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Moola_Bandha
Australia
24 Posts |
 Posted - Oct 12 2013 : 01:46:15 AM
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I've just finished The Secrets of Wilder. Great book! I'd like to congratulate Yogani on writing this book.
I've prevented myself a few times from posting this thread, but I think I'll just ask my question, maybe someone is able to enlighten me:
One one hand, John Wilder (the main character of the story) was having all these beautiful experiences of bliss and connecting with God through spiritual practices which are supposed to be attainable by anyone who sticks to the practices, but on the other hand, he was described as some sort of superhuman who could fly a few feet up in the air, etc. which sounds non-attainable.
I know that potentially people can do miraculous things as a by-product of practices, but I suspect that no one on this forum (how advanced they may be in their ability to connect with 'i am') would be able to float in the air.
So why assigning such abilities to John Wilder which are beyond anything that people have achieved through AYP system?
Sorry, but I'm a little disappointed that the character is not completely believable. I wanted to give the book to a few friends, but now I know what they are going to tell me when they read it. |
Edited by - Moola_Bandha on Oct 12 2013 02:22:48 AM |
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bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2013 : 09:20:05 AM
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Hi,
Good question. Here is my take: The story gives literal, objective shape (fictional) to subtle inner experience (actual). My favorite is the ascension where John turns into an explosion of light and his clothes are left limp on the chair, along with the cross that he had worn around his neck. The empty cross is a clue of meaning: this ascension story echoes the story of Jesus ascension.
Namaste,
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2013 : 10:07:34 AM
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If you limit the potentiality of a human being, then you limit the potentiality of God, and that is insanity. The only sane conclusion I have been able to reach is: anything is possible. If you don't believe THAT, I would recommend doing a brief survey of human history and contemplating the progressive trajectory of life on the planet. If history has proven anything, it's that perceived limitations are often surpassed. We sent a spaceship to the moon, for instance.
Stick around, and you might be surprised what you see. There might be miracles right in front of you. Godspeed on your chosen path.  |
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jonesboy
USA
594 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2013 : 10:40:19 AM
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| While Yogani does say the story is fiction. Is flying any more unrealistic than the stories of Lahiri Mahasaya? What is not possible with Gods blessing? |
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AumNaturel
Canada
687 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2013 : 2:55:36 PM
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I see where your question's coming from. You're saying it could potentially turn people away because the higher possibilities (miracles, siddhis, supernormal powers) discredit the more plausible benefits to one's personal life - to someone who is just starting out and who carries a lot of doubt, or otherwise approaches the propositions (practice - effect correlation) from a critical (null hypothesis, no effect) experimental approach.
Like Jonesboy says, it is published as fiction, with Yogani saying the story is modeled after or borrows from actual events from his own life.
Also, as a story, I see it being put forth to allow people who resonate with similar ideas to begin considering the very real possibility that such a practice (involving eye lifts, palate lifts, root seats, etc.) is very effective in making a tangible and undeniable difference to one's state of being, one that just so happen to correlate on a 1 to 1 basis with methods of many other spiritual practices.
Anyone is invited to interpret it in whatever way is appropriate to them. It can be a novel, spiritually uplifting literature, or a hidden (occult) manual of practices and effects that the toltec warrior, bringer of the dawn, mage, yogi/ni, psychonaut, etc. can take upon themselves to 'decode' and integrate it into their practice.
Someone who does not resonate with the basic idea may not consider any such material, no matter what format Yogani may have chosen.
Why not share with them the book, and let them make up their own minds about it. It comes from you, after all, who is their friend, and therefore represents a part of you. Of course, use discernment too, in case keeping personal distance along certain lines is necessary to preserve whatever is in common. As Yogani often says, "your call."
