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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
 Posted - Jan 23 2015 : 5:10:23 PM
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Hi there, from now on, I will post all my experiences in this topic, rather than opening a single topic for each one of those.
So, this is where I'm now, I can't meditate without overloading. I have switched to breath meditation, and I can't do niether that without overload. I have cut down to just one breath, yes, a one breath "meditation", and then I just rest for 20 min. I don't know can you believe this, I'm not sure I would if someone would tell me. I just do one concetrated breath, and then feel a slight pressure (around my eyes and in my forehead) and feel some happiness. It lasts for about 2 hours, but the feeling is less intesive after 10 min of it and after 1:30 hour after.
So is this good (because of the happiness I'm feeling) or bad (because of overloading). Should I continue like this until I can meditate more or should I pause until I can meditate without overloading and longer.
This is of course because of a long period of overloading I've head (with DM) (about half a year), maybe even ever since I started DM, I just wasn't realizing I was overdoing it.
And yet to mention this: a couple of days ago, I was able to meditate (on breath) for much longer, a normal period of 15-20 minutes! And then what happened, I thought that maybe I could do a DM again, and I tried it and since then I'm overloading again! Damm it.... And the amount of DM I've tried was just 15 seconds, lol. |
Edited by - Sungazer on Jan 23 2015 8:56:53 PM |
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ak33
Canada
229 Posts |
Posted - Jan 23 2015 : 7:05:51 PM
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| What exactly is the overload? Is it the feeling of pressure in forehead? Is it painful? Does it cause emotional outbursts? |
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Jan 23 2015 : 8:54:03 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by ak33
What exactly is the overload? Is it the feeling of pressure in forehead? Is it painful? Does it cause emotional outbursts?
Yes, I've said, a pressure in forehead and around my eyes, not painful, just a slight pressure. Sometimes I feel a small sensation in forehead. I don't have any emotional problems...
And... it's not just the pressure... I also can't do some kind of activities, like watchig TV or being on computer, or doing dishes, or doing any kind of workout, I can't speek loud and fast, and so... I have that about an half an hour after meditating, and then for about 1,5 hour I just feel a little bit happy. |
Edited by - Sungazer on Jan 23 2015 9:03:36 PM |
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Dogboy
USA
2294 Posts |
Posted - Jan 23 2015 : 9:45:17 PM
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quote:
Yes, I've said, a pressure in forehead and around my eyes, not painful, just a slight pressure. Sometimes I feel a small sensation in forehead. I don't have any emotional problems...
I personally don't consider this overload. Many times after a sit I feel this too, my "yoga hat."
quote:
And... it's not just the pressure... I also can't do some kind of activities, like watchig TV or being on computer, or doing dishes, or doing any kind of workout, I can't speek loud and fast, and so... I have that about an half an hour after meditating, and then for about 1,5 hour I just feel a little bit happy.
I'm not sure I understand what prevents you from doing these activities. Are you having difficulty concentrating/focusing? Is it a light sensitivity? |
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Jan 24 2015 : 08:42:38 AM
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@Dogboy, it's difficult to explain, if I would do those activities, a pressure would increase and the benefits would be washed away. That's what was happening to me all the time of my practice.
If I watch TV let's say, first I would feel more pressure and less happiness, and soon both would fade away, those iritations would be gone faster than if I was doing some thing I didn't bother, but the benefits would also fade away much more quickly.
And the other day, when I said I was able to meditate for a normal period of 15-20 minutes, I didn't feel any iritations, I just rested for a few minutes, and just felt great after it, no iritations at all.
And, it's difficult to explain, as I said, it's not the pressure the thing that keeps me away from watching TV, it's some kind of I would say a psychological component of it, which I can't explain, when I watch TV it's like my mind is squeezing, yes that's the word! IT's not a pain, it just... but it's niether an emotion outbursts...
