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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
 Posted - May 11 2008 : 10:55:24 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by VIL
The article utilizes the "V"edanta traditon, explaining the three kinds of karma, via an archery metaphor, to help reduce the amount of experiences and to remember the target of meditation is self-realization through non-attachment to phenomenon:
VIL
Hi VIL,
Thank you very much for the response and possible insight. Somehow, I find the reference to arrows and karma rather disturbing so perhaps there is something there that I need to examine. 
TI |
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 12 2008 : 12:12:17 AM
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Hi,
This morning I practiced the mahamudra vase breathing for about 15 minutes. At the end of the session I had a rather nice ball of heat in my lower abdomen.
During my morning's regular practice (breathing exercises and 'i am' mantra meditation), the fire gradually crawled up my spine, which is unusual for that to happen during 'i am' meditation. However, my 'i am' has transformed into a visual picture of the mantra as in: "aaaaaaaaeeeeeeeeeeeeyyyyyaaaaaaaaaaaammmmmmmm" which I now watch while I repeat it. The intervals in between repetitions are somewhat silent but still have colors and images appearing..
I followed my morning meditation with a mahamudra heart/mind meditation. Perhaps I am good at this style of single point concentrative meditation (as opposed to mantra repitition)? I focused on the indestructible drop in my heart and kept at it. I discovered that if I control my breathing, not forcing it but by not pausing between breaths and by keeping the breathing really quiet, I could maintain a constant stream of attention on the little whitish ball of light at my heart area. No breaks, just a constant steady stream of attention.
Just as I figured that out and had sustained the focus on the ball of light in my heart for about 10 seconds, that area released many very powerful tingles that went through my whole body, legs and arms included. What a surprise!  I started to cry. It was so intense and beautiful! Needless to say, I couldn't meditate any longer and shut the session down. Was that a heart orgasm?
TI |
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greenyogi
14 Posts |
Posted - May 13 2008 : 04:09:20 AM
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"Clear Light of Bliss" Is it by Geshe Kelsang Gyatso?
quote:
Originally posted by Tibetan_Ice
Hi,
I have several stories today.
1) Two days ago I was standing outside. I was looking at the street through my third eye vision with regular eyes closed. The scene was relatively clear; things do not appear as 'flamey' as before. I noticed that there was a white car on the road about 30 feet in front of me. When I opened my eyes, it was not there. I mean, the street had no cars on it. I looked around to see if there was a white car on the other side of the street and there was not. 
About five minutes later, the same white car that I had seen drives down the road and stops in the exact same location that I saw it in during the third eye vision! Now I'm figuring that I have to account for some kind of time warp during third eye vision sight. I still can't believe my vision was from 5 minutes into the future.. Hmmm..
2) I was sitting in the bathroom, drinking yogi tea, smoking and reading. I put the book down for a minute. After a few seconds a scene with a buddha sitting appeared right before me in my third eye vision. I watched it. The buddha had a staff in the right hand and a three pronged fork thing in the left hand. It was wearing a red and white gown of sorts and it's hair was tied up in a knot. As I watched, the buddha moved to the right and an infinte number of buddhas appeared as a string behind the first one.
My attention started following the string of buddhas. On and on they went. The trail of buddhas started twisting and turning as we went. My attention kept up. Suddenly, the string of buddhas turned downwards into a whitish tunnel. I tried to follow but I coudn't. So, I started following the tunnel, which turned and spiralled downwards. This went on for a while until the tunnel turned and pointed right at me and a buddha came out of it.
The buddha had a baby in it's arms and held it forward as if to give it to me. The baby had very long black hair and it grew into a female form very quickly. The female (she looked Japanese) then took out a bow and an arrow and shot it in the sky. I followed the arrow and it looked like it had pierced a white cloud that sort of looked like a miniature universe. The female then shot another arrow and this arrow had a flaming tip of fire on it like a burning marshmellow. She then shot a third arrow and this arrow had a 'V' on the tip with sort of rounded edges. After that, she produced a baby girl (pulled it from her abdomen) and held it up proudly in her right hand.
This whole vision lasted about 10 minutes. What the vision means? I don't have a clue but it should be interesting when it reveals itself.
3) I have read the "Clear Light of Bliss" once, and I am now re-reading it, studying it intensely. It is a great book. It has answered so many questions for me, especially about flames and heat!
I cried when I read the part that says the indestructable mind resides in the heart. (Steve is going to love that one.. haha)
The description of the process of concentrative meditation is one of the best I've ever read. Again, emptiness meditation is a separate practice from concentrative meditation, which is interesting because it appears to me that the 'i am' meditation has both intermixed.
According to this book, the main channel is shaped like an umbrella handle and goes from the navel to the heart, then to the throat, next to the crown and finally to the third eye. When I follow that pattern for sucking in cosmic energy through my third eye, my back of the head/neck doesn't hurt as compared to the pain I experience by sucking in the energy straight back from the third eye to the medulla.
The book references an episode of leaving the body through the crown and does state that although this phenomenon is a true experience it does not help in one's spiritual evolution. (This happened to me many years ago after a 3 hour meditation on an area about 6 inches above the crown). It is nice to find confirmation of experiences..
The vase breathing is very clearly described. This was a great mystery to me. You see, chi breathing or reversed breathing involves sort of compressing the air in the abdomen (tan tien) and sort of using the root lock. Yogi Bhajan talks about 'pressure' that is exerted to make the heat rise, but never really explains the process. The "Clear Light of Bliss" explains, step by step, how to store the heat and make the flames rise up the central channel, eventually melting drops that drip back down the central channel causing 4 types of bliss. This process works for me and I can follow it and get results immediately.
It has also explained my experience with too much heat and flames and pointed out some subtler methods of enacting the fire without breath control which also works for me.
I also appreciate that fact that this book has given me a viable explanation of the 'drops' of substance that I can see periodically on the spinal nerve.
There is also a part which explains adequately why the breath stops and how to recognize when central channel 'breathing' is starting to occur.
Funny thing, there is no mention of kundalini anywhere in the whole book, but you'd swear that you were reading a kundalini manual. The essence of the mahamudra is mixing bliss with emptiness, which is very similar if not exactly the same type of thing that the ayp lessons are designed for.
I highly recommend this book to everyone. I have great respect for Gyatso and his accomplishment of writing this book.
TI
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VIL
USA
586 Posts |
Posted - May 13 2008 : 09:13:51 AM
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Hey, TI, I know that with dreams it's important to discriminate or understand what the symbolism is attempting to convey to get in touch with ourselves. So, although I don't have awake dreams, I figured that maybe if this same perspective is employed then a new awareness may be gleaned from the visions by learning to also look at things, symbolically, as you do literally, so that the experience can transform into something more subtle.
I think this is a misconception that when detachment to these expressions are mentioned that it's like asking a person to give up a part of themselves, alluding that a person is crazy or what they're experiencing is not real, and this is never my intention. I know that we all possess gifts that are a part of who we are and I've noticed that many people, as shared even on this forum, experience these things. But what I've also noticed is that sometimes detachment entails a process of letting go of these experiences, little by little, instead of cold turkey, depending on the person, so that these are no longer necessary/observable, although the gift (if it's more palatable) or energy expression, does not go away, but just like energy, merely transforms into something less overt/obvious/gross, into something more subtle, such as intuition, insight, knowingness or whatever.
Anyway, so I posted the article, since the commonly used archery metaphor came to mind when I read your post, so that maybe you can learn that even if these experiences happen, or you have a gift of seeing within the future, what if you reexamined these visions so that there is no longer a need to actually see the future, since you know how to proceed as each situation presents itself, thereby creating the future within each moment. In other words, really getting in touch with ourselves, by listening to that subtle aspect of who we are, so that we just know things that seem impossible to know, and if you end up knowing the future, by being present, then it is what it is. So detachment is actually self development and transformation.