Flying in the air, having one's physical body float through a wall as directed by a blue light, or other paranormal phenomena may occur regardless of or even contrary to one's conscious will or expectation, and all it would take is one single account among countless others we find entirely credible and beyond all other explanations, and a door opens even if just intellectually, into dimensions beyond the three of space and one of linear time, and we can idly ponder the implications. Going beyond displays of what may just be subtle tech, into latent potential of the human body and spirit, and the implications multiply exponentially, only now it's in our hands experientially, and there's less mental baggage clinging to a surpassed (and perhaps shattered) ontology of the world as reflected in our awareness. |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4514 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2013 : 4:00:29 PM
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Hi Moolabanda,
I found the AYP site because of levitation. One night I was sleeping on a balcony near the top of a 17 storey building, and I woke up to find myself floating 3 foot up in the air. It totally freaked me out at the time. I was worried that my body might end up in the wrong place- i.e. in mid air with nothing underneath and I would fall to my death. The next day I did a search on "levitation" and "yoga" and the AYP site came up. It was very reassuring to read the main lesson on levitation by Yogani which says that we do not need to worry about being harmed by levitation as the body knows what it is doing and where it will end up when it comes back down (interesting, no?  ). It is here:
Samyama, Lightness, Lurching and ... levitation
You would be surprised how common it is for people to find themselves floating in the air. It is the only time it has ever happened to me though, although many other things, which are much more extraordinary have happened to me. As we practice yoga things open up before us which we could not even have dreamed about happening before. That has been my experience at least.
When I read The Secret's of Wilder, I could not believe how many of John's experiences were similar to, or identical to things that had happened to me. It was a real eye opener. It is certainly not a book for everyone, but when someone is ready, they won't be able to put it down.
Christi |
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Anima
484 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2013 : 5:03:25 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Moola_Bandha
I've just finished The Secrets of Wilder. Great book! I'd like to congratulate Yogani on writing this book.
I've prevented myself a few times from posting this thread, but I think I'll just ask my question, maybe someone is able to enlighten me:
One one hand, John Wilder (the main character of the story) was having all these beautiful experiences of bliss and connecting with God through spiritual practices which are supposed to be attainable by anyone who sticks to the practices, but on the other hand, he was described as some sort of superhuman who could fly a few feet up in the air, etc. which sounds non-attainable.
I know that potentially people can do miraculous things as a by-product of practices, but I suspect that no one on this forum (how advanced they may be in their ability to connect with 'i am') would be able to float in the air.
So why assigning such abilities to John Wilder which are beyond anything that people have achieved through AYP system?
Sorry, but I'm a little disappointed that the character is not completely believable. I wanted to give the book to a few friends, but now I know what they are going to tell me when they read it.
Thank you for being honest.
What is the difference between reality and metaphor? Flying through air versus flying through atoms? Through water rather than through ocean?
As simple as it sounds, it is a mere matter of perspective, or, more ridiculously, a matter of attachment to a particular stratum of explanatory presumption, e.g., an apparatus containing functional components of interpretive and predictive language. We embed ourselves in such doctrine to make sense of the world, with the central misunderstanding that it is alien, viz., an object privy to cognitive manipulation.
Love
Tom |
Edited by - Anima on Oct 12 2013 5:10:57 PM |
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bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2013 : 9:41:56 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Christi
... I did a search on "levitation" and "yoga" and the AYP site came up.
Samyama, Lightness, Lurching and ... levitation
Interesting lesson!
For those who have not read the lesson, a questioner writes: "...I peeked when the lurching started after the sutra and saw my body hop from one end of the bed to the other... Is this levitation... I'm afraid of going off the bed."
Yogani replies: "Is it levitation? Well, it is trying to be, isn't it? At this stage there is a lot of purification going on in the nervous system and the body is responding to the energy surging through by lurching and hopping... you will find that there is not much risk of falling off the bed, as you will be intuitively aware of your location during the practice."
Samyama, Lightness, Lurching and ... levitation
Yogani is addressing a spontaneous case of what the TM practitioners featured in this National Geographic documentary call "stage one levitation:"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHwhGUo90jw |
Edited by - bewell on Oct 12 2013 10:05:15 PM |
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bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2013 : 10:15:07 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Christi
...I woke up to find myself floating 3 foot up in the air. It totally freaked me out at the time.
