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TensorTympani
USA
69 Posts |
 Posted - Dec 04 2023 : 4:54:21 PM
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Hi andy, I don't have this fear and worry attached to these kind experiences, so I don't know for sure if AYP will help. But I would also guess that it will in the long run. Once you reach the stage of ``abiding inner silence'' were such emotions and worries could just be released into stillness whenever they occur, they will likely not have such a grip anymore. This releasing might then also naturally happen as self-inquiry gets going once this witness stage is fully there (see lesson https://www.aypsite.org/350.html). I'm not there yet, but I have seen glimpses of the witnessing state so that I believe it's in reach.
So I think AYP might move you beyond this fear even though it might also trigger it sometimes along the path.
It's not precisely on topic (it's about a different fear), this lesson https://www.aypsite.org/373.html contains a quote by Yogani I feel is somewhat in line with my attitude of accepting the possibility of never knowing:
quote:
The inner workings of deep meditation, or enlightenment itself, can never be "understood," because they are beyond the realm of the mind. It is the condition of abiding inner silence, ecstatic bliss, outpouring divine love, unity, and "I don't know." We can't have enlightenment without "I don't know." In time, we get used to being the unknowable behind all that is known.
Edit: Even though the last line resonates with my gut feeling, I would still never subscribe to such a statement. It's a good attitude. But I would still like to be even more open minded like John C Lilly:
quote:
Thus do I operate: If I see premature closing off of possibilities, as if something is impossible [...], I paraphrase, reorient the statements, so as to continue my own metabelief: The province of the mind has no limits; its own contained beliefs set limits that can be transcended by suitable metabeliefs (like this one).
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Edited by - TensorTympani on Dec 04 2023 11:48:47 PM |
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andy
Australia
10 Posts |
Posted - Dec 04 2023 : 8:30:18 PM
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Thank you Dogboy, that's reassuring to hear. Would you mind sharing what your experiences were like at the start and then what they have transformed to now after 10 years of purification? My experiences during these episodes is very separating, not at all the unifying perception that Yogani talks about throughout the lessons, in the advanced stages of purification.
And yes, grounding has been a hot topic for me and especially lately. I'm noticing the subtler clues more easily now when I'm not quite grounded enough. |
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Dogboy
USA
2202 Posts |
Posted - Dec 05 2023 : 12:17:47 AM
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Most of my purification symptoms involve weeping, and the sense I was watching myself weeping. There was a space between. This happened mostly in DM three years in; I was unsettled and broke meditation and went prone on a bolster, and something in that action broke a dam inside me. Luckily no one was home because it was a noisy ugly cry, reviewing my troubled life (was juggling so many balls at the time) watching and weeping. I was very weak but deeply calm in the aftermath.
You are likely to have different experiences, but the concept is the same. Whatever you have stashed away could bubble forth. It is a lesson in surrender.
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andy
Australia
10 Posts |
Posted - Dec 06 2023 : 07:05:56 AM
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| Sounds like a very profound unraveling. Thank you for sharing, Dogboy |
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Jayleno214
USA
87 Posts |
Posted - Jan 21 2024 : 07:57:06 AM
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Hi Andy. I can relate to your experience and it makes me feel I'm not alone seeing someone else all about this.
I too have recently experienced this you describe. Though I recently began, and stopped because of it, experimenting with psilocybin mushrooms, and I blame this experience on that. I am convinced this experience we share is what is described here as a "premature crown opening ".
To be clear, I never had a bad experience while under the influence, in fact it was positive and when I micro dosed the days were exponentially improved. It was as if I was at my sweet spot in yoga practices at the flip of a switch, or in this case the consumption of a fraction of a mushroom.
The problems began randomly at random times, and every single time is seared in my memory due to its intensity and lack of onset warning. The first time I was laying in bed on my phone, and wham, it's like everyone left (family was near) and I'm alone with this lifesucking presence on top of me. To be clear, no presence was visible nor imagined, just that the emotion I was feeling was of a DIRE EMERGENCY. SOMETHING IS WRONG!! But there remained a part of me that was still, I thank my 16 years of ayp.( Mostly just dm, have never veered past dm for long, though I've tasted the best ultimate orgasm through ecstatic conductivity alone in meditation, and still battle remaining celibate to achieve that again)
The still part of me stood there in shock analyzing what the hell is going on, I'm fine, my body's fine, but worse still, I felt with such certainty, such certainty, that telling my wife what I'm experiencing in this moment, and by doing so asking for help, would absolutely break the camels back and make it worse. I felt this knowing that acknowledgement through communication in that moment would cement that experience for longer, in fact I'm mincing words, it felt like it would remain forever. I also felt like I was going insane and would remainike this forever.
