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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
 Posted - Dec 26 2011 : 05:33:33 AM
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as long as one resists there is suffering....once you had enough (really enough) of self created suffering then only one will surrender....then doors that were closed start to open bringing solutions not necessary the ones you wanted...nevertheless all is good because there is a shift inside you....the fundamental question is: have you really had enough of suffering or u want more of it?
i had enough |
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Dec 26 2011 : 06:33:47 AM
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What is suffering? Just an attempt to change things from how they are. As long as there is a persistence of thinking that something is not wanted, or can be given up, then the suffering will continue. It's a fine line, a knife edge.
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nearoanoke
USA
525 Posts |
Posted - Dec 26 2011 : 09:29:45 AM
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Very true karl. As Adyashanti says...
Not wanting to suffer is the most common reason why many people start to do spiritual practices. But it will only take you to some distance. At some point along the path the orientation has to change from "not wanting to suffer" to "wanting to find the truth".
It is true that in some cases extreme suffering can make the shift but there is a great amount of letting go in all such cases (Tolle, Katie etc...). It is important that we be extremely honest with ourselves; when we inquire into our suffering, we do it for seeing the truth than doing it just to make the suffering go away. |
Edited by - nearoanoke on Dec 26 2011 09:31:02 AM |
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Radharani
USA
843 Posts |
Posted - Jan 03 2012 : 04:04:08 AM
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| Actually this relates to what I just posted about the Polar Bear Swim (cold), namely, "resistance" is the cause of suffering. I also discovered this recently in regard to physical pain. When there is no resistance there is no suffering. |
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Jan 03 2012 : 08:28:46 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Radharani
Actually this relates to what I just posted about the Polar Bear Swim (cold), namely, "resistance" is the cause of suffering. I also discovered this recently in regard to physical pain. When there is no resistance there is no suffering.
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vijikr
United Arab Emirates
413 Posts |
Posted - Jan 03 2012 : 10:32:47 AM
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| nice quotes on suffering! |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Jan 03 2012 : 1:29:17 PM
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dear Radharani
yes i read your polar bear swim post....but you are far more stabilized in awareness than i am
much Love to you and namaste |
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Radharani
USA
843 Posts |
Posted - Jan 04 2012 : 03:40:35 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by maheswari
dear Radharani
yes i read your polar bear swim post....but you are far more stabilized in awareness than i am
much Love to you and namaste
I am "stabilized in awareness" - ? wow! LOL! thanks.
Funny, the guys over at Taobums said I am "ignorant" and "new agey" (a real insult) and that I was "watering down" yoga and vedanta (as does AYP), and how dare my teacher call me "jivamukti"?! (I dunno, I assume it is part of his job as a guru to know that sort of thing.) They also said that yoga is NOT (as my teacher and also AYP state) a neutral technology that can be used by a person of any religion; they said it is purely Hindu, according to Krishnamacharya (?). This is very interesting, as my teacher lived in Krishnamacharya's house and studied with him for many years and is primarily responsible for bringing K's teachings to the west...! Well, I didn't respond, as I spend WAY too much time in online discussions as it is and I could see this would not go anywhere good...
For what it's worth, your energy feels VERY "stable" to me every time I tune into you! Your awareness is very bright and steady, at least from this distance. maybe it feels different from your perspective in dealing with daily life, etc. but, what the hell do I know?! LOL! |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Jan 04 2012 : 03:42:55 AM
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quote:
They also said that yoga is NOT (as my teacher and also AYP state) a neutral technology that can be used by a person of any religion; they said it is purely Hindu,
that is funny...it is a monopoly now? LOL |
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Jan 04 2012 : 05:52:38 AM
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Not a neutral technology ?
That's a strange turn of phrase. I'm thinking this is related to a question in another post in which there has been a watering down of Yoga in general leading to one mans conclusion that perhaps there is a need to spilt Vendant from Yoga completely. I can sort of understand why someone would approach that same conclusion by lumping it all as Hindu religion to get around this perception.
It's interesting because we can see this happening in Yoga throughout the West, where Yoga is seen as Ansana's with the spiritual aspect being considered as something that is far too esoteric and controversial to become part of that scene. Yoga is excersise as far as the majority in the West understand it, it's a commercial thing, another adopted money earner.
This always results in hard liner attitudes and fundamentalism which is equally destructive to the original philosophy. Nothing new there that's probably what's happening for those who now consider it as a Hindu owned, pure philosophy in order to protect it from watering down in any form.
It's a pity there are not more Vendanta teachers that thoroughly understand the philosophy. It is all a bit ragged with self appointed Gurus who have no official qualifications making it difficult to separate the wheat from the chaff.
I looked into becoming a Yoga teacher and was told I needed many physical education certificates and several years doing Asanas. When I asked about the philosophy of Yoga there was a less fixed answer and an admission that not many teachers paid more than the basic attention to this just for back ground. The reason is there is no financial incentive to teach this stuff. Ansanas, yoga mats, yoga clothing are commercially viable. None of that is required for the average Satsang. |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Jan 04 2012 : 06:01:19 AM
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i totally agree with all what you said Karl....but there are schools where you can do TTC without having physical education certificates and several years doing Asanas...the only requirement is to be eager to learn....
i can not understand why some "yoga clothes" are so fancy and expansive lolll.... |
Edited by - maheswari on Jan 04 2012 06:02:07 AM |
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Jan 04 2012 : 06:51:01 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by maheswari
iand expansive lolll....
have you been to Eirope or the USA recently  Expansive is definitely a growing trend.
