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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
 Posted - Nov 07 2011 : 07:49:20 AM
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quote:
Accept that she is indeed the one (but leave yourself open to the idea that she is possibly not the ONLY one), love her with all of who you are and joyously accept this loving. Does Love have to diminish in the absence of the person loved? All of this pain will not resolve itself overnight.
the mind creates a fixation...."i want this person to be with me and to love me " .....it is a mental disease...for years i greatly suffered from it during "love" in teenage years and also with the married man i talked about ...only with practice one learns to notice the mind disease.. one will still feel the pain created by the mind,one will still suffer....it is hell of suffering..it is a long deconditionning process...now i am much much better at cutting the mental crap than when i was 14... the suffering will get shorter and shorter  ...eventually you say to yourself 'ok i love that person even if he is absent...it is a great Love cause i am not getting anything out of it...but this person is not the ONLY one...other persons will eventually appear in my life"....and they do appear
luckly our mind's fixation is on love ....many many people's mind fixation is about money ,prestige,career etc...our fixation on love , if worked out through spritual practices and enquiry will lead to Love pure and unconditional |
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SeySorciere
Seychelles
1553 Posts |
Posted - Nov 08 2011 : 03:14:39 AM
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@ karl
In what way does the idea of Soulmate not fit into Oneness? I am not sure... Oneness to me means that at the very core we are all one; of one consciousness. So strip away the illusion, we should feel the same amount of love for all (?).. so any form of preference is illusion?
@ Maheswari - Yes ! Lucky our fixation is on Love  |
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Nov 08 2011 : 04:40:56 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by SeySorciere
@ karl
In what way does the idea of Soulmate not fit into Oneness? I am not sure... Oneness to me means that at the very core we are all one; of one consciousness. So strip away the illusion, we should feel the same amount of love for all (?).. so any form of preference is illusion?
the world unfolds as it must. Time is none existent. Doors open and people and objects walk in and out of perception. There is no separation.
It does not matter if you call the world illusion, or the world. Universal consciousness and oneness are part of that illusion Accept the world/illusion as it is, without attachment to it. Then you can observe the comings and goings and they will not trouble you. You can give without expectation.
If you are referring to the inner stillness as oneness then it is not. That is beyond concepts, beyond illusion, beyond beyond. It's easy to confuse that with the world, when the only perception is of the world.
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tonightsthenight
846 Posts |
Posted - Nov 09 2011 : 10:26:18 AM
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thanks for the kind words gatito and everyone else...
i am making progress in surrendering and in my practice.
Karl, Oneness and Stillness are not the same of course. But we are alive, after all, and although we can perceive oneness, the world of forms offers distinctions: all things are not the same. So a 'soulmate' is different from a regular love, just as a beetle is different than a moth. (or whatever, hehe). if the world had no importance, than why are we here at all? just to get out? i don't know that many people would agree with that.
Seysorciere:
I can't really describe how i know she is my soulmate, because it is not something i deduced. i am certain that there are stories beyond this one life we live, as i have memories of moments not in this dimension. i do not know the details, i only know that i have dreamed of this girl since i was very young, and when i first met her, i did not recognize her. but soon after, there was a moment when all of it came flooding into me, like k just blows up your spine with radiance. and i "knew" in a blink of an eye...
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nearoanoke
USA
525 Posts |
Posted - Nov 09 2011 : 2:08:07 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by SeySorciere
@ karl
In what way does the idea of Soulmate not fit into Oneness? I am not sure... Oneness to me means that at the very core we are all one; of one consciousness. So strip away the illusion, we should feel the same amount of love for all (?).. so any form of preference is illusion?
Hi Sey,
As per many enlightened masters (Adyashanti, Yogani and few others that I've listened to) the exclusivity of love towards a partner/child/parent/etc.. remains upon enlightenment. They still feel same amount of love and respect towards everyone but somehow this exclusivity remains
- Near
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tonightsthenight
846 Posts |
Posted - Nov 09 2011 : 5:11:01 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by nearoanoke
quote:
Originally posted by SeySorciere
@ karl
In what way does the idea of Soulmate not fit into Oneness? I am not sure... Oneness to me means that at the very core we are all one; of one consciousness. So strip away the illusion, we should feel the same amount of love for all (?).. so any form of preference is illusion?
