|
|
 |
|
| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
 Posted - Jun 29 2019 : 01:58:20 AM
|
Perhaps most of us who have been on this journey for some years have understood Intellectually or intuitively that physical (and subtle) objects appearing within your Consciousness is also the same Consciousness. Others may attest to have reached this realization through the experience of a high degree of Unity.
While I “see” this to be true for subtle objects such as thoughts and emotions, I cannot directly perceive it for physical objects. I cannot “see” the act of the formation of physical objects by my Consciousness.
Ofttimes I would wake up in the middle of the night and as I open my eyes, it would take some milliseconds for my room to reconstruct itself , I can actually see shards of physical objects such as my wardrobe moving to fit into a cohesive whole. Note the use of the word “shard” . Frankly I cannot tell if it’s simply a sight defect. I have yet to consult an eye doctor about it. This almost never happens in broad daylight. However, it can happened that I see that these enormous shards are not quite aligned and it feels a little like being in a crystal. This could be pointing to the formation of the physical world (or eye defect) .
Can anyone here clearly perceive the formation of physical objects in their Consciousness?
I have read of a practice called Uccara (from Abhinava Gupta) to help with this but it sounds a little complicated . Anyone know of a simple effective practice? Yogani has spoilt us with simple practices 
If I can make an object appear in my Consciousness through my sense organs, it stands to reason I could also make it disappear, right?
It’s a gorgeously sunny day in the Seychelles with a nice cool breeze and I am sitting in my verandah looking at my overgrown garden and trying to make a little bush of crimson flowers, cross from me, disappear .... for the past hour....
Sey 
|
|
|
kumar ul islam
United Kingdom
791 Posts |
Posted - Jun 29 2019 : 06:54:31 AM
|
the greatest magic trick is to make the world disappear and its just very simple just close your eyes |
 |
|
|
interpaul
USA
551 Posts |
Posted - Oct 14 2019 : 1:07:22 PM
|
SeySorciere, I am new to AYP and just saw your provocative topic. I have also struggled trying to integrate this idea of the outside world being purely a construct of our conscious mind. I acknowledge we only experience all of the outside world as an approximation generated by the limited, yet magnificent, circuitry of the brain along with our 5 senses. I have been very interested in neuroscience for years. Neurologists deal with disease states that point at the limitations of the brain to accurately reconstruct the reality of the outside world. It is clear there are practical aspects to our conscious experience, i.e neurochemical signals in the brain etc and there are metaphysical experiences that transcend the body. Since you describe an odd feeling of your visual reality being constructed as you open your eyes it raises questions about whether you have some central processing issues in the brain or eye or more likely it is just you are very aware, having practiced DM etc, and are essentially peering "under the hood" as Yogani would speak. There are many physicists now who believe we live in a simulation created by a super computer. Every time I recall a dream on awakening I realize my brain has created an amazing world in which I have explored in a different state of awareness. Good stuff. I hope this message finds you enjoying your garden and a beautiful fall day. |
|
|
|
SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
Posted - Oct 17 2019 : 01:58:46 AM
|
Eternally summer on this tiny dot of an island. It has been raining loads the past few weeks though. Flowers looking miserable.
I regret to inform that I have yet to succeed at making thing disappear. 
Sey |
|
|
|
jusmail
India
491 Posts |
Posted - Oct 18 2019 : 12:50:46 AM
|
| It is not eye defect, but "I" defect. |
|
|
|
smileforme
USA
29 Posts |
Posted - Oct 27 2019 : 03:48:09 AM
|
Om Shanti, I guess this might be the longest answer that I will be writing. First please keep in mind that English is not my first language and there might be a language barrier explaining the thing that I would like to explain in a more elegant way.