I lay there though breathing through it, incredulously analyzing the void of the feeling I was feeling, it was so consuming. It was taxing, it was detracting from me. Hence the presumption of a presence. It swiftly and slowly began to fade and normalcy swiftly returned. I felt so grateful to feel normal again that I realized feeling normal is such a gift.
This happened 4 more times. On the second time, after having contemplated the first time post-incident, I told myself I would face it, should it happen again, knowing it was temporary. Upon it coming on again, closing the world again and consuming me again, I said to it " go ahead, do your worst" with genuine bravery, and to my surprise, it instantly vanished.
In retrospect I didn't do that the 3rd and 4th times, I just tiptoed around it like you describe,as if to not wanting to break the shattered glass almost.
The third time I was at work, the fourth time I just sat through it, just letting myself be sucked. All 4 times consistently last around 5 minutes.
The 4th time really challenge my stillness. But I remained still and clearly observed the relationship between the experience and the tightening stress it was causing my body. I couldn't to ask for help anywhere, I knew that, in spite of the fact I would have traded an arm to make it stop. So I stayed still getting sucked and feeling every second of it. At one point, as I do regularly, automatically, and randomly, my body relaxed, as it does usually, and as it did, I noticed a reduction in the suck. I kept still until it subsided.
I haven't had heavy episodes like that since, it's been about 6 months since the last. And needless to say ive stopped the experimentation.
I've been doing this ayp for 16 years without anything but praise to speak of. Im certain it was the substances effect on my energy/chakras. At the moment and for weeks I didn't know what to say of the events. They were jarring like that. It was after time I came to the hypothesis that this is premature crown opening.
I can say with certainty I know what ayp does for me and I knew myself solidly until these occurrences. The extreme emotions and devastating emotions described in the lessons capture the essence of the experience. Ive got so much faith in the ayp system because of what it's done for me this far (and I've got miles to go), and cannot fathom the system not having a map to navigate that abyss of an experience that I trust them to know that particular extreme margin of an experience exists, and thus take them for their only explanation regarding/alluding (to) it.
For the record, I get plenty good boons from ayp practice. Have been faithfully doing 2 sittings a day for a decade and a half. The catalyst that made me venture into the mushrooms was a YouTube video personality named kilindi iyi. He spoke of being able to separate the spirit from the body and travel (trip) with such vernacular that it seemed aligned with my spiritual curiosity.
I never consumed more than the threshold amount so I never achieved that in particular, but I experienced enough to know they are called magic for a reason. Post sessions, My views on many things have been changed for the better, but the path demands what ayp practice provides: a stable practice and a positive spiritual trajectory.
However, Dark pessimism I didn have before endulging, lingers. Could still be the premature crown opening. Could be what the mushroom community calls cleansing. I can't say for sure, all I know is I had it good before endulging and do and don't regret taking them.
In some sense this darkness will make me stronger. In another sense if I knew this was in store you bet I wouldn't have began.
While in sessions though I was as if in perfect yoga practice. All the good qualities meditation and energy practices have on me and I know are the fruits of ayp were instantly activated in sessions, obviously when the effect wore off I was somewhat back to baseline, without the "yoga effects".
Sorry for rambling, just adding notes for those interested and for science.
At time of this writing, I do not recommend mushrooms for the potential after effects of premature crown opening. The effects during consumption were positive, but having said that, the potential post effects negate the positive tenfold. God knows what I would have done or thought or ended up mentally had I not the 16 years of ayp background to navigate the experiences.
Perhaps an accomplished yogi, with sturdy energy flows, and perhaps sturdy crown can experiment with no I'll effect. But at my current state I'm done.
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Edited by - Jayleno214 on Jan 21 2024 09:06:16 AM |
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Why am I so afraid?
