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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
 Posted - Dec 23 2007 : 02:19:36 AM
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The Illusion of Friendship
What is friendship?
Friends were people I associated with because I felt a need to talk, to laugh, to share stories. Ultimately, friends filled a void in me, like they eased the ache of loneliness in my heart.
Often I would feel the need to contact a friend and have a chat or just socialise in general, have a bit of fun.
Last Tuesday evening I experienced a clearing in my energy. The result was a drive to clear more of the accumulated baggage in my outer world. This has included a constant urge to clear and clean up my physical house, my office, throw out old files, get rid of books, all the usual feng shui kind of stuff.
Then the nagging feelings of wanting to contact friends and the associated thoughts and feelings that went with this, began to hit home.
My attachment to wanting friends to fill this “void” in me became very apparent. The effect of the clearing began to take hold and I simply didn’t want this baggage any more.
The result was a fair bit of pain in my heart and gut. This went on for a couple of days, with various feelings associated with it. The most successful method adopted for coming to terms with it was Byron Katie’s the “work”. She is supreme when it’s time to get radical.
So now I have no pain and I feel I can let my friends go. They can disappear into the sunset and I will still love them, but love them only in terms of how I love myself.
I still haven’t finished this and I feel some sadness, perhaps grieving this loss.
Does anyone relate to this?
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Kyman
530 Posts |
Posted - Dec 23 2007 : 02:47:27 AM
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Hey Sparkle,
I can definitely relate. Often I worry for my family and I have to remember not to become too attached. No one belongs to anyone else, we have no claim over any thing. As you say, we can only love others in respect to how we love ourselves.
That sentence does seem to aggravate the mind a bit, move it, or sadden it. But at the same time we are viewing our friends and family in a different way we are also taking a new perspective on ourselves, and this self seems to have a pretty efficient way of doing things. There is a definite sense that what I thought most of my life, what I learned and believed as a child, is not actually true. There is some loss of illusion here, yet we can see the truth for the first time, as we examine the past. We see it with fresh eyes, penetrating it more deeply than we ever did with our personalized perceptions.
I suppose these are very deep layers that have always acted as the bases of our identity. And this was a natural part of our development. Now they are no longer needed, or they must be incorporated or integrated into our higher perspectives. What use do these things have when we forgive relationships altogether as an illusion?
The sadness will surely pass. The type of self sacrifice you are making right now will only deepen your sense of oneness with others. The mind's fragmented view can no longer sustain, but it only shatters to pieces upon the eternal backdrop of love.
I have a brother who is military and may or may not come face to face with danger. I cannot own him, and knowing this makes me appreciate him more. He serves the will just like I do, I can only view him within the context of our essential nature.
Another positive to this kind of release is the further confirmation that we are not separate beings. We are on the verge of an endless reservoir of strength, here. |
Edited by - Kyman on Dec 23 2007 04:52:02 AM |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Dec 23 2007 : 08:34:31 AM
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Thanks for the confirmation Kyman, beautifully expressed.
quote:
I have a brother who is military and may or may not come face to face with danger. I cannot own him, and knowing this makes me appreciate him more. He serves the will just like I do, I can only view him within the context of our essential nature.
Yes, this is a difficult one, when someone close is in danger. I know this one with our two teenage kids, ready to go out into the world. I still have that one to cross
Cheers
Louis |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Dec 23 2007 : 09:11:19 AM
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I have not had this issue with friends, but I lately had it with horses - who have filled my void.
You know... It's strange. I thought I would quit horses all together. It really seemed as if they were to be feng shuied out of my life. Attachments were cut off. I was sad, I cried, I stayed in that sorrow and accepted what was happening.
Then... what happened was... this body was lead to the stable again. Life pushed me to go and do the annual "audition" at the cavalry where I've been helping out with the horses for years, in order to keep my permission to ride there. A few hours before the audition I realized... it IS over, though. The riding IS over for ME. But the riding is not over for this body. I am no longer going there to ride to have fun for my own sake or to fill my void. ... What hit me with a great humility was that:
I'm going there only to serve those horses...
Ego-me has lost the horses, but the horse riding happening in life is not gone. Life just obviously thinks this body-mind is still needed there at the moment. The horses rarely get handled by persons who are kind and loving to them, new frightened recruits handle them mostly all year round.
When I had let go and surrendered and lost the attachment, abundance showed up, I suddenly found myself engaged in a lot of activities at the stable.