First to bring up an understanding of divinity I will touch on some topic and go to the answer. When I was in Ethiopia I first started meditation like 16 or 17 years ago there was a discussion about soul and the sister was explaining how the soul take mentally disable people body and come to this world and she said it is paying for past karma. Me even at that moment I listen not judge or take her answer as a definitive definition. Now time has passed here in Nairobi where I stay at the moment every single time I finish from my meditation I go to the super market and while doing so around 7 in the evening I see this lovely girl who people are calling mentally desable plays with other boys and girls. She plays like any other kid except for the inability to explain herself faster sometimes she acts like a 40 year old girl sometimes like her own age 12. Every single time I see that I remember the sister who said that the soul is paying for their bad karma to come into this world on such body. Me I disagree at this moment because seeing that girl makes me realize that the soul has no clue in what type of body it is living. Call it the perfect people mind or the less one for the soul they are just mentally disabled. Both of them are the same. One disabled by choice. They are covered in body consciousness and can't see the universe the way it is. The girl copies her mom and acts like 40 and copies the kid and acts like 12. The only people who suffer from having a child like that are the parents. Again it is not suffering but I just want to use the sister explanation to explain this matter. They suffer because their way of looking at things has come from body consciousness. They compare their kids with other kids and said mine is not normal. Mine is more beautiful than the other and vice-versa. But to me on the other hand, if you ask me why did they come to this world that way? My answer will be "I don't know." But when I see people as human beings I see all of them similarly. But from my understanding the soul of mentally disabled beings is not suffering. In fact it is not contaminated by body consciousness and it is cherishing every single time.
Now let's go to your explanation of what's going on. Look I'm not calling it wrong just like I was talking about previously I'm just giving you another perspective.
I went back to Ethiopia to get a police certificate for a week. Doing that, since I wanted a place where I sit and meditate I decided to go to Raja Yoga meditation center. When I went there, I was told to meditate in the special Baba's room. I said OK and sat there. There is a big picture of the founder looking at me two to three meters away. From left to right side, there are half dead flowers sitting next to the picture. First I don't care about the founder picture unless you are body conscious you will not allow yourself to sit in front of a portrait no matter how important that person is. Second, I just saw this beautiful flower suffering from the flactuated happiness of these body conscious people. Since those people don't justify staring at a dead body picture, they have to kill another beautiful looking plant and have to put it next to it to make it more appealing for the eye. Why? Because they couldn't see the beauty in everything. They have to recreate their fantasy based on body consciousness. Their happiness comes from outside, not inside. They don't see unity within themselves and others.
Do you understand now? You on the other hand had trapped yourself in the game of the intellect which doesn't give you anything on understanding the total concept of your existence. Rather than you sit and see the way they are, you are busy playing games. Just like you did outside of your body experience. First, this game clouded your judgement even to put the inability to see right and Wong. You place yourself on a comparative level. the moment you place yourself comparing this and that you will lose the broad picture which is right in front of you.
Even in your explanation I will show you a flaw. The reason you are appreciating the flower is because of the other beautiful tree tree next to it. You never realised that. If you had done that, you would have realised how big a significant role it is playing. It might be helping, contributing for the growth of the beautiful flower next to it to flourish. On the other hand, if this world is full of that flower, do you know how beautiful it is or not? The varayty of different types of plants created different types of emotion in your brain. You are enjoying that. However, the broad concept of unity has been disappearing from you at the same time. which is, the understanding of "unity" which is accepting the difference and moving on without attachment to see the way it is.
Om Shanti |
|
|
|
SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
Posted - Oct 28 2019 : 01:27:01 AM
|
What can I say - Smileforme - I love playing games. . Like our Creator.
Sey |
|
|
|
SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
Posted - Dec 04 2019 : 12:18:22 AM
|
More on this subject. This what I love about Truth, if you keep insisting (and you keep practicing), it will reveal itself to you.
