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emc
2072 Posts |
 Posted - Sep 07 2011 : 02:10:30 AM
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This is so far the best I've ever read on spiritual bypassing. Very actual for me right now - seeing how I've ignored so much of my human needs all my life.
This article has got very little to do with "intellectualizing" advaita truths, which is often called spiritual bypassing. That may be the case too, and is even worse IMHO. But this is not about "believing" something only in your mind, without direct experience. Spiritual realizations may very well be there too, and deep ones! No contradiction. This article is mostly stressing the denial of the other side, the human side of it, along with the non-dual realizations!
Recommended reading!
http://www.tricycle.com/interview/h...uddha-nature |
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Sep 07 2011 : 02:48:03 AM
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Great article emc!
INTO A BLINDING DARKNESS GO THEY WHO WORSHIP ACTION ALONE.
INTO AN EVEN GREATER DARKNESS GO THEY WHO WORSHIP MEDITATION.
FOR IT IS OTHER THAN MEDITATION,
IT IS OTHER THAN ACTION.
THIS WE HAVE HEARD FROM THE ENLIGHTENED ONES.
MEDITATION AND ACTION --
HE WHO KNOWS THESE TWO TOGETHER,
THROUGH ACTION LEAVES DEATH BEHIND AND
THROUGH MEDITATION GAINS IMMORTALITY.
INTO A BLINDING DARKNESS GO THEY WHO IDOLIZE THE ABSOLUTE,
INTO AN EVEN GREATER DARKNESS GO THEY WHO DOTE ON THE RELATIVE.
FOR IT IS OTHER THAN THE RELATIVE,
IT IS OTHER THAN THE ABSOLUTE.
THIS WE HAVE HEARD FROM THE ENLIGHTENED ONES.
AUM
THAT IS THE WHOLE.
THIS IS THE WHOLE.
FROM WHOLENESS EMERGES WHOLENESS.
WHOLENESS COMING FROM WHOLENESS,
WHOLENESS STILL REMAINS.
[Both and More - I Am That]
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Sep 07 2011 : 1:01:51 PM
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I loved this article. 
"Trying to move beyond our psychological and emotional issues by sidestepping them is dangerous. It sets up a debilitating split between the buddha and the human within us. And it leads to a conceptual, one-sided k...ind of spirituality where one pole of life is elevated at the expense of its opposite: absolute truth is favored over relative truth, the impersonal over the personal, emptiness over form, transcendence over embodiment, and detachment over feeling. One might, for example, try to practice nonattachment by dismissing one’s need for love, but this only drives the need underground, where it is likely to become acted out in covert, unconscious, and possibly harmful ways."
Thanks for sharing this emc
Love!
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faileforever
USA
190 Posts |
Posted - Sep 07 2011 : 1:24:47 PM
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"We are not just humans learning to become buddhas, but also buddhas waking up in human form, learning to become fully human"
Love that! Thanks for sharing |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Sep 07 2011 : 10:52:13 PM
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Really enjoyed the article emc, thanks for posting.
Wouldn't it be nice if the journey ended at the experiencing of the infinite? Much easier to just stop there! Forget this facing/ embracing this humanness nonsense, who needs that???
Have also noticed the tendency to avoid their thinking in many and even those who have devoted the majority of their lives to healing (their) minds. Certainly seen it in myself as well! Meditation can definitely be an avoidance mechanism without awareness of this tendency.
Understandable to see why, the wounds within can cause so much pain when faced, wouldn't it be easier just to convince ourselves they aren't there?!? Hate to admit those darn areas of identification!
Without this willingness to face and see all aspects of ourselves, how could we ever transcend? Human and Buddha, love that part of the article.
thanks!
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bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Sep 07 2011 : 11:09:33 PM
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| Yes, a fine insight. |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Sep 08 2011 : 05:02:50 AM
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Glad you enjoy the article!
I have noticed, though, that becoming more human gets more and more intense. The more One we become, the more we pick up from the collective, so the wounds and emotions are not (only) our own that we process. From that follows, that the more cultivated stillness, the greater ability to hold more intense emotions. Becoming more human implies becoming more vulnerable to intense pain. Quite the opposite from the myth that we will only have the bliss and yummie stuff left after shifting.  And it is possible to hold the emotion only from a non-identified position, from being. Otherwise the body-mind-emotional system just goes havoc from the magnitude of it. So it's this double thing still... to BE with the emotion and not identify with it, yet experience it FULLY, no holding back and escape by distancing mentally.
I have this huge, massive, black hurricane sweeping the system empty, ravaging the heart... The heartbreaking is so intense, the vaccuum so vast, and the silent screaming so loud I hardly think I can cope sometimes... |
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Sep 08 2011 : 08:49:32 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by emc
I have this huge, massive, black hurricane sweeping the system empty, ravaging the heart... The heartbreaking is so intense, the vaccuum so vast, and the silent screaming so loud I hardly think I can cope sometimes...
Amen!
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jeff
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - Sep 08 2011 : 10:24:00 AM
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Excellent article! It is important to realize that practices are only half of the equation.
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bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Sep 08 2011 : 12:16:32 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by jeff
Excellent article! It is important to realize that practices are only half of the equation.
Yes, like the article says:
"...when spiritual practice is used to bypass our real-life human issues, it becomes compartmentalized in a separate zone of our life that remains unintegrated with our overall functioning."