So this is my current perceptions, so take what is applicable and discard the rest, since I am always a work in progress: 
Namaste:
VIL |
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 13 2008 : 10:36:58 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by greenyogi
"Clear Light of Bliss" Is it by Geshe Kelsang Gyatso?
Hi greenyogi
Yes it is. Why do you ask?
TI |
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 13 2008 : 11:34:12 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by VIL
Hey, TI, I know that with dreams it's important to discriminate or understand what the symbolism is attempting to convey to get in touch with ourselves. So, although I don't have awake dreams, I figured that maybe if this same perspective is employed then a new awareness may be gleaned from the visions by learning to also look at things, symbolically, as you do literally, so that the experience can transform into something more subtle.
Hi Vil
If you want to have awake dreams, try meditating lying down. For me, it's like watching cable tv and someone is continually switching the channel. If that doesn't work for you, try meditating lying down with a piece of apophyllite on your third eye.
I appreciate your advice. There are two events that come to mind when I analyze my vision of the archer (after reflecting for a few days on it now):
1) I recently met a woman with very long black hair who is a buddhist, who resembles the archeress in the vision.
2) There is a story in "The Clear Light of Bliss" wherein an archer and a swordsman were fighting each other. When the archer shot an arrow, the swordsman, having perfect concentration, would twirl his swords so fast that the arrow disintegrated. So, the archer got his wife to dress seductively and wander within the swordsman's view. At the very instant that the swordsman saw the wife, the archer shot and killed the swordsman.
In the book, it uses this example to laud the merits of unbroken concentration. I practice unbroken high-intensity concentrative meditation on occasion so I have high regard for this practice as it seems to be one method of dissolving the winds into the central channel.
Perhaps these two events have some connection to the vision?
The other thing I will say is that I've always had trouble linking non-meditating visions to reality and my mind seems to always enforce some kind of meaning to them. It is interesting that the visions are coming closer to reality now.. Also, when I visualize the mailbox, now I can see that I'm sending some kind of white mist out of my third eye to go grasp the mailbox. I can see it pick up and project out. Fascinating stuff. I'm sure it's a technique that others have written about but I haven't researched it.
quote:
I think this is a misconception that when detachment to these expressions are mentioned that it's like asking a person to give up a part of themselves, alluding that a person is crazy or what they're experiencing is not real, and this is never my intention. I know that we all possess gifts that are a part of who we are and I've noticed that many people, as shared even on this forum, experience these things. But what I've also noticed is that sometimes detachment entails a process of letting go of these experiences, little by little, instead of cold turkey, depending on the person, so that these are no longer necessary/observable, although the gift (if it's more palatable) or energy expression, does not go away, but just like energy, merely transforms into something less overt/obvious/gross, into something more subtle, such as intuition, insight, knowingness or whatever.
I don't believe those are 'gifts'. I believe that anyone can do the same once they understand what it is, how to do it and what to practice.
Attachment first, then detachment. I'm the kind of person who has to experience things myself and learn, rather than take someone's advice (however true and correct that advice is). Before you can detach from something, you have to know what it is you are detaching from, eh?
As the initial awe wears off and it all becomes more familiar I will detach myself from the phenomenon. Already, I have detached from the myriad of visions that I see during meditation; they serve no purpose, have no meaning and are a distraction. But at least now I understand that. I'm sure the same will apply to the rest of it once the novelty wears off. My goal is enlightenment. I would like to join the rest of the Buddhas and help elevate the rest of humanity.
quote:
Anyway, so I posted the article, since the commonly used archery metaphor came to mind when I read your post, so that maybe you can learn that even if these experiences happen, or you have a gift of seeing within the future, what if you reexamined these visions so that there is no longer a need to actually see the future, since you know how to proceed as each situation presents itself, thereby creating the future within each moment. In other words, really getting in touch with ourselves, by listening to that subtle aspect of who we are, so that we just know things that seem impossible to know, and if you end up knowing the future, by being present, then it is what it is. So detachment is actually self development and transformation.
Again, I appreciate the correspondence.
I'm still in awe of the concept that there is no past or future. Right now I'm viewing this phenonmenon as a sort of confirmation of that and it blows my meager intellect! I'm also having a hard time understanding the argument used to justify the idea that there is no 'I' in the Clear Light of Bliss. I'd really like to experience that one!
Thanks again VIL for the chance to slow down and examine my statements and experiences. I hope you are progressing well on your path.
TI
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Edited by - Tibetan_Ice on May 14 2008 02:15:25 AM |
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VIL
USA
586 Posts |
Posted - May 14 2008 : 08:14:48 AM
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quote:
Thanks again VIL for the chance to slow down and examine my statements and experiences. I hope you are progressing well on your path.
TI
No, thank you, TI, I appreciate your honesty and sharing your perspective and I always learn from everyone. About the progression part, I just try to go with it, with the ups and downs that we all experience.
Namaste:
VIL |
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 15 2008 : 12:58:00 AM
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Strange phenomenon:
For the last few days I have added a 20 minute heart meditation to the end of my routine. Last night, I discovered that if I am sad, tingles come from the back of my head and move downwards into my arms and body. If I am happy, smile and focus on my heart, the tingles travel upwards from my heart and then fill my whole body. I kind of spent a few minutes playing with this. I ended up being bathed in tingles for some 15 minutes. Took a long time to get to sleep after. So, I've now recognized that tingles can come from the dan tien, the perenium, the heart and the back of the head. Each type of tingle has it's own distinct rate of vibration or flavour. 
At the end of these meditation sessions, with the added concentrative meditation on the little bluish indestructable drop in my heart which I can easily see thanks to Samyama on "Love" which blew open my heart chakra a while back, I get to a point where it is like I can see the room and everything is bathed in a faint yellowish/green light. And, whatever I focus on, or move my attention to, there seems to be two rays of something that points to the focal point from my heart, like a reversed 'V'. It is rather strange. It is like a state of super concentration happens and it makes you feel really power-full mentally. I wonder if this is part of the phenomenon of the Witness???
Anyway, I was sitting in the restaurant tonight and I was just kind of reflecting on this strange state that I have just described. As I reflected and imagined or focused on the feelings of that state, I could feel it quite well, almost like I was in that state.
The waitress plopped a cup of coffee on the table and when I went to speak and say thank you to the waitress, my consciousness was a blob of pliable goo and it kind of whiplashed at her. Then, my brain swooned and I felt like I had awoken from a dream. I mean, you know that kind of magnetic feeling you get in your fingers if you shake your hands for 1/2 minute? It feels like there is a magnetic field which kind of lags behind your moving fingers for just an instant. Well, that's what my mind did, or rather the scene/reflection that I was thinking about had texture and a weight which elasticized and then whiplashed out! It took a real effort to speak "Thank you".
Kind of dumbfounded, I sat there contemplating what had just happened. That is when I noticed that the table top didn't look like a table top anymore. It was shimmering and vibrating and I could see a faint whitish mist entertwined in the molecules. It had a distinct non-coporeal quality and I felt like I could have gently moved my hand right through it.
Has anyone here had these types of experiences? If so, I'd be very interested to hear about them.
Thanks.
TI
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 16 2008 : 02:37:48 AM
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Hi
Here is a deeper view of the concepts from some of my remarks from earlier posts in this thread. This is helping me get a better understanding of the AYP techniques and it might help you too.
The purpose of presenting the following quotes in this forum is as follows:
1) This text presents the end result of attaining the highest level of tranquil abiding (which I interpret as deep silence in AYP terminology) is that the crown opens up and transforms the body and mind. Following that, tranquil abiding on emptiness bestows miraculous powers and leads to true enlightenment.