Hi Sey,
As per many enlightened masters (Adyashanti, Yogani and few others that I've listened to) the exclusivity of love towards a partner/child/parent/etc.. remains upon enlightenment. They still feel same amount of love and respect towards everyone but somehow this exclusivity remains
- Near
Another way to put it:
I could feel the same love for Joseph Stalin that I feel for everyone else... but it doesn't mean i want to spend my life with him!  |
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Nov 09 2011 : 9:19:26 PM
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How well did you know Stalin or Hitler?
It is said that there is someone for everyone, there for you could very well experience being the Soulmate of someone like that.
Your only belief that someone is a soulmate is based purely on a past memory. Is it fact? Can you prove. In a world built of memories, that this has always been so?
This is an interesting thing to explain, I do not say it is true, but watch me conjure this idea and then decide what it means.
Many people mention living in the now, or the moment. It is taken to mean getting on with stuff that lands at your door and not worrying about the past or future. Some describe it as absorption in a task.
How about if I say it is neither of these things. Instead it is stasis, viewing one frozen frame at a time.
Take some time to look at a raindrop falling from the roof of a house. You see it begin to fall, you watch it as it makes it's way past your viewpoint and you know it has hit the ground because that is what raindrops do.
However, you only See that raindrop falling because you can remember it's position prior to the next. Living in the moment is an impossibility in a world in which time is dominant.
Consider what might happen if you could not retain the previous position of the raindrop.the raindrop would start anew each and every moment. Continuity would vanish, there would be no movement as you would only view a constantly occurring static raindrop.You would have no method of predicting it's start or finish and no requirement to do so. There is no way you could create the story of the falling raindrop.
This is happening every day within our lives, things come in and out of perception and are linked to stories that we have about them. We believe these stories because we need the continuity in time otherwise every event would be random and have no chain.
Are the stories true? Are the stored memories true, even though at times we cannot remember where the car keys are, somehow we have a perfectly detailed memory of our soulmate. Except for some reason we often cannot even remember facial details of our partner or the exact words of a 2 minute old conversation. Still we insist this is accurate, our mind glosses over the blanks, adds a story and hey presto this is your life
Now your probably going to say. That's crazy. But wait a minute, let's have a look at what we regard as today's world. Let's see what Quantum physics is showing us about basic particles.
If you look at the classic double slit experiment. One single particle is seen to go through both slits at the same time. Suddenly we are confronted with a version of the raindrop. This time we have no story and no memory to draw on. The particle goes through two slits and our brain just fills in the blanks and sees a flash of light. Once you understand the significance of this it is like seeing the start and finish of the raindrop without any memory of it falling.
So is the scientists memory faulty ? Why is it impossible to recall what happened? Surely they were able to watch it happen? Have we now to allow for the possibility one event will have two outcomes of which we can view the result but never the division of the original event?
In any case it must give rise to doubt That which we perceive, which we remember, or how we see things might not be exactly the way they actually are. perhaps your soulmate is just a perfect stranger that you have never seen before, but that you perceive as a long time acquaintance.
Living in the now means living just that way. Giving love to all who come in and out of perception regardless of there role. How you relate on a physical level is different, it is according to those memories and stories. There is no conflict with that. It is likely that the contacts that engage with you directly and come into the gravity of your direct influence are quite a low number, certainly not the entire world........although our memory of that might not be as complete as it should be.
That's enough brain bending for now
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Radharani
USA
843 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2011 : 03:34:41 AM
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Tonightsthenight, Thank you for sharing your painful personal experience with us. You do have my sympathy and I can relate because I may soon be breaking up with my partner of over 6 years, the longest and deepest love relationship I have ever had in this world. I don't know if I believe in "soul mates" but we are best friends and tantric partners and love each other very intensely. But we may be headed for a breakup because of his mistress, Ethanol. Today I sobbed quite a bit over this. I don't know what is going to happen but I do know we are all in God's hands. I am not attached to the outcome but I allow myself to feel the pain in the present. You said:
quote:
Originally posted by tonightsthenight
I feel as if the yogic process is pulling us apart because of the attachments, like the relationship was keeping me from being fully invested in god... and in that case I wonder if it is possible for me to have an meaningful relationships in the future?