I hope someone understands me, I'm sorry I wasn't able to expain it better, just don't think I'm trolling :D |
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Dogboy
USA
2294 Posts |
Posted - Jan 24 2015 : 09:52:52 AM
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Perhaps a grounding activity, like walking (or anything) outdoors in the hour that follows would help in the transition. Interacting with people after meditation might help too. Isolated activities (watching tv or working on computer) may keep you inside your head too much. I notice the feeling of my "yoga hat" diminishes when I engage with others or nature. Just a suggestion, but may be worth a try; it would be a shame not to enjoy the benefits of yoga.  |
Edited by - Dogboy on Jan 24 2015 09:53:41 AM |
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ak33
Canada
229 Posts |
Posted - Jan 24 2015 : 10:03:10 AM
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| I agree with Dogboy. But at the same time, how do you know that your benefits are being washed away? Perhaps you are over analyzing everything, because like you say, there is a psychological component. Now, you have a couple of options . if this thing is a figment of your imagination, then forging through with your practice is usually the best way to resolve it. If it is really overload, then take Dogboy's advice and engage in grounding. |
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Jan 24 2015 : 10:29:22 AM
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Well I never tend to do those activities that increase my irititaons an decrease benefits after meditating. I always tend to go out with friends, take a walk, do anything relaxing.
How do I feel the benefits are being washed away? Well, simply, when I do some of those activities, the feeling of happiness is gone.
When I said I feel this overload for about an half an hour after meditation, I actually ment it is happening in relaxing, grounding activities. If I watch TV, overload suddenly increases and then fades away much more quickly than when relaxing, but the benefits fade away also. That's interesting.
And I have already mentioned that these overloads happen after 20 minutes of resting after "meditating" (under quotation marks because it is a one breath meditation).
I am just wondering should I pause meditating for some time, or should I continue like this until I am able to meditate more and without overloading. If pausing for some time would cause me being able to meditate for longer time sooner, then I will pause, currently I do just one meditation a day. Is that good? |
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Jan 24 2015 : 2:54:20 PM
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| Just did one breath + 20 minutes resting, felt nothing. Tomorrow I will do it again, if I still wouldn't feel nothing I will do 5 minutes. Yes! |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1734 Posts |
Posted - Jan 25 2015 : 09:54:01 AM
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Hello Sungazer
When you say “I just do one concentrated breath” you don't mean your are altering your breath during breath focused meditation?
quote:
Originally posted by Sungazer
I never tend to do those activities that increase my irritations an decrease benefits after meditating.
It is nice you can do some pleasant activities after your meditations. However, should you need to do things that are not so good for your mood, rest assure that the benefits of meditation will not be wiped away by tensions or irritations arising in daily life. I am talking about the long term effects, which will accumulate regardless of the occasional unpleasantness we put up with in daily life. In time you will find that the unpleasantness will no longer affect your core. These will be the important gains from your regular meditation.
quote:
Originally posted by Sungazer
I am just wondering should I pause meditating for some time, or should I continue like this until I am able to meditate more and without overloading. If pausing for some time would cause me being able to meditate for longer time sooner, then I will pause, currently I do just one meditation a day. Is that good?
Well, I have had times when I paused my mantra/breath meditation, but not by skipping the session. What happens when I overload is that my attentions is drawn inwards by strong sensations along the spine and pressure in the head. At these times it's not easy to focus on the breath or mantra. So instead of forcing the mantra, I just let my attention be with those sensations that are claiming it. I find that after a few days of this (and doing grounding activities too) I am able to return to focusing my attention to the object of meditation.
I hope this helps. |
Edited by - BlueRaincoat on Jan 25 2015 10:05:54 AM |
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compassion
90 Posts |
Posted - Jan 26 2015 : 03:00:03 AM
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It's worth remembering that as the effects of meditation overflow into everyday life, this can change the way we are inclined to live. It doesn't necessarily mean overload, but may feel like so if the inclination to live a different way exceeds the rate at which we can make changes.
As a personal example, when blissful experiences started, I could no longer watch television or a movie. It was no longer interesting to me and I couldn't watch more than 10 minutes before getting bored at sitting so passively. Since I could easily watch a movie every day before these experiences, the challenge wasn't just to notice that I didn't enjoy watching television anymore, but was to work out what else I could do with that time.
The same might also be true for the other activities that seem to result in problems for you. There are many reasons people workout, and they can be to look good, to impress people, to escape from feelings, etc. As we become more conscious, these motivations might fade away, to be replaced by others, such as staying healthy. They don't necessarily require a change in activity, but a change in intention.
This might not be true in your case, but I use the example to illustrate the sort of changes that can take place with ongoing meditation. |
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Jan 29 2015 : 1:05:26 PM
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Hi, I'm sorry i wasn't able to post before.
quote:
When you say “I just do one concentrated breath” you don't mean your are altering your breath during breath focused meditation?
