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lightandlove
Germany
85 Posts |
 Posted - Aug 15 2021 : 09:15:22 AM
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Hi everyone,
how do you deal with emotions attached to people that e.g. broke a friendship?
So a while ago I had quite a good friend at the time, but due to happenings I felt quite hurt by him due to dishonesty from his side, which in talks he never admitted, but rather put on to me kind of, although I cannot have known about it. Thus I kept distance from him.
What I lately realized is that whenever I think of him or see him, emotions pop up about this happening. I very much associate this with him.
What I wonder is, while the happening is in the past and cannot be changed, why does it bother me in regards of is presence.
Should I feel as I do and accept it as such? Like ok, this happened and I feel like this person is not supposed to be close to me as long as there is no openness from his side and thats ok.
I would feel wrong to kind of „white“ color it. What helped me alot is to talk openly about it to other friends and close people.
I am happy to hear your thoughts that may quiet mine :) |
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interpaul
USA
551 Posts |
Posted - Aug 16 2021 : 5:02:53 PM
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Lightandlove, You cannot control other people. Ideally love is shared like the release of a sutra in Samyama. People all have baggage. We have the option of engaging with whomever we choose. There are certain behaviors for each of us where the other crosses the line. Dishonesty and denial of accountability sound like a strong boundary for you. I believe these past actions continue to bother you in the present since the connection you feel to this individual remains on some level. It is also likely you remain conflicted about how to proceed. Should you "white color" it, blow it off, lower your standards for what you will tolerate or move on. This process is an internal one, that is, you can work through your feelings and still remain in this persons presence without him having this hold on you. I wish you clarity and wisdom working through this very painful interpersonal struggle.  |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1734 Posts |
Posted - Aug 17 2021 : 7:23:41 PM
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hi lightandlove
Accepting the emotion is a good approach, if you can take it. Or release the feeling into silence, as interpaul suggested:
quote:
Originally posted by interpaul
like the release of a sutra in Samyama.
You might find Lesson 110 useful. It's not the same situation, but it's about how to deal with an unwanted emotion. |
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k.cherry
USA
86 Posts |
Posted - Aug 19 2021 : 01:49:53 AM
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| Hi lightandlove, I'm sorry you're feeling hurt by your friend. Betrayal by someone close is a horrible feeling. I think your instinct to not ignore the feeling is good, and talking to others is healthy. I'd say just be mindful of talking too much about it, because it can also unconsciously fall into the gossip side of things where the ego is trying to soothe itself in the warmth of other's sympathy and/or make the other person look bad. Not at all saying that’s what you’re doing, but I can’t tell you how many times I’ve obsessed over being wronged and talked everybody's ear off about it for a very long time, only to later realize that I either had a similar quality in myself as they did or that I was unknowingly trying to socially isolate/punish the other person. I find more healing can be brought into the world if I flip the problem on it’s head and inquire as to why I’m so hurt by this particular action or person. There is a reason the mind/ego latches on to specific things and not others, and it often involves our blind spots. Like a resonating guitar string, we must have that particular note in ourself in some form in order to resonate with the music that others play, even if we think their music sucks. We can only ever change ourselves, but this self-work is exactly the portal through which healing comes into being. Just a perspective. Best of luck |
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lightandlove
Germany
85 Posts |
Posted - Aug 20 2021 : 12:54:11 PM
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Thank you interpaul for your insights.
It is true that I was very unsure about how to see and take the situation. I kind of pushed my feelings away as I felt a strong defense coming from the outside that intimidated me to open up to others. It is just now after one and a half year that I felt ready to talk about it and it wasn‘t easy as I did still feel strong resistance from people involved.
I found out that it is exactly this what blocked me inside. All in all the story wasn‘t really an issue for his life and I felt like if I don‘t accept that and keep my own emotions back and act like it does not matter to me, I would not act in a right way. So I suppressed my suffering.
K.cherry, I very much agree with you that this can quickly turn into gossip. Though, in my case, this fear of judging him by telling my side of the story is what hurt me even more. I did not allow myself to feel this disappointment, distrust and pain, just in fear of being uncomfortable for him.
I did recognise very much that in situations where I talked to him I would outwardly very much act and talk like nothing has happened, but inside I was in this room of all these emotions that longed to be expressed, but weren‘t allowed to, were defended from outwards and by myself.
I learned that only I am able to feel my emotions and can fully trust them. Even if others don‘t like to hear, it is not my business and should not influence the way I feel. No one else can judge my feelings or should be able to do so in sake of their own ego. I am allowed to fully express myself.
What I experienced during the last days in my meditations is that I slowly allowed this room to open up with full acceptance. Giving room and space for these emotions to be experienced in an attitude of forgiveness towards him, with a big hug and also full acceptance wether he may recognize this or not, and let it go into silence as you described, BlueRaincoat.
