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LittleTurtle
USA
342 Posts |
 Posted - Sep 19 2006 : 10:08:39 PM
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| I feel a little restricted by the 20 minutes guideline in the AYP meditation. Although I sometimes have difficulty even getting my meditation done regularly, I do like to meditate for a longer time. This is very pleasing to me and I go very deep if I can meditate for an hour or more. In the past I've meditated up to three hours. It's great. This was doing the HamSa meditation, or some call it Hong Sau. Now I'm doing the I AM and getting the benefits but I still wonder if I couldn't go deeper if I did it longer. 20 minutes is so short. I feel I just get started and have to quit. |
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Sep 19 2006 : 10:54:15 PM
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Hi LittleTurtle,
It's good to hear the AYP meditation is working well for you!
I have asked the question about the 20 minutes in the past and been answered, and it was also discussed in this thread: http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....OPIC_ID=1175
To sum it up:
* deep meditation with mantra is considered more efficient than most other types of meditation, therefore less time will do the job.
* the depth experienced during meditation is not a good indicator of progress, rather the amount of inner silence experienced during daily activity.
* it has been found by experienced long-term practitioners that 2 x 20 minutes of deep meditation a day (give or take a few minutes) is best for building long-term inner silence.
* much longer time than 20 minutes may feel good during the session itself, but is likely to create excessive purification, with possible irritation or fragility of mind being felt during the day. The effect is often delayed and may not surface until after several days or weeks of over-meditation. |
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LittleTurtle
USA
342 Posts |
Posted - Sep 19 2006 : 11:03:41 PM
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| Thanks for your reply Weaver. I'll keep at it. |
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Sep 19 2006 : 11:23:05 PM
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You are very welcome!
To shed more light on the subject I will also quote from Yogani's reply to a question I asked about my 30-40 minute sessions that I did when I started with AYP meditation:
"The cycle of meditation practice includes both the sitting and the activity during the day and evening to integrate inner silence into our nervous system comfortably. For most people, this cycle comes in around 20 minutes of meditation twice per day, with good mental and/or physical activity in-between. As spinal breathing and additional practices are added, the 20 minute guideline for meditation holds, even as much more purification and opening are occurring. Some people can handle more meditation, and others have to go with much less. It all depends on the nervous system involved.
Generally, more meditation is done in more same-length (20 min) sessions per day in "retreat mode" (see the topic index for lessons on "retreats") rather than in longer meditation sessions. Even then, light activity in-between multiple sessions per day is important to integrate inner silence at deeper levels. Retreat mode is a special situation that is not our normal daily practice. I mention it as it relates to the desire to achieve more progress with more meditation. Going to retreat mode is usually preferable to trying to get the job done with longer meditations built into a normal schedule involving work and responsibilities.
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All of that is to give a guideline on the "standard approach," which is not to say that 30-40 minutes of meditation is not going to be good for you. It is a big leap, however, and you should be advised of that -- don't be surprised if you begin to feel a bit frayed at some point. That will be the signal to back off. Everyone is encouraged to do their own "research" and find the best balance of practices. It always involves placing limits on certain practices at times as the inner energies become stimulated and move inside -- causing some discomfort as a bit too much purification occurs. Rarely will a single formula of practice times stay the same without some modifications being needed from time to time.
So, if your experience is good at this level, and you feel strongly about continuing that way, see how it goes. You can always back off -- and I suspect you will at some point. Keep in mind that there can be a delayed reaction with practices. This is most common with pranayama and kumbhaka, but can also be the case with meditation. I think you would agree that a long series of small manageable releases along the way is better than a big destabilizing one somewhere down the road. Practices are measured to cultivate the former and avoid the latter.
Reminder: We do not meditate for a particular subjective experience during meditation. A meditation full with thoughts is as productive as one full with silence. Both are involved in the purification process. If we keep meditating until we are full with silence, we could find some imbalance later on due to excessive purification being stimulated. The length of meditation is what we should be measuring, not the subjective depth. The former we can manage, and the later will always be changing. It is the correct "dose" of the meditation procedure, rather the subjective experience during meditation, over months and years that produces the ideal result.
Increases in practice time on anything are recommended to be in small steps of five minutes or so, with weeks or months of monitoring results in-between, so as to avoid building up the delayed reaction situation just mentioned. Everyone is different, and each of us has to gauge our practice according to results. Those results are going to be in the short term and in the long term. We should make sure that what we are doing will stand for the long term, for it is through long term practice that we reach enlightenment. It is in your hands." |
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LittleTurtle
USA
342 Posts |
Posted - Sep 20 2006 : 09:30:44 AM
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| Again, thanks. Despite the 20 minute "restriction", I get so much more immediate happy feelings from the I AM meditation than from HongSau that I am willing to continue with this "experiement". I am used to doing the longer meditations on my days off which are like mini retreat days for me, but for now I'm going to stick with this 20 minute thing and see where it leads me. :) |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Sep 20 2006 : 10:27:27 AM
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Looks like a great summary by Weaver. BTW, there's even more on the forum about this topic, though I can't look for it right now...
There is the question of retreats, in which you can do extra meditation. However, the circumstances of a retreat should be such that you can handle the 'extra purification'. So, retreats are a topic of their own, and I'm not saying you can just go and do a retreat as intensive as you want at any time...
One final note I would add to what Weaver said: even if you are doing a retreat, with this kind of meditation, it's best to do the extra meditation as extra sessions, rather than very long meditation sessions. So, for example, on a retreat, you might do four or five meditation sessions, with other practices in between, and some exercise such as walking, and preferably some contact with some sympathetic and like minds.
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yogani
USA
5241 Posts |
Posted - Sep 20 2006 : 11:28:28 AM
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Hi All:
For those interested in "retreat mode," see these schedules and guidelines developed by Trip with my assistance:
Weekend (up to 4 days): http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....OPIC_ID=1416
Extended (5 days or more): http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....OPIC_ID=1428
Trip has experience with the schedule and I'm sure he would be happy to answer any questions.
Note: For a successful retreat involving the AYP practices, it is essential to follow a predetermined schedule, with the associated guidelines. This is because high levels of internal purification will be occurring, and everything must be preplanned and paced accordingly.
There is also the possibility of coordinating "group retreats," physically in one place, or not. As many are finding, group practice (even done long distance) can be very powerful. See here and here. Eventually we will get around to it in retreat mode. All things in their own good time. 
The guru is in you.
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Frank-in-SanDiego
USA
363 Posts |
Posted - Sep 23 2006 : 1:50:25 PM
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Hari Om
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Hello,
regarding 20 min... perhaps this conversation will add perspective.
It does not resolve the 'restricted' conversation, but adds some depth to undersanding.
http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....TOPIC_ID=683
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LittleTurtle
USA
342 Posts |
Posted - Sep 23 2006 : 6:13:09 PM
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| Thanks again, everyone, for the replies. One thing I must say is that I'm feeling such immediate benefit from this meditation. Among other things, I find myself feeling more happy and even smiling on the way to work. :) |
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Only 20 minutes?