What do you mean? Sorry for my bad English, what does "altering" exactly mean, changing? Changing my breath (in what way?) during meditation?
Well, I just try to stay with a breath to focus on it, when I notice my attention is not on a breath I just bring it back on. I think that's it.
quote:
It's worth remembering that as the effects of meditation overflow into everyday life, this can change the way we are inclined to live. It doesn't necessarily mean overload, but may feel like so if the inclination to live a different way exceeds the rate at which we can make changes.
As a personal example, when blissful experiences started, I could no longer watch television or a movie. It was no longer interesting to me and I couldn't watch more than 10 minutes before getting bored at sitting so passively. Since I could easily watch a movie every day before these experiences, the challenge wasn't just to notice that I didn't enjoy watching television anymore, but was to work out what else I could do with that time.
Yes, I know, sometimes, when I'm in a meditation-induced mood, I may not find PC gaming that much of a fun... However, I do like wathcing some kind of movies.
And, okay, this is where I'm now... I think I'm still overloading, after meditation, I still feel a little bit of those iritations I have described before, much less then before but I still do; I will have those about an hour or two after meditating if I'm not doing something that is relaxing (which excludes watching TV in a case you find that relaxing).
Today I meditated for 2:30 minutes and it was like that. Tonight I will do just one minute, I think might be still a little bit of an overload but I won't go lower than that.
The best was when I meditated for 4 minutes, I've head more overload, but I've also had more benefits, more bliss. So this was, may I say a balance, maybe I should stick with that?
And how to expain these experiences since they are induced buy a such short meditations? I think I'm picking up a refined energy impulse, not creating a new one, Yogani explained that in one of the lessons. As soon as I sit, yet in a first breath I feel it like I am already in 5 minutes of meditating (compared to the previous sessions a months ago).
I've also practiced asanas twice and that was great, it did had a great, relaxing, and lasting effect, not like meditation, different. But I'm not sure would it be a good thing to include it in my daily practice. I mean, how will I include a new practice if I'm not even stable with a current one? In lessons, they come after many other practices, but many people start with asanas first, before even hearing of meditation...
I don't know, maybe it wouldn't cause any more overload, what do you think? |
Edited by - Sungazer on Jan 29 2015 1:36:10 PM |
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Feb 05 2015 : 8:36:20 PM
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Okay, now I know for sure that I allways overload from meditation.
I have tried the most minimal amount of meditating and I was still overloaded; so the most minimal amount was 40 seconds, I've head the minimal bliss but also minimal of the overload. Before that I didn't feel anything, so it's always like that: if I have bliss from meditating I will also have an overload.
So I think best would be pausing for some time and then coming back to when I would be able to meditate without an overload. But I will still do it if I have some important situation to handle, tomorrow I have an exam so I will do just 2 minutes meditation, that will help me for sure.
And I will do a 2 minutes or so mediation a week to see am I able to meditate again. Who knows, maybe just tomorrow. :)
And I am making a small progress, before I was able to meditate for just one breath, and with much higher overlaod then now with 1 minute.
If you maybe don't believe me thinking I may be overanalizing everything or so, feel free to say it. :D I would definitely find it hard to believe that somebody meditates for just one breath and gets benefits out of it. |
Edited by - Sungazer on Feb 05 2015 9:15:35 PM |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1734 Posts |
Posted - Feb 06 2015 : 09:36:41 AM
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Well, you're in charge Sungazer.
I don't see anything wrong with taking a break. If you've overdone it in the past, it will be chance for the energy to settle down. Perhaps it would be good to do some asanas instead, to maintain the habit of doing yoga regularly. Standing poses are more grounding than the rest.
Also keep up any other grounding activities. Studying a lot and spending time in front of computers is rather the opposite of grounding. |
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Horst
Austria
30 Posts |
Posted - Feb 07 2015 : 10:55:39 AM
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Sungazer, you are saying one breath is overloading you? I know this from my own experience, but only when I practice spinal breathing pranayama which means to consciously "control" and stir the breath and its subtle energies. Is it possible that you are doing this in your breath awareness meditation, too? Or are you letting the breath freely and naturally flow?
