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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
 Posted - Apr 22 2006 : 10:16:10 AM
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Yogani thought I should share this with you...
Just want to follow up on this. http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....TOPIC_ID=980
I have handed out many of Yogani's meditation books and few of the ladies were really interested in going in for meditation. Somehow I thought they just needed a little push.. So today for the first time 6 of us met for a group meditation. It was wonderful. Before we started the ladies were not sure if they could do it for 20 mins. I told them to try it.. they could not believe 20 mins went by so fast. They were all amazed.. They just loved it. My window was open.. it was a beautiful day.. but once we started I realizes there was a lot of noise from the street.. I looked around.. nobody seemed bothered.. so I let it go. Later they said.. at first the noise really bothered them.. but they were not sure when they did not hear it any more.
I think we may have 5 more AYPers. We plan on meeting once a week for group meditation. Some of my other friends were hurt I had not invited them.. so I think the group will grow. Don't know how many I can fit into my house.. so lets see how it goes. I am not taking any money for the books or the meetings.. I have however told them if they do benefit from this, we could all contribute and send the money over to Yogani. I hope this will help Yogani and AYP. I believe in AYP.. this is my small way of "pay it forward". |
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nearoanoke
USA
525 Posts |
Posted - Apr 22 2006 : 11:17:24 AM
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| Sounds very good shanti. Good work. Probably you can point them to the site too. Because the online lessons are very inspiring and can get them started very soon. Your work reminds me of John Wilder and Devi Duran's group meditations :) |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Apr 22 2006 : 12:30:05 PM
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| Thanks Near. Yes I have talked to them about the web site.. the forum, and Yogani. I guess they will take a little time to get into all of this. None of them have any spiritual background or meditation or Yoga (not in this life time at least). So they were just overwhelmed by the meditation itself. I am sure they will visit the website. I have talked a lot about it. I also have 3 extra copies of the AYP book which I have told them they can borrow if they would like. I will get some spinal breathing books soon to circulate among them. So just send some positive vibes this way.. and hopefully this will work out. |
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Manipura
USA
870 Posts |
Posted - Apr 22 2006 : 12:49:08 PM
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| Shanti (and others) - What do you say to people when you explain AYP? This is a sincere question, and I sincerely need help. I figure I've got about 15 seconds to catch their attention, and spend 14 of those stumbling around between ecstasy, conductivity, divine birthright, and so on. I've never succeeded in gaining anyone's interest. I either get the glazed eye response, or the oh-you-poor-dear head tilt. Seriously - I've leafed through the lessons in search of a paragraph which sums it up, but haven't found a concise explanation. I've even tried writing one myself, but can't summon the right words. Maybe Yogani could condense it all into a few sentences? Mind you, it's not that I'm trying to convert anyone to my beliefs and practices, but when asked, it would be great to be able to give a good description of the work and the objective without turning people off. |
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yogani
USA
5247 Posts |
Posted - Apr 22 2006 : 5:36:05 PM
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Hi Meg:
A good way to talk about AYP is to put it in terms of what the other person might be looking for. No two people are the same, of course, but generally, most are seeking less hassle in life, better health, prosperity, good relationships and happiness in general.
Ecstatic bliss and enlightenment are further up the needs scale for most people, but it is surprising how quickly they will ascend once they see the positive effects of practices on their basic needs and begin to comtemplate their greater possibilities.
If you use deep meditation as an opener, the following, borrowed from the back of the Deep Meditation book, might be helpful:
"Deep Meditation" is a concise step-by-step instruction book for a simple yet powerful method of daily meditation that will systematically unfold inner peace, creativity and energy in daily life. Whether you are seeking an effective tool for reducing stress, improving your relationships, achieving more success in your career, or for revealing the ultimate truth of life within yourself, "Deep Meditation" can be a vital resource for cultivating your personal freedom and enlightenment.
If you want to take the discussion further up the scale, consider this, borrowed from the back of the AYP Easy Lessons book:
The premise of Yoga is simple. There is an outer reality and an inner one, and our nervous system is the doorway between them. Effective Yoga practices stimulate and open that doorway. The result? Peace, creativity, happiness, and a steady rise of ecstatic bliss radiating from within us... Advanced Yoga Practices (AYP) brings together the most effective methods of Yoga in a flexible integrated system that anyone can use. Instructions are given in plain English for deep meditation, spinal breathing pranayama, bodily manipulations (asanas, mudras and bandhas), tantric sexual practices, and other methods that are systematically applied to swing open the door of our nervous system to permanent higher experience. This is a non-sectarian approach that is compatible with any belief system or religious background.