At this point, I feel that I am able to say that I can move on and let this be a story of the past.
Thank you all for your time
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interpaul
USA
551 Posts |
Posted - Aug 20 2021 : 4:55:30 PM
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| lightandlove, You are living up to your online name, releasing these heavy feelings and being more light in love. This sounds like an amazing meditation session. Don't be surprised if the feelings return, just release them how you have. I'd expect they will be less heavy if they do come back. It is really hard to truly forgive just as it is really hard to love unconditionally. Learning to forgive, I suspect is like one of the "obstructions" Yogani talks about being slowly cleared through DM. I admire your desire for personal growth and commitment to the journey. |
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lightandlove
Germany
85 Posts |
Posted - Aug 21 2021 : 10:32:47 AM
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Hi Interpaul,
I very much agree with you that truly forgiving is not an easy task. For quite a while now I'm using "forgiveness" as a sutra in Samyama. I find it very relieving, especially when it comes to forgiving myself for and making myself aware of my own ignorance. |
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Annademiel
Germany
29 Posts |
Posted - Sep 03 2021 : 4:20:58 PM
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Hello LightandLove,
Maybe what you are looking for is what Yogani describes as "letting go of Jnana". He advises to look for the system you like best and mentions the "Sedona Method" or "The Work" as examples. Most importantly, he explains that it is less about following an intellectual concept and more about letting intentions go into stillness - just like samyama is about the sutras. My understanding is that the methods e.g. in your case are for getting clear with questions about wanting to conclude/let go of a certain thing and then letting that decision go into stillness, stillness is an amplifier for our intentions.
I have not been around AYP or spiritual paths that long so what I write is just my personal view, may be those who are already a bit more enlightened here can say more or different about it, just take what you find useful for you.
First of all, I think the very fact that you are actively trying to forgive something speaks very well for you and there is no reason to hide for someone else hurting you. You don't need to condemn yourself for a wound you received and the feelings that arose from it, what is important is how you acted and if it was an unpleasant action, you decided to do it differently next time. This can also be the decision not to be affected by injustice, if one's own actions were already okay anyway.
Then: What do you understand by forgiveness? For me it looks as if you set yourself the standards of a saint and want to meet the one who has hurt you with love / compassion. This is what Jesus and others have taught us, but is sometimes difficult to implement when the wounds are not yet healed. Of course it can help to ask yourself why another person acted this way or that way and since behind every hurtful act there is also an imperfection, this can sometimes help us to have compassion. From my own experience, however, I can say that a different approach and definition of forgiveness has helped me better.
Forgiveness: The decision, for the sake of one's own inner peace, to renounce everything that the thing presents / holds. In most cases this was with me the feeling still something like debate, apology (worst case revenge) from this or that to get or the last word (also a reconciling) to have. However, if one comes to the realization that the most urgent wish of the heart is simply to let the matter be ... well, because one does not want to suffer anymore, one is usually able to close an unpleasant matter - with silence or without. If we are honest, in such cases it is usually not about the highest ideal to love the enemies - one simply does not want to suffer anymore. At least that was the case with me a few times in the past. Once this decision (not to continue in favor of closure) has been made or some other method has been used, there comes a point when the pressure, the burden on the heart eases a bit, it's not all good immediately, but it eases. I have always felt this as if there was a splinter before that has now been pulled out. In your case this seems to be the case to a certain degree and in my experience one is well advised not to operate on the matter any further from this point on; the splinter may be gone but the wound still needs some time to heal and should then be left alone.
If there was friendship / love for the person in question before, then this will reassert itself over time and the past will rest. If you did not have much to do with the person in truth, you see that more clearly now and perhaps let this relationship go.
I do not feel love for all people who have hurt me once - why should I? But I don't bear them any grudge and in some cases I also feel sympathy. In general, I think that at some point we start to love even our enemies, then when we start to love all people, when we progress further on the path. And once the wounds are healed a little bit, you can certainly start to wish these people well in silence / pray for them whatever.
In my experience, however, it is not so helpful as long as one is still bleeding to want to love or to dissect the situation in order not to find something from which one could perhaps learn something. This can be done later or on smaller current and similar situations to master them better in the future (find the string that resonates). For the healing of the old wound itself it is in my experience not so good to do this, certainly not in which one brings this situation mentally over and over again and in addition counts also, once one spoke out with someone who also listened to us, to talk over and over again about it.