2) These teachings indicate that the central channel (spinal nerve) goes from the neck chakra to the crown and then to the brow. This is the same path that Barbara Brennan indicates in her "Hands of Light" book. Although this is not mentioned in the upcoming quotes, it is mentioned in the "Clear Light of Bliss" book elsewhere in the visualization meditations.
3) Before one performs meditation on emptiness, one must have reached an attainment of level 9 in tranquil abiding.
4) The book recommends meditating on the little whitish blue indestructible drop at the heart chakra in the central channel, because that is the 'eternal mind'. Thus, mind meditates on mind.
5) Offhand, I would agree that the 'i am' meditation is easier to perform than this type of concentrative meditation. Also, the 'i am' meditation seems to be a blend of concentration and deep silence realization built into one. With tranquil abiding, one must reach level 9 first and then turn one's attention to meditating on emptiness.
Here are excerpts from the "Clear Light Of Bliss" by Geshe Kelsang Gyatso:
First of all, here are the levels of tranquil abiding meditation:
Level 1:
"At the first stage, placing the mind, we will barely be able to hold the meditation object before losing it. Again and again, we will have to seek and find the object and then try to hold it."
Level 2: "Eventually, we will be able to remain focused on the object for up to five minutes without losing it. When we are able to do this, we will have reached the second stage, continual placement."
Level 3: "At the third stage of mental development, we have to employ new mindfulness again and again because the mind keeps losing its object of meditation."
Level 4: "Eventually, however, we reach the point where we are able to hold the object without ever having to employ new mindfulness. When we are able to do this, we have attained the fourth mental abiding, 'close placement'. Because at this stage our mindfulness does not degenerate once it has been set, it is said that we are now maintaining our meditation by means of 'old' mindfulness."
Level 5: "However, the excessive effort needed to maintain this unbroken level of concentration causes the mind to become too collected and, as a result, subtle mental sinking occurs. Thus, on the fifth stage, which is called 'controlled mind', it is necessary to apply the force of alertness to uplift the mind by gripping the object more firmly. We need to relax slightly the effort of maintaining our concentration, yet still be able to remain single pointedly on it."
Level 6: "At the sixth stage, known as 'pacifying', we complete the force of alertness. Although at this stage there is no more danger of subtle mental sinking, there is still a danger of subtle mental excitement that results from tightening the grip on the object and overly uplifting the mind at the previous stage. This subtle mental excitement is overcome through the force of alertness."
Level 7: "On the seventh stage, the balance of our concentration cannot be disturbed by either mental sinking or subtle mental excitement, because the forces of mindfulness and alertness are now complete. Although it is still possible for either obstacle to arise, we can immediately overcome them through the force of effort. This stage is know as 'completely pacifying'."
Level 8: "At the eighth stage, known as 'single-pointedness', it is impossible for mental sinking and mental excitement to develop at all. Now it requires only a little effort to remain focused on the meditation object for an entire session without experiencing the slightest interruption to concentration."
Level 9: "Finally, on the ninth stage, known as 'placement in equipose', we are able to maintain faultless concentration without any effort. We have become so familiar with the object of meditation that it requires no effort at all to remain focused on it single-pointedly. Our concentration is now sustained by the force of complete familiarity."
Now that we have an introduction to the nine levels of tranquil abiding meditation, this next section explains the inevitable outcome of performing this type of 'concentrative meditation':
"After we have attained the ninth mental abiding, and we can remain focused effortlessly and unwaveringly on the object of meditation, we then have to pass through various states of mental and physical suppleness before we reach the actual state of tranquil abiding. At the ninth stage, we will experience a very special, beneficial wind flowing throughout our crown channel wheel. The movement of this wind will induce a great mental suppleness and our mind will become completely free from discomfort, extremely flexible, and delighted to engage in any virtuous activity. Eventually, this wind will flow throughout our body, thereby inducing a great physical suppleness. As a result, our body will be very agile and comfortable and we will find it very easy to engage in virtuous actions. It will seem very light and we will feel as if we are almost able to fly. This experience of lightness and freedom induces an intense feeling of bliss of physical suppleness. As a result of experiencing this, the mind then attains an immutable bliss of mental suppleness. Once we have attained this bliss of mental suppleness, we have reached the actual state of tranquil abiding. This state possesses such extraordinary clarity of mind that we feel as though we could count all the atoms of the world!
...
There are two paths that we can take after attaining tranquil abiding: the mundane path and the supramundane path. Through following the former, we can attain clairvoyance such as miracle powers, and rebirth in the god realms. Although these attainments are remarkable, they do not have much meaning when compared to the results of following the supramundane path of meditating on emptiness. This path leads to complete personal liberation and the full enlightenment of Buddhahood. If, for example, we have developed renunciation - the thought definitely to escape from samsara - and our mind of tranquil abiding meditates continuously on emptiness - lack of inherent existence - we will eventually attain the state of Foe Destroyer, or nirvana."
Now for my questions (if anyone would care to ponder them...):
1) Will the 'i am' meditation take me to level 9?
2) Is the state that is described after attaining level 9 the same as the Witness?
3) There is no mention of kundalini in the TCLOB book. It takes the view that the crown instigates the transformation to enlightenment. Why is that?
4) How can mantra repetition, unless it is one continuous never-ending iteration, be the same as concentrative meditation? The transformation seems to be from activating the crown which requires unbroken concentration. Isn't mantra repetition a series of broken streams of concentration?
5) What is the difference between activating the crown by tranquil abiding or 'just meditating on the crown' or 'using crystals to activate the crown'? (aside from cultivating discipline, detachment, a stable routine with self pacing etc)
TI
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Edited by - Tibetan_Ice on May 16 2008 05:19:46 AM |
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selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
Posted - May 18 2008 : 04:53:40 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Tibetan_Ice
3) There is no mention of kundalini in the TCLOB book. It takes the view that the crown instigates the transformation to enlightenment. Why is that?
Hi TI,
Usually, Tibetan schools do not employ kundalini label which is more hindu. Nevertheless, you will find kundalini used in the amazing book "The Bliss of Inner Fire" by Lama Yeshe:
http://www.amazon.com/Bliss-Inner-F...p/086171136X
which has many common points with NKT since both schools comes from the same lineage (gelupa) but then split in a very violent way:
http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....OPIC_ID=3577
Rather look for tigle or drops which are same as kundalini in the 5 main Tibetan schools but remember, these are just labels to describe the same experience whatever the system.
In Shakti, Albert |
Edited by - selfonlypath on May 18 2008 05:25:06 AM |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4515 Posts |
Posted - May 18 2008 : 4:41:01 PM
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Hi TI
"Now for my questions (if anyone would care to ponder them...):
1) Will the 'i am' meditation take me to level 9?
2) Is the state that is described after attaining level 9 the same as the Witness?
3) There is no mention of kundalini in the TCLOB book. It takes the view that the crown instigates the transformation to enlightenment. Why is that?
4) How can mantra repetition, unless it is one continuous never-ending iteration, be the same as concentrative meditation? The transformation seems to be from activating the crown which requires unbroken concentration. Isn't mantra repetition a series of broken streams of concentration?
5) What is the difference between activating the crown by tranquil abiding or 'just meditating on the crown' or 'using crystals to activate the crown'? (aside from cultivating discipline, detachment, a stable routine with self pacing etc)"
I'll have a go at answering your questions:
1. Yes, Deep meditation can take you to level 9
2. No, the state described as being beyond level 9 sounds more like the descending kundalini, also called the descending paramatma light in yoga.
3. I think the winds entering the central channel stuff is synonymous with the rise of kundalini. The crown plays a seperate (and hopefully later) role in the enlightenment process as described in lesson 199.
4. Mantra meditation is the same as concentrative meditation because it establishes the mind in uninterupted silence. It is the silence that is ultimately key, not the mantra. The mantra is just a tool.
