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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
 Posted - Aug 21 2014 : 9:03:50 PM
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As I was doing my normal samyama routine this afternoon, a thought crossed my mind. All the sutras are nouns. What if they were changed to verbs? For instance, radiance becomes radiate; unity becomes unite; strength becomes strengthen, etc. This is probably trivial, but I wonder if there would be a difference in the vibrational power of the sutra when released in stillness as a verb.
Verbs denote action; nouns denote conditions and objects. Since samyama is cultivating "stillness in action", I'm feeling like it could make a difference. Can anyone offer any insights or experience re: the vibrational power (in stillness) of nouns vs. verbs? If Yogani stumbles across this post, perhaps he could chime in?
(I know this is probably just linguistic fickleness, but I just have to ask.  ) |
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cosmic
USA
821 Posts |
Posted - Aug 21 2014 : 10:25:53 PM
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I like the way you're thinking, Bodh 
How about adjectives, e.g. strong, radiant, wise? Adjectives would denote qualities... isn't samyama about cultivating qualities?
BTW, the post title had me thinking you'd found a way to generate electricity via samyama. Guess I should keep paying my utility bills (shucks).
Peace. |
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tonightsthenight
846 Posts |
Posted - Aug 21 2014 : 10:27:54 PM
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| in deep samadhi, thing and action are inseperable. |
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tonightsthenight
846 Posts |
Posted - Aug 21 2014 : 10:30:21 PM
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| although I just tried (while eating stew and listening to pixies haha) and there is a different quality to it. not as peaceful and contented, but more power. great ideas keep em coming:) |
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Aug 21 2014 : 10:39:21 PM
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Good point, cosmic! Why not adjectives? Do these subtleties matter? Do they affect the outcome of how the sutras manifest in the material realm?
And hey bro, let's not rule out generating electricity via the the subtle vibrations of consciousness. That would solve much of our conflict regarding limited resources, would it not!? I mean if all we had to do was silently whisper a sutra like "Electrify", and then poof--our whole house would be glowing luminously, I think that would save a lot of time and effort, don't you!? (No wonder I like Harry Potter so much).
Thank you for illuminating the topic, and I like the way YOU think. 
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Aug 21 2014 : 10:52:15 PM
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Ahhhhh, tonightsthenight, thank you for jumping in. I can get the gist of action and object being inseparable in deep samadhi. Who is the mover, and what is being moved? Neti, neti. But, alas, you have felt a little more power in an active verb, whereas the normal nouns led to more contentment...very interesting. Again, a curious interplay between the dynamics of change and rest. Are we accessing a condition that is already pre-existent of the sutra, or are we creating a future condition with the sutra itself, or both? An existential crisis! Help!  |
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cosmic
USA
821 Posts |
Posted - Aug 21 2014 : 11:19:51 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Bodhi Tree
Do these subtleties matter?
I would think so... samyama is a rather subtle practice, no?
It'd be cool to hear about your (or someone's) experiments with this. I'd volunteer myself, but I don't intend to take up samyama anytime soon. 
"Electrify", hahaha!  Next time the fuel light comes on in my car, Imma drop "Fullness" into the ether. Ah, the possibilities! |
Edited by - cosmic on Aug 22 2014 12:44:54 AM |
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Jourdain
USA
34 Posts |
Posted - Aug 21 2014 : 11:28:01 PM
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This makes me want to try prepositions. "With"..."From"..."Into"...
At least it's relational! |
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SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
Posted - Aug 22 2014 : 12:44:34 AM
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Well, I long ago changed "Health" to "Healing" as health seem to imply physical health (at least in my mind) and healing is a process and involves all aspect physical, mental, emotional.
I volunteer to try out the verbs - I quite like the idea - and will report back.
As for generating light - throw in a couple of mahamudras to your practice and you'll light up brighter than a lightbulb.
For Harry Potter fans, the spell is "Lumos"
Sey |
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Aug 22 2014 : 06:15:08 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by cosmic
Next time the fuel light comes on in my car, Imma drop "Fullness" into the ether. Ah, the possibilities!
Our cup runneth over. Surely goodness and mercy shall follow us all the days of our life: and we will dwell in the house of the LORD for ever. [King James amended  ]
@Jourdain
Aha! The plot thickens. The efficacy of prepositions is revealed. Interestingly, samyama can be used for both positive and negative qualities, so if we wanted to dissolve the existence of war and violence, we could make the sutra "without war and violence"--enhancing the intention to dissolve by adding the preposition "without". Perhaps less is more, but again, there is precision in language, and just as the mantra has particular resonant qualities that echo in certain directions, maybe the outward intentions of meaning and language make a twist.