We are to lose everything. We cannot own anything. Nothing can be kept, all has to be surrendered. We have to die for this love. But it doesn't mean life necessarily changes that much. It's just "Ego-I" who is no longer DOING it for its own sake, because it WANTS or NEEDS it. We will still have friends, go horse riding and do lots of joyous things, it's just not "US" who are doing it or owning it anylonger... It's just that tiny, simple change of perspective... and we go free from all suffering that comes along with ownership and loss.
I have now gotten one horse to take care of during the spring - one of the meanest horses who bites, kicks and pushes you up against the wall in the box, preferrably all at once!  Logical. Very logical... Very intelligent by life force, huh? That's where I'm needed the most! I just came home from a first encounter and a ride on that horse. It tried all those dangerous things when I handled it in the box, but I just had to stay present, stay aware and and empty my mind, then it became so calm and kind. It seemed very surprised not to be hit back, but gently stroked when it tried to bite. It stood absolutely still in the end and it 'snuggled' me when I left.
quote:
So now I have no pain and I feel I can let my friends go. They can disappear into the sunset and I will still love them, but love them only in terms of how I love myself.
Lovely. I bet they won't go anywhere. I bet they're gonna love you more than ever after you have let go!
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Edited by - emc on Dec 23 2007 09:18:27 AM |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Dec 23 2007 : 10:43:28 AM
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Beautiful post EMC. Thank you.
Friendship is a mind concept. It's more of wanting, needing, controlling. My definition of friendship is not your definition of friendship and it maybe completely different from a third person's definition of friendship. So yes, when ego drops.. the definition of friendship (a mind story) goes with it and what is left behind is the pure love of being. The uneasiness comes because the mind is not sure how to deal with this new perspective (a vacuum created when a story drops) and is trying to build a story to justify your feelings (a vacuum needs to be filled by another concept.. the mind does not get "nothing"). If you don't try to understand it.. you will get used to this new perspective and it wont feel uncomfortable for much longer.
With every opening, comes confusion.. because an opening is beyond mind.. and if we just let it be.. it becomes a part of our everyday life.. if we cling to it with mind and try to figure it out, it becomes just another story that will need to be dropped sooner or later.
There was a video I wanted to share for awhile.. maybe now is as good a time as any other..
It is by late Father Anthony De Mello.
Talking about LOVE without attachment.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AoV...ture=related |
Edited by - Shanti on Dec 23 2007 10:54:40 AM |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Dec 23 2007 : 5:06:59 PM
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You guys are so great,
I don't know what I'd do without you --- whoops
Emc, thank you for that great post. It is wonderful how the letting go resulted in your new and more profound experiences.
The way it looks right now, I'm not looking for anything out of this, whatever comes along, will come along.
When I stand still I can still feel the process going on inside me and I'm just letting it happen.
What I have noticed is that I am more present with the people I am with, with the kids, with the wife, with people in the supermarket. This feels right to me, and it feels more loving both ways from me and from others.
"We are to lose everything. We cannot own anything. Nothing can be kept, all has to be surrendered"
Yes, I'm seeing this more and more, how true it is.
Shweta, its ages since I heard anyone talk of Anthony DeMello. That u-tube video is great. I have read a couple of his books in the past but obviously didn't get him properly then. It makes a lot more sense to me now
What he said about attachment desires got my interest and after a little searching got one of his other videos which explains it more fully : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pYUVw1i-jw&NR=1
quote:
Friendship is a mind concept. It's more of wanting, needing, controlling. My definition of friendship is not your definition of friendship and it maybe completely different from a third person's definition of friendship. So yes, when ego drops.. the definition of friendship (a mind story) goes with it and what is left behind is the pure love of being. The uneasiness comes because the mind is not sure how to deal with this new perspective (a vacuum created when a story drops) and is trying to build a story to justify your feelings (a vacuum needs to be filled by another concept.. the mind does not get "nothing"). If you don't try to understand it.. you will get used to this new perspective and it wont feel uncomfortable for much longer.
With every opening, comes confusion.. because an opening is beyond mind.. and if we just let it be.. it becomes a part of our everyday life.. if we cling to it with mind and try to figure it out, it becomes just another story that will need to be dropped sooner or later.
Thanks Shweta ..... just let it be...
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Dec 24 2007 : 07:08:29 AM
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I missed this before:
quote:
Shanti said: If you don't try to understand it.. you will get used to this new perspective and it wont feel uncomfortable for much longer
This is full of paradox for me and flies in the face of my current understanding.