In the UK there doesn't appear to be anywhere to learn the Vendanta, or any requirement to teach it other than as a bit of additional back ground to the physical aspect.
I have to laugh because NLP has gained more mainstream approval in recent years though it is still considered a bit fringe by old school business people. Some of the more esoteric bits have been extracted for more commercial consumption, I can only imagine the look on their faces if they knew what the Vendanta was all about.
I was thinking about this last night, it struck me that there really are two sides in this world. One side relies on force, suppression, materialism etc, the other has far less obvious potency and includes, or is based on the pure Yoga union which is more than just a technique. It's about unconditional love. Something very hard to get right and relatively difficult to action, when the most popular and easiest way of living is by the side of materialism. The dice is loaded so to speak.
I'm re-reading the Gita. I think that Battlefield is as relevant now as it was 4000 years ago. The easy way is that of Arjunas enemies (in effect the internal battlefield raised into manifesting as external). The more difficult way is that which Arjunas chooses, he does not want to fight but begins to understand that unconditional love means that he must fight. If he had not fought then his actions would have been as his enemies actions, he would have been no different. He sought not to gain but for the world to gain by his actions in a selfless way.
That is such a massive departure from the general philosophy that it has caused consternation amongst pacifists the world over. To fight wothout foghting, stillness in action. To do that with total purity of heart is enlightenment in its fullest sense, a place where only a few are able to go. The path I think is wide at the base of the mountain and utterly precarious the nearer the top we go. At the very top a fall is both easy and fatal. |
Edited by - karl on Jan 04 2012 06:54:05 AM |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Jan 04 2012 : 11:05:31 AM
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you see TTC is not the best way to learn vedanta....a good TTC give you the basics (Gita- Patanjali sutras-basic vedanta philosophy -study of Shankaracharya) also there is bhakti (chanting), karma yoga ...AND 4 hours of asanas daily...lolll....this is a good TTC, not the pure physical commercial one....
ttc is for basics,not more
the practice, the search and enquiry is on going,it is a life time journey ...so yes it is wide at the base of the mountain but very few have the persistence, the discernment and the transparency needed to make it to the top...those who "fall" will learn from their mistakes in their due time ... |
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Jan 04 2012 : 11:51:38 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by maheswari
you see TTC is not the best way to learn vedanta....a good TTC give you the basics (Gita- Patanjali sutras-basic vedanta philosophy -study of Shankaracharya) also there is bhakti (chanting), karma yoga ...AND 4 hours of asanas daily...lolll....this is a good TTC, not the pure physical commercial one....
ttc is for basics,not more
the practice, the search and enquiry is on going,it is a life time journey ...so yes it is wide at the base of the mountain but very few have the persistence, the discernment and the transparency needed to make it to the top...those who "fall" will learn from their mistakes in their due time ...
I understand now. To dispense with the I completely and take our place in (not with) God without distinction but as individuals also. Becoming both personal and impersonal. Doing what is to be done, just as a hand obeys the brain without conflict, without attachment to results or lack of results and retaining the individual human component. It is so far beyond merely the end of suffering and more a divine merging with God. It's more than stillness in action, it is divine action.
I feel this now, it' has entered my heart and woken it up and I silently watch with wonder as it expands outwards all on its own. It's own inertia and momentum, just like an egg is fertilised and the cells begin to divide without any intervention. Part of me yet distinctly different from me it follows it's own course. |
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Radharani
USA
843 Posts |
Posted - Jan 04 2012 : 5:06:46 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by karl
quote:
Originally posted by maheswari
you see TTC is not the best way to learn vedanta....a good TTC give you the basics (Gita- Patanjali sutras-basic vedanta philosophy -study of Shankaracharya) also there is bhakti (chanting), karma yoga ...AND 4 hours of asanas daily...lolll....this is a good TTC, not the pure physical commercial one....
ttc is for basics,not more
the practice, the search and enquiry is on going,it is a life time journey ...so yes it is wide at the base of the mountain but very few have the persistence, the discernment and the transparency needed to make it to the top...those who "fall" will learn from their mistakes in their due time ...
I understand now. To dispense with the I completely and take our place in (not with) God without distinction but as individuals also. Becoming both personal and impersonal. Doing what is to be done, just as a hand obeys the brain without conflict, without attachment to results or lack of results and retaining the individual human component. It is so far beyond merely the end of suffering and more a divine merging with God. It's more than stillness in action, it is divine action.
I feel this now, it' has entered my heart and woken it up and I silently watch with wonder as it expands outwards all on its own. It's own inertia and momentum, just like an egg is fertilised and the cells begin to divide without any intervention. Part of me yet distinctly different from me it follows it's own course.
Yes. Right there with ya, bro. Of course in this place there is only One of us.
Interestingly the guys at Taobums don't seem to think it is possible. I wonder why they do a spiritual practice if they don't believe that it works? |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Jan 05 2012 : 01:40:59 AM
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I wonder why they do a spiritual practice if they don't believe that it works?
maybe in order to engage in useless discussions |
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Radharani
USA
843 Posts |
Posted - Jan 05 2012 : 02:52:20 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by maheswari
quote:
I wonder why they do a spiritual practice if they don't believe that it works?
maybe in order to engage in useless discussions
OMG! LOL! |
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the fundamental question