That's why in AYP we advocate a slow and steady routine of practices, where we self-pace, and see that our progress gains tractions in our overall functioning. |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2520 Posts |
Posted - Sep 09 2011 : 1:57:26 PM
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great article thank you....
most seekers in their journey pass by this pitfall....
i passed by it ...in 2005 then a bit also in 2008
when one realizes this pitfall one grows in so many ways .....
unfortunately many seekers stay stuck in it....razor edge path indeed...
Love
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Sep 09 2011 : 2:05:13 PM
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For me there is little value in conceptualizing or identifying with any pain that is experienced.... not identifying with the pain causes it to pass much quicker than if *don't* identify with it. BUT, in my experience, choosing not to fully feel any pain that arises and refusing to look at my areas of identification (which is what causes the pain) simply because I know in my mind that I am the infinite, is just as detrimental as identifying with my pain. This is "spiritual bypassing" at it's finest and to do this is to miss out on half of the "enlightenment" equation in my opinion. It's only in embracing our humanity *as well as* our divinity that we can truly be Wholeness.
In my experience, there is always some identification going on. As long as we are human there is identification... it just gets subtler and subtler the more "awake" we become (this is the whole "the journey never ends" thing). To believe that I am completely "unidentified" is just that, a belief... not Truth. I think it's very easy for one who identifies strongly with the "Avaita/non-dual" path to be totally identified with the idea that they aren't identified with anything.  I've been one of those people. This is one of the more "subtle" identifications that can sneak in when we stop looking for our identifications because we think (believe the concept) that we are Whole. Seeing this identification was totally painful for me simply because it hurts to see myself so clearly and honestly, especially when I had believed I was somewhere I wasn't in reality (which in essence had me putting myself on a pedestal without realizing it). This pain didn't last long, simply because I chose to accept and embrace the "seeing" that I was still identified with something when I thought I wasn't, but, fully feeling that pain (and not trying to conceptualize my way out of it) was absolutely necessary in order to actually work through that identification instead of mentally bypassing it and pretending like this didn't hurt. Pushing away a painful experience in favor of a conceptualized idea that we are beyond pain doesn't serve anyone.
....in my opinion.....
Love!
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maheswari
Lebanon
2520 Posts |
Posted - Sep 11 2011 : 07:03:52 AM
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a summary for the lazy readers
"one might for example try to practice non attachment by dismissing one's need for love,but this only drives the need underground,where it is likey to become acted out in covert,unconscious and possibly harmful ways.....for those who are in denia labout their personal feelings or wounds and who have hard time to express themselves in a personally transparant way,meditation can reinforce a tendency toward disconnection and disengagement.....so how do we reconcile the ideal of non attachement with the need for human attachment? we need a larger perspective ....we are not just humans learning to become buddhas ,but also buddhas waking up in human form...these 2 tracks of developement can mutually enrich each other....the hand can not function unless it is attached to the arm ,that is attachment is the positive sense....people dont feel free to say what they want because you dont want to be seen as needy.You are trying to be non attached ,but that is like and unripe fruit trying to detach itself from a branch instead of receiving what is needs-which will allow it to ripen and let go...trying to live up to an ideal instead of being authentically where you are can become a form of inner violence if it splits you in two ....but if we can acknoweldge these feelings and open ourselves nakedly to them,we are moving towards greater openness,in a way that is grounded in our humanness.....i am suggesting that we need to be able to form satisfying human attachments before genuine non attachment is possible" |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Sep 11 2011 : 08:35:37 AM
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Thanks Maheswari! I am one of those lazy readers.
This ties in closely with what i am going through at the moment. I'm going through some "unintentional self inquiry", where I notice things about myself without trying. Lately what I have been noticing is if I hold a belief in my mind, conscious or unconscious, that belief shows itself all throughout my life, as if I am putting it on display with a big sign.
Since a belief is not in-the-moment, it distracts us from experiencing the NOW.
Of course we have to have morals, but non-attachment applies to concepts in our mind as much as earthly things. |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Sep 12 2011 : 09:07:19 AM
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David Deida is not someone I particularly like, but one thing has stuck from him. He talks about therapy, glow and flow. We must do some proper therapy before we can properly glow with kundalini and flow with What Is.
"We need to be able to form satisfying human attachments before genuine non attachment is possible."
Someone else said: "First, we have to have an ego, before we dare to lose it." |
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chit-ananda51
India
127 Posts |
Posted - Oct 30 2011 : 9:53:57 PM
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| When I tried to open the tricycle link, it asks for a membership password. Is that a way you all got around to read the article ? |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Oct 31 2011 : 02:27:00 AM
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| Oh, no, they must have changed something on the site. Sorry. Glad we have the summary for lazy readers above, then. Brilliant move , maheswari! |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2520 Posts |
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Sparkle
Ireland
1457 Posts |
Posted - Oct 31 2011 : 10:01:56 AM
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John Welwood is brilliant, he is one of the few therapists I would feel like going to. Most of the ones I know, and I know a lot of them, would not hold any interest for me in terms of learning about relationships and the Dharma or any other spiritual way of truth.
I echo the sentiments above that say it doesn't get any easier, what seems to happen me though is some sort of stability and solidness comes that holds me on course, despite myself. |
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Swan
India
256 Posts |
Posted - Nov 01 2011 : 01:20:39 AM
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| Many thanks for the article emc!!! this is a jwell indeed.. |
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Spiritual bypassing - a pitfall