The bl***y frog in the garden finally served a purpose than just keeping me awake nights. I woke me up two nights ago around 3 a.m. and was listening to its rhythmic croaking. Each croak reverberated through the clear field. It was a disturbance of the sparkling clearness that I see all the time, even when I am looking at objects. And it finally sink in (I hope I am not off at a tangent here) that the sparkling field of nothingness is the background screen to my experience. It pervades all. I sat up and looked out of the window at the neighbour's house and the trees and I could finally see that they are just "colourings" of the clear field. My physical body too is just that. It's all the same stuff. Like written in many philosophical & spiritual books, this croaking, the neighbour's house are not real in and of themselves. They are emerging out of something else. So what is there really? Just the Knowing.
I know this has been written /explained in plenty of books, by plenty of masters. I just wanted to share in my own words, from my own "truly seeing."
Just the Knowing... but something /someone is still knowing; "I" can perceive the clear field, so the Witness is there somehow. Can I correctly deduce that the clear field is just the Mind? Illuminated by an inner light. Self-illuminated. "I" = Consciousness (the Knowing). Could that be the same as the light that illuminates the mind? I don't know.
The other thing about Truth. You totally get it at one point; you know it! Then it slips away...grr.. 
Conclusion: I may be a little closer to making that little flower disappear.
Sey
|
|
|
|
lalow33
USA
966 Posts |
Posted - Dec 04 2019 : 03:18:20 AM
|
Yes!
Love you, my friend.
Lori |
|
|
|
Stille
Germany
76 Posts |
Posted - Dec 04 2019 : 11:27:54 AM
|
| Thank you for sharing Sey! |
|
|
|
Christi
United Kingdom
4514 Posts |
|
|
Blanche
USA
873 Posts |
Posted - Dec 06 2019 : 06:26:27 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by SeySorciere
And it finally sink in (I hope I am not off at a tangent here) that the sparkling field of nothingness is the background screen to my experience. It pervades all. I sat up and looked out of the window at the neighbour's house and the trees and I could finally see that they are just "colourings" of the clear field. My physical body too is just that. It's all the same stuff. Like written in many philosophical & spiritual books, this croaking, the neighbour's house are not real in and of themselves. They are emerging out of something else.
Sey
You could also see that the world emerges from this field of nothingness/potentiality, just to disappear into it the next moment, and to come back again. Noticing this fluctuation is like seeing between the still scenes of a movie. Both the field and the world are present in the same time, there is no separation. It is just the level where we put our attention that makes that layer obvious, but the more open the awareness, the more the infinity reveals itself. |
|
|
|
SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
Posted - Dec 07 2019 : 12:02:44 AM
|
Thank you, Blanche for further input. But no, I did not notice that that night. However, this fluctuation of what I call “life in frames” I have noticed at times for many years now. You may notice /“see” plenty of clues along the way but drawing the right conclusion is another matter; the “clicking into place” takes time apparently. Or I am just thick
What I have noticed each time is that a “sucking in, worm-hole style” can be experienced , a collapsing of sort and the object is no longer far away but right there within you. Like the days I swallow the sun. I swallowed the sound of that frog and everything else.
Loads of things /scenery happen along the spiritual path and I have reported plenty myself , some relevant, some irrelevant but always interesting. And we keep practicing.
Sey
|
|
|
|
Presence Light
Algeria
26 Posts |
Posted - Dec 11 2019 : 7:24:08 PM
|
|
|
|
|
Blanche
USA
873 Posts |
Posted - Dec 13 2019 : 07:27:17 AM
|
While spiritual experiences can be a distraction and they do not mean much in themselves, they do offer that chance for a profound change when they are understood and integrated. We are here to learn, but just like with anything else in life, we could go through many experiences without learning much. There is a saying when it comes to spiritual life: “Everyone realizes, but not everyone cognizes.”
Just as you describe, Sey, I see this world fluctuating to an underlayer of potentiality, just to pop up back in place. What does this mean?
Some years ago, in a meditation, something else happened, something that your words, Sey, hint to, something that it can only be describe as a swallowing of the world. Everything went inside, and when I looked out nothing was left. Everything that existed and did not exist was inside. “I”, whatever “I” is, I am the world, I am everything that is and is not, there is nothing outside the Self, as there is no outside when it comes to the Self. What followed were months of learning to live “with the world inside,” learning to meditate again not on an outside mantra, but an inner mantra, which is pervading and sustaining everything. And then a friend said, “Brahman is the devourer.” And I went, “Yah, this makes perfect sense,” and things just fell in place. Knowing something comes not from turning the attention to it, but by being it.