5. Not much.
Hope that helps,
Christi
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 19 2008 : 01:32:27 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by selfonlypath
Hi TI,
Usually, Tibetan schools do not employ kundalini label which is more hindu. Nevertheless, you will find kundalini used in the amazing book "The Bliss of Inner Fire" by Lama Yeshe:
http://www.amazon.com/Bliss-Inner-F...p/086171136X
Hi Albert
Thanks for that. Yes, the "Clear Light of Bliss" refers to the "Six Yogas of Naropa" four times. And then I find, in the first link you mention, this: "In tantric practice, we work with the energy of our own human body. This resource is composed of six factors: the four elements (earth, water, fire, and air), the channels of our subtle nervous system, and the blissful kundalini drops that exist within the channels."
Kundalini drops! This sheds some light on the idea that kundalini isn't just an electric jolt up the spine. It has now become a much larger phenomenon with many more combinations and methods of activation. I can see that any combination of entering the central channel through any of the doors/openings and melting drops can cause kundalini reactions. That is fascinating and explains a lot. You have given me food for thought.
TI
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 19 2008 : 02:22:07 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Christi
4. Mantra meditation is the same as concentrative meditation because it establishes the mind in uninterupted silence. It is the silence that is ultimately key, not the mantra. The mantra is just a tool.
Hope that helps,
Christi
Hi Christi
Thank you for your responses.
The thing that I've come to understand, or at least have been thinking about for most of the day, is the advantage of meditating on the indestructible drop in the heart aka (the very subtle mind).
It goes like this:
- There are different levels of the mind, ranging from gross to very subtle.
- As the minds and their winds dissolve into the central channel, they become inoperative. This is the reason why the CLOB states that movement of winds in the left and right channels causes mental disturbances (thoughts) and those disappear once the respective winds enter the central channel. So, to be silent, all winds have dissolved into the central channel.
- If one is using a gross mind to meditate with and it dissolves into the central channel, what happens then? Have we lost our platform? Or does a new platform appear that we can jump on to?
- If, on the other hand, we focus on the very subtle mind in the drop in the heart and can meditate from that point of origination, it never dissolves into the central channel (it is indestructable). It is the only rock which grants refuge from the quicksands of dissolving winds.
- So, it really makes me wonder why Yogani says that the 'i am' meditation's mantra should become fuzzy and less clear. Is it possible that the fuzzier the mantra becomes, we are climbing the ladder of the levels of mind, going from gross to subtler? Are we using the 'very subtle mind' of the heart drop when we just barely touch the mantra? If this is the case, then yes, the 'i am' meditation should get you there. I agree with you.
All this really makes me wonder. For example, a very powerful way of performing the 'i am' meditation for me is to pulse the mantra from my heart as repetitions of love. Does anything that comes from the heart come from the very subtle mind?
When I first started the 'i am' mantra meditation, I was subvocalizing the mantra (very gross) and my voice box was silently miming along.
After a while, I shut off the subvocalizing by trying to separate breathing from the mantra repetition. This required very much effort.
I found a quieter part of mind with which to repeat the mantra from and periodically could stay aloft without stooping back to subvocalization.
Taking the mantra to a higher frequency, that of light, I started to see the mantra as it was birthing in my mind. I entered the realm of visions; too many visions. I could see thoughts as electric pulses of color and even some thoughts that looked like white misty snake-like cables trying to find me.
Pulsing the mantra like waves of love to God from my heart is most powerful for me; not only for the return of God's love back but for the bliss it generates. And well, bliss melts kundalini drops!
Are these methods of performing the 'i am' meditation steps on the ladder of gross to subtle minds? Is the destination the very subtle mind of the heart?
Something to think about.
TI
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 25 2008 : 01:42:31 AM
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Hi
Various
Bubbles
About a week ago, after a double meditation session (one deep silence and one on the heart), I had to urinate so I did. As the stream hit the water in the bowl, it produced bubbles. I watched the bubbles and suddenly they came alive! They were glistening, shining, shimmering, radiant, little rainbows; they were enthralling and held me spellbound! I loved them .. awe insipiring .. magical .. beautiful vivid sparkling bright colors .. they were alive!!! When the last drop hit the water, the final wave pulsed; it was so rhythmic and peaceful. The whole surface of the water glistened and shimmered. I would have never believed that something I've seen all of my life could all-of-a-sudden become so interesting and alive. I stood there for a few minutes just savoring the experience thinking that this is incredulous. In retrospect, I think I was feeling the whole episode from my heart instead of my senses; that's the only way I can explain it. What strange perceptions... and how do you tell someone what just happened?
True confessions
About three years ago, after an intimate love-making session with my "wife" (ex-wife now..) I had this horribly intense pain in the area of the perenium. I didn't know what to make of it. I could hardly sit down. The intense pain lasted for three weeks and then kind of moved to my coccyx. I couldn't sit very long and it was very painful to get out of the chair after sitting. Over the next year, sometimes the pain would go away for a while but would return towards the end of the day. I could sit for at most 40 minutes until finally I couldn't bear the pain any more and had to stand and walk around. As well, at the same time I started getting the runs (diarhea) for days at a stretch. Sometimes that would last a month and then go away. Sometimes two months.
The doctor told me that I had Irritable Bowel Syndrome. I had no idea what I had, but this is what started me meditating again in my life. That was three years ago.
Nowadays, I still have the runs. Since I've been practicing better posture, the pain in the tailbone area is almost gone. It comes back sometimes when I do things like the horse stance or sit in a slouched position. I was very surprised to read a number of posts on kundalini that the pain might be kundalini piercing the root chakra. I was equally surprised to read from other posts that IBS could also be a kundalini symptom.
As I reflect over the course of events during the last three years, I've come to realize that perhaps this is when my kundalini became active. I had no idea at the time.
Heart meditation
When I first tried the heart meditation on the indestructable drop in the heart as described in "The Clear Light of Bliss", I saw an area in my heart chakra that resembles some whitish straws twisted around each other. In the center of this 'knot' is a small round ball of white light surrounded by a ring of light blue. There is also a thin white chord projecting out from the heart knot to about 4 inches in front of my chest, and there is another light clump of white light at then end of that chord. I was somewhat confused about this until I realized that perhaps this other clump of white light was my astral self that had shrunken quite a bit.
In the Clear Light of Bliss, it says that the indestructible drop in the heart is white and reddish in color. As hard as I try to clearly perceive this, it does not appear reddish to me. It is blueish. It's center is white and the periphery is light blue.
So far, I haven't succeeded in tying my concentration to the indestructible drop for very long. I've come to realize that I have to consciously control my breathing in order to sustain an unbroken stream of concentration on the little blue ball of light in my heart. This has led me to wonder about the aspect of letting the breath go during 'i am' meditation. I've read several other books which say to co-ordinate mantra repetition with the breath, repeating the mantra on the in-breath and once again on the out-breath, with no pauses in between. One book states that the hole where extraneous thoughts gets into the mind is the pause between breathing. In order to produce a steady stream of attention, one shouldn't pause between breaths during meditation..
Kundalini Dancing
About 4 days ago, as I was sitting on the bathroom floor having (you guessed it) a smoke after meditating, a woman appeared to me in my 3'rd eye vision. Although I ignore visions during meditation now, I pay attention to the ones that just come out of nowhere when I'm doing something else.
Not knowing who or what this woman was, I bound it in the name of Jesus Christ, asked it to leave if it was not from the highest purest realms and prayed the blood of Jesus over it. (This is my protection routine). The woman remained. She was dancing.
She has long brown curly hair, blue eyes and white teeth. She wears a yellow top and a long blue-black skirt with white puffy fringes underneath that comes down to just above her knees. She has bare feet and shakes a tamboreen. Or rather, sometimes she has a tamboreen. Sometimes she lifts one leg and twirls around. She is very beautiful. She kind of hops when she dances and swings her feet around.