I can see though that I need to just live with the paradox and just experience what is going on. |
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Guy_51
USA
170 Posts |
Posted - Dec 24 2007 : 10:00:09 PM
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Hey Sparkle
I just want to say Merry Christmas to you and let you know I think you are terrific.
Guy |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Dec 28 2007 : 3:52:38 PM
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Dear Friends
Friends are friends no matter whether there is illusion involved or not. Ultimately everything we do, say, think, hear, see or feel is an expression of love, of love’s longing for itself.
Friends are not something to be caste aside as objects of illusion, they are real people communicating with real people, communicating from a core of love. Illusion is not in it, illusion does not exist, but friends exist.
Friends exist to love each other deeply, to communicate with all the foibles of life’s longings, to carry each other to unity.
Communication brings unity, brings peace, brings love.
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Dec 28 2007 : 6:31:06 PM
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Of course friends are friends.. its the attachment to the definition that your ego makes of what friendship is or should be, that is the illusion. When you can drop the attachment and desire surrounding your friendship, what is left behind is love. Like I call it adjective-less love..
No one is telling you to cast aside friends Louis.. that is not what we are about now are we? It's all about practicing Yoga and then living your life to its fullest.. which includes friends along with family and work etc. And yes..
quote:
Louis said: Friends exist to love each other deeply, to communicate with all the foibles of life’s longings, to carry each other to unity.
Communication brings unity, brings peace, brings love.
...just without the illusion of attachment and desire... Not for anyone else's sake.. but our own sake.. so we can experience life to its fullest.
This is what this post is about.. relationships and unconditional love , esp something that EMC talks about here.. She is talking with respect to a certain man in her life right now.. but this is how every relationship you have in this life can be.. and you can fit anyone into these words.. you can feel love for anyone like this when you have dropped attachment and desire. Replace the words "the man" with "the friend".. Really it's not about the form of the person EMC is talking about.. it's not the object of her love that she is experiencing.. its about the experience of Loving What Is.
quote:
Originally posted by emc
There are no demands, expectations and therefore no disappointments. There's no missing or longing when we don't see each other, there's no hoping to do anything special in the future. There's no fear. There IS NO FEAR of any kind. Everything that happens is ok, perfect and what should happen. Even that which seems as possible problems or obstacles are no problems when we look closer and remember to love what is.
quote:
Originally posted by emc
Yes, my alarm bell is the old emotionality - feelings - bringing a contraction and closing the flow down. Feelings of any type - negative or overwhelmingly positive, as when "madly in love" in the traditional sense. There's instead a calmness, total joy and openness and an unshakeable acceptance and love of what is.
quote:
Originally posted by emc
Mutuality is overrated. It only takes ONE to have a great relationship, and that's me. The mirroring comes from me. And the beauty of that mirroring is unnameable, there are no words to express the softness, gentleness and beauty, which with such abundance is flowing through the mirror...
quote:
Originally posted by emc
Abundance... when we drop our desires and hopes, life gives us more than we could possibly imagine. It's truly a 'love-without-an-object', Jim. The man in front of me with fire in his eyes is not the object of my love. The love goes on everywhere, inside. The man and his mind will most certainly not behave according to my dreams, and that is totally irrelevant. That's not what's going on here - no minds comforting and reassuring eachother in a casual emotional love play... It's itself having a love affair with itself, celebrated by a union in flesh...
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Edited by - Shanti on Dec 28 2007 6:56:42 PM |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Dec 28 2007 : 8:14:03 PM
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Shanti said: quote:
Of course friends are friends.. its the attachment to the definition that your ego makes of what friendship is or should be, that is the illusion. When you can drop the attachment and desire surrounding your friendship, what is left behind is love. Like I call it adjective-less love..
No one is telling you to cast aside friends Louis.. that is not what we are about now are we? It's all about practicing Yoga and then living your life to its fullest.. which includes friends along with family and work etc. And yes..
quote:
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Louis said: Friends exist to love each other deeply, to communicate with all the foibles of life’s longings, to carry each other to unity.
Communication brings unity, brings peace, brings love.
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...just without the illusion of attachment and desire... Not for anyone else's sake.. but our own sake.. so we can experience life to its fullest.