Understanding may not be necessary for liberation, but it is necessary on the road to embody what we really are. The insights that come from experience are like doors to another level of this reality. Each of us has to do our own learning.
Blanche
|
|
|
|
SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
Posted - Dec 15 2019 : 11:36:27 PM
|
quote:
While spiritual experiences can be a distraction and they do not mean much in themselves, they do offer that chance for a profound change when they are understood and integrated. We are here to learn, but just like with anything else in life, we could go through many experiences without learning much.
This is so true. Since this insight, I have more questions than answers, meaning still in the process of accepting and integrating. I suppose as the experience happens more often, it will also lead to the profound change you are talking about. Right now, I am centered enough in the joy and bliss of the Self to not give in to a sense of nihilism. There is a danger there.
quote:
“Brahman is the devourer.”
I like that !
quote:
Knowing something comes not from turning the attention to it, but by being it.
Hmmm... true.
Thanks, Blanche.
Sey
|
|
|
|
SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
Posted - Jan 03 2020 : 05:42:50 AM
|
Prompted a couple of times by Christi, I read Yogani's Self-Inquiry booklet the past two days (in between partying).
The man is a Genius!!!
4th time reading it since starting AYP. First time, I understood squat. Second time just about something. Third time I thought I'd understood it and living it. Fourth time and immediately I realized I had understood nothing before.
Now, its wisdom is literally shining through.
Thank you so much Yogani for sharing all That, and Christi for constant prompting towards the right literature.
Sey
|
|
|
|
Christi
United Kingdom
4514 Posts |
Posted - Jan 03 2020 : 06:45:33 AM
|
|
|
|
|
SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
Posted - Jan 11 2024 : 06:55:29 AM
|
Hello all,
I came across something very interesting to day that reminded me of the times when I kept seeing misaligned shards in the sky as reported somewhat at the beginning of this thread and could not explain it, causing me to dig out this old thread.
Listening to a documentary on Jewish mysticism and kabbalah, I have come across this fellow called Isaac Luria (16th century). He puts forward the concept that the creation of the physical world (and humans) from the Infinite and Limitless (the Ein Sof) happens through a contraction (of the Limitless/God) via the vessels of the sephirot. As these cannot withhold or bear the fullness of the Light of God, the vessel shatters into shard that then descend into our world.
Ergo - my seeing shards(?)
Similarly, some months ago, I finally found something about a gold crucible which holds manna from the book of Moses on the ark of the covenant and what it contained. It reminded me of my experience of gold bursting forth from the pineal gland area and turning my whole body into gold - while doing the dishes at the kitchen sink.
Dig enough and there is always someone who has "an explanation /theory" on what we experience on our journeys into the spiritual realms.
Very intriguing.
Sey
|
Edited by - SeySorciere on Jan 11 2024 06:57:36 AM |
|
|
|
kensbikes100
USA
192 Posts |
Posted - Jan 11 2024 : 5:43:43 PM
|
Sey, I've recently been reading Kabbalah as well. It's a more modern treatment of the ideas, but it regards the Vessel and its shattering as absolutely central. I was just going to look it up and tell you about it! I'm very glad you have found it.
But on a much more simple level, perhaps love has something to do with it. Perhaps you can choose an object which is not so beautiful and perhaps not living. Perhaps one's natural attraction to a very beautiful flower affects what you may be trying to do.
Thank you so much for sharing that!
Can you share the link to the Jewish Mysticism and Kabbalah documentary you watched?
|
|
|
|
SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
Posted - Jan 12 2024 : 05:54:39 AM
|
Dear Kenbikes,
This thread was started some time ago and my journey as continued to evolve. Christi was not teasing above when he said - perhaps you will disappear instead. Yes, 'I' am the one who have disappeared instead.