Hi Christi,
How would you respond to the suggestion that your physical body was safely in bed the whole time, and that what you experienced was actually an altered state of consciousness which convincingly simulated physical levitation?
Bewell
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Edited by - bewell on Oct 12 2013 10:19:24 PM |
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AumNaturel
Canada
687 Posts |
Posted - Oct 12 2013 : 11:36:05 PM
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Hi Bewell,
that question came up on hearing the account as well, but I figure Christi in his experience can discriminate real levitation from a high-level OBE or projection or lucid dream, falling sensation, and waking on the spot where he was sleeping just underneath.
Non-physical sight of whatever form, speaking from my limited experience, is fairly convincing at times, especially under trance states that sometimes make it more difficult to think critically at that split second, or do the necessary tests to determine whether the vision is from the eyes being partly open or not.
Now the question is asked, I too am curious about clarifying it more. |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Oct 13 2013 : 07:59:27 AM
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The path is different for each person, and therefore you can't predict what is going to happen to any person. What you can predict, is that very likely things will happen that are beyond your present belief system, and this is because changes will be made to the system you use to connect with reality.
We think our mind is perfectly logical, and certain questions, like whether it is your real body levitating or your astral will perfectly put the truth in order. But then people have experiences that shake us to the very core of our belief systems, and question the reality and truth we base our whole life on.
I think that is the reason the story is written the way it is.
Your experiences will be different than Wilder. But the feeling you will get will be just as fantastic,
in your own personal way. |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4514 Posts |
Posted - Oct 13 2013 : 08:23:46 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by bewell
quote:
Originally posted by Christi
...I woke up to find myself floating 3 foot up in the air. It totally freaked me out at the time.
Hi Christi,
How would you respond to the suggestion that your physical body was safely in bed the whole time, and that what you experienced was actually an altered state of consciousness which convincingly simulated physical levitation?
Bewell
I wouldn't say my physical body actually levitated, only that it felt as if I was levitating, enough to concern me.
But to be honest, I don't think it really matters. Would it make much difference to the world if everyone could levitate? I can't personally see how it would make any difference at all. Someone once said that it would mean you wouldn't need to get a chair to get something off the top shelf. I can't think of any other really practical use other than that.
The real miracles in yoga are things like making peace and unconditional love the foundation of your life. If everyone did that there would be no more wars on this planet, no more starvation and no more poverty. That would be something and that is what yoga can do. So when people talk about miracles we tend to fixate on the small things and miss the real miracles that are actually happening.
Christi |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Oct 13 2013 : 08:33:38 AM
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If things can fly around "levitating" why not humans? I've seen stuff fly around. I've seen a person be in one place one sec and the next sec 75 meters away in another direction... Fast moving! At least three people have said it feels as if their bodies start to levitate when lots of energy goes through me to them. They lift from the chairs where they sit to the degree they have to grab something to hold on to, and then they get scared, so I never see how how they can fly. (giggle) Might be just a feeling - might be levitation.  |
Edited by - emc on Oct 13 2013 08:36:46 AM |
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bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Oct 13 2013 : 6:22:56 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Christi
... Would it make much difference to the world if everyone could levitate? I can't personally see how it would make any difference at all. Someone once said that it would mean you wouldn't need to get a chair to get something off the top shelf. I can't think of any other really practical use other than that.
Good point. |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2520 Posts |
Posted - Oct 14 2013 : 04:05:42 AM
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quote:
Would it make much difference to the world if everyone could levitate? I can't personally see how it would make any difference at all. Someone once said that it would mean you wouldn't need to get a chair to get something off the top shelf. I can't think of any other really practical use other than that.
The real miracles in yoga are things like making peace and unconditional love the foundation of your life. If everyone did that there would be no more wars on this planet, no more starvation and no more poverty. That would be something and that is what yoga can do.
beautiful |
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Moola_Bandha
Australia
24 Posts |
Posted - Oct 15 2013 : 09:53:00 AM
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| Thanks everyone. |
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The Secrets of Wilder – why exaggerations?
