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Maximus
India
187 Posts |
 Posted - Mar 09 2007 : 01:39:13 AM
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| It is widely known that premature death by violent means makes you wander as a ghost. I have seen in 'A Haunting' program of Discovery channel, cases of ghosts living in haunted houses for centuries after their death. How to avoid becoming a ghost and be reborn or whatever soon after death? I suspect this has something to do with spiritual level of a person. But if I suddenly die in an accident tomorrow before advacning spiritually then I become a ghost. It sounds unfair, doesn't it, as we don't have control over how we die. |
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Kirtanman
USA
1651 Posts |
Posted - Mar 09 2007 : 03:10:06 AM
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Hi Maximus,
I wouldn't be 100% confident that this ghost-related information is accurate (I'm not saying it's not -- I'm just pointing out that it is an expressed belief, which has no necessary connection with the way things actually are).
However, some yogic practitioners experiences things daily, that other would believe to be impossible.
The difference between yoga and other systems with "difficult to believe" items, is that non-yoga systems usually create "belief by consensus" - people use their rational minds and egos to evaluate information, and combine that with how they feel about the people or resources providing the information ... and if "all of the above" lines up just right ... that person may restrict and close off their awareness with respect to that subject, voluntarily (what else is "belief", if not building a mental box?) ... until a belief which is more suited to their ego-mind's standards of rationality at the time, comes along.
It's a wacky system, but Empires have been built using it.
I'm more a fan of the "let's try it, and see what happens" approach ... which in this case, I guess would be, "Let's live until we 'die' - and see what happens!"
Very seriously: the only "sense" I have, of what might make sense in terms of practices, to best prepare ourselves for shedding the 20% sheathing represented by the physical body - is simply to become as conscious as possible, with yoga (re: the "sheathing" comment - we have five koshas, or sheaths ... the physical body is only one of them .... and so "death" is a 20% reduction in our sheathing ... not a 100% cessation of our self.)
And it might sound like I'm asking you to trade one set of beliefs for another (ghosts for koshas) - I'm not. The koshas are not conceptual are illustrative - they are bodies we each have, and yet for the most part remain unaware of, because of our [lack of] yogic conditioning. As yogic conditioning progresses, we begin to experience the other koshas with as much or more fulness than we do the physical body ... and even when we really feel / see / experience the etheric body (the next level of subtlety from the physical, and the one most of us experience first [after the physical body we've had all our life] when we practice enough yoga.
It becomes clear fairly early on that this etheric "spirit" body, is the primary one we'll identify with, when we "die" - if we're still on the Wheel of Samsara (not yet conscious enough to Self-Realize).
So, my recommendation to be as conscious and as "at peace" in life (the parts with a physical sheath, and any parts that may be without ....) -- just do your practices; the peace, equanimity and experiential knowledge of how things are .... will help you to have clarity regarding any items such as this one, which you posted about.
You may not know the answer ... but you'll be okay with not knowing (knowing is greatly over-rated ... especially in major areas of life, where it's really more "believing" than knowing - such as the whole "after death" thing.)
A person having dialog with the spiritual teacher Adyashanti said, "Adya, what happens when we die?"
Adya smiled, and said, "Well, first of all ... we don't really die ... but I get that that's not what you're asking. Regarding what you're asking .... I have no idea! I'm not there yet. How would I know what happens when I die?"
Essentially, one of the great modern axioms of Yoga is:
You don't need to take anyone's word for anything; practice - and know for yourself.
If you really "feel into" what the whole mythology surrounding ghosts is about, it's about those who are lost and powerless ... awaiting someone, or something, to set them free ... so that they can (I guess ...) -- go out to the range. So they can be Free Range Ghosts. :o)
Seriously, though: Ghosts are not conscious -- and if they do exist somewhere / somewhen ... they're quite disempowered.
To avoid a similar state, it's not a matter of hoping your association with your physical sheath doesn't change rapidly .... but is a matter of maintaining your consciousness at as high as state as possible.
Peace & Namaste,
Kirtanman |
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Balance
USA
967 Posts |
Posted - Mar 09 2007 : 12:07:55 PM
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Hi Maximus
Kirtanman's always chock full of useful knowledge  As he points out the "widely known" of what happens after violent death is expressed belief. No matter what one may read or hear form someone else is not going to be what one will experience. And there aren't too many people walking around that we know for sure had died violently and returned to talk about it. So what we may really experience if we die in such away is really an unknown. The Discovery Channel is fun and informative but also sensationalizes things. They advertise on the fact that people will watch because it excites imagination and emotion and watchers will return again for the fix. Ultimately we all have to accept that the drama we play out in these temporary bodies has an end and there is no stopping the event, however it will happen. What's fair or unfair about the fact? Who or what is it that dies? |
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Balance
USA
967 Posts |
Posted - Mar 09 2007 : 2:18:36 PM
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I should add, though I'm not read up on ghosts, they are included in my present personal belief system as possibly existing, though what thing or things they may be if they do exist I don't know. But what I do want to add here is that even though I wrote that I believed the body must drop, that's not entirely accurate. My beliefs also include the possibility for accomplished yogis (and I mean way accomplished) to be able to extend the body indefinately. In truth, I believe anything is possible, just like in a dream anything can be done, why not here where everything is structures of energy dictated by thought (another of my beliefs  ) |
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Dedroidify
22 Posts |
Posted - Mar 09 2007 : 3:33:34 PM
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Wavy Gravy once asked a Zen Roshi, "What happens after death?"
The Roshi replied, "I don't know."
Wavy protested, "But you're a Zen Master!"
"Yes," the Roshi admitted, "but I'm not a dead Zen Master."
The best advice for dying is that no matter what happens, if you have the possibility die with love and peace in your heart. (see Gandhi)
Then recognize the ground luminosity/clear light and don't be frightened by its blinding radiance. Simple! 
There are ways to simulate death aswell, hallucinogens, lucid dreaming, etc.
I've seen Death in a mushroom trip, he was an elderly man in a suit with a pair of scissors (to cut the etheric cord or whatcha ma call it) to me. He seemed nice and gestured no with his scissors as in not yet 
The Tibetan and Egyptian Books of the Dead are a fascinating read.
Nothing is for certain though as my opener tries to make clear
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Edited by - Dedroidify on Mar 09 2007 3:35:08 PM |
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Yoda
USA
284 Posts |
Posted - Mar 10 2007 : 2:17:02 PM
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Imo, ghost is the energy body's equivalent of the physical body's cadaver. The stronger the energy flow was around the time of death, the easier it is to see it. It dissolves over time.
jmo, of course.
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How to avoid becoming a ghost after death?
