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Eddie33
USA
120 Posts |
 Posted - Oct 25 2007 : 11:41:15 AM
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I was here a while back and i posted under a different name. it might have said Eddie in it i don't even remember..
Anyway, at the time I came in I had just got back from Ramamna Ashram where I'd literally spent the whole week saying who am i as much as I can. So i got here and i have to admit i think I was kind of manic.
Well, I think I'm one of those people who try to do self-inquiry too soon, lol. It's produced kind of a I NEED IT reaction in all areas of my life. I think I'm starting to come to terms with the fact that I'm just not gonna get it.
If there's one thing I told myself from day 1 is that I Don't Know and that pretty mcuh where I'm still at. Sometime even the words subjective and objective don't make much sense to me. I'm kind of used to feeling confused. But part of me still can say that I benefited from this whole experience. It's brung out skepticism in me that I really think could serve me some value in the future. Also I've read A LOT.
But I on about it which I don't feel like. What i jsut wanted to really say is that I'm back and I'm here to stay. I've been reading the posts again and I like what i see. Doing some asanas and spinal breathing which is feeling really good to me.
And thanks to Yogani for makign this rediculously beneficial site.
Seeya |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Oct 25 2007 : 11:50:04 AM
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Hi Eddie
Welcome back.
Are you including the Deep Meditation in your programme?
Louis |
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anthony574
USA
549 Posts |
Posted - Oct 25 2007 : 1:14:37 PM
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"I don't know". there really is something magical in that as well, don't you think?
When I got onto the path via entheogens a year or so ago I too was very eager to pierce through the wall of ego and illusion...but then when I would via a premature entheogenic-spiritual experience or spontaneously find my ego dead, it would really be too soon and I would find myself scrambling to pick up te pieces of my identity again. It can be dangerous to try to force a break with your identity and lead you into the dark road of spirituality...schizophrenia and the like. Just trust in the process and that it will be revealed to you ever so slowly.
I found Herman Hesse's Siddhartha and Steppenwolf to be a great counsel in these matters. |
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Victor
USA
910 Posts |
Posted - Oct 25 2007 : 1:52:15 PM
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Welcome back Eddie, and as Jack Kerouac once said:
"walking on water wasn't built in a day" |
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Eddie33
USA
120 Posts |
Posted - Oct 25 2007 : 3:08:39 PM
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Thanks guys
I don't have the deep meditation booklet yet. I think I'm gonna do it primary and just fallow my breath as a secondary method. I need to "clear my mind' first so i can start thinking better. You know in zen they sometimes say that you have to approach the path with an equal amount of doubt and faith. WELl so far the doubt side has been in full control. I feel like i can doubt wearing clothes. Everything turns into a struggle with hthis type of mentality. Why this why that? It's endless really. Any cognition turns into another story that inevitably "isn't reality" . So I'm almost kind of lost. Nothing makes sense sometimes.
BUt on the other hand I do experience these apparent awareness expansions that sem to be stabilizing. For instance my senses are becoming more and more all-embracive. Like the way i generally percieve is changing. Is it good is it bad I don't know.
Right now my mentality is to kind of go through my spiritual quest from the begining and this time take it slow. This time i want to throuroghly not know stuff, lol, and paraoxically know all the steps that got me there.
I've always had kind of an all-inclusive attitude. I think in the end everything comes together in some kind of way. Which is another reason why I like Yogani because he seems to draw from all traditions, although some in small ways. One of my "goals" that linger around somewhere in my awareness is to make kind of "History of Consciouness" book before i die. Kind of like Ken Wilbur except easier to understand and hopefully better,:P
I have Siddhartha but i definitley gotta check out steppenwolfe
thanks guy |
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Richard
United Kingdom
857 Posts |
Posted - Oct 25 2007 : 3:17:03 PM
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Hi Eddie welcome back to the forum
I hope you are doing deep meditation as part of you programme it really is the keystone of AYP practices and the benefits are extraordinary. Nice to have you back with us keep posting 
HI again we crossed over with our posts there 
here is a link to some info on Yogani's deep meditation lessons and some threads on the forum
http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....ID=2158#2158
Hope this helps |
Edited by - Richard on Oct 25 2007 6:55:41 PM |
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Eddie33
USA
120 Posts |
Posted - Oct 25 2007 : 4:40:22 PM
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ok ok i'm gonna do it. it will be my main thing. the way i see it with holding ont just the breath it allows your mind some leeway. it's tougher in a sense to keep the breath because the thoughts can go anywhere. where with the mantra it kind of neutralizes thoughts because the mantra resonates even at the back of your awareness.
