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Apr 19 2008 : 11:38:11 AM
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You may be right... My experience this time, though, was that I could keep my practices and instead add more grounding activities and cut all extras from other systems (+ all things you listed above, like reading stuff etc etc) and that seemed to be enough this time. It is getting much better! The strange bleedings have stopped, the body temperature is getting better, eczemas come and go, but show up more seldom now. Since I let the root chakra expand it has not come again!!! But that's only a few days, so I won't scream HI before I'm over the stream, as we say in Sweden!
I really appreciate your friendly advice, and if I go into an overload again I'll definitely consider diminishing AYP practices more. I have noticed though, that they diminish by themselves gradually. I am automatically "taken out" of meditation quicker and quicker. Starting with 20 min regularly at the start some 1,5 years ago is now down in mostly 10-12 min, on a few occasions 15 min. Seems like a natural decrease happening... |
Edited by - emc on Apr 19 2008 11:39:47 AM |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Apr 22 2008 : 3:57:05 PM
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It's like there's this huge friendly wave coming to carry me... No signs of more overload yet. I continue walking a lot, exercise as much as I can, do some dirty work for others, particularly helping out more at work... and it's like... all the tension I had was due to an attempt to HOLD BACK this wave... because I was afraid it could burn me, afraid I could have no control over it. These last days after the release of the pressure have only been flow... involuntarily smiling, particularly when getting a glimpse of my face in a mirror. My eyes shine and the lips just form the biggest smile! Lots of 'magical' funny things happen... In short, there's a huge opening!
I remember Meg told me once that "the mindy, tough periods are when the real work is done - the flow afterwards is only the resting time, the reward" It seems to be something like that! A lot more activity in the crown than before, and for the first time I have started to get glimpses of awareness during sleep! More visions and inner scenery whenever I close my eyes.
So far, so good. We'll see if this massive opening will bring more overload, or if it will stabilize and bring a more consistently centered stillness and simplicity and joy to my life. Very new to me to feel this inner joy, particularly when socializing with others, which normally is more of a duty than a pleasure to me! I get spontaneously happy over things I have never enjoyed before. At the moment negativity is far away.
PS: I suddenly got the gospel "Joshua fought the battle of Jericho" in my head...
Joshua fought the battle of Jericho,
Jericho, Jericho,
Joshua fought the battle of Jericho,
And the walls came tumblin' down.
You may talk about your kings of Gideon,
You may talk about your men of Saul,
There's none like good old Joshua
At the battle of Jericho.
Up to the walls of Jericho,
He marched with spear in hand.
"Go blow those ram horns",
Joshua cried,
"'Cause the battle is in my hand".
Then the lam'ram, sheep horns
Began to blow,
Trumpets began to sound,
Joshua commanded the children to shout,
And the walls came tumblin' down.
That morning
Joshua fought the battle of Jericho,
Jericho, Jericho,
Joshua fought the battle of Jericho,
And the walls came tumblin' down. |
Edited by - emc on Apr 22 2008 4:01:58 PM |
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Steve
277 Posts |
Posted - Apr 22 2008 : 4:33:54 PM
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Hi emc, quote:
I remember Meg told me once that "the mindy, tough periods are when the real work is done - the flow afterwards is only the resting time, the reward"
I don't disagree but I would say that the flow is more than a resting time and reward.
When we don't fear, when we are in the flow, even better when we are also within the Heart and let the Love work that IS the time when the real work is done and done at its best without resistance. During the mindy, tough periods real work is done, but a good portion of the 'mindy' and 'tough' can be directly attributable to our resistance (fears, trying, holding, blocking, etc.) ... As you have communicated without the resistance, it's like "this huge friendly wave coming to carry me..."
Amazing amounts of 'real work' can be accomplished through us ... on us ... in a short period of time when we are in the flow, trusting and allowing the Love to work. And it can actually be enjoyed as attested to by your involuntary smiling and shining eyes. That's the optimal way, it's done in joy and letting go.
Of course, there are also times when cleansing takes place and our resistance does surface (maybe due to the amount of cleansing, or a pattern we are holding onto and not ready to let go, or someone we don't want to forgive, etc, etc, etc.). For whatever reason in that moment we cannot let go completely and 'just' let the Love work without interfering with the process. We come out of the flow and joy. At those times energy overload is real and can be amplified even more by our interference so Yogani's self-pacing guidelines take precedence to help cover us until we can move back into the flow and joy. quote:
I get spontaneously happy over things I have never enjoyed before. At the moment negativity is far away.
Somebody's in their Heart... 
Really happy to hear of the progress you are making ... and having fun too ... yahoooooooo  
Love and Light,
Steve |
Edited by - Steve on Apr 22 2008 5:18:28 PM |
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Apr 22 2008 : 4:39:09 PM
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Hi emc
That's great
I hear you singin'
quote:
We'll see if this massive opening will bring more overload, or if it will stabilize and bring a more consistently centered stillness and simplicity and joy to my life.
Well....from what I can tell from your current state.....which is all there is at any time really......then there will be nothing to see ahead. You are now - right now - centered, and you are right now singing because there is simplicity and joy.....so just enjoy
HERE NOW |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Apr 27 2008 : 03:56:18 AM
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Steve and Katrine, thanks!
It is interesting. What happens is that I naturally fall back into unawareness when life becomes stressful enough to make me forget the stillness, and then some itching starts on inside thighs... which becomes a great reminder. And what I do then is to let the root chakra expand. I feel I'm holding a tension in my PC-muscle and my buttocks, and when I just relax and let that tension go... the energy chooses to expand outwards in a circle around me and downwards not upwards! Like connecting with Earth, bringing a cool calmness, instead of sending a hot wave up my spine as often has been the case otherwise! And the itching stops directly! Very interesting.
Another interesting thing that works is prayer at bedtime. Prayer without trying to control or wish or expect anything, just putting it out there. I usually pray for cleansing of heavy energies and release of cords from others. As Louis suggested, I have added a prayer for balance in my energies and peace instead of more energies. When I come to the balance part... I get a direct response where energy goes from chakra to chakra top to bottom sort of checking the power - getting different amplitude responses from them, some are stronger than others - and in the end it's like an evening out, a hand stroking the energies to even out through the whole chakra system! Very comfortable and the night is totally free from itching! |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Apr 28 2008 : 3:51:12 PM
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I'm glad I have started to overcome my neuroticism! This might have scared me otherwise: A few days ago my skull cracked open!
I had an early experience of my spine "cracking open" - a very intense sensation, which I only just briefly mentioned here:
http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....page=3#19745
Now the same sensation came, but it was my skull, from the ajna to the opposite point of the back of the skull, that "cracked open" with a distinct sound and feeling... it's followed by more crown activity than usual.
Let's see where it goes from here.... |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - May 03 2008 : 5:36:53 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by emc
Now the same sensation came, but it was my skull, from the ajna to the opposite point of the back of the skull, that "cracked open" with a distinct sound and feeling... it's followed by more crown activity than usual.
emc, remember to open.. let the energy flow.. just like you did with the root. |
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emc
2072 Posts |
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Selfpacing and Neuroticism