I asked her "Who are you?". She replied "I am Kundalini". I asked "Why are you dancing?" She replied "I am dancing for you". After saying that, she slowly spun in a circle and kept dancing. I asked her why she had no shoes. She said that she could wear shoes if I'd like. [a pair of black high heels appeared on her feet]. With the heels on, she did not dance with the same carefree pulsing rhythym as before. So, I asked to to take the shoes off. She did. Hmm.. I asked her to take off her clothes. She did. She had golden chains hanging from her breasts and around her torso, like a bikini. She said "I can look like anyone you'd like. I can be anyone.". At this point I was kind of amused and somewhat perplexed.
I opened my eyes and then closed them again. She was still there. Her skirt was back on and she had resumed the dance. For the rest of the night, whenever I closed my eyes, or peered into the 3'rd eye cave, she was there.
For the last four days in a row, she has always been there, dancing for me. I can see her, even with my eyes open, when I focus on her. The 3'rd eye cave that opened up a while ago now has a woman who calls herself Kundalini dancing in it! Sometimes she lifts both hands up into the sky and I feel tingles showering down on me. Most of the time she just keeps dancing. (sounds like a schizo tale, eh?)
Two nights ago she appeared to me in a dream. She and I were staying together in a retreat, enjoying each other's company, embracing and smiling at each other. When night came, we were shown to a bed in a large open room next to a large courtyard. We went to sleep. I woke in the middle of the night to discover that I was laying on the floor next to the bed. When I tried to get back into the bed with her, there were 9 other people with their beds next to ours, all lined up in a row, each in their own bed. Some of the people were women, some were old men and some were children.
She (Kundalini) asked me to return to the floor because there was only room enough for 10 people in the 10 beds. I remembered that sleeping on the floor was ok so I went back to sleep on the floor next to the bed. Then I woke up.
I identify the 10 beds as the 10 doors through which you can pierce the central channel. I was wondering why Kundalini, with her blue eyes, long brown hair and little white panties had appeared to me in a dream as my companion, in the 10'th bed. I know it is a sign. Perhaps there is some connection to the Kundalini woman and the "Dance of the Siddhars" song which I have been listening to recently?
Play of Consciousness - Muktananda
Finally this book came in yesterday. What a great book. I spent all of last night and this morning reading it. Finished it early today. I was spellbound and would be inclined to say that Muktananda is definately enlightened. I wish I would have read that book back in the 70's. I didn't know you can use the blue pearl for travel! Also, it mentions that anyone who touches the book automatically gets some kind of shaktipat. Is that why I feel dazed today?
Today, just to try something new, (I've been doing the 'i am' meditation twice a day for 7 months now) I decided to try Muktananda's meditation. This meditation is to mentally repeat "Om Namah Shivaya" (I am Shiva) on the in-breath and once again on the out breath with no pauses in between breaths. I also added sambhavi and the tongue on the epiglotis. After about two minutes of getting the rhythm going, a clump of white light appeared in my crown area and it stayed there throughout the duration of the meditation. The 30 minutes just flew by and before I knew it, the alarm went off. It felt like 5 minutes had passed. As I rested I noticed that I felt extremely good, like I had a current of something was permeateing my whole body. I also noticed that I had a peculiar sexual feeling like I was on the verge of getting turned on. These two sensations are still with me as I write this. I feel like I am in a daze or in a dream right now.
Bits and bytes
Here are some points of interest:
-Chi, prana or heat follows the out breath. If I breathe very slowly, gently out through my nose, wherever I focus my attention gets hot. If I don't focus my attention and breathe out very slowly, my face and hands get hot.
-I can pump up my aura by breathing in and then, on the out-breath, by imagining my aura getting bigger, stronger and whiter.
-I was in the restaurant and got something caught in my throat. I started coughing. By the last cough, I coughed so hard that I saw an outline of my body in red.
-The book "Your Hands Can Heal You" is full of detail and contains many procedures for channeling prana. However, it continually stresses the importance of cleansing the hands during healing, as in "spraying the hands with alcohol". This is because you use your own etheric body to pull out blockages and negative prana. On the other hand (pun intended), Mantak Chia's Cosmic Healing book sends rays of prana or chi through the target area and beyond it to carry the bad stuff away from both of you, hence there is no need for cleansing. Seems like a better way to go.
-I attempted to prana-laser out a small cyst in my right arm by projecting white-orange prana at it, using controlled breathing, root lock and kechari. I did this for two minutes. Then, I sent in blue-green prana to stablize and rebuild. In all I spent about 5 minutes on it. Immediately after doing this, I felt a lump in the right side of my throat! It felt like I had a ball in my throat or strep throat and it hurt when I swallowed. So, I 'brushed my throat area' with long white fingers and pulled out the blockage (and sent it burning into violet light). Five minutes later it was gone. It appears that there is some kind of connection between the cyst in my arm and my throat chakra. Isn't learning fun?
TI
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 26 2008 : 11:25:16 PM
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Hi,
I appreciate having someone to talk to about all of this. Sometimes living alone has it's disadvantages...
Three days ago I changed my practice. Not much, but after spending 7 months on the 'i am' meditation I figured I would try something new. So, here is my practice now (twice a day or more):
-I now imagine that I am the Guru, Shiva, Buddha and I sit very straight in a almost-half-lotus.
-Five minutes Breath of Fire (Bhastrika, kapal bhati..) with hands held in prayer position. I believe this helps to balance faster.
-Five minutes of spinal breathing with a very gentle root lock, kechari (phase 2) and sambhavi to a breathing routine of 6-3-6-3.
-Thirty minutes of meditation (10 minutes rest afterwards):
What I am doing now is this: I've adopted the 'Om Namah Shivaya' mantra and I'm also coordinating my breathing; on the in-breath I mentally repeat the mantra and then on the out-breath I repeat it again. On the in-breath I gently breathe in through my nose, and on the out-breath I hiss a bit from the throat. My breaths are long and relaxed with very little or no pausing in between.
I know this is not the AYP style of meditation but I guess being a musician for so long has given me quite an inbred resolution to make things rhythmic and in sync. I'd like to know what the effects are of coordinating the breathing, since prana follows the breath, especially when you perform uyaji along with the out-breath. I think the throat chakra activates the breath and directs prana by using sound vibrations. I know Yogani says you can go deeper if you don't coordinate the breathing. If this doesn't do anything for me, I can always go back, right?
These are my experiences since I've changed the meditation:
- As soon as I start up the mantra I can see a clump of light. Today, the clump of light turned into a perfectly round disk of pale white light that sort of looks like a moon except the center has no differentiating features. It simply looks like a pale white disk with a very slight touch of yellow in it. I watched it throughout the whole meditation. I tried to see if it is located in my heart chakra or in the sahasrara (Crown). It seems to have no locality.
- My arms and parts of my right side developed this feeling of being frozen in a stationary position, like being held in a magnetic field.
- The fire ( a gentle little boyscout campire) slowly rose up to my heart chakra. It was a pleasant warm feeling with very small flames.
- The whole meditation just flew by (it seemed like it lasted 2 minutes).
- After the meditation was over, I felt like I was having some kind of continuous low grade orgasm or a sexual rush coming up the front channel from my genital region (no erection). Two hours later, this is still going on.
- I'm experiencing spordic waves of tingles from my heart chakra upwards; it seems to be triggered by the sensual updraft that is coming from my genital area.
- There is way less ringing in my left ear and more in the right. I also have a slight headache right in the center of my head. (nothing I can't handle).
- I can see that the pleasureable sensations that are arising could be very addictive. They are lasting longer and longer after meditation.
Now I'm looking forward more to "after the meditation is over" than the meditation itself. 