something like that |
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anthony574
USA
549 Posts |
Posted - Oct 25 2007 : 7:33:54 PM
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I found today a separation of breath and mantra. What I mean is that I was doing spinal breathing and it was particularly deep, usually it is most visualization. I went on to meditation, but found that spinal breathing seemed to want to continue on. I went with it a minute or so, but knew I should go on to meditation but found that when I focused on the breath to clear my mind it kept me in "ecstatic mode" whereas I was trying to go to "silence mode", which at this early point in practice should be kept or is kept seperate. I guess this is why Yogani advises against focusing on breath because it mixes energy work with silence work.
Eh, whatever works... |
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Eddie33
USA
120 Posts |
Posted - Oct 26 2007 : 1:24:28 PM
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for me a big thing is since i have a lot of thoughts and attachments i assume that i need to release them somehow. So i get stuck in deciding whether or not the I AM mantra is the best for bringing the thoughts into conscious awareness so the can be discarded. The breathawareness seems to be a better way to notice thoughts. But then again the mantra prevents you from getting lost in thoughts better.
just gonna stick with the mantra though |
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scottfitzgerald
USA
65 Posts |
Posted - Oct 27 2007 : 11:31:26 AM
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Hi there all, maybe a few posts this time around. Been watching a long time, and of course started out reading all of Yogani's posts through the years...blessed enough to have been the geeky radio guy who did some of the Yogani radio interviews that are posted on the AYP site. Wish they could have gone on longer, alas the mighty dollar and greedy large corporations got in the way of that. Would love to figure out a way to continue them, however with the tools available on the net now, YouTube etc, there is less need for a commercial outlet to air Yogani.
With that said, I have been doing deep meditation for a few years now, as well as pranyama and both inner silence and EC are growing.
My question is, I really feel a disconnect from my body as most of the work is done in the head. Any thoughts on how to connect with the body so that can eventually be transcended? Or is that what asanas are supposed to do, and my laziness in that area is finally calling to me loudly?
Love the stuff here, and truly enjoy the sincere lack of ego and how many people are here to help. Thanks very much, and hope I have something to add as we flow along here.
Scott
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yogani
USA
5201 Posts |
Posted - Oct 27 2007 : 12:30:29 PM
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Hi Scott, and welcome!
Well, now that you have confessed to being the radio guy, let me offer a big thank you for those interviews, which can be found linked in the upper right corner of this page. A big thank you also to Will Brashear of the Cincinnati Yoga School, who conceived and sponsored the radio show, "Yoga - The Other Ninety-Eight Percent." An apt title for sure.
I hope the show comes back someday. It was a lot of fun. On this end, it also led directly to the AYP Enlightenment Series AudioBooks, so the audio lives on!
Regarding being up in the head after practices, if asanas (postures) are not your thing (some are encouraged as preparation for sitting practices), there are other ways to deal with energy blockage in the head. We call it "grounding" around here. It is about getting involved in physical and external activities, whether it be a regular exercise program, digging in the garden, volunteering for your favorite cause, whatever you enjoy that is not internal activity. Such activities help stabilize what we gain in our daily practices. Yoga isn't just about inner purification and opening. It is also about getting out there and giving it all away in daily activity. Very important. This is how the results of practices become stabilized in daily life, so we see steadily increasing "stillness in action" as we go about our daily business.