I'm glad you brought this up, because it is a common misconception on the spiritual path that in order to "find God" we must give up attachment to human beings, especially romantic relationships. This approach does not lead to enlightenment, it leads to dissociation and stunting of our emotional growth! First of all we must understand that God is Love. Secondly, we are all unique manifestations of that Love. So when we deeply, truly love another person we are experiencing or expressing God. The Love that you have shared with her is real regardless of whether your paths have diverged at some point. Be thankful for the Love you have shared and know that it was from God. You can share that same Love with somebody else when the time is right. As a former celibate, I assure you that "meaningful relationship" need not keep you from being "fully invested in God." On the contrary, the joys and sorrows of relationship are valuable experiences on the yogic path and can bring us closer to God, more so than remaining aloof from relationships. It is ok to feel whatever you are feeling. Offer it all up in the consuming fire of divine Love. Blessings to you, bro.
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Edited by - Radharani on Nov 10 2011 03:37:04 AM |
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SeySorciere
Seychelles
1553 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2011 : 06:42:31 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by nearoanoke
Hi Sey,
As per many enlightened masters (Adyashanti, Yogani and few others that I've listened to) the exclusivity of love towards a partner/child/parent/etc.. remains upon enlightenment. They still feel same amount of love and respect towards everyone but somehow this exclusivity remains
- Near
Dear Near - I am sure glad to hear that.
@ Karl /Tonight - I call the man my Soulmate not because of a memory (although we do have one shared memory of a house we lived in) but because one day I met a total stranger who took one look at me and said in awe "It's you". I could not respond because my insides were going very funny - my chakras (did not know they existed at that time) were flowering one by one and I was suddenly feeling larger than life, larger than my physical body (reminds me of the effect of the "lightness of air" sutra has sometimes. I have a very strong bond with this person and it has happened that I would answer a question his mind has formulated but he has not voiced yet; or another case where I woke up screaming from a bad dream in the middle of the night and he (from another country) texted within minutes to ask what was wrong - he apparently could hear my scream. I have many examples of "psychic" behaviour between us (astral ones too)
So I do not know what to call such a person, except my Soulmate, as I have never experienced such with anyone else.
Sey |
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2011 : 09:24:28 AM
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The World unfolds as it must. Experiences are transient. You 'remember' it happening that's all, the story then develops.
If you live in the moment, at the source, you should witness this. The story is 'this is my soulmate because this is what happened'. It is perfectly acceptable to diminish experiences during meditation as 'just scenery' and dreams as 'just a dream' yet we are so sure that what we remember is completely indisputable truth and real, that no story is pending.
You cannot have any experience at the source, there is no way of sustaining it. If you view those experiences in the light of the source you see them break down. The story is broken and cannot reform because each event is viewed separately without connection. The stories are retained, the memories remain but they are seen for what they are. Sustained by Ego.
I have a wife that I love. She leaves me to go to work. My memory tells me she is my wife yet I know that while she is away from me she does not exist. My mind creates the story of existence, people, places and experience, my memory of us. This means anything that comes into my life is new each moment regardless of my remembered familiarity receives the same attention. It is difficult to separate this physicality. My wife returns from work and we simply pick up the storyline again.
I don't ask that you accept this idea. It is not an easy transition. Stay with it for a while, see how your mind works. You can actually swap one story for another, the mind can do it. It can wipe your whole memory and leave a blank template populated only by none intimate knowledge. Whole character changes can occur and yet the mind will happily accept them without the slightest hesitation. You could be a priest one moment and a murderer the next.
It is this linking that is amazing, yet we don't notice it. Like a film running through a projector we happily string together the static pictures to see movement. If we just cut up the static pictures and threw them randomly on the floor we would struggle to imply a story. Wouldn't stop us trying we would make individual stories to fit each frame.
