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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
 Posted - Oct 23 2009 : 11:30:39 AM
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Namaste Everyone 
Hope you are all having a swell Friday and that you are at peace.
I have come to understand/theorize that my own sub-conscious is "consciously" controlling the pace at which my nervous system is evolving, enabling a "smooth(er)" evolution for me. I realized today while reading Steve's post here: http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....D=6465#58853 that to unfold too fast would be disasterous. I had a brief vision of being "completely open" and "living fully from the heart" right now, and I was unable to function even somewhat normally. My ability to socialize normally was gone as I was pushing people away (due to their inability to relate to me) with the overwhelming Love, and I was unable to maintain a professional working relationship with my co-workers. I am wondering if the speed of our spiritual evolution is not so much governed by what we do, as by when we are "ready" as deemed by our sub-conscious mind(universe?). I think that with a stable set of spiritual practices, and the "right" mindset, everything unfolds exactly as it "should". Basically I see it as "stepping out of the driver's seat" in regards to our personal unfolding and letting the process take over. Understanding this is tempering the bhakti here and allowing me to relax a little as I can occassionally find myself a little "over-zealous" with the desire to evolve faster. Now I see that too evolve faster would not only hinder progress, but could actually stunt it and even reverse it. Anyone agree/disagree have any comments?
Love,
Carson |
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Konchok Ösel Dorje
USA
545 Posts |
Posted - Oct 23 2009 : 11:54:59 AM
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The outward expression of love for others does inhibit one's normal function with others. The powerful expression of love for all must be mediated by one's intellect, the natural capacity for wisdom.
In enlightenment, love and wisdom are together. Love is like the accelerator of a car, and wisdom is like the brake. You need both to drive the car.
The good news is, and I think you already know this, judging by your inquiry, that meditation cultivates both at the same time without you having to do anything extra.
The mind is by nature a unity if all, but most importantly a unity of compassion and wisdom.
When the outpouring of love causes you to feel a bit out of sorts, that feeling of a bit out of sorts is your wisdom saying, "hit the brake." |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Oct 23 2009 : 12:46:51 PM
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Funny I was contemplating this kind of thing today for a while.
The nature of impermance, constant change and what, if any, is the "speed of impermance".
We say everything is changing all the time, including us, and this is true. But what is the true speed of this impermance, if, as you imply, we could relax enough to just let it happen - what would happen?
Is the brake our fear of love?
Is the brake too much processing at one time producing overload?
Is there anywhere to go, but right here, and where is right here in impermance?
If we can enter the stream of impermance, with no active thoughts, with all our supposed imperfections and with the processing of these happening automatically - is this all we can be?
Or - do we want to be in the witness state and look at what is going on, do we have a choice? Do we choose this active intermediary state of witness because it is most beneficial for living in the world and assisting others.
anyway, just some ramblings, thanks for the thread Carson.
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Oct 23 2009 : 1:25:33 PM
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wholeheartedly agree
thank you for the thread brother Carson(f) |
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Oct 23 2009 : 5:12:04 PM
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Hi Carson
Thanks for this....loving perspective
quote:
I think that with a stable set of spiritual practices, and the "right" mindset, everything unfolds exactly as it "should". Basically I see it as "stepping out of the driver's seat" in regards to our personal unfolding and letting the process take over. Understanding this is tempering the bhakti here and allowing me to relax a little as I can occassionally find myself a little "over-zealous" with the desire to evolve faster. Now I see that too evolve faster would not only hinder progress, but could actually stunt it and even reverse it
Yes.....it is certainly the experience here that the desire to evolve faster is in itself like every other desire.....it needs to dissolve into silence. Since it is at odds with what already is. It is a judgement of what is taking place....to desire to evolve faster...or differently.....is always in relation to an idea of how it should be. And believing it and acting on it.... always brings suffering here.......
I learn from many different people and many different situations this way.
The desire.....and the love......I am not sure if I am wording this accurately.....since I am in the middle of it...at the same time as I am watching it....but here it is felt that when the heart opens more and more.....the love.....it has changed from being overwhelming when the desire is mixed in it....to gradually being more and more peaceful....at the same time as it is more and more encompassing . More and more it quiets the mind and calms the heart.....and the desire transforms into devotion....The wanting (for faster evolving or anything else)...if it is allowed fully....yet not acted on from the wanting itself.....it is also embraced fully....and now comes the difficulty of expressing....but something happens with the devotion in the middle of this........
It is a feeling of....rather staying somewhat unenlightened (whatever that is judged to be) and being allowed to be two....so that the sacredness can be....bowed to. That the devotion....the love for.... it/God....that it is possible to simply just love it/Himher.... and not mind the rest.....Like you say..it is already happening.
That "loving it"...is not overwhelming. It is very very quiet.....and I never knew that love could be like this. It is a sweetness inside.....and i hope that talking about it won't.....that it won't disturb it.....
And after so many times of pushing myself into openings.....whether it was divorcing before it actually happened of itself....or moving before it happened of itself...or resigning before it happened of itself......all that struggle that hurt so much....it is seen that even though it was not necessary to hurt this way.....it was in a way necessary so long as the stubbornness is in place. And this happens everytime around.....yet more and more sweetness seeps through. So even the "pushing" is transformed by the love into something that is fuel for the greater transparancy to happen. In other words...it is always the love that is in the driver seat.....or rather...is the driver seat.....it just is not seen...and therefor not felt...when drowned in the wanting....