That's it for now..
TI
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 29 2008 : 10:57:45 PM
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Hi,
Well, after 5 days of matching the breath with the mantra this is what I've discovered:
My tinnitus was nearly gone!!! It was still there, but so far into the background that I really had to listen for it. I also had some interesting experiences and wonderful persistent visions.
Yesterday, I went back to the deep silence style of meditation because I was starting to feel less insulated from events in the world. I went back to "not paying attention to the breath during meditation" and just letting it be. I still had visions, though. Today, I saw what resembles a blue planet or ball. I watched it for nearly 10 minutes. It looks like a blue water planet with white clouds on it. I'm wondering if this is the blue pearl that Muktananda talks about.. ??
Well, today my tinnitus is back with a vengeance.
Just what is going on here?
Is tinnitus a result of trying to voice mantras in the mind without adding the throat chakra?
What does that say about meditation techniques? Are you damaging your psyche or some synaptic pathways by breaking that connection during meditation, by not paying attention to the breath? Is that what is happening?
Or is it that deep silence meditation really get you deeper and this stimulates the pineal gland, which then causes the tinnitus (like I read somewhere)?
When you coordinate deep breathing with the mantra, it not only oxygenates your body, it draws in more prana and makes the apana function longer and more efficiently.
Many buddhist and other styles of meditation say to focus on your breathing. The "Clear Light of Bliss" says that when the breath is evenly matched through the left and right nostrils (equal flow) and when the inhale is exactly the same length as the exhale, the winds dissolve into the central channel. Is that relevant here?
Actually, I can remember having a hangover (haven't had a drink in 27 years now.. ) ) and having tinnitus. Is that tinnitus suggesting an imbalance in the chemistry of the brain?
What is going on here? After several months of having tinnitus and then not having it for four days, and then having it again, I find it really annoying and I'm convinced that it is directly linked to meditation breathing techniques. Can anyone else confirm this?
Thanks.
TI
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 30 2008 : 11:20:03 PM
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Hi,
The problem with personal history is that you have to keep changing it. -Don Juan
Today, I've had serious concerns about whether or not to incorporate watchful or controlled breathing into my meditations.
I was somewhat depressed about the issue, pondering the pros and cons of both techniques. I believe each has merits.
What I did enjoy about coordinating the breathing with the mantra are these phenomenon:
-The session went by very quickly, like being in a time warp
-It seemed easier to concentrate and hold the visions
-I found myself in a magnetic frozen type of state that I really enjoyed. (arms, right side)
-There was a definate after effect of sexual energy and feeling rising upwards after the meditation and this lasted for a while, longer and longer.
-Tinnitus nearly disappeared.
-During heart meditations, the only way I can keep a steady stream of awareness is to consciously control the breath. Also, during intense concentration, the breath naturally slows and suspends so I feel that this process is natural.
What I did not enjoy about coordinating the breathing with the mantra:
-Guilt about not blending in deep silence. However, many sources recommend a separate meditation on emptiness, which I will do.
-I wasn't sure if this was true meditation because it seemed to be a variation of spinal breathing.
-At one point during the meditation I started to get a pain up the left side of my neck. Reflecting on this afterwards, I think it was a definate clearing of some sort..
Anyway, I was dreading my second meditation of the day when I came accross this site http://lovebliss.eu/Myjourney.htm
As I read the journey, it quoted Muktananda and the mentioned the Blue Pearl (which I believe is what I am seeing now during meditation). Then, I read the section about Jan's method of meditation; it incorporates breathing and visualization. (this is an interesting account of the path to enlightment because although Jan activated the kundalini several times he still had to perform many tasks in order to take it further.)
Then, I opened a link to Shri Anandi Ma's website (from Jan's website) and found this about meditation and breathing:
quote:
Meditation and Breath
Meditation is the practice of turning the attention from outer awareness to inner concentration. In the practice of Kundalini Maha Yoga, meditation is much more than a relaxation technique. It is a way of easing resistance to the ascent of the Kundalini energy by quieting the fluctuations of the mind. Of all the forms of meditation, meditation through attention on the breath is the simplest and most direct way to Self-realization.
The aspirant can coordinate and integrate various energies of the nervous system by performing breathing exercises called pranayama in conjunction with meditation. Once this is accomplished, the student easily gains control over the life supporting vital air, the prana, which in turn leads to control over the mind. When the student gains complete control of the mind there is an experience of unique peace and joy. The student realizes the entire world is the creation of one God. When this happens on a large scale, the miseries of the world will end and there will be peace and happiness everywhere.
As I read this I started tingling and resonating with it. That is the sign I needed.
So, I've decided to go back to repeating the mantra while coordinating it with the breath.
TI
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - May 31 2008 : 03:21:19 AM
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Hi Tibetan_Ice,
I'm sorry I don't have anything to add to your questions. To me, with a research background, it would seem very difficult to be able to pinpoint exactly what in your practices is the causing factor X and what is the outcome factor Y. When we blend techniques from different systems, and are adding practices before evalutating each new step properly over long time (I'm speaking weeks and months, perhaps years), it's very, very difficult to tell what is what. The energies often has a certain "sleeping effect", thus the results doesn't show directly, but after a certain amount of time. It sounds like you don't give yourself enough time to find out before trying something new.
I reacted on this sentance: "It seemed easier to concentrate and hold the visions". In AYP we don't mind about the visions. There's no point in concentrating or holding them. Rather, the whole path is about practicing letting go...
Finally, I didn't understand the 6-3-6-3 thing in pranayama. What do you mean by those numbers?
I wish you well on your path, but I seriously think you might benefit greatly from a slow-down at the moment. What happens if you just drop your analyzing and testing and just settle in for one practice and keep it for a couple of months? If you want challenges, that might be the greatest one at the moment...  The most important result will not be in what you experience during practices - it will be in what you experience in your daily life.
All the best,
emc
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 31 2008 : 6:02:37 PM
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Hi emc!
Thank you for your concern. You are such a wonderful shakti! Awesome!
quote:
Originally posted by emc
I reacted on this sentance: "It seemed easier to concentrate and hold the visions". In AYP we don't mind about the visions. There's no point in concentrating or holding them. Rather, the whole path is about practicing letting go...
That sentence is referring to the practice of focusing single-pointedly on the little white-blue ball of light (called the indestructible drop) in my heart chakra.
According to "The Clear Light of Bliss", one's goal is to maintain undivided attention on the indestructible drop (or an object of meditation) for up to 1/2 hour, at which point the crown is supposed to kick in and shower down transforming energies. Once a practitioner has accomplished that, they then point their attention at 'emptiness'. The main requisite though, is the ability to concentrate. Concentrative meditation is a popular technique which is found in many teachings. I practice concentrative meditation on the heart drop.
Yes, it is not an AYP deep silence meditation technique. I believe that the AYP dsmt is 'recite the mantra once', then let go, then recite the mantra, then let go etc. So, in a sense, it is a broken stream of packets of concentration with "letting go" in between. And yes, Samyama is also great for 'letting go'. So yes, you are correct. However, when you keep adding things like mulabhanda, sambhavi, kechari etc to meditation, it is hard for me to believe that that is 'letting go'. I think that performing meditation with all the attachments is meant to re-wire your system so that when kundalini does kick in, the pathways are open. I think it is also the technique used to blend the rising of the ecstatic conductivity with deep silence.
quote:
Finally, I didn't understand the 6-3-6-3 thing in pranayama. What do you mean by those numbers?
You inhale for 6 seconds, hold for 3 seconds, exhale for 6 seconds and then hold that for 3 seconds, then repeat the cylce. What this routine does to me is it kicks in my lower chakras on the exhale-retention and they all tighten automatically, releasing tingles and energy from the perenium and the lower tan tien. It also heats me up and makes me sweat. (gentle heat, not heat up the spine).
quote:
I wish you well on your path, but I seriously think you might benefit greatly from a slow-down at the moment. What happens if you just drop your analyzing and testing and just settle in for one practice and keep it for a couple of months? If you want challenges, that might be the greatest one at the moment...
