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elderberry
USA
49 Posts |
 Posted - Jun 11 2024 : 5:44:52 PM
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I've finally taken the next step in my AYP practices and integrated samyama. It's been going great.
I've had an interesting experience so far to say the least.
In some sense, I almost feel as if samyama "taught" me how to meditate.
During my first few samyama sessions, I experienced an enormous amount of inner silence between the sutras. Much more than I typically feel during standard meditation. It was lovely.
After the session, I found myself asking why this might be the case. Which led to me wondering, what exactly are the differences between a samyama practice and a meditation practice. It seems to me, it's essentially:
1. Using particular sutras with meaning behind them, vs. using a mantra devoid of meaning (AYAM)
2. Depending on one's typical pace of repeating the mantra, one likely takes a much longer pause between each sutra and each reach repetition of the mantra. We usually take a 15 second pause between sutras. I don't know about you guys, but I typically repeat "AYAM" a fair bit faster than that during DM.
3. The instruction to "release the sutra into stillness".
What captured my interest the most was #3. The intention to "release the sutra into stillness". Based on my limited experience so far, this is a bit of a fuzzy and difficult to describe intention, yet is has unbelievably profound effects. For whatever reason, that intention seemed to be key to me in residing in the stillness between each mantra.
I decided to perform an experiment during my next meditation practice. I would repeat the mantra as normal, however this time, with each repetition I set the intention to "release the mantra into stillness".
The effect this had on my meditation was profound. Firstly, I found myself much more in touch with the inner silence between each mantra repetition. Secondly, this naturally made me repeat the mantra significantly slower than usual, as I was bringing more awareness to the space between each repitition.
That meditation session certainly felt like one of my "best" so far. I felt deeply in touch with my inner silence, which I must admit, is often not the case.
Following this experience, I have two questions:
1. Is the intention to "release the mantra into stillness" during meditation, much in the way we do during samyama, a deviation from the standard AYP protocol of deep meditation? Or is this the way I should've been performing meditation all along? I can't tell if I'm having a bit of a breakthrough, or if I'm piling extra complications onto the inherently simple process of meditation.
2. Apart from using sutras instead of a mantra, what exactly is the difference between samyama and meditation, in practice? When I first learned the protocol of samyama, it seemed like such a "different" and new practice. But as I practice it more, it seems so unbelievably similar to meditation. Especially given the fact that we are not meant to ponder the meanings of the sutras anyways, we are just meant to release them into stillness. So in some sense the fact that they have meanings aren't super relevant as far as the implementation of the practice is concerned.
As a crazy example, lets say I decided I wanted to add a sutra to my samyama practice called "AYAM". I would repeat the sound of ayam to myself, releasing the sound into stillness. Would this not, in effect, be the same as deep meditation? Or are there other pieces present in samyama that are not present in deep meditation that I am not seeing? |
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SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
Posted - Jun 12 2024 : 06:28:13 AM
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Dear Elderberry,
There is a huge difference between the practice of DM and that of samyama. The mantra in DM is a vessel to bring your mind to stillness, introverting your senses to within, thereby cultivating Inner Silence aka the Witness. Your awareness is to remain on the mantra repetition - not in inner silence, unless that happens naturally without your being aware of it. If you become aware that you have slipped into inner silence and are no longer repeating the mantra, you go back to the mantra.
Samyama, on the other hand, is a practice to pick up a sutra (and the faint intention of it) from within to without, i.e. bringing their qualities back out into your daily life. The awareness rest in inner silence (cultivated during DM) and sutras carry you back out.
So DM is a 'without to within' movement while Samyama is a 'within to without' movement.
Using AYAM as a sutra rather than a mantra is certainly a deviation from Yogani's wisdom 
Best of luck in your practices and your explorations. It is how we gain true understanding after all.
Sey 
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TensorTympani
Sweden
100 Posts |
Posted - Jun 12 2024 : 4:38:14 PM
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Hi elderberry,
I very much have had similar questions about the essential differences and similarities between DM and samyama. What Sey explained was also mentioned by Yogani a few times in the lessons, here is one example: https://www.aypsite.org/176.html
I also remember reading Yogani's reply to someone posting in the forums (many years ago) suggesting/asking if it is ok to remain in silence for a while after each mantra repetition similar to samyama practice. This is similar to your idea (your question 1) to have as intention to release the mantra into silence. The reply basically was that it would be a wrong practice. It would not anymore be DM despite the superficial similarity and despite making the practice more similar to samyama. My guess is that such a wrong DM practice would still do something good, it might just be way slower and less efficient in cultivating abiding inner silence.
Regarding your crazy experiment, I was actually also tempted to do that and did it fact a few times. Not as a regular practice, but just to see what happens. It indeed feels very good to release AYAM into stillness just like a sutra. And it is even more fun to note the difference between releasing AYAM as the mere sound and "I am" as the meaning. The more subtle/fuzzy one can pick up these two versions of "I am" the bigger the difference seems to be.
So I think there is a big difference between DM and samyama while of course having also a lot in common. I recently pondered over the similarities and differences when reading a commentary of Patanjali's Yoga sutras https://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic...=19668#19668 |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4512 Posts |
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Dogboy
USA
2293 Posts |
Posted - Jun 12 2024 : 11:41:57 PM
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| That was worth the re-read. |
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elderberry
USA
49 Posts |
Posted - Jun 13 2024 : 02:11:35 AM
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Wow. Yogani often talks about similar topics coming up repeatedly on the AYP forum. Different people all touching the same elephant as he might say.
The forum post that christi linked discusses exactly what I was referring to in this post. Yogani's perspective on the topic is incredibly clear and valuable as always.
Long story short, like you guys said here, just keep repeating the mantra and for goodness sakes don't overcomplicate things. No "releasing into stillness" or any other mental layer on top of the simple process of repeating the mantra. |
Edited by - elderberry on Jun 13 2024 05:31:16 AM |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4512 Posts |
Posted - Jun 13 2024 : 11:19:08 AM
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Parallels Between Samyama and Meditation