@Sey
If you were to robustly utter the Expecto Patronum spell, pray tell, which power animal would emanate from your being? I am most curious...at present, mine might be an eagle, but I think there are several prime candidates floating around in the psyche. For you, I sense a leopard for some reason... |
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AYPforum
351 Posts |
Posted - Aug 22 2014 : 09:12:49 AM
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| Moderator note: Topic moved for better placement |
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Chaz
USA
129 Posts |
Posted - Aug 22 2014 : 6:21:03 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by cosmic
BTW, the post title had me thinking you'd found a way to generate electricity via samyama. Guess I should keep paying my utility bills (shucks).
Same, got me excited that maybe my theory of consciousness/prana powered electrical devices are indeed a near possibility.
I like the idea though, will give it a try. |
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Aug 23 2014 : 4:30:06 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Chaz
Same, got me excited that maybe my theory of consciousness/prana powered electrical devices are indeed a near possibility.
Check out Nassim Haramein (http://resonance.is/). He's more or less trying to prove that all energy is derived from empty space (stillness), and that by understanding the nature of spin, we can directly access the infinite resource. Could be really close to materializing your theory. |
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Chaz
USA
129 Posts |
Posted - Aug 24 2014 : 04:05:31 AM
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Good stuff man!
This is a science I definitely want to get involved in. I've been contemplating it a lot lately. I mean the human nervous system is probably one of the most highly advanced machines in the universe and literally needs electricity to function, but this electricity is completely produced on it's own by our very atoms. There are infinitely complex biological processes going on in nature every second, which seemingly require conscious intelligence and lots of energy. But it's all there all on it's own. I feel like if we can mimic these miracles of nature with our technology, I think we could achieve a healthy balance between nature and technology and have a better chance at preserving and taking care of the earth.
I'm reminded of Autobiography of a Yogi when Yogananda mentions some scholars who speculated that Atlantis was an advanced civilization that knew how to harness atomic energy, but their misuse of this power ultimately led to their demise. I think with future breakthroughs in quantum physics and new understandings of it's correlation to consciousness, we might be heading in a similar direction. Hopefully minus sharing the same fate.
Think if one day all we needed to power our electronics was create an electrical charge between atoms within a power source just with our intention samyama style. If we already know that by observing a particle it changes we know consciousness has a degree of influence there. Thinking of all the possibilities with this drives me crazy. It's a cool fantasy of mine that I hope some science can make a reality very soon.
Sorry to go off topic. It's just very fascinating to me. Thanks a lot for the link! |
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Aug 24 2014 : 6:34:54 PM
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| Chaz, I think you are a visionary beyond your time. We're both relatively young, but you have really got a headstart on this stuff, so I applaud your expansiveness. |
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SeySorciere
Seychelles
1571 Posts |
Posted - Aug 25 2014 : 02:05:37 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Bodhi Tree
@Sey
If you were to robustly utter the Expecto Patronum spell, pray tell, which power animal would emanate from your being? I am most curious...at present, mine might be an eagle, but I think there are several prime candidates floating around in the psyche. For you, I sense a leopard for some reason...
A large white owl.
I tried out the sutras:
Love (experienced as a drop of light that expand rapidly into inner cosmos)
Radiate (shushumna tube-light lit up a lot more than the mere glow of radiance)
Unite (did not feel comfortable; unity is best)
Healing
Forgiveness (kept creeping in this weekend)
Strong (did not feel right either)
Abundant (felt no different to abundance)
kept 'inner sensuality, wisdom, inner space' as is
What I've noticed in cases where you can use the verb, like radiate, because it is the imperative case, it feels like you are giving an order to your Self
Sey
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Ayiram
88 Posts |
Posted - Aug 25 2014 : 06:37:18 AM
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Hi guys,
you got my attention... 
I have tried out the experiment as well (only on the first two sutras) and I would agree with Sey. Regarding the official samyama practice, it is my feel that it´s better to leave the sutras as nouns. Nouns are formless, so there´s less chance of becoming identified with the illusion of me being a doer (verbs can create that effect)or of samyama being about "me" (when one uses adjectives).
The only time I use a verb is when I feel I cannot do samyama on anything, then I intend:"Show me".
But during self-inquiery (outside the official samyama practice), I use the sutras I feel like using and in the form I feel like using (verbs, adjectives, prepositions...). Thas has proven to be very effective as well.