On the other hand we can just accept this is all real, that all thought and memory are truths and there are no stories just reality. Matters not either way, it's only if you wish to look over the hill, or see what's behind that wall, to need to explore, what is beyond that and beyond that and beyond that.
So, I now have a story of a 'source' and will seek to uncover it's authenticity. Is it just a convenient truth ? Has anything changed for me ? My memory tells me it has, yet it cannot be substantiated, each moment seems perfect and no story is needed, was it always that way?
Fun isn't it. That's how it should be
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Radharani
USA
843 Posts |
Posted - Nov 11 2011 : 02:52:04 AM
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Dear Tonightsthenight,
I forgot to mention: Our yoga practice is especially important in the midst of such heartaches. Pain and sorrow offered up actually create fertile ground for spiritual growth. In our daily deep meditation we get in touch with the Love that is the source of all love. When earthly loves let us down - which they inevitably will - we are invited to go deeper into that perfect Love. Also, I have found the AYP practice of samyama to be very helpful in dealing with this situation. I drop my partner's name into the silence and let God deal with him/us. It brings a profound sense of peace and helps with the "attachment." |
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tonightsthenight
846 Posts |
Posted - Nov 11 2011 : 12:17:28 PM
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Radharani, thanks for you thoughts.
I am using these circumstances to energize my bhakti and deepen the stillness in everyday life. I believe this circumstance to be necessary for my transformation... it is about healing.
Samyama, especially has been helpful, I agree. But just having abiding inner silence through the pain and grief has really allowed me to love in a new way recently.
I know that this is just the beginning of a period of transformation, and I cannot say what my life circumstances will be like on the other side.
SeySorciere, I can totally appreciate your view of soulmate. In this life i have found that some people are very special for us, for whatever reason. I don't have to know factually why this is so. It just is.
I am just happy, at this moment, to have experience life with this person. Yes, life will never be the same without this person. However, with abiding inner silence and expanding love to encompass all things, life continues on, and the heart still loves, even as it is scarred.
Karl, you totally lost me on that one! |
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Nov 11 2011 : 12:27:29 PM
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Tonightsthenight,
Thanks for sharing this recent post. Seems like you have experienced some healing.
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tonightsthenight
846 Posts |
Posted - Nov 11 2011 : 2:38:58 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by jeff
Tonightsthenight,
Thanks for sharing this recent post. Seems like you have experienced some healing.
I have experienced healing.
This relationship was something that I had been holding on to throughout a long stage of purification. I needed to let go of it in order to continue on my path.
This is a key time in this life, and I need to face it with courage, faith and hope.
I think I may even be embroiled in a bigger transformation now, than the initial spiritual transformation i had several years ago. The end of one process, and the beginning of the next. Holding on to this relationship was the last barrier i faced.
So other's results will vary, but i think with samyama and inner silence, we can face anything. |
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Nov 11 2011 : 3:37:29 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by tonightsthenight
So other's results will vary, but i think with samyama and inner silence, we can face anything.
I find the energy/vibrations help too.
Love.
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Nov 11 2011 : 4:17:16 PM
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| good to hear that things are getting smooth...all the best |
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tonightsthenight
846 Posts |
Posted - Nov 11 2011 : 7:45:51 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by jeff
quote:
Originally posted by tonightsthenight
So other's results will vary, but i think with samyama and inner silence, we can face anything.
I find the energy/vibrations help too.
Love.
absolutely Jeff :)
However, I've relied too much on the ecstatic nature of Life too much in the past... and never failed to be let down by it. The ecstasy comes and goes... the power it brings is only truly useful if it is tempered by inner silence.
This past week the ecstasy has been wonderful. But now, for example, I have become very ill (i've been ill for well over a month now, with various viruses) and there is very little ecstasy.
Whereas the silence stays even when the ecstasy does not.
thank you maheswari for your words :) |
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Nov 11 2011 : 9:04:27 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by tonightsthenight
absolutely Jeff :)
However, I've relied too much on the ecstatic nature of Life too much in the past... and never failed to be let down by it. The ecstasy comes and goes... the power it brings is only truly useful if it is tempered by inner silence.