Now that is moving up the scale, and it generally only works for those who are contemplating these things already. So proceed accordingly.
The trick is to discuss it from the perspective of the person who we are talking to, which means first finding out where their head and heart are at, and then gearing the discussion to that.
All the best!
The guru is in you.
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yogani
USA
5247 Posts |
Posted - Apr 22 2006 : 7:21:21 PM
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Hi Shanti:
What a nice way to share AYP with your friends and acquaintances. There is nothing like a group meditation to convince people in a hurry that something profound is going on in deep meditation.
There is that line from the Bible:
"Where two or three are gathered in my name, there I am in their midst."
It is really true, and is quite noticeable. With six or more the effect goes up exponentially.
The wonderful thing about this kind of sharing is that we don't have to do anything beyond the mechanical part. The real content of the work comes through us and through everyone who is involved. This is divine life -- stillness in action!
I hope others here will be inspired by your experience and consider doing the same in their area. It does not require anything special in the way of facilities -- just a place for everyone to sit comfortably. Keep us posted on how it goes!
The guru is in you.
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Apr 22 2006 : 7:39:23 PM
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| Thank you Yogani. |
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Manipura
USA
870 Posts |
Posted - Apr 22 2006 : 9:32:51 PM
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| Yes, thank you, Yogani. Don't know why I didn't think to read the back cover. Now the trick will be to say it without sounding like a robot. :) I think I may be guilty of giving too much information to those who needed a simple reply. |
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Apr 22 2006 : 10:06:26 PM
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Hi Meg,
One of the easiest ways to bring up meditation with friends, at least as I have found, is when they talk about feeling stressed, or feeling some other challenge or being too distracted etc. This happens quite often, and then it makes much sense to mention that you think maybe meditation could help them. Instead of trying to remember specific things to tell from AYP or the meditation book, what usually makes the most impression is to just tell them how it has helped you deal with similar situations or maybe overcome them. And then if they ask about more details it's usually easy to just fill in. |
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Jim and His Karma
2111 Posts |
Posted - Apr 22 2006 : 11:20:45 PM
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Another possibility to bear in mind is to "teach" meditation. I don't think Yogani would mind if any of us made a few bucks on his practice (especially if we give credit and recommend the books). It's weird but true: people value stuff they pay for more than stuff offered for free. "We'll Teach You to Meditate!" classes are far more attractive than "Come Meditate With Us" sessions.
As for group meditation, Idunno. In my zen days, I was a pleasure to have in the room. Nowadays, I moan and gasp, spin my head around, scratch my nose, yawn, and otherwise am a total pill. I'd either distract the hell out of everyone - or, worse, the acting out might prove contagious.
OTOH, it might be good for me to do this in a group, for the same reason I like meditating on trains. When I start tending to do too much of the above stuff in meditation, and I do a session on a train or other public setting, it strips out 95%, even later when I meditate back home. I don't suppress any of it (I try not to suppress anythign in practice!), but I lose the stuff that's merely habit (and a surprising amount is). |
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nearoanoke
USA
525 Posts |
Posted - Apr 23 2006 : 08:57:15 AM
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Yes Jim, your idea about making ppl pay and teaching sounds good.
The problem with telling ppl about AYP (or any other good meditation technique we know) is they might feel we are advertising or trying to sell something. Even when you are ready to give free deep meditation book, it might not help (infact it might worsen things). Thats why I make sure I give the book only to ppl who I know will use it and understand its value.
Just as weaver points out, the best time to tell about AYP is when they are in need of such a thing. Also I try to take the position of an outsider/non-member of AYP in telling him about AYP.
It is best to spread the word in places where you have ppl interested in yoga/spirituality than wasting time on ppl who argue there's no spirituality at all. One good thing that worked for me, I goto yahoo chat, and to yoga rooms and while casually chatting will give this link to someone. Especially from the first lesson "Why this discussion?". I just need to give the link thats all. Everyone who I gave the link till now is impressed. The lessons are afterall so inspiring and it makes our task all the more easier.
