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sesile
Austria
7 Posts |
 Posted - Jan 31 2014 : 3:26:18 PM
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hi, although in overall this seems to be the best yoga website I have encountered so far, the exact information that I am looking for is very unclear, that is kechari mudra. the long article makes little sense, although as if it is all in clear English one cannot connect it to reality. IT WOULD BE VERY NICE TO ADD PROPER ILLUSTRATIONS TO IT! THE LINKED IMAGES DO NOT HAVE THE ANATOMICAL PARTS THAT ARE MENTIONED IN THE ARTICLE AND ARE OF LITTLE USE.
so, it is often mentioned that we can push the tongue back with fingers, however this does seem to be anything practical because i have to open my mouth to put the finger inside and that makes the tongue reach even less far! so it makes no sense even.
also, it is often mentioned that the tongue can find shorter way on the left or on the right, however in reality in my personal mouth nothing like this is happening at all. am I an alien or is this article true even?
also on picture for stage 4 the internal organs of the person have disappeared compared to the images of the other stages! are there any sensible images somewhere in internet? i link will be appreciated! i can't even figure out on which stage I am.
i think the kechari mudra article needs lots of improvement. sadly it is the only one i could fine...
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jonesboy
USA
594 Posts |
Posted - Jan 31 2014 : 4:12:49 PM
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Hi sesile and welcome to the forums!
I competely understand your fasination and frustration with Kechari Mudra. It is one area of research that kept bringing me back to AYP for it's knowledge before I started the practice of Yoga.
As far as the pictures go. I think Yogani has provided the best pictures to be found. It is not a common practice and showing a YouTube video of it would not help much.
If you don't mind me asking what is your current practice? Kechari can take years or decades to achieve.
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sesile
Austria
7 Posts |
Posted - Feb 01 2014 : 03:54:43 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by jonesboy
" and frustration with Kechari Mudra. "
" If you don't mind me asking what is your current practice? "
the frustration is the lack of clear information , not the mudra itself.
my current practice - trying to master Kechari Mudra
my questions
1. so, it is often mentioned that we can push the tongue back/up with fingers, however this does seem to be anything practical because i have to open my mouth to put the finger inside and that makes the tongue reach even less far up! so it makes no sense even.
2. also, it is often mentioned that the tongue can find shorter way on the left or on the right, however in reality in my personal mouth nothing like this is happening at all. am I an alien or is this article true even?
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woosa
United Kingdom
382 Posts |
Posted - Feb 01 2014 : 04:56:39 AM
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Hi sesile
It can be very frustrating when trying to get into kechari mudra. Trying to push the tongue up with fingers didn't help me either. Our anatomy is different so what works for some people doesn't work for others.
My advice would be to keep snipping regularly, and keep trying. One day it was will slip into place -- probably then you least expect it.
All the best! |
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JonnyQuest
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - Feb 01 2014 : 08:41:35 AM
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Hi Sesile,
I agree with you to an extent, having experienced some of the same frustration. Pushing with the finger will only work in facilitating stage 2/3 if you have already gotten the tendon that runs behind soft palate to "grab" the tip of the tongue, as is mentioned in the writings. And here, once that happened, it didn't even require the finger to go in to the hilt. Pushing with the finger prior to establishing the "lock" with the tendon just resulted in the tip moving all over the place--impossible to control it.
After the tongue is in the cavity, obviously, using the finger is irrelevant, as the tongue is Buried to its base and therefore inaccessible to the fingers.
In any event, here are some links to more information on kechari. Unfortunately, no diagrams either.
The first link is from Dear Victor, may he rest in Peace and Bliss.
The second link talks about Natural Kechari, which is The Only Way To Go. Yogani explains this perfectly. If there is no invite from Shakti to Shiva, meaning the Ecstatic Conductivity Rising, experienced (here) as Natural Sambhavi, Don't Bother Coming Up !!!
Best of Luck with this !!!
JonnyQuest
http://www.curebum.com/37/how-to-ma...a-technique/
http://thekundaliniprocess.blogspot...i-mudra.html |
Edited by - JonnyQuest on Feb 01 2014 3:57:42 PM |
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sesile
Austria
7 Posts |
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sesile
Austria
7 Posts |
Posted - Feb 01 2014 : 11:22:41 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by JonnyQuest
the finger will only work if you have already gotten the tendon that runs behind soft palate to "grab" the tip of the tongue,
yes, i am definitely beyond the second stage and i reach somewhere in the cavities behind/above, yet i do not numerous passages as expected in stage 3, am i just before stage 3 or ...? where i have reached it starts getting kind of narrow and more bone like surface. so according to some images i am already there, yet i am supposed to have reached the space between the eyebrows to reach the final stage. this can't be taken very literally ... so those of you who have reached the final stage, how did you figure out that you actually did? |
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yogani
USA
5201 Posts |
Posted - Feb 01 2014 : 11:46:17 AM
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Hi Sesile:
The reason you are having some difficulty grasping kechari is because you are trying to do it mechanically using the mind. Kechari is primarily a natural ecstatic act of a purifying and opening nervous system. When that happens, the development of kechari becomes automatic and self-evident, and answers to questions about it come from within in the form of ecstatic responses to physical movements we make.