So my advice would be to see if there isn't something in you that is stronger than the hurt you suffered, stronger than all the negative feelings or the desire for official closure from the outside, a last bastion if you will. This can be your own ishta of wanting to forgive at all costs because that is your path, because someone you have as an example has advised you to do so, or because you yourself feel in your innermost being that you will do it, simply because it is right. Or you find that the strongest desire is to be free of this thing, to be happy again. Mostly it is the last one, your own will to survive, because I can tell you one thing: to carry such a grievance around with you for more than one and a half years is nothing else than a slow way to commit suicide. So: throw it out! Whatever it was, it has no right to continue to sour your life (and you don't have the right to carry it around either, because that's not what God gave you your body for, and if we're really all one, the whole thing radiates out). Throw it out and then ... let it go. In my experience, forgiveness is a decision of the heart and from the moment it is made it gets better - if you give it time and don't bring it back. Leave the analyzing to the wise and the loving to the saints, the important thing is to find your inner peace again; if you are already doing such powerful yoga with so much devotion at the age of 21, you will get the other qualities.
Greetings
Annademiel
The same in German
Hallo LightandLove,
Vielleicht ist das was du suchst das was Yogani unter „loslassendem Jnana“ beschreibt. Er rät dabei sich das System zu suchen das einem am besten gefällt und nennt die „Sedona Methode“ oder „The Work“ als Beispiele. Vor allem erklärt er aber, dass es dabei weniger auf das Befolgen eines intellektuellen Konzeptes ankommt, als darum Absichten in die Stille gehen zu lassen – genau wie bei Samyama die Sutren. Meiner Auffassung nach dienen die Methoden z.B. in deinem Fall dazu sich mit Fragen darüber klar zu werden, dass man eine bestimmte Sache abschließen/ gehen lassen möchte und diesen Entschluss dann in die Stille gehen zu lassen, Stille ist ein Verstärker für unsere Absichten.
Ich bin noch nicht so lange bei AYP oder auf geistigen Wegen, daher ist das was ich schreibe nur meine persönliche Ansicht, kann sein, dass Diejenigen die hier schon ein bisschen erleuchteter sind mehr oder anderes dazu sagen können, nimm einfach was du für dich nützlich findest.
Zunächst einmal: Ich denke alleine die Tatsache, dass du dich aktiv darum bemühst etwas zu vergeben spricht sehr für dich und es gibt keinen Grund sich dafür zu verstecken, dass Jemand anders einem verletzt hat. Man braucht sich für eine erhaltene Wunde und die Gefühle die daraus entstanden sind nicht noch verdammen oder das verbergen, wichtig ist wie man gehandelt hat und falls das ungute Handlungen waren, den Entschluss gefasst hat es beim Nächsten mal anders zu machen. Das kann auch der Entschluss sein sich von Unrecht nicht mehr so treffen zu lassen, falls die eigenen Handlungen sowieso schon in Ordnung waren.
Dann: Was verstehst du unter Vergebung? Für mich sieht es so aus als ob du dir die Maßstäbe eines Heiligen setzt und den der dich Verletzt hat mit Liebe / Mitgefühl begegnen möchtest. Das ist das was Jesus und Andere uns gelehrt haben, ist aber manchmal schwer umzusetzen wenn die Wunden noch nicht verheilt sind. Natürlich kann es helfen sich zu fragen warum ein Anderer so oder so gehandelt hat und da hinter jeder verletzenden Tat ebenfalls eine Unvollkommenheit steckt kann uns das manchmal helfen Mitgefühl zu haben. Aus meiner eigenen Erfahrung kann ich sagen, dass mir aber eine andere Vorgehensweise und Definition von Vergebung besser geholfen hat.
Vergebung: Die Entscheidung, um des eigenen inneren Frieden willens, auf alles zu verzichten was die Sache vorsetzt / festhält. In den meisten Fällen war das bei mir das Gefühl noch etwas wie Aussprache, Entschuldigung (schlimmstenfalls Rache) von Diesem oder Jenem bekommen zu müssen oder das Letzte Wort (auch ein Versöhnendes) haben zu müssen. Wenn man im Inneren aber zu der Erkenntnis kommt, das der dringlichste Wunsch des Herzens ganz einfach der ist die Sache … gut sein zu lassen, weil man selbst nicht mehr Leiden möchte, ist man in der Regel in der Lage eine unangenehme Sache abzuschließen – mit Stille oder ohne. Es geht wenn wir ehrlich sind in solchen Fällen meist nicht um das höchste Ideal die Feinde zu lieben – man will einfach nicht mehr Leiden. Zumindest war das bei mir in der Vergangenheit ein paar mal so. Ist diese Entscheidung (Verzicht auf Fortsetzung zugunsten des Abschließens) einmal gefallen oder hat man sonst irgendeine Methode angewendet, kommt der Punkt an dem der Druck, die Last auf dem Herzen etwas nachlässt, es ist nicht sofort alles gut, aber es lässt nach. Ich habe das immer so empfunden als ob vorher ein Splitter da war der nun herausgezogen wurde. Bei dir scheint das zu einem gewissen Grad der Fall zu sein und meiner Erfahrung nach ist man ab diesem Zeitpunkt gut beraten nicht weiter an der Sache herum zu operieren; der Splitter mag weg sein aber zum Heilen braucht die Wunde dann noch einige Zeit und sollte dann in Ruhe gelassen werden.