Chin pump (dynamic jalandhara) is also very good for bringing energy down from the head, though there can be more stimulation of energy with that also. It is for those well-established in deep meditation and spinal breathing pranayama, preferably with some ecstatic conductivity coming up. Chin pump really shines in that situation, literally.
If there is some inertia in the body that seems to be causing a separation, it could be a "kapha" imbalance, and it is suggested to check the ayurveda diet guidelines here, or for more detail, check the appendix in the Diet, Shatkarmas and Amaroli book.
If nothing seems to be working to bring the energy down (getting the whole body involved) and there is ongoing discomfort or strain, it may be time to self-pace, scale back on practices a bit until balance returns, and then creep back up with practices as comfortable. And, of course, always take adequate rest before getting up from spinal breathing pranayama and deep meditation. This is the first, and most important, step in transitioning from practice sessions to activity.
There are additional methods for grounding that come from the Taoist system. A daily routine of Tai Chi or QiGong can help a lot. "Jim and his Karma" is our resident expert on integrating more focused Taoist methods with AYP for aiding with the kind of blockage you are describing. Maybe he will add a few words. You can find some of his thoughts on this here: http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....D=2395#25244
Sooner or later, all the answers will be there for you. Keep knocking, and the doors will open.
All the best!
The guru is in you.
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Eddie33
USA
120 Posts |
Posted - Oct 29 2007 : 4:27:50 PM
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| good radio guy |
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Jim and His Karma
2111 Posts |
Posted - Nov 11 2007 : 2:32:40 PM
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Scott, remember, first, that energy follows attention. I bet you are focusing attention on your head (likely between brows) during practices. Try not doing that. If you have to place your attention somewhere, direct it to your chest. But better to just opt out of any point of attention, let yourself go into a sort of "brain fart" mode, and just let the practices do you. Let the Cosmic Barber trim your hair! Anyway, I have a feeling that moving your point of attention during practices off of the head area will fix the problem for you. If not, try lots of walking. That's the time-honored yogic solution.
If you try those steps and still feel that spacy-headedness, do take a look at my posting which Yogani linked to, at http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....D=2395#25244
....but if the more generalized suggestions, above, fix the problem, no need to resort to that heavier artillery.
Finally, know that this is a Good sign, though something you need to "handle". Most people have trouble getting energy to their head in the first place. Of course, some of us manage to do so, then realize we should have been more careful what we wished for! Only joking...it's worth it, and there ARE ways to keep the energy from pooling there. Please keep posting and let us know about your progress and whether you have any questions.
As for radio, have you considered the Podcast Network? thepodcastnetwork.com
Hey, we'd all listen in.... |
Edited by - Jim and His Karma on Nov 11 2007 2:35:36 PM |
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Eddie33
USA
120 Posts |
Posted - Nov 11 2007 : 5:00:28 PM
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aziz kristof talks about the head space and the third eye as the center of awareness. this is nothing new. he talks about the presence there and then says that intelligence is a "dynamic extension" off of that awareness. this also makes sense because usually people who think excessivly have there center of there identity located in there head, hence the phrase "stuck in my head" (i speak form experience, lol)..
anyway, for further talk abotu this, you can externally try to manipulate your experience to get yourself out of your head by breathing into your heart, walking, basically just shifting you awareness to other biological centers which then in turn slows down and changes the quality of thought. that's cool to do but i also suggest at the same time trying to make some kind of sense out of your thinking. your mostly in your head because there's some kind of "problem" that needs to be solved or something to correct or whatever needs to be looked at differently, there can be many umm so-called reasons that you are stuck in your head as the human psyche is pretty darn complex...
as for the best of the overall methods that i recomend is this thing called focusing that i discovered. it's great because it deals with body and mind simultneously. i made a post about it not to long ago, http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....OPIC_ID=3058
or you can check out
http://www.focusingresources.com/index.html
it's basically listening to physical symptoms to try and see what they are trying to tell you. this way it cuts out of a lot of unnesecary assumptions that you can easily tell yourself and get confused. i can talk forever on matters like this so i'll stop now.
take it easy |
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Jim and His Karma
2111 Posts |
Posted - Nov 11 2007 : 10:16:55 PM
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Just to add on to my prior posting: asanas would help, especially standing postures, which are grounding. But if you do asanas while "living" in your ajna (third eye, between brows), that will just exacerbate the problem.