If I had to choose one practice, which would it be? I think that practice should be aligned to my goals and my goal is to become enlightened, or become one with God. I have to learn how to stand aside and "let God". This is my challenge (and probably everyone else's challenge too).
Lately, I'm conviced that the blue planet that I see is not the "Blue Pearl" that Muktananda talks about. I think the Blue Pearl is the indestructible drop at the center of the heart (because it looks like a blue pearl). What I'd really like to do is take the Blue Pearl for a ride. According to Muktananda, you can travel to distant places in it. According to "The Clear Light of Bliss" you can ride the indestructible drop up and down the sushumna, so who knows where else.
quote:
The most important result will not be in what you experience during practices - it will be in what you experience in your daily life.
All the best,
emc
Well said!
Today I have no tinnitus (ringing in the ears). It is there if I really listen for it, but for all practical purposes it is gone. I also don't have the runs today. Last night I did a 1 1/2 hour meditation session: 1/2 hour pranayama, 1/2 mantra repitition, 10 minutes heart meditation, 10 minutes full lotus and 10 minutes rest/reflection.
This morning, while I was sitting on my sheep skin rug in the bathroom, smoking, a being of light appeared to me. I did not bind it in the name of Jesus or question it. I felt like I didn't have to! It looks like an angel. I can feel it's purity, it's radiance. It has long wings of light. It is all white light and just shines. It is sending me great hoards of love! When I focus on it, I'm overwhelmed with love. I am showered upon with love, joy, tingles that envelope me. I have never felt so loved before. It makes me cry. I think I've been crying for 2 hours off and on today. It's so wonderful!!! I can't focus on it for too long at a time. It's so intense. I've been crying so much that I've developed a migraine of sorts. The back of head where it connects to my spine hurts pretty bad. The center of my head throbs up to the crown and there is a stabbing pain from my medula to my third eye. It is like the whole central third eye structure is being cleansed and purified. Intense purification of sorts..
So yes, experiences in my daily life are reflecting something wonderful. It's all good. Thank you for your correspondence. I appreciate it.
And yes, there is only one Source but it manifests in infinite ways.
Love and protection
TI
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VIL
USA
586 Posts |
Posted - May 31 2008 : 7:59:26 PM
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I enjoyed your experience TI, it sounds like a lot of positive things came from it.
Namaste:
VIL |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Jun 01 2008 : 3:16:24 PM
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Ah, oki, I associated to AYP pranayama, so I didn't get the 6-3-6-3. Now I get that you're not following AYP at all, so it all gets clearer.
Thanks for clarifying the rest!
All the best, emc |
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VIL
USA
586 Posts |
Posted - Jun 01 2008 : 6:11:41 PM
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I had an experience last night where I was awoken from a deep sleep and I felt a reverbational/vibration within the center of my chest. Now I'm accustomed to the regular vibrational kundalini, but this was different and felt just like a snake wriggling toward my throat, as if it was going to pop right out of my mouth!
It was kind of like when I was younger and would bend a metal saw to get the noise, vibrational, quality, but without the noise - but similar quality to it.
Anyway, so this snake like movement went right to my throat area and absorbed right into it toward the back of the throat, spinal area. It was a strange sensation and I later found out that the kunalini energy moved to the vishuddhi!
So, anyway, I wanted to share my experience with you, TI, since you are so generous to do this with what's going on with you.
And I also wanted to know how your head was feeling and is the throbbing still there?
Namaste:
VIL |
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - Jun 02 2008 : 01:37:00 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by emc
Ah, oki, I associated to AYP pranayama, so I didn't get the 6-3-6-3. Now I get that you're not following AYP at all, so it all gets clearer.
Thanks for clarifying the rest!
All the best, emc
Hi emc
I wouldn't say that I'm not following AYP at all. I have been doing spinal breathing and deep silence meditation twice a day, every day for the last 7 months. I also do kechari and sambhavi, root lock and rest afterwards. I also self-pace. But I also do kunlun, Reiki, chi exercises and some Qi gong. I also do heart meditations and Sagan practices to build my 3'rd eye. Also, if I get too much heat in the head I will do the Micro Cosmic Orbit. The last meditation of the evening is free-form; I pray and then do whatever I feel like doing.
The hard part for me is that during deep silence meditation I don't believe I've ever hit deep silence. I mean, I hit parts where there is just black and no thoughts. Is that deep silence? I think we had a discussion about the black before a while ago..
Like today, I did 5 minutes of Bhastrika, 5 minutes of spinal breathing, 20 minutes of "Om Namah Shivaya" while matching the breathing, rested for 5 min and then did 30 minutes of AYP deep silence meditation. During the deep silence meditation, I tried to make the mantra quieter and quieter (fuzzy?). It starts out as subvocalization. Then it is mental thought. Then I can see the "i am" as it comes. As I try to take it to a deeper, quieter place, this white cone shaped thing appears with the letters 'i am' on the tip. It looks like a growing straw of white light and it has the 'i am' at the top of it. It travels away from me and just keeps going. Before too long, there is just black, this long white thread with the 'i am' at the head of it and silence. No thoughts, just that ultra quiet 'i am' 'i am' 'i am' flashing on the end of the white thread. Now I don't think that's deep silence, is it?
This is the thing that I'm very confused about: Most yoga practices are like taking a balloon and stretching it, hoping that kundalini will jump in. The stretching of the balloon is the asanas, pranayama, meditation, kechari etc. After learning about the Siddhars (Cave of the Siddhars), shaktipat, turiya and watching this on Youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUtq...ture=related
it seems like the other method is to activate kundalini first and then the balloon stretches to accomodate it.
I would say in your case, the balloon is stretching because kundalini is already in it. You have been blessed. Now it is up to you to keep it up.
So why am I doing all of these practices? I don't know. I should go back to straight kundalini meditation and bring kundalini up again, instead of trying to stretch the balloon and hoping kundalini jumps in. That is what I've been asking myself. I've done two kundalini meditations in the past (Found at this link: http://www.crystalinks.com/kundalini.html ) which worked well. I've learned that I can light a fire up the spine just through concentrative meditation or focusing on the lights/suns that appear. I can also reach astral planes and experience new and wonderful phenonmenon and scenery.
Now today, I've read in "Kundalini Yoga for the West" by Swami Sivananda Radha (which I bought ten years ago) that the kundalini pranayama is to do a 3-12-3 breathing cycle and you focus on the root chakra while holding your breath for the 12. When I did this today, my crown opened up and streamed white liquid light down the sushumna to just above my root. This only took three rounds (under two minutes). I stopped there because I believe I've been influenced by fear (and I have to work tomorrow).  Maybe I've read too many posts about premature kundalini awakening?  Now I must overcome my fear.
Well, I've seen two videos on YouTube where crowds of Indians were given Shaktipat and many of them were going into spontaneous yoga movements (like you). Some of these people are children!!! Maybe Osho is right when he said that everyone in India has their kundalini active.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGpS...ture=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dk7FC-VlHmo
Maybe I'm having a bad day. Maybe not. The tinnitus is back so that blows that theory 
Love, Light and protection!!!!
:)
TI
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - Jun 02 2008 : 01:51:17 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by VIL
I had an experience last night where I was awoken from a deep sleep and I felt a reverbational/vibration within the center of my chest. Now I'm accustomed to the regular vibrational kundalini, but this was different and felt just like a snake wriggling toward my throat, as if it was going to pop right out of my mouth!
It was kind of like when I was younger and would bend a metal saw to get the noise, vibrational, quality, but without the noise - but similar quality to it.