-Near |
Edited by - nearoanoke on Apr 23 2006 08:59:23 AM |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Apr 23 2006 : 10:09:37 AM
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Hummm... tell you the truth.. all these people who have agreed to come and most of the the ones who want to join us.. would not have come if I was going to ask them to pay. There is something attractive about try it free.. if you like it stay.. if not you haven't lost anything and you get to keep the book for free.. They don't feel like they have to be there every Friday because they are paying for it.. they have no expectation that I have to get this much result out of this class since I have paid this much money.. they wont feel, we better sit there for a full 45 mins since I have paid for it.. it becomes very easy to do just what is required without expectations and without a dollar value attached to the session. I don't expect everybody to stick around. The experience they had for free I am sure felt much better than it would have if there was a price tag on it.. because then you think.. now this 20 mins of silence, was it worth the X amount of dollars I spent. maybe I could do this at home for free.. but would they.. One of the ladies said.. good thing we are going to meet once a week.. now we will do this every day so we can say we did something during the week and share some of our experiences when we do meet.. Now I know that may not be the way to go.. but don't you think for someone with no spiritual background.. a little push will go a long way? All I want to do is introduce them to this world.. then once they start.. their bhakti will take them forward..
Well this is how I think. Hey I am no expert at anything..
quote:
Nowadays, I moan and gasp, spin my head around, scratch my nose, yawn, and otherwise am a total pill. I'd either distract the hell out of everyone - or, worse, the acting out might prove contagious.
Now that was a image that made me smile... |
Edited by - Shanti on Apr 23 2006 10:10:09 AM |
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Apr 23 2006 : 10:21:55 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Shanti
Hey I am no expert at anything..
Shanti,
Everything you wrote makes perfect sense. In some circumstances people value what they pay for, but in your situation what you do is right. It's important that we trust our inner guru. Our inner guru is the expert. Or, as they say in Christianity, the holy spirit guides us. This is what people feel too and get attracted to, when we do what is genuine. |
Edited by - weaver on Apr 23 2006 10:24:29 AM |
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Jim and His Karma
2111 Posts |
Posted - Apr 23 2006 : 12:15:12 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by nearoanoke
It is best to spread the word in places where you have ppl interested in yoga/spirituality than wasting time on ppl who argue there's no spirituality at all.
Sorry, but I couldn't disagree more. AYP meditation is so clearcut and down to earth that even the least "spiritual" person might be inclined to try it. And if they do, they'll learn lots of things. And they'll never go down this path unless they discover the enticements themselves.
Those are the BEST people to give the meditation book to.
As for not wanting to seem like you're selling or evangelizing, I don't make a big deal. I hand people the book and say "hey, check this out...it's the clearest meditation technique ever. Clears out your head. You might like it." I don't follow up ("did you read it yet?"), I just let it go. |
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Jim and His Karma
2111 Posts |
Posted - Apr 23 2006 : 12:17:01 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Shanti
Hummm... tell you the truth.. all these people who have agreed to come and most of the the ones who want to join us.. would not have come if I was going to ask them to pay. There is something attractive about try it free..
but that's your friends and acquaintances. That's a different thing. Presumably, you'll run out of them eventually.
But strangers will be vastly more inclined to pay $10 for group meditation lessons than to join some scary group. There's reassurance in the commerciality. It makes it feel like the rest of their lives, which is comforting to people. |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Apr 23 2006 : 1:03:36 PM
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Yes Jim, I see what you are saying.
Let me ask one question though.. Don't know how many of you have been with Yogani since he started putting lessons up. Why did you guys decide to joining in for free lessons.. and then stick around? Did it not scare you that there wasn't a $200(don't know where I came up with that number) charge for the lessons? What made you guys join this scary group? |
Edited by - Shanti on Apr 23 2006 1:46:55 PM |
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Apr 23 2006 : 2:04:15 PM
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Shanti,
What made me interested in Yogani's teachings (not as a group), was the content plus fact that he displayed them for free, and did not show any interest for personal gain. That meant that he could be an exception to the rule where almost everyone displays a flashy web site to attract the attention and trying to get followers, but often not conveying teachings of much substance, and charging money for personal gain. Those tendencies do not agree with my view of the consciousness of enlightenment. (However, I still agree with what Jim has said, that it's fine to charge for courses and people often value what they pay for.) |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Apr 23 2006 : 3:42:00 PM
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| Yes Weaver, I agree with Jim too. I was just curious that's all. |
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Jim and His Karma
2111 Posts |
Posted - Apr 23 2006 : 3:50:12 PM
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shanti, I never perceived myself as part of a group. I'm doing exactly what I think Yogani intended....following his roadmap as a do-it-yourself open source project. Sometimes I deviate from the roadmap, but always keeping the path well in view. And as time goes on, I'm seeing that most of the deviations were unncessary after all.
