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Roshan
Australia
5 Posts |
 Posted - Feb 09 2012 : 10:23:12 PM
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Hi all
I want to add chin pump to my daily practices, but I'm confused about the order of practices. Yogani mentioned in lesson 139 that when we add chin pump to our practices, kambaka should be done at the end of meditation and before rest. But what if we do Samyama and cosmic samyama? Should we do yoni mudra after DM or after samyama? My daily practices are as followed:
asanas,SBP,yoni mudra kambaka,bastrika parnayama,navi kriya, DM,samyam,and cosmic samyama.
Could you please tell me what is the best order for my practices after adding chin pump? |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2520 Posts |
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SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
Posted - Feb 10 2012 : 02:54:30 AM
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Dear Roshan,
I see you are new to the forum. Are you new to AYP practices as well? How long have you been practicing? I ask because if you are new, you may be moving too fast and likely to hit overload with these advanced practices. Less is definitely more in AYP. If you are an old-timer - disregard.
concerned
Sey |
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Victor
USA
910 Posts |
Posted - Feb 10 2012 : 04:51:06 AM
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| It does seem like you are doing alot of practices. Depth is better than quantity. That said, chin pump is a pranayama so I would do it as the last pranayama before meditation |
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AumNaturel
Canada
687 Posts |
Posted - Feb 10 2012 : 1:50:03 PM
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Hi Roshan,
From my understanding, which is based on the order it was introduced as well as the suggestions to where it fits best, jalandhara (chin pump) is initiated after already using intermediate yoni mudra. You then replace intermediate yoni mudra with its advanced form, which is now done after DM and samyama but before targeted bastrika, navi kriya and cosmic samyama. Navi kriya will then have to be moved and incorporated into SBP enhanced, or done separately after yoni mudra advanced.
So when you do it depends on whether you are doing intermediate or advanced yoni mudra, which in turn depends on whether you initiated jalandhara, which is what you're going for assuming you've already followed the guidelines on timing, self-pacing, and giving time for delayed effects and clunkiness specific to each practice. I'm not using that many practices myself, but by the book your routine looks well in order. |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4514 Posts |
Posted - Feb 10 2012 : 2:12:22 PM
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Hi Roshan,
Samyama always comes straight after meditation, so kumbaka goes in before savasana. 
Welcome to the forum. |
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Roshan
Australia
5 Posts |
Posted - Feb 11 2012 : 08:00:07 AM
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Thanks Maheswari, Nearoanoke's post was very helpful. It answered all my questions.
Hi SeySorciere. I'm not new in yoga. I had been doing transcendental meditation (TM) and alternate breathing for several years before I joined AYP three years ago. I started AYP lessons with SBP and then added other practices gradually. I really appreciate your concern, but I always self-pace.
Thanks AumNaturel, victor and Christi for your advice. So I do chin pump between SBP and DM, and Yoni mudra after samyama and before targetd bastrika. I'll start chin pump with 4 breaths and continue for several months to see what happens. |
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Victor
USA
910 Posts |
Posted - Feb 11 2012 : 4:28:16 PM
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| I disagree, Christi. One would want to go from the most physical to the most subtle in order of practices tehrefore start with asana (if youa re doing asana), follow with pranayama which includes spinal breathing with or without kumbhaka, bandhas, yoni mudra etc. Anything involving control of breath would fall under pranayama. this should be done before meditation with mantra as the meditation is about stillness rather than energy control or direction. Then samyama after quiet meditation and finish with rest (savasana) |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4514 Posts |
Posted - Feb 12 2012 : 11:24:58 AM
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Hi Victor,
It's a peculiarity of the AYP practice that when you add the chin pump you move yoni mudra kumbaka to the end of your practice session, before rest. It is here in the main lessons:
http://www.aypsite.org/139.html
"When we add the chin pump, we move our yoni mudra kumbhaka to the end of our practice, after meditation and before rest. "
So the question being asked in this thread is, "what happens if you are practising samyama and cosmic samyama, where does that fit in around kumbaka."
So what I am saying is, that as samyama always immediately follows meditation (in a practice session), then it would go: asana, SBP, chin pump, DM, samyama, C. samyama, YMK, savasana.
As for why this is done, I don't know. I can only imagine it is about spacing out two powerful pranayama practices so as to avoid energy excesses.
Christi
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Edited by - Christi on Feb 12 2012 11:32:06 AM |
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yogani
USA
5241 Posts |
Posted - Feb 12 2012 : 1:26:13 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Christi
Hi Victor,
It's a peculiarity of the AYP practice that when you add the chin pump you move yoni mudra kumbaka to the end of your practice session, before rest. It is here in the main lessons:
http://www.aypsite.org/139.html
"When we add the chin pump, we move our yoni mudra kumbhaka to the end of our practice, after meditation and before rest. "
So the question being asked in this thread is, "what happens if you are practising samyama and cosmic samyama, where does that fit in around kumbaka."
So what I am saying is, that as samyama always immediately follows meditation (in a practice session), then it would go: asana, SBP, chin pump, DM, samyama, C. samyama, YMK, savasana.
As for why this is done, I don't know. I can only imagine it is about spacing out two powerful pranayama practices so as to avoid energy excesses.
Christi
Hi Christi, Victor and All:
Yes, from the AYP perspective that is correct. And for those doing cosmic samyama, that would occur during savasana at the end, with suitable rest afterward, before getting up.
As for why yoni mudra kumbhaka (YMK) is moved to after meditation and core samyama when chin pump is introduced in the lessons, yes, it is to spread out the energy practices, particularly the kumbhaka (breath retention) aspect, which is present in both chin pump and YMK. Traditionally, both practices would be done before deep meditation, so you are also right Victor.
The aim in the lessons is to keep it as practical and doable as possible for anyone seeking to move to further advanced practice -- hence the separation in time between chin pump and YMK (I have done it this way for many years). Which is not to say all the energy related practices could not be done before deep meditation. Certainly they can. It is a matter of personal preference. The end results will be the same.
Related to this, a hybrid practice of YMK and chin pump combined is offered in Lesson 281, called "Yoni Chin Pump." This is for advanced practitioners who are experienced in the use of both chin pump and YMK. It combines the effects of both practices into a single practice. This would be undertaken before deep meditation. I have used this in lieu of the two separate practices at times over the years. It is one of the tricks of the trade I found helpful, and it is offered for others who might have interest in saving time in practices without giving up much on effects. There are a few tricks like that in the later lessons, offered as options for advanced practitioners.
As always, it is your call on how to proceed. And always remember to self-pace, which by now is a very familiar reminder, right? 
All the best!
The guru is in you.
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Victor
USA
910 Posts |
Posted - Feb 12 2012 : 8:30:07 PM
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| I have tried using the fingers on the nose during chin pump and it is a useful practice. I have found though that increasing pressure in the head or throat is undesirable but rather that the direction of energy and breath should make wherever you seal the breath to be very light rather than feel bottled up. I have practiced for a time with the throat actually slightly open during kumbhaka which helped open things for a short time until the chest opening made the seal in the throat very easy and light. |
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the order of practices