Certainly some help from mind can be there, pictures, positions, how-to instructions (as in Lesson 108), etc. But the driving force behind kechari is not in the mind, or even in the anatomy. It is in the ecstatic response and emerging bhakti (spiritual urge) to take that further, not only with kechari, but with a wide range of interconnected mudras and bandhas reflecting and furthering the ecstatic response in the nervous system. We can feel it flowing from within, and we become partners in this divine process unfolding.
For this, a well-rounded daily practice of meditation, pranayama, asanas and other yoga practices is the prerequisite. Like other mudras and bandhas, kechari is as much effect as cause in this. Coming to it purely on a mechanical basis is putting the cart in front of the horse. It is problematic that way, and the results will not be optimal either. It is like trying to have sex with no arousal (an apt analogy). 
So the suggestion is to focus more on the prerequisites, and then kechari will be there as appropriate, as will other physical manifestations of natural ecstatic openings. When the tongue is being drawn back naturally by itself, even just a tiny bit, that is far greater kechari than mechanically getting into stage 2, 3 or 4 on a dare.
All the best on your chosen path. Practice wisely, and enjoy!
The guru is in you.
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sesile
Austria
7 Posts |
Posted - Feb 01 2014 : 1:08:24 PM
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Thanks a lot, yogani. Actually my questions were about the technical side since the bahkti aspect is well clarified in the lesson on khechari mudra already. Although your point about the ecstatic response and emerging bhakti is true, I really sincerely believe so, still I think that practitioners could be provided with clear technical instructions as well. I do not seem to find that particular part (fully explained) yet anywhere.
Some people like me simply prefer to know exactly what are they doing, I do not find in any way opposed to bhakti. I do not believe that keeping the exact technical specifications of the mudra secret or unclear will in any way increase or help my bhakti. |
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JonnyQuest
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - Feb 01 2014 : 5:38:26 PM
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Hi Sesile, and Thanks Yogani ! For the excellent explanation of "Natural Kechari" vs the "Induced" Method, here:
Yogani: "Like other mudras and bandhas, kechari is as much effect as cause in this. Coming to it purely on a mechanical basis is putting the cart in front of the horse. It is problematic that way, and the results will not be optimal either. It is like trying to have sex with no arousal (an apt analogy).
Realizing that this is chronically frustrating to a "Purely Technical", aka "Mental" approach to this, as we have all taken at some point, Yogani states:
The suggestion is to focus more on the prerequisites, and then kechari will be there as appropriate, as will other physical manifestations of natural ecstatic openings. When the tongue is being drawn back naturally by itself, even just a tiny bit, that is far greater kechari than mechanically getting into stage 2, 3 or 4 on a dare.
You will not find better information on kechari than you have already seen, it was until very recently a Most Esoteric Practice
Hint Hint "Practice" Sambhavi, as is suggested in the writings, such that it occurs naturally, which will result in an opening of soft palate as The Ecstatic Bliss State Beckons
As a final note, when kechari comes naturally, ie via this natural sambhavi, ALL THE FIREWORKS Are There  Whereas Pursuing it "unnaturally" as a physical/technical exercise, ie, something to be "attained" or "accomplished," via purely "technical" execution of the mudra, will likely result in NADA, which might/could lead people to ask, (as you have), why do this, what is the final step etc etc ?
If there is no invite from Shakti to Shiva, meaning there is at the moment no Ecstatic Conductivity Rising, experienced (here) as Natural Sambhavi, Don't Bother Coming Up !!!
The "Welling Up", or rising of Ecstatic Bliss/Conductivity, ie accumulation of Prana, at Medulla and thru Kutashta is the invitation to Have A Divine Union   
Best Wishes Sesile
Thank You Dear Yogani
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Edited by - JonnyQuest on Feb 01 2014 6:30:56 PM |
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sesile
Austria
7 Posts |
Posted - Feb 02 2014 : 03:14:28 AM
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Thanks for your time. Although my question was not answered I deeply appreciate the attention and care. People like you are the hope of humanity!