A bit of self-inquiry may help....are you your head? Are you your brain? Is that where "you" live? Is that even where your thoughts live? Couldn't you just as easily have the narration of your mind stem from your elbow, or even from across the room? Feel the answer....intuit it, rather than think about it. If you feel a release, try shmearing it around a bit.
The point is to get yourself to stop considering the pumpkin on your shoulders to be where you are. When you're no longer Being from that arbitrary vantage point, there'll be less feeling of separateness between head and body (I know just what you mean, btw). Again, if you need to have a specific vantage point, take it to your chest for a while. Think in your heart. Speak and act from your heart. Live there. Even have the five senses tie in there. It sounds VERY mystical, I know, but you'll be surprised how easy it is to transfer the vantage point. Why is that? Because your consciousness is everywhere and nowhere, so whichever point you locate it is as good as any other! :)
Hope that wasn't baffling...
Oh, and if you do manage to relocate your vantage point, then DEFINITELY hardcore asana practice would be a great thing to meld everything together again. Great BKS Iyengar quote: "Before [hatha] yoga, the mind is a million parts and the body is one big part. After yoga, the body is a million parts and the mind is one big part." |
Edited by - Jim and His Karma on Nov 11 2007 10:24:36 PM |
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Eddie33
USA
120 Posts |
Posted - Nov 11 2007 : 10:43:49 PM
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| what did you mean that doing asanas while living in the third eye would exacerbate the problem... how so ?? |
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scottfitzgerald
USA
65 Posts |
Posted - Nov 12 2007 : 08:29:17 AM
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Thanks for all the great advice. I think that all of you have hit the nail on the head in different areas. I have incorporated some of the strategies you have suggested, and already feel a bit more grounded.
I have plenty of bliss moving, and at the same time, much silence--to the point where I'd rather stay THERE most of the time. It's the integration into daily life that has been hard.
Love the quote about a billion parts...makes much sense.
I'll let you know about my progress, and again thanks!
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Jim and His Karma
2111 Posts |
Posted - Nov 12 2007 : 08:54:20 AM
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You can think of asanas as doing coarse tuning and meditation as doing fine tuning. They both open and purify, but asana is less subtle (and therefore is a great preparation for meditation....its traditional function is to fix up, clear up, and de-stress folks so they can, eventually, sit peacefully and get the benefit of a meditation practice).
Energy follows attention. So if while you do asana or meditation to open up your pathways/nadis you consistently put great attention in your head, that's where it'll go, leading to precisely the symptoms Scott describes.
If you're not having such symptoms, it's not something to worry about. The last thing any of us neeeds is a complex about where our attention goes. If it's not broke, don't fix it and don't even peek under the hood! :) |
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Eddie33
USA
120 Posts |
Posted - Nov 12 2007 : 2:21:19 PM
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it's just hard to imagine asanas exacerabating the problem. i'm still new though i have lots to learn. i still barely know what the I Am mantra is really doing.
i do think there's some benefit of having attention in your head, as i often say. people who don't have attention in there head are the kind of poeple that have spiritual experiences and attribute it to the christian god or the type of people who can't believe it when someone blames them for something and on and on. sounds like a generalization and i guess it is. but i feel that on the whole in the spiritual scene there lacks a certain fundamental logic. even zen the most practical of the bunch has it's idealistic mumbo jumbo moments...
this is why i'm starting to appreciate ken wilbur a lot more nowadays. how does someone like him exist i ask myself. he's pretty remarkable if yo uthink about it.
seeya |
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