This is what this post is about.. relationships and unconditional love , esp something that EMC talks about here.. She is talking with respect to a certain man in her life right now.. but this is how every relationship you have in this life can be.. and you can fit anyone into these words.. you can feel love for anyone like this when you have dropped attachment and desire. Replace the words "the man" with "the friend".. Really it's not about the form of the person EMC is talking about.. it's not the object of her love that she is experiencing.. its about the experience of Loving What Is.
quote:
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Originally posted by emc
There are no demands, expectations and therefore no disappointments. There's no missing or longing when we don't see each other, there's no hoping to do anything special in the future. There's no fear. There IS NO FEAR of any kind. Everything that happens is ok, perfect and what should happen. Even that which seems as possible problems or obstacles are no problems when we look closer and remember to love what is.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by emc
Yes, my alarm bell is the old emotionality - feelings - bringing a contraction and closing the flow down. Feelings of any type - negative or overwhelmingly positive, as when "madly in love" in the traditional sense. There's instead a calmness, total joy and openness and an unshakeable acceptance and love of what is.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by emc
Mutuality is overrated. It only takes ONE to have a great relationship, and that's me. The mirroring comes from me. And the beauty of that mirroring is unnameable, there are no words to express the softness, gentleness and beauty, which with such abundance is flowing through the mirror...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by emc
Abundance... when we drop our desires and hopes, life gives us more than we could possibly imagine. It's truly a 'love-without-an-object', Jim. The man in front of me with fire in his eyes is not the object of my love. The love goes on everywhere, inside. The man and his mind will most certainly not behave according to my dreams, and that is totally irrelevant. That's not what's going on here - no minds comforting and reassuring eachother in a casual emotional love play... It's itself having a love affair with itself, celebrated by a union in flesh...
Thanks Shweta, assume that I know all that and please read the post again. |
Edited by - Sparkle on Dec 28 2007 8:14:59 PM |
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sadhak
India
604 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2007 : 05:12:25 AM
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Hi Sparkle,
I can relate to what you posted first. And then everything else everyone else posted afterward.
Friendship used to be a very important aspect of my life...whether with people, animals, or inanimate things. It continues to be, for the moments that I am in interaction with them.
And everything else has been already said. So I needn't bestir myself. What are friends for? |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2007 : 08:04:54 AM
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quote:
Sparkle said: Dear Friends
Friends are friends no matter whether there is illusion involved or not. Ultimately everything we do, say, think, hear, see or feel is an expression of love, of love’s longing for itself.
Friends are not something to be caste aside as objects of illusion, they are real people communicating with real people, communicating from a core of love. Illusion is not in it, illusion does not exist, but friends exist.
Friends exist to love each other deeply, to communicate with all the foibles of life’s longings, to carry each other to unity.
Communication brings unity, brings peace, brings love.
If people do not relate to this then tough. It was not written from the head but purely out of an open heart. As I wrote I wept and wept afterwards.
If you lay aside the story of who you think I am and read with an open heart and clear mind you might see it differently, and then again you might not - either way I don't care. |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2007 : 1:20:28 PM
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Sparkle, what you wrote is beautiful, particulary this:
"Ultimately everything we do, say, think, hear, see or feel is an expression of love, of love’s longing for itself."
To me then, what you wrote goes for all non-friends and people I don't even know as well. Not only friends.
"Friends are not something to be caste aside as objects of illusion"
This expression seems to have an underlying assumption - that if anything is illusion it is to be cast aside... Is that true? Where does that assumption come from? In my experience, the whole physical world, existence is a type of illusion. That goes for everything in it. That doesn't make it less valuable. On the contrary, when that is seen, it gives birth to an immense love of it! Of movement, of form, of every being present - friends or non-friends. It gives birth to a gigantic embrace of it all, of the totality, not casting away a tiny bit of it. Impossible!
"Friends exist to love each other deeply, to communicate with all the foibles of life’s longings, to carry each other to unity."
Yes, friends are there for that, and all other beings and things happening in life! I have a very difficult time nowadays to see something I encounter as anything but a friend. My thoughts are friends, the trees are friends, the house I live in is my friend. Gosh, it's letting me step on it every day! Everything around me is so friendly, loving and kind. And it is all welcoming me home. Friends are truly here to love deeply!
Thank you for your contributions in this thread, and con gratulations on your deep work and realizations on your friend issue!!!
PS: "Communication brings unity, brings peace, brings love."
True, and a very good reminder. Clear communication is unvaluable - remembering the non-violent communication discussions we've had...
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Edited by - emc on Dec 29 2007 1:25:51 PM |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2007 : 2:38:06 PM
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Hi Emc
Thanks for the comments: Your breaking it down into segments and analysing it, is tempting to engage in.
When I look at it myself, I see words like friends, love, communication, illusion, no illusion, all bungled into one expression.
What you said about everything being your friend is beautiful, the trees, the grass, the moon, the wall - so true.
Everything is our friend and everything is love when we are in the now.
Some of these "friends" however seem to gather more closely, are more closely connected, connected through communication, whether verbal, written, energy or whatever. So whilst everything is our friend some friends are more particular.
Those particular friends probably have similar patterns in their energy that can create attachments and thereby also create the ground for healing those energy distortions in us. This is all healed through communication, so I see friendship and communication as mutual. (I'm sure you can say this a lot better than me).
Yes, this work has been extraordinarly deep and healing for me and I'm very grateful to all my friends here who have contributed - you being one of them of course emc.
I've probably been pushing myself a lot over the past few months, being more in retreat mode and allowing the raw edges to show themselves more nakedly. I know I can step back into a nice comfortable witness state or equanimity any time I choose. I've also been self pacing these extra practices and have managed to keep them reasonably balanced, sometimes by leaving out meditation for a couple of days.
What you describe in your post on relationships, quoted by Shweta above, is equinimity to me. The deeper the work, the more unshakable the equinimity or witness.
The temptation now is to rest and ease back, but I'm enjoying the fruits of the practice, as are the people around me -most of the time
PS. Since I don't have a lot of conductivity going on I probably depend more on self-inquiry with this sort of stuff.
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Edited by - Sparkle on Dec 29 2007 3:10:01 PM |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2007 : 3:49:21 PM
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quote:
Those particular friends probably have similar patterns in their energy that can create attachments and thereby also create the ground for healing those energy distortions in us.
Sounds true to me! The closer the person, the better mirror! The partner being the superior guru!
quote:
I know I can step back into a nice comfortable witness state or equanimity any time I choose.
Who is the one stepping back and having the choice, and who is the witness? |
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Hunter
USA
252 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2007 : 4:01:18 PM
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| Great post everyone. I thoroughly enjoyed reading this topic, thanks for posting. |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2007 : 5:20:27 PM
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quote:
Who is the one stepping back and having the choice, and who is the witness?
I am all of these, and in the present moment blend into one or disappear. And I, like everyone else here, have a large ego, and will continue to enjoy evolving through.
It's like walking up a "down" escalator and appearing stationary, It is stillness in action - if we stop we will go backwards. |
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Alvin Chan
Hong Kong
407 Posts |
Posted - Jan 16 2008 : 12:26:44 PM
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Beautiful....it's now midnight (1:20am) in Hong Kong and I'm only half way through the long list of reply. Everyone body's asleep here, and I did feel a great void and loneliness, as I've been feeling from tmie to time recently. On one day (just yesterday) I may feel I can unload the attachment and love without an object (some sudden inspiration I got partly from reading this forum) , on another day I could feel bad. I could even say one reason of why I hang around here is to feel my void. It sounds bad, but I've to admit.
My fear, as opposed to 2 years ago, is that I may lose my memory of the past and to face the undetermined future, not to grasp the past. Is this still an attempt to own something: my memory? But isn't much of our life composed of memory, experiences? At this moment, even if I die today, I won't regret. May even be a relief. I just fear about the future, fear about forgeting the magical moments in my life, that I may owe the others. May even disappoint them if I forget. It happened, and it should forever be recorded somewhere as a fact. Where is that somewhere? |
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Kyman
530 Posts |
Posted - Jan 17 2008 : 01:05:18 AM
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The degree to which you treasure those experiences will translate to the depth which they are stored, till they rattle in the corridors of the nervious system, in all its aspects, till the cross of our reference point that holds them in view takes takes residence some place new in the web of life.
No doubt we would carry an infinite store of our experiences through eternity if we could, and perhaps at some level, of the highest dimension and order, we can retain them forever. This doesn't mean we will recognize them, since our perspective changes with the wheel of time, and we may only be able to live in a world that repurcusses our past eminations of joy. But to the witness, its all the same.
I'm blessed to able to find value in the little things, so all that I've known, even what my mind would call bad, the soul treasures. We can experience the "'sweet sorrow'', but eventually we fade/emerge into new vibrations. |
Edited by - Kyman on Jan 17 2008 01:39:48 AM |
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The Illusion of Friendship