Have you tried to "just sit" without deliberately follow your breath? Just doing nothing, but simply be? No manipulation at all, but allowing everthing to be as it is? For me this is even finer than breath awareness Meditation. I can't do the Mantra Meditation at all either. Maybe it's worth a try... |
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Feb 07 2015 : 7:18:33 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Horst
Sungazer, you are saying one breath is overloading you? I know this from my own experience, but only when I practice spinal breathing pranayama which means to consciously "control" and stir the breath and its subtle energies. Is it possible that you are doing this in your breath awareness meditation, too? Or are you letting the breath freely and naturally flow?
Have you tried to "just sit" without deliberately follow your breath? Just doing nothing, but simply be? No manipulation at all, but allowing everthing to be as it is? For me this is even finer than breath awareness Meditation. I can't do the Mantra Meditation at all either. Maybe it's worth a try...
I was doing spinal breathing before, I stopped because I've found it useless, I wasn't yet ready for it. So I wasn't definitely doing SB while trying to do breath meditation, just a normal focus on a breath, and as I said in a last post now I overload/get benefits from about 40 seconds (atleast that was the last time I tried), not just one breath as before.
I've also tried "just sitting", with eyes closed ofcourse, that's not bad actually, but not even as close as meditation, breath or mantra. Are you sure "just sitting" is better for you that breath meditation, for how long have you practiced breath m.?
I'm actually souprised how, for me, the efects are almost the same from DM and breath meditation, the difference is just the intensity. |
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Horst
Austria
30 Posts |
Posted - Feb 08 2015 : 05:31:23 AM
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Generally, I have been using the breath as object of meditation for many years, and have done this particular AYP breath awareness meditation (alternative Mantra meditation) for about half a year. I cannot say which technique works better as it all depends on the situation and objective. Each technique has certain advantages, like SBP cultivates your ecstatic conductivity and subtle energies, or mere breath awareness leads more towards spacious stillness.
When my mind is very agitated, I might even start counting the out-breaths, and when it gets quieter, I drop the counting and just stay with the breath. And then I might even focus more on the pause between the breaths until I drop the breath altogether and just sit in spacious silence with everything in it. So, for me the breath is just part of a tool box.
However, I understand the importance of a clear structure for an open system like AYP. It needs to be simple and effective, otherwise practicioners might get caught up in the myriad of variations and loose the whole point, and they might not be able to see the forest because of all the trees... :-)
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jonesboy
USA
594 Posts |
Posted - Feb 08 2015 : 08:47:52 AM
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Hi sungazer,
I too would like to recommend mindfulness meditation.
If you can't do dm and you can only do breath meditation for a few breaths then mindfulness might be the ticket. It is the method I am currently using. I do it for 45 minutes twice a day. I find it very powerful. Maybe look up mahamudra to get some better/deeper understanding. |
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Feb 08 2015 : 10:13:38 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by jonesboy
Hi sungazer,
I too would like to recommend mindfulness meditation.
If you can't do dm and you can only do breath meditation for a few breaths then mindfulness might be the ticket. It is the method I am currently using. I do it for 45 minutes twice a day. I find it very powerful. Maybe look up mahamudra to get some better/deeper understanding.
Yeah, that may be a good advice, but can you recommed any particular mindfulness meditation? There are many out there, which one do you practice? |
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jonesboy
USA
594 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2015 : 09:47:50 AM
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Hi Sungazer,
I am just going to go over the basic method that I learned.
First the breath is just a point of focus. If I notice I am daydreaming to much I return to the breath.
So starting off I use the breath to calm down.
Next, I start at by relaxing my feet, ankles, calves continuing up to relaxing my jaw, eyes and forehead.(I find this really calms the mind)
After a few mins.
Next you reside in any emotions you feel, just be with them. The physical sensation of the emotional feeling. Not the thought!
After a few mins.
Start by observing your thoughts without changing them. Just let them come and go, you are just a witness to your thoughts.
Lastly just reside as Awareness. Just observe whatever, energy, thoughts, feelings, sensations you might have. Like you are watching it all as a movie or you are the sky and all those things are the clouds.
You can go step by step if you wish. I use to and it really works. Nowadays I tend to go straight to awareness and just reside there for awhile. Whatever you try I am sure it will work.
Let me know how this works for you. |
Edited by - jonesboy on Feb 09 2015 2:37:54 PM |
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Feb 10 2015 : 6:59:27 PM
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Here's what's up now.