This past week the ecstasy has been wonderful. But now, for example, I have become very ill (i've been ill for well over a month now, with various viruses) and there is very little ecstasy.
Whereas the silence stays even when the ecstasy does not.
thank you maheswari for your words :)
I understand. Sorry to hear about your illness, I hope passes quickly.
The ecstasy is like the silence, always there. Just sometimes harder to notice. It is more often noticed around the obstructions/issues.
Have a good weekend.
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Nov 12 2011 : 01:40:06 AM
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The ecstasy is like the silence, always there. Just sometimes harder to notice. It is more often noticed around the obstructions/issues.
dear Jeff can you explain this further?thx |
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Nov 12 2011 : 03:26:02 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by tonightsthenight
Karl, you totally lost me on that one!
Apologies, I just threw you the advanced swimming book you can read it when you get to the shore.
Be as you are. |
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tonightsthenight
846 Posts |
Posted - Nov 12 2011 : 2:32:33 PM
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maheswari and Jeff,
I would tend to say that the ecstasy is not always there.
for example, i am ill currently and my body truly feels terrible. or another, in the moments before massive ego death, one only feels death coming, and ecstasy is not a part of that.
the ecstasy of Life going on is always there, but we are individuals as well as universal consciousness.
Karl, i agree with you to an extend. however, we create stories for a reason... we are naturally inclined to do this. you imply that this is not a healthy part of life, whereas i would say that we simply abuse this ability rather than use it in the way that is meant.
i have had glimpses of the stories beyond this lifetime... many people have.
our ultimate story, in fact, is finding our way back home. god, or us, or whatever, created this whole drama! |
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Nov 12 2011 : 3:18:50 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by maheswari
quote:
The ecstasy is like the silence, always there. Just sometimes harder to notice. It is more often noticed around the obstructions/issues.
dear Jeff can you explain this further?thx
Sure. The silence and energy go together. The energy & silence are always there, but most just dont notice it. As you build a "bubble of silence", you become more able to notice things (including the energy) from the silence. Energy is more easily noticed around "energy obstructions". It often feels like vibrations. The obstructions are the same as attachments (or unconscious issues). So Kundalini energy events are often associated with the release of major obstructions. Hence, lots of pain going through the issue/event. As obstructions are removed (not fun), more energy can flow freely, which is the same a greater mind clarity.
Just as with the silence, the energy is always there. It is just about paying attention to the moment.
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Nov 12 2011 : 3:35:28 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by karl
quote:
Originally posted by tonightsthenight
Karl, you totally lost me on that one!
Apologies, I just threw you the advanced swimming book you can read it when you get to the shore.
Be as you are.
Or, you could work on the book...
Have a good weekend.
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Nov 12 2011 : 3:48:20 PM
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so even when the energy is not being worked out  nor easily circulating with lots of bliss and mental clarity,still the energy is there....it is me that is not aware of it...
it makes sense cause energy like Lavoisier says 'Nothing gets lost, nothing gets created, everything gets transformed"
i do feel inner silence,and ecstasy but on and off like Tonightisthenight....although i know that silence is always present i never thought the same applies to energy....something to keep in my mind
as for obstructions being cleared out ...well those are easily felt..sometimes it so strong it feels like ego dying
thank you Jeff |
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Nov 12 2011 : 5:05:11 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by tonightsthenight
Karl, i agree with you to an extend. however, we create stories for a reason... we are naturally inclined to do this. you imply that this is not a healthy part of life, whereas i would say that we simply abuse this ability rather than use it in the way that is meant.
i have had glimpses of the stories beyond this lifetime... many people have.
It's very healthy, it is creation unfolding, it's the attachment that causes the suffering. When the witness is present it helps to view your reactions with little attachment, at the source there is no suffering because there is no attachment. Alternatively put yourself totally in Gods care.
Using time line therapy I experienced a glimpse of a past, the emotion around the event - anger- became a crutch in the now and took some work to persuade me to let go of it. That's incidental but you mentioned it.
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Long Term Relationship & Yoga
