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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
 Posted - Feb 09 2006 : 06:55:42 AM
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Hello and thank you. AYP is a great site.I have only known it for a month, but it has answered many questions I had about the strong sensations that run through my body. My name is Katrine and I live right outside Oslo in Norway. I am 44 years old. When I was 18 I had a strange attraction to Yoga (noone in my family or vicinity knew about Yoga back then). I stumbled across a book in the library one day and felt strangely drawn to it. I never went to a course but did a few of the asanas on and off for a few years. Then I met an Englishman in Oslo that introduced me to meditation (bless him  ). I learned TM and did that also for a few years. Then life got busy (or rather, I did). I married, had children and meditation subsided for years. I had two serious health issues coming up, first I got arthritis (17 years ago) and second I had cancer (10 years ago). The first diagnose led me into a new profession (homeopath and councilor) but it was the cancer that really woke me up. Death does that. I changed my diet to macrobiotic food and that cured first the arthritis and then the cancer. But most important of all, I took up TM again. I have never done any other practise; just simple mantra meditation once a day for about 15 min. And for long periods at a time I didn’t meditate either. After the cancer I felt a strong urge to read illuminated literature. The books seemed to find me. In 2003 I came across the books of A.H.Almaas and the Diamond Approach. For the first time I had a tool to work with. The way he integrates psychology and spirituality immediately won me over. After I finished all his books I read most of the works of Osho. Together these two clear minds have given me a platform to work from. After applying my awareness on unconscious behaviour patterns and working with fully accepting and understanding the layers of my psyche (ego/essence) I discovered one day that I was emptied of previous trauma. During this time I did not practise regular meditation, but I practised being present to myself whenever I could during daily life. (This is also meditation, no?). Eventually the constant raw pain I felt in my chest changed into emptiness and then it transformed into a spacious feeling. One day I discovered an inner sound. Listening to it was ecstatic! Eventually all my chakras became clear (But this was always in juncture with understanding something new (it involved acceptance of deep pain inside) about how my personality operated. I won’t go into details on how my process speeded up after that; it is enough to say that I now experience ecstatic conductivity all the time - in fact this is how I found the AYP site – I simply listed my symptoms in google, and what popped up was Yoganis lessons. At that time I could hardly concentrate because the ecstatic feelings were so strong, and the pressure in my head was enormous (I never felt it as painful though). I also had unfamiliar taste and smell experiences (pleasant). Since I have never talked to anyone about my spiritual practises (in fact I never even labelled them as such) I simply didn’t know what to do. At the same time I knew things were progressing exactly the way they should. I felt – and still feel – an enormous calm. After reading what Yogani says I immediately started to do spinal breathing before I meditate. It also became clear that I had done too much meditation (the pull inwards is so immense  ). In just a few days everything ran along just fine. The activity in my crown is there constantly, and I don’t dare to focus on it, but all I have to do is look at my spine from bottom to the third eye and in just a few seconds the energy instead concentrates there. I have to do this while I am in daily activity since the energy is always active. My question to you is: Why do you not talk about the importance of understanding HOW we end up loosing contact with our inner center? And how important it is to use this understanding actively? Surely doing both that and Yoga/meditation will speed up anyones process? Maybe this is a form of yoga I haven’t heard about? I have never done any yoga mudra or kechari or all the rest; then how come grace showered me with all this ecstacy? I have another question: Most of the time the pressure I feel in my head comes from “below” – but every now and then I experience a truckload on my head – coming from “above”. When it happens it feels like I am pressed down by an enormous force, and I can hardly move a finger. I simply watch it; it doesn’t scare me but it is intriguing. What is it? I understand that it is something my system is having trouble absorbing. Why? After experiencing it, it becomes very clear that my heart is my center. Something meets there. Daily I have incredibly strong experiences of love inside; when I look around then, everything is crisp and clear and has a shine to it. I also understand that I have always had a lot of Bakhti in my life. I somehow think that my process will take care of itself. It has so far. Is it possible to manage the opening of the crown without engaging in the yoga exercises? (I like spinal breathing a lot and will keep doing that, but I am hesitant when it comes to kechari and bastrikas etc). One more thing: When I read illuminated literature these days, the ecstacy becomes so strong I have trouble concentrating. (I have taken it to mean that I should stay with the energy and not the books  Any tips?
Thank you for listening to all my words (sorry...I took up a lot of space).
Katrine
May all your Nows be Here |
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yogani99
USA
153 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2006 : 09:56:13 AM
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Hi Katrine and welcome!
I have been enjoying your beautiful poetry the past few days. When experiences reach a certain depth and intensity, poetry is about the only way to capture the feelings. I don't know why exactly, but fewer words can say more in describing such experiences. Perhaps it is the inner silence that shines through between the lines. Rumi is one of the masters of this, and so is St. John of the Cross. Leaping through traditions there. The tradition does not matter. It is the divine expression surging through the human nervous system that does. We are the doorway.
Speaking of surging, your experiences described above are also beautiful. Your journey verifies that there is certainly more than one way to go through the process of human spiritual transformation. At the same time, you are running into some of the same opportunities and limits we all find as we move ahead with practices and find ourselves in the resulting experiences. We want to let it happen fully, yet we must self-pace or face a bit of chaos. It is a matter of managing the process of purification that is occurring within us. I am very happy you are finding spinal breathing and some of the other methods in AYP to be helpful. As for the crown, well, I think you are finding what we have been discussing in the AYP lessons. It can be approached directly, but only with great care in later stages. That too is self-pacing.
As for the psychological component -- how we lose our