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Edited by - Ayiram on Aug 25 2014 06:41:22 AM |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1734 Posts |
Posted - Aug 25 2014 : 12:02:11 PM
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Hi Everyone
Bodhi Tree, it's a interesting question and an enjoyable thread to read.
I think there is a good reason for having nouns and not verbs or adjectives. The mind finds it generally easier/quicker to translate nouns into images. Of course we don't favour visualisations in Samyama - even so, nouns feel easier and the most straightforward to get a handle on.
To take one of your examples, when I think 'strength' I immediately settle into the idea. But if I say 'strengthen' or 'strong' my immediate reaction is to ask myself 'strengthen what?'/'strong what'? And it's only when I apply the verb or adjective to an object - that my mind settles into the idea.
Love to you all  |
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Chaz
USA
129 Posts |
Posted - Aug 25 2014 : 1:55:54 PM
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Bodhi, I applaud your expansiveness as well.
quote:
Originally posted by BlueRaincoat
I think there is a good reason for having nouns and not verbs or adjectives. The mind finds it generally easier/quicker to translate nouns into images. Of course we don't favour visualisations in Samyama - even so, nouns feel easier and the most straightforward to get a handle on.
I have often wondered what effects samyama might have on visualizations, and have recently been experimenting with creative visualization at the level of stillness. I actually like it a lot, it's pretty powerful ime. When I form an image at the subtle level of stillness it seems a lot of energy floods into the visualization and gives it life, then I let go and all that energy and the visualization dissolves or expands into infinite stillness, and then I bring up the image again like subtle ripples on the surface of a lake and let it go, each time getting more subtle and less specific until I'm no longer letting go of an image but rather a feeling associated with that image which is often felt at the level of the heart.
I've only just recently started trying this so I haven't noted any direct effects in daily life yet other than it seems to add weight to my visualizations, and I seem less attached to them. I was wondering if anyone else maybe tried this before? This thread got me thinking about it. I can see how it might be a clunky process for some and that's why maybe sutras are favored, but I find the visual element can bring up a lot of energy which adds a lot of weight to the visualization. And it feels pretty good.
Anyone have any thoughts on this way of using samyama?
I do think as far as nouns vs. verbs in samyama, nouns allow for easier and more complete surrender. Verbs seem to be more forced and imply an expected outcome by nature of the mind. But I think a situation could call for dropping a verb in stillness, maybe to enhance whatever verb we are engaging in with the essence of inner silence. Or sutras like "show me" and another one I like, "speak truth." I remember in Secrets of Wilder, John made a huge mess with dirty laundry in his room by dropping the sutra "move" in stillness. So who knows, maybe we'll find more practical use for verb sutras as we continue to expand in stillness. |
Edited by - Chaz on Aug 25 2014 2:10:32 PM |
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Aug 25 2014 : 6:17:57 PM
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@Sey
White Owl, hello. Your sunken, circular eyes speak to me from afar. The clarity of your lens reflect rays of a not too distant sun. If I am silly, I am surely serious. These codes and layers have meaning. All is mystery making sense of Herself. (Thank you for sharing the results of your experiment, and the imperative edge is felt over here.) 
@Ayiram
Ahhhhh..."show me"...I am also prone to whisper that command silently. In frustration, anger, confusion, or in mere curiosity (more gentle tones). Lord, show me the way. Or, as the gospel tune goes: "I went down to the river to pray, studying about that good old way, and who shall wear the thorny crown? Good Lord, show me the way."
Undoing the doer--always a tricky topic, when there's nothing left to reference.
@BlueRaincoat
Aha! I think you struck the core there. Verbs seeks objects; nouns are objects in themselves. Therefore, the noun would be more about cultivating an all-pervading essence, rather than materializing a specific outcome (objectification). Thank you for pointing out that important detail.
@Chaz
We are on the same page--I am sure of it. Visual samyama. For me, that arises when the open-eyed, exterior perception is glowing electric. For instance, at the Michigan retreat, on the first night I could not sleep because my room was liquid, luminous light, and images of people I knew began appearing (faintly) in the room. So I holographically began to release them in bundles by drawing simple geometrical shapes into the air (which were visible as pranic light), and then letting those shapes dissolve into the field of conscious emptiness. Boy, that was an ecstatic night! I was walking up and down the halls flailing my arms somewhat gracefully and just soaking in the intensity. I should have woke you up...hehehe...well, next time. |
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