I was going to a mindfullness meditation as Jonesboy suggested but it turned into "just sitting" xD as Horst suggested. And still, was just sitting after all, I did kind of imagine things that I would find suitable, at the end I imagined my self radiating with love and light :)
I did it for 12 minutes, then I stopped because I felt a pain in my chest of which I was talking about in another topic.
And icredibly I was still overloaded. I don't know what is your opinion on this, do you believe me, do you believe it is possible to overload from that? The overload was as usual as before, only less intesive. And the effects lasted allmost until the end of the day, they weren't good as with breath meditation but they lasted. Tomorrow I will do it for just 5 minutes, think that will be just fine. |
Edited by - Sungazer on Feb 10 2015 7:10:36 PM |
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Horst
Austria
30 Posts |
Posted - Feb 11 2015 : 2:21:56 PM
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Sungazer, have you tried meditating lying down? You can do the breath awareness meditation or a body scan lying on a yoga mat. This way takes even more of the subtle energy System out of the game and the chance to strain is less too.
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Feb 13 2015 : 7:46:29 PM
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Yesterday I tried to meditate while lying down, it was the same.
About "just sitting technique", I have found that I only feel that if I had done a meditation lately, as I did today beacause I meditated yesterday.
Tomorrow I will try Vipassana technique.
I think I have a bad karma, good things happen to me only when I don't them expect them, and when I expect something good like at meditation, I get excited like "everything's gonna be great again, I will be happy", it doesn't turn out so good.... And I mean in all situations of my life it is like this!! Before, I was sometimes paying a more attention to this, and it would happen even in the smallest situations, literally like 10 times a day, in anything!
Do you know anything about karma? |
Edited by - Sungazer on Feb 13 2015 7:52:26 PM |
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compassion
90 Posts |
Posted - Feb 14 2015 : 01:55:42 AM
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Hi Sungazer,
It seems you are learning a valuable lesson regarding expectations. They can be challenging to let go of, but generally the quality of life improves with fewer of them, because we are able to see life as it actually is, instead of comparing it to what we expect.
Regarding your overload problems, a question came to my mind just now. That is how much quiet time do you spend by yourself each day? I was thinking that if you were a person who kept yourself very busy and occupied (including passive activities like watching TV or listening to music), then suddenly taking a break from it all might feel quite overloading at first. This is because we confront all of the thoughts and feelings that we have not been noticing because of the other activities. If avoiding feelings has become a habit for us, it can be quite confusing and overwhelming to just stop all of a sudden, which is what we have to do with any sitting practices.
So just an idea that if formal meditation is too much right now, then perhaps just to spend 5-10 minutes each day by yourself, no distractions, watching thoughts and feeling and to see what comes up. Once we start to build this kind of relationship with ourselves over time, then the intensity of eyes-closed practice might become a little more tolerable for you.
Best wishes and good luck :) |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1734 Posts |
Posted - Feb 14 2015 : 07:11:12 AM
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Hi Sungaze
Compassion is right about expectations.
quote:
Originally posted by Sungazer
good things happen to me only when I don't them expect them, and when I expect something good like at meditation, I get excited like "everything's gonna be great again, I will be happy", it doesn't turn out so good....
That is not bad karma, that is perfectly normal. Analysing and problem-solving your way to happiness is the certain recipe for losing it. If you give your mind that task, it will always, always find discrepancies between what it and what 'should be'.
Instead, we need to live in the moment, enjoy and be grateful for the pleasant experiences, be aware and grateful for the not-so pleasant ones. Both pleasant and unpleasant experiences are our teachers. Have you happened to read Runi's poem “The guest House”? Here's part of it:
“This being human is a guest house.
Every morning a new arrival.
A joy, a depression, a meanness,
some momentary awareness comes
as an unexpected visitor.
Welcome and entertain them all!
Even if they are a crowd of sorrows,
who violently sweep your house
empty of its furniture,
still, treat each guest honourably.
He may be clearing you out
for some new delight.” |
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Horst
Austria
30 Posts |
Posted - Feb 15 2015 : 01:44:54 AM
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Hi Sungazer,
if you want to check out what Yogani wrote about Karma, see Lesson 343 - What is Karma?
For a great Website with lots of free audio guided mindfulness meditations, go to www.tarabrach.com.
Horst |
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Sungazer's experiences