War zu der betreffenden Person vorher Freundschaft / Liebe da, dann wird diese sich mit der Zeit wieder durchsetzen und die Vergangenheit wird ruhen. Hatte man mit der Person in Wahrheit nicht viel zu schaffen sieht man auch das jetzt klarer und lässt diese Beziehung vielleicht gehen.
Ich empfinde nicht für alle Personen die mich einmal verletzt haben Liebe – warum auch? Aber ich trage ihnen auch nichts nach und in manchen Fällen empfinde ich auch Mitgefühl. Allgemein denke ich, dass wir schon irgendwann anfangen auch unsere Feinde zu lieben, dann wenn wir anfangen alle Menschen zu lieben, wenn wir auf dem Pfad weiter vorankommen. Und sind die Wunden erst einmal ein wenig verheilt kann man sicher noch anfangen diesen Leuten in der Stille gutes zu wünschen / für sie zu beten wie auch immer.
Meiner Erfahrung nach ist es aber nicht so hilfreich solange man noch blutet lieben zu wollen oder die Situation zu zerlegen um nicht doch noch etwas zu finden woraus man vielleicht etwas lernen könnte. Das kann man später einmal oder an kleineren aktuellen und ähnlich beschaffenen Situationen um diese in Zukunft besser zu meistern (Saite die mitschwingt finden). Für die Heilung der alten Wunde selbst ist es meiner Erfahrung nach nicht so gut dies zu tun, schon gar nicht in dem man diese Situation gedanklich immer wieder herholt und dazu zählt auch, hat man sich einmal mit Jemandem der uns auch zugehört hat ausgesprochen, immer wieder darüber zu reden.
Mein Rat wäre also, dass du schaust ob es da nicht etwas in dir gibt, das stärker ist als die erlittene Kränkung, stärker als all die negativen Gefühle oder der Wunsch nach einem offiziellen Abschluss von Außen, eine letzte Bastion wenn man so will. Das kann das eigene Ishta sein um jeden Preis Vergeben zu wollen weil das dein Pfad ist, weil das Jemand den du als Vorbild hast geraten hast oder weil du selbst im Innerstem fühlst dass du es willst tun wirst, ganz einfach weil es richtig ist. Oder du findest dass der stärkste Wunsch ist dass du von dieser Sache wieder frei, wieder glücklich sein möchtest. Meistens ist es das letzte, der eigene Überlebenswille, denn eins kann ich dir sagen: Eine solche Kränkung mehr als eineinhalb Jahre mit sich herum zu tragen ist nichts anderes als eine langsame Art Selbstmord zu begehen. Also: schmeiß es raus! Was auch immer es war es hat kein Recht dir weiterhin das Leben zu versauern (Und auch du hast nicht das Recht das mit dir herumzutragen, denn dazu hat Gott dir deinen Körper nicht gegeben und wenn wir wirklich alle eins sind stahlt das ganze auch noch aus). Schmeiß es raus und dann … lass es gut sein. Meiner Erfahrung nach ist Vergeben eine Herzendentscheidung und ab dem Zeitpunkt wo sie getroffen ist wird es besser – wenn man der Sache Zeit lässt und sie nicht wieder herholt. Überlass das Analysieren den Klugen und das Lieben den Heiligen, wichtig ist erst einmal dass du wieder deinen inneren Frieden findest; wenn du schon mit 21 mit so viel Hingabe so kraftvolles Yoga machst wirst du die anderen Qualitäten schon noch dazubekommen.
Grüße
Annademiel |
Edited by - Annademiel on Sep 04 2021 10:51:42 PM |
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lightandlove
Germany
85 Posts |
Posted - Sep 07 2021 : 10:54:23 AM
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Dear Annademiel,
thank you very much for taking your time and writing these beautiful words. It seems to me that you speak from your heart when you give this advice and it deeply resonated with what I am experiencing.
May you be blessed on your path |
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interpaul
USA
551 Posts |
Posted - Sep 07 2021 : 6:39:24 PM
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Annademiel, Beautiful and wise words. Your dual response is like a Rosetta stone. I am going to use your response to learn German now |
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Annademiel
Germany
29 Posts |
Posted - Sep 08 2021 : 3:56:53 PM
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quote:
May you be blessed on your path
Thank you 
and: you too
quote:
I am going to use your response to learn German now
I wish I could bring myself to seriously learn English instead of trying DeepL |
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Letting go of emotions
