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sushman
India
86 Posts |
 Posted - Feb 17 2008 : 1:36:08 PM
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After 4 - 5 months of celibacy, i dediced to try tantric masturbation. I ended up losing semen twice in the same night as I could not control it. I thought I would get depressed with that. But somehow did not feel bad (which is actually good  ).
Ok coming to the main question. After hours of tantric masturbation, my lingam got really swollen (mostly the skin) and it took almost 3 days or so get to normal size.
I had felt soreness (or pain) in the lingam in the past due to excessive masturbation. But this is first time, it got swollen.
Is this normal in prolonging the masturbation?
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Jack
United Kingdom
305 Posts |
Posted - Feb 17 2008 : 2:23:39 PM
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| I think hours of rubbing could probably cause some swelling. Try using lubrication! |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Feb 17 2008 : 3:11:58 PM
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Sushman said:
Is this normal in prolonging the masturbation?
I suspect you got swelling because you over-did the rubbing somewhat, though harmlessly. Maybe you rubbed too hard for too long or something like that. Or maybe you squeezed too hard on a lingam that was no longer hard enough to take it?
Sushman said:
I ended up losing semen twice in the same night as I could not control it. I thought I would get depressed with that. But somehow did not feel bad (which is actually good ).
No surprises there that losing semen twice in one night didn't hurt you in any way in this case -- you had 5 months celibacy behind you! Twice a night every night would be a very different story...
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Edited by - david_obsidian on Feb 17 2008 3:14:38 PM |
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Victor
USA
910 Posts |
Posted - Feb 18 2008 : 03:44:39 AM
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Yes, two things come to mind. First off, after no sexual activity to shifting to hours of stimulation is extreme to say the least! Try to be moderate. Try a half hour or so and then self pace accordingly.
You didn't say what lubricant you used but you do need something not too slippery but enough so that your skin doesn't get irritated. try experimenting with skin lotions of different types.the best I have found is a makeup remover called Albolene that comes in a tub at the drugstore. Good luck! |
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x.j.
304 Posts |
Posted - Feb 21 2008 : 02:20:14 AM
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Here's possibly a stupid question but I'll ask it anyway:
Since when has masturbation been a technique within the yoga tradition? I am aware that masturbation happens in Yogani's novel "Secrets of Wilder" but I am not aware that masturbation has ever been a technique of yoga as I look back on all the books on tantra and sexual yoga that I have read over the years. I thought that, on the basis of my previous reading, that sexual yoga involves a partner,...who embodies divinity in fact, for a devotional practice.
So, is masturbation peculiaar to the AYP system? or is there some precedent for this within the general literature of yoga? That's my question. Can anybody anwer that for me please? |
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yogani
USA
5201 Posts |
Posted - Feb 21 2008 : 10:32:15 AM
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Hi John:
Tantric masturbation is common and well-documented in the Taoist schools, which approach the cultivation of higher sexual functioning with less shyness and secrecy than other traditons. Since human spiritual capabilities are universal everywhere, similar renditions can be found in every tradition, though often less visible.
For example, in yoga, self-cultivation of sexual energy is only thinly veiled in techniquies like mulabandha and siddhasana. Once ecstatic conductivity is awakened, sambhavi and kechari mudras can be regarded as self-stimulation of sexual energy also. And so it goes...
All of this may be regarded as relationship with the divine lover within. This in particularly true as the process advances and becomes more internal. Then it comes to be called "internal lovemaking" and highly charged with bhakti, which accelerates the process of human spiritual transformation. Some of the prominent European nuns of the middle ages were known (through their diaries) to be quite ero-ecstatically involved with Christ within themselves. Was that relationship expressed in some outer ways? Only their habits and confessors knew for sure.
The guru is in you.
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x.j.
304 Posts |
Posted - Feb 21 2008 : 12:49:39 PM
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Hi Yogani,
Like I said, I am just pleading foolish stupidity in this question, but is there some reference you know of in the yogic literature re-
garding the practice of masturbation?
I am less interested in Taoism, if at all, because my interest is in yoga, but I'll bite. So where is the reference in Taoist literature to this?
Do you then have a specific reference in the available literature relating to masturbation by Catholic monastics?
I thought I had done a thorough reading of the available yoga literature and am very interested where masturbation is dealt with,
so thank you in advance for that information. That is my primary question. Thanks.
I'm just interested if there is a precedent you can direct me to within the yoga tradition literature that mentions masturbation specifically.
thanks,
.
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Edited by - x.j. on Feb 21 2008 1:15:46 PM |
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yogibear
409 Posts |
Posted - Feb 21 2008 : 12:59:41 PM
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Hi John,
There is a book called Taoist Secrets of Love by Mantak Chia. That is a good place to start.
Best, yb. |
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yogani
USA
5201 Posts |
Posted - Feb 21 2008 : 2:22:42 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by John C
Do you then have a specific reference in the available literature relating to masturbation by Catholic monastics?
Hi John:
"Ecstatic Confessions" by Martin Buber, which covers a range of ascetics over the centuries, west and east. The word "masturbation" is not used as I recall, but the ero-ecstatic element is plainly visible in quite a few of the writings. Highly ecstatic bhakti plays a key role in many cases.