Letting the process take over......I don't know....and never knew....how to do this. I am always coming back to this fact of not knowing.....And in resigning that job......somehow something is taken......and this sweetness happens instead....
So yes Carson....I wholeheartedly agree not to push yourself. I am so daft sometimes....and have payed dearly for it.....so heed your own inner guru and stay cool......warmly And enjoy along the way
PS. just like your baby :) |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Oct 23 2009 : 5:36:36 PM
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Thanks Everyone for the great posts....a lot to think about....or not
quote:
Originally posted by Katrine
It is a feeling of....rather staying somewhat unenlightened (whatever that is judged to be) and being allowed to be two....so that the sacredness can be....bowed to. That the devotion....the love for.... it/God....that it is possible to simply just love it/Himher.... and not mind the rest.....Like you say..it is already happening.
I think you pegged exactly what I was trying to say with this....I feel that I am at this point "allowing" myself to stay "as two" because I know that to fully let go into the One at this point would be disasterous.....and would likely shut down all forward progress at least for a while. Instead the "subconscious/universe/life" is slowly giving me, little by little, exactly what I can handle, as I am able to handle it. To allow myself to fully Be exactly what I Know I am, would be too much for me at this point I now realize. I am thankful that whatever is in charge of the flow of Life knows what it is doing, because if it was up to me I would probably eff it up royally
Thanks Everyone....
Love,
Carson |
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Konchok Ösel Dorje
USA
545 Posts |
Posted - Oct 23 2009 : 11:53:28 PM
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Sparkle, Too much love can cause problems. For example, you can end up feeling sick from it. You can become so overpowered by love for someone who is in pain that you become immobilized. Love is an emotion. Wisdom tempers this power. Also too much intellect is a huge problem, we already agree about that here. Love and wisdom in balance take one to the final goal.
Impermanence: Change happens against the background of the changeless. From the perspective of the changeless, there is no change, just movement, like turning a crystal and seeing all the facets. From the view of the crystal, it would look like a kaleidoscope with many patterns forming. So the rate of change is relative to the viewer, the attachments, etc. |
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Lacinato
USA
98 Posts |
Posted - Oct 24 2009 : 9:25:18 PM
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| A nice perspective on the importance of self-pacing... the comments on love and wisdom remind me of the balanced samyama practice as well. I feel the same way. When bhakti rages, I tell myself, no worries, you can pace yourself, no need to force or do anything you/I am not ready for. :) |
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Kirtanman
USA
1651 Posts |
Posted - Oct 24 2009 : 9:56:32 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Konchok Ösel Dorje
Sparkle, Too much love can cause problems. For example, you can end up feeling sick from it. You can become so overpowered by love for someone who is in pain that you become immobilized. Love is an emotion.
The term "love" can also refer to the unbound uplifting willing, knowing and acting that is the movement of the wholeness of awareness.
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Oct 24 2009 : 11:35:29 PM
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quote:
Yes.....it is certainly the experience here that the desire to evolve faster is in itself like every other desire.....it needs to dissolve into silence. Since it is at odds with what already is.
This thought of wanting to "evolve" at the fastest possible rate is definitely familiar to "me". Bhakti can get the best of us sometimes and we end up pushing inwardly against ourselves.
A few years back someone pointed out to me that this rushing towards opening or "enlightenment" causes an innate resistance, like leaving the hand-break on while driving and only serves to slow us down and suggested that when I finally let it go, I would really start moving at a fast rate. Interesting idea.
I can say that for the last few years I have often noticed that frequently when typing something, I would often rush and get to the end of the word not having completed the middle correctly, hence having to go back and retype the word properly. A few weeks ago, I was relating this story to a friend and came to realize that I felt there was a connection to my always trying to move so quickly through life and particularly through the evolutionary process of the mind. After making this connection and realizing the effect that rushing had on my life, interestingly enough, the typing issue has pretty much disappeared.
Life is truly the supreme teacher, particularly if we "listen" carefully. Sometimes though it has to yell or hit us over the head with a stick to get our attention! |
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atena
113 Posts |
Posted - Oct 25 2009 : 09:34:41 AM
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Yesterday I had a paradoxical experience with resistance/opening dynamic. I experienced a part of me which was resisting the part that was obsessed about enlightenment, opening or something. Like suddenly being confronted with the fact you're being suctioned to a black hole you just want out of the effect of that.
I watched that dynamic and understood it is centered around nothing. There is nothing in the eye of the black hole. Absolutely nothing to resist but the energy is there, doing that
Easing the resistance at a suitable pace is my spiritual work so nothing wrong with that, or maybe better put having a spiritual vacation and letting it ease itself with minimal effort is the deal for me
I sometimes like to enjoy or relax into the moments when there is no openings going on and to take it easy, then after a while I get bored... and want more action, and am able to have it. So this is close to perfect... Thx for starting the thread |
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Sub-conscious in control of the pace of evolution?