Sey
Oh - the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzbNq_kfLKU
|
Edited by - SeySorciere on Jan 12 2024 05:58:29 AM |
|
|
|
Mithuna
France
16 Posts |
Posted - Jan 12 2024 : 8:05:12 PM
|
Many thanks Sey for this beautiful spiritual immersion.
Many of us have had similar experiences like what you are telling us. They concern in one way or another the disappearance of what establishes in us a separation between our inner world and beyond our consciousness as a witness and the world that we ordinarily consider as external. It is possible that the siddhis Patanjali speaks of are in fact states of consciousness describing such experiences. They are also close to the beautiful expression of the philosopher Romain Rolland when he evokes the "oceanic feeling" illustrating a deep feeling of unity with the neighboring Universe of what Blanche relates.
Such experiences, which are rarely the fruit of conscious effort, are for each of us "witnesses" to the reality of our inner life, even if as Yogani points out not without humor in lesson 94:
"If you are doing spinal breathing and, as you come up to the third eye on inhalation, your ishta (your chosen ideal ? Jesus, Krishna, Moses, Mohammed, Mother Divine, etc.) comes galloping up to you in a golden chariot, beckoning you to climb in and go for a ride, what do you do? You easily exhale and go back down the spinal nerve. In other words, you favor the practice you are doing. If the chariot with your ishta in it goes down the spinal nerve with you, great. If it doesn?t, that is okay too. We don?t push visions out. Neither do we hang on to them. We just favor the practice we are doing. If these visions are real, they will be with us for a long time both inside and outside practices. "
The possibility of acting on the external world from our internal world ? in particular through images and mantras ? is the basis of numerous forms of magic in the East and in the West, magic which mechanically finds its limit in the strong implication of desire and will.
In Yoga and particularly the teaching of Yogani, this is not the case. If we study what for me is the most beautiful form of magic ? Samyama ? we bring images invested with our emotional force to dissolve into inner silence. We could say that it is a form of offering in which we abandon the link that we may have with the image by gradually stealing it until it is reabsorbed into inner silence.
In the Kabbalah we indeed find the TSIMTSOUM designating the contraction of the divine light of which Sey speaks. By doing Samyama we have a similar experience by reabsorbing into inner silence all the vibration contained in the mantras, which prepares the 5th pillar of Yoga, the withdrawal of the senses Pratyahara, a form of introversion which brings us to the origin of our feelings.
In many spiritual practices images have great importance but not as an end. When the Tibetan disciple creates a mandala as a drawing but also as a mental representation, he projects into figures the forces which invest his inner world. Beneficent or wrathful devas allow him to exteriorize these pairs of opposites that live within him, the impregnations and conditionings of yoga, to bring them to generate an interior dynamic allowing them to overcome their opposition. Whatever their terrible or protective aspect, a time will come when the most beautiful mandalas must fade away, giving back their freedom to these figures to allow a new composition of its interior landscape and open a new chapter of its liberating journey.
Externalizing these inner images in one way or another helps. I know for my part that while drawing, these figures imperceptibly appear and weave a story that reveals me to myself, in a plot that I did not suspect before having started this drawing. And strangely they act in me in return, releasing and animating new energies.
If we practice the techniques taught by Yogani day after day our conditionings and our impregnations coagulate and gradually dissolve, very often in the form of images.
All these images are markers on our inner path, signs that a silent but real transformation is taking place within us. These are encounters that can be very powerful with our inner world, being able to reassure us or warn us, but must encourage us to continue the road towards fullness. Images, their appearance and their resorption are important elements, milestones which always encourage us to continue on the path, without becoming attached to them.
|
|
|
|
SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
Posted - Jan 14 2024 : 07:26:52 AM
|
Sey |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
|
|
| AYP Public Forum |
© Contributing Authors (opinions and advice belong to the respective authors) |
|
|
|
|
Realization of Objects as Consciousness