If it wasn't for AYP, I'd have spent a lifetime (or 1000 of them) chasing after experiences and running down dead ends. The basic precepts of AYP (self-pacing, favor practice over experience, calm the hell down and just brush your darned teeth) are brilliant. Everything else is just smart explanation and integration. FYI, I'm not even doing the "everything else"...i"m really just meditating and doing samyama (plus mula banda and sambhavi). So I'm all aobut the basic precepts.
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Edited by - Jim and His Karma on Apr 23 2006 3:50:48 PM |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Apr 23 2006 : 4:58:43 PM
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| Jim, The thing is.. it took a year, but I have come to the same conclusion.. just Spinal breathing, meditation, Shamyama.. along with sidhasana, mula banda and sambhavi... I have to say.. most of these days.. by the time I am done and open my eyes I feel like I am "high" on something, all groggy and disoriented.. and it is impossible for me to just get up and go without at least 10 mins of rest. Yes.. I like brushing my darned teeth. Thanks for not giving up on that.. |
Edited by - Shanti on Apr 23 2006 5:26:38 PM |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Apr 23 2006 : 11:11:58 PM
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In different situations, different techniques of spreading the word around will work better.
Nothing will please everyone. What Jim said is correct in many Western settings --- people have more respect for, listen better to, and get the willies less around what they pay for. That doesn't mean they won't mutter some complaints that 'spiritual stuff should always be free'!!!
I know I am a bit wary around stuff that is offered for free, though I keep an open mind. But I feel a bit like I am little Hansel being invited into the house made of cake and candy.  It's a feeling I can shake off, but it does exist.
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Apr 24 2006 : 09:36:11 AM
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Hey, here's an idea -- teach meditation for a fee, and for that fee, include Yogani's book, 'Deep Meditation'.
You could teach it in two sessions to a group of people, maybe $10 per session. You pay for the place, (if you have to), the books, and you may have a little left over for yourself.
What do y'all think?
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Apr 24 2006 : 09:49:48 AM
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Hi David
quote:
Hey, here's an idea -- teach meditation for a fee, and for that fee, include Yogani's book, 'Deep Meditation'.
This works for me. I have been "teaching meditation" for two years now. For a fee. I have just started including Yoganis book "Deep meditation". (Actually....I am waiting for the first little batch.....hope they arrive soon)
The groups are small (due to space limits) - from 3 to 7 people. I love it. They love it. They are all strangers I meet through my practise....none of them have been into Yoga. It really doesn't matter. The meditation stands on its own feet. Labels don't matter.
May all your Nows be Here |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Apr 24 2006 : 12:52:08 PM
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Teaching for a fee and including the book as part of the deal is a great win-win situation for everyone.
The meditators get lessons in how to meditate, and for many of them, lessons are better and easier for them than reading the book. And they get to start in a "group setting" which can be helpful and powerful. And they pay a small fee so they don't feel like Hansel/Gretel getting free cake and candy.  The teacher gets a fee, the students go with a great little book which they can read now at their leisure (and can use it to recap what they have learned at any time), and Yogani gets some royalties from the book.
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yogani
USA
5247 Posts |
Posted - Apr 24 2006 : 1:53:26 PM
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quote:
David said: Teaching for a fee and including the book as part of the deal is a great win-win situation for everyone.
Hi All:
Sounds very good, with or without the fee -- casual or structured gatherings. Whatever works for those involved...
Would anyone like to volunteer to help others get started on the hosting/teaching side? If we have a general scenario to follow for hosts/teachers, with support as needed, it might be easier to invite friends and acquaintances into the home for sharing, assistance and tasting inner silence deeply via group meditations. It is also an excellent way to give and receive ongoing support.
The AYP books are intended for both individual and group instruction and follow-up. It is yet to be seen exactly how the group aspect of it will develop. All in good time.
I'm moving this topic over the the AYP Helpers forum, as that seems to be a better fit with the way the discussion has evolved here. Thanks much!
The guru is in you.
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Apr 24 2006 : 2:18:41 PM
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| Don't know what kind of help you have in mind Yogani.. but if you tell me what needs to be done, I can help. |
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Group Meditation