Anyway, so this snake like movement went right to my throat area and absorbed right into it toward the back of the throat, spinal area. It was a strange sensation and I later found out that the kunalini energy moved to the vishuddhi!
So, anyway, I wanted to share my experience with you, TI, since you are so generous to do this with what's going on with you.
And I also wanted to know how your head was feeling and is the throbbing still there?
Namaste:
VIL
Hi VIL
It is cool to hear about your experience! Thank you for sharing too. With kundalini in your throat chakra you might find new power in voicing mantras or even speaking words. Pay careful attention to the spoken word for the next while.
Me? I think I've had a bad day. The tinnitus returned even though I was coordinating my breath yesterday and yes, the throbbing pain was still there today. Funny, it only hurt when I relaxed or really tensed. I ended up taking an aspirin and still did two 1 hour meditations today (and cut the lawn).
You'll have to let me know how kundalini gets along with your spoken words. Also, there is a knot in or above the neck chakra. I wonder if your kundalini will blow it away or gradually loosen it. Good luck!
Om Shanti
TI
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Christi
United Kingdom
4515 Posts |
Posted - Jun 02 2008 : 12:31:14 PM
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Hi TI,
quote:
“When I first tried the heart meditation on the indestructable drop in the heart as described in "The Clear Light of Bliss", I saw an area in my heart chakra that resembles some whitish straws twisted around each other. In the center of this 'knot' is a small round ball of white light surrounded by a ring of light blue. There is also a thin white chord projecting out from the heart knot to about 4 inches in front of my chest, and there is another light clump of white light at then end of that chord. I was somewhat confused about this until I realized that perhaps this other clump of white light was my astral self that had shrunken quite a bit.”
Interesting stuff! This sounds very much like something that Sri Aurobindo called the “psychic being”. He never gave a description of it but there is a book published by the Sri Aurobindo ashram called “The psychic being” and on the front cover is a picture of this as you describe it, a ball of white light made up of hundreds of straws. I have seen this thing myself, and I have seen it move (inside me) from the heart up to the third eye and descend back down again. Here are some very loose quotations of things that Sri Aurobindo said about it (it is a couple of years since I read anything by him so please forgive my loose quotes) :
“ The psychic being has two seats one in the heart and one in the head”
“When the psychic being comes to the fore and takes full control of the sadhana [spiritual practice] the way becomes much easier”
“A sadhak [spiritual practitioner] could enter samadhi every day for thirty years without ever coming upon the psychic being centred in the heart”
This brings to mind the line in the Bagavad Gita (again a very loose translation from memory):
“In the heart of every human is a being about the size of a mans thumb which is the jivatma [living soul]”
When I saw this thing it was flashing, and the speed of its flashing changed. There were only two speeds, fast and slow. The slow speed was the same as my heartbeat. The fast speed was a bit slower than a strobe light
quote:
“About 4 days ago, as I was sitting on the bathroom floor having (you guessed it) a smoke after meditating, a woman appeared to me in my 3'rd eye vision. Although I ignore visions during meditation now, I pay attention to the ones that just come out of nowhere when I'm doing something else.
Not knowing who or what this woman was, I bound it in the name of Jesus Christ, asked it to leave if it was not from the highest purest realms and prayed the blood of Jesus over it. (This is my protection routine). The woman remained. She was dancing.
She has long brown curly hair, blue eyes and white teeth. She wears a yellow top and a long blue-black skirt with white puffy fringes underneath that comes down to just above her knees. She has bare feet and shakes a tamboreen. Or rather, sometimes she has a tamboreen. Sometimes she lifts one leg and twirls around. She is very beautiful. She kind of hops when she dances and swings her feet around.
I asked her "Who are you?". She replied "I am Kundalini". I asked "Why are you dancing?" She replied "I am dancing for you". After saying that, she slowly spun in a circle and kept dancing. I asked her why she had no shoes. She said that she could wear shoes if I'd like. [a pair of black high heels appeared on her feet]. With the heels on, she did not dance with the same carefree pulsing rhythym as before. So, I asked to to take the shoes off. She did. Hmm.. I asked her to take off her clothes. She did. She had golden chains hanging from her breasts and around her torso, like a bikini. She said "I can look like anyone you'd like. I can be anyone.". At this point I was kind of amused and somewhat perplexed.
I opened my eyes and then closed them again. She was still there. Her skirt was back on and she had resumed the dance. For the rest of the night, whenever I closed my eyes, or peered into the 3'rd eye cave, she was there.”
All the advice in Yoga (and I suspect in Tibetan Buddhism also) is to ignore visions of this kind. It is difficult to say if this lady is malevolent or benevolent. After all, malevolent spirits usually appear to be beautiful and helpful, as they are often very clever, and if they appear to be ugly and harmful then they would not succeed in their task, which is simply to distract you from your path on the spiritual quest. The incantation you use as a protection spell is a good one, but it will be dependent for its effectiveness on the level of your spiritual will. There are many powerful beings in the astral realms that could easily survive such an incantation if the will accompanying it is not strong or pure enough. I tend to think that truly high and benevolent female beings from the heavenly realms who have our best interests at heart, generally speaking, don’t take all their kit off as soon as we ask them to. But then she did leave her chain mail underwear on so... who knows.
These beings can often appear to us in any form they choose, and they can easily read our minds, and so they can appear in a form that will draw us under their power if they are not of good intent. (Apparently) the higher you go on the path, the more of these beings will be drawn to you, and the harder they will try to draw the direction of your sadhana away from the truly Divine path.
The best way to test such beings is to ignore them. A being who is actually wanting to help you will stay around and help whenever needed, and one that does not serve your higher interests will get annoyed and go away to find some other prey. Those beings that have dark intentions survive by drawing your attention and energy. They feed on lust, craving, fear, anger and hatred. This is why ignoring such visions is the best way of proceeding over the long term. The good will stay, and the bad will leave. And the good will become more and more, everywhere about you.
Crossing the fourth dimension is hard as there are dangers everywhere and someone with a weak heart, or an unstable mind, could easily be swept away and lost to madness or worse. Mental institutions all over the world are filled with people who have entered these dimensions (the lower fourth especially) and have not survived. This is why it is so important to develop a strong sadhana in the first instance, and to follow the guidance of those who have gone before.
The good news is that these beings only exist in the fourth dimension, they do not exist at all in the fifth dimension, so if you are able to make the crossing safely then you will be safe. There everything is light and everything is so clear that you will have no doubts about the true nature of things and about the true intentions of beings.
quote:
This morning, while I was sitting on my sheep skin rug in the bathroom, smoking, a being of light appeared to me. I did not bind it in the name of Jesus or question it. I felt like I didn't have to! It looks like an angel. I can feel it's purity, it's radiance. It has long wings of light. It is all white light and just shines. It is sending me great hoards of love! When I focus on it, I'm overwhelmed with love. I am showered upon with love, joy, tingles that envelope me. I have never felt so loved before. It makes me cry. I think I've been crying for 2 hours off and on today. It's so wonderful!!! I can't focus on it for too long at a time. It's so intense. I've been crying so much that I've developed a migraine of sorts. The back of head where it connects to my spine hurts pretty bad. The center of my head throbs up to the crown and there is a stabbing pain from my medula to my third eye. It is like the whole central third eye structure is being cleansed and purified. Intense purification of sorts..
Now That is an angel.
I have been visited by such beings, and I also cry when they touch me. Beautiful aren't they. A few months ago my yoga teacher in India told me not to rely even on angels. He said they can be ficcle, like fairies. I was very surprised. He recommends only going to the high Devas for guidance and advice (higher than angels).
I must say, I do have to agree with emc when she said that you need to chop and change less, and give things more time to settle in.
Good luck!
Christi
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