As mentioned, yoga tends to be somewhat indirect on this, though the techniques mentioned already are clear enough in their purpose. If you get into the details of the life of Ramakrisna (see "Gospel of Ramakrishna" by M), the sexual element will be clear enough, though I don't think the word "masturbation" is used there either. However, something that might be called "spiritual orgasm" occurs often without the presence of an outer partner. It is an inside job.
A case for masturbation is not being made here. But the case for expansion of sexual function to higher purpose is -- by whatever effective means that are available within the context of one's sexual preferences. There is no judgment here on methods or lifestyle. We are only interested in results.
The operative principle and the methodologies used are all related to extended periods of pre-orgasmic cultivation. That is the central theme in the AYP Tantra lessons and the AYP Tantra book. It can be found in greater or lesser detail in many traditions.
The guru is in you.
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x.j.
304 Posts |
Posted - Feb 21 2008 : 3:06:32 PM
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Hi Yogani,
That's pretty much what I thought. So there are no specific references to masturbation. There are inferences regarding sexual arousal. And when we speak of sexual arousal for the likes of Ramakrishna, or for Christian monastics, in mystical trance or prayer, perhaps that is the spontaneous sexual arousal that occurs without masturbation.
I am sorry if it seems I am belaboring this question, but I think it is interesting to understand a technique in context, as to whether it comes out of the traditional and ancient yogic practices or is a particular practice within AYP itself. And it's good for new developments to occur. We don't need to stay with what the ancients discovered necessarily, if something is a new addition to Tantra, within AYP for example. |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Feb 21 2008 : 3:55:42 PM
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John C said:
We don't need to stay with what the ancients discovered necessarily, if something is a new addition to Tantra, within AYP for example.
Good Lord John, if Yogani claims Tantric Masturbation as his own invention, the ghosts of 100,000 wanlcers would descend on him instantly. 
I can't lead you to ancient texts on the matter, but I can say a few things: one, I am convinced, even without sources, that many yogis practiced it. The reasons I am convinced they practiced it is that, if you find sexual tantra itself useful and effective, it is simply an obvious thing to do a certain amount of if you don't have taboos around it; even if you do have a partner, training yourself is an obvious thing to do. No sportsman of any stripe confines himself only to experience in the field.
Secondly, if you find the process effective with a partner, there is a good chance you will find it effective without one. Which brings up the same 'why not?' question about tantric masturbation as for any yogic practice.
Thirdly, there are reasons why yogic texts on the matter may be difficult to find; there has been a huge taboo against masturbation in many cultures. Strange though it may seen to our contemporary ears, I have heard that some cultures in India looked down on masturbation more heavily than on the use of prostitutes; our culture would tend to have it exactly the other way around.
Fourthly, I have actually heard 'on the grapevine', that certain Yogis/Gurus practiced this. Swami Kripalu is an example I've heard of. As far as I know, it was just one of those things that is told behind closed doors because of the taboo.
And lastly, I'd suggest another reason why this was suppressed. The guru system and everything that goes with that in practice. In the guru system, the image of the guru is carefully cultivated and heavily invested in. While it is possible to have an image of the great guru in tantric embrace with Shakti, and still keep the guru on the pedestal, the image of the guru having a wanlc for himself (tantric or not) is another story entirely!
The Guru is Within You (and us all).
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yogani
USA
5201 Posts |
Posted - Feb 21 2008 : 4:20:47 PM
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Hi John:
Nothing is new under the sun.
I would not claim that anything has been "invented" within AYP. It is an integration and optimization of methods that have been around for thousands of years, including the spiritual use of masturbation from the ancient Taoist schools, and elsewhere. It is not presented here as a "must do." Rather, it is presented as one of many options for pre-orgasmic cultivation according to one's lifestyle.
If anything is new in AYP it is the flexibility to look objectively across sectarian lines and review causes and effects in relation to known capabilities we all have for human spiritual transformation. That, and open access for everyone to information on the exploration, the means, and the results. Even these elements of AYP are not new. Many have sought to do the same in the past, but were thwarted by the forces of sectarianism and ignorance. Now, in the information age, we can do more, so we will.
The spiritual practices side of what eventually became AYP has been a lone project I was engaged in for many years, based on extensive research, numerous initiations, and personal experiments. All this writing is an attempt to pass it on so others can carry the investigation and applied knowledge much further in the future. It has been happening already through the independent research of many who keep in touch here, which brings me great joy.
The guru is in you.
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avatar186
USA
146 Posts |
Posted - Feb 23 2008 : 3:07:48 PM
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what has been invented, is the grouping of the methods and somone going, hey, pay attention, you can combine them. like maha bandah.
plus ive never seen spinal breathing anywere but here, though it does make since.
my question is, can you do spinal breathing, and the microcosmic orbit at the same time. haha |
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sushman
India
86 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2008 : 08:58:30 AM
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John,
thanks for stealing my thread...just kidding :)
Masturbation is still not widely and publicly accepted in INDIA even now.
So, not finding any references to that in scriptures or yogic methods (from INDIA) is not a suprise. If they did, it would have not gotten the public approval and yogis would have got branded and banned.
I am not intending that this was a technique used in those days. But just suggesting that even if it was used, it would not have made to the books.
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Edited by - sushman on Mar 03 2008 12:06:57 PM |
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sushman
India
86 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2008 : 09:01:46 AM
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thanks to all who responded to my query.
I never used a lubricant for masturabtion. Probably, I will try one next time when I do it.
So far, i have not tried tantric masturbation after last time. not thinking about it right now. |
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Swollen Lingam