I did find a young boy on youtube who actually helped me. He is not as advanced as you people, but had respect for the simple fact that some people under certain situations may need a technical information on a given mudra. Desire to know the precise techniques does not always equal purely "technical" execution, there are all kinds of situations in life when certain information is needed and I happen to be in one of them.
sincere thanks to all!
silvia |
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Holy
796 Posts |
Posted - Feb 02 2014 : 1:54:16 PM
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Hi sesile,
Yogani is pretty right in this. Even though my tonge was physically able to go into kechari years before, it happened when the intensity of life force flowing reached some degree of intensity, then the tounge went up straight the middle path.
http://biology.clc.uc.edu/fankhause...PA281061.JPG
Looking at the picture, describe where your tounge can reach, or even better paint into it, then up the pic somewhere and we can help more. Practicing kechari alone most probably will not do anything at all, but you can still try.
Peace and happy practice :) |
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adishivayogi
USA
197 Posts |
Posted - Feb 02 2014 : 11:54:15 PM
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| kechari is defiantly worth the effort, don't give up. practices before and after kechari are like night and day for me. the energy was getting almost unbearable for me, but with the tongue up in kechari it is much easier to handle |
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pkj
USA
158 Posts |
Posted - Feb 03 2014 : 11:31:19 AM
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Hi Sesile
I think starting with breathing and some asansa will bring some balance before going to the advance level techniques like Kechri. As in my case i was doing Asans and breathing for a while then Kechri happened spontanously as the nervous system was getting ready. It is automatic process. As getting ahead before getting the system ready can cause some unbalanced symtoms. We all want to taste the nectar sometime it is worth to wait so that the system is ready.
All the best. |
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zero
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - Feb 03 2014 : 2:15:40 PM
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Hi Holy
Thank you for the great nasal picture. I annotated the picture and wondering if someone can give names to the annotated cavities and ridges. http://xyzgeneric.s3.amazonaws.com/...l_cavity.JPG
I can feel the center ridge marked as #2
If I move my tongue to the left or right, I feel two hole like depressions. Although I have not poked into it yet. Are these two holes the same as the marked 3 and 4 in the picture?
What are these cavities for? What is the target for stage 3 and 4?
Thank you |
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KellyN
75 Posts |
Posted - Feb 04 2014 : 12:46:35 AM
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Does one have to snip the tiny tendon underneath the tongue for Kechari to progress? I am not currently near this stage but I am reading the Secrets of Wilder and in it, the character snips. Sorry, but that made me cringe a bit! I am however, very intrigued by this practice but I am heeding the advice generously offered here, and will allow for it to happen naturally in time.
Thanks :)
Kelly |
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adishivayogi
USA
197 Posts |
Posted - Feb 04 2014 : 01:47:42 AM
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| for me personally snipping didnt work much in terms of snip a little and get a little further back. i did three largish snips all-together. when the energy demanded kechari it was easier to get in had i not snipped. I regret snipping. I feel it was completely unnecessary |
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KellyN
75 Posts |
Posted - Feb 04 2014 : 01:51:37 AM
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Gabe Miller, I am sooo glad you shared that
Muah!
Kelly |
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woosa
United Kingdom
382 Posts |
Posted - Feb 04 2014 : 06:45:43 AM
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Hi Kelly
It all depends on your anatomy.
I've been regularly snipping for about five years. I would never have progressed as much I have if I hadn't snipped.
Snipping instantly gives you more range of motion, but when the tissue heals, 1 - 7 days, you will lose the length -- time to snip again. Over a lot of time you will slowly gain more and more reach.
Initially it took a lot of talking myself into it to make the initial snip. It's not normal! but I can assure you it doesn't hurt, if at all, if you take it easy and don't get the garden shears out.
All the best! |
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sesile
Austria
7 Posts |
Posted - Feb 04 2014 : 07:51:17 AM
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| hi, thanks to all for the additional replies. actually a young boy on youtube channel called ManojTheYogi clarified the mudra question already, so I am good for now. |
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saan majumder
India
3 Posts |
Posted - Sep 19 2014 : 09:05:39 AM
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| Namah shivai , everyone, first of all i thanks all of you for giving so much information about this mudra, i need to ask a question , i have heard that during practicing kechari mudra practice , a person should not eat or drink sour and salt , it make lose of elasticity of tongue ...is it true..or if it not please suggest me what should not be eaten.. |
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Anibaru
Chile
72 Posts |
Posted - Sep 22 2014 : 09:53:20 AM
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We all experienced some frustration, for me it's been just a couple months since i'm able to perform Kechari mudra.
I took me two years, no fingers, no snipping, just talabya, and some "invented by me" frenum stretching procedures.
As some said, it is actually a process rather than a purely mechanic thing.
I had my frenum long enough for at least 7 months, but something wasn't allowing my entrance to the cavity. At last
one day the door finally opened ...
I insist that those of us who can do the mudra should get ourselves an MRI (ala Shailendra Sharma), so as to clarify
where the tongue goes!
Blessing to everyone |
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saan majumder
India
3 Posts |
Posted - Sep 26 2014 : 10:52:58 AM
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| Namah shivai, good idea of MRI , it should be done in order to see where it is.. |
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kechari mudra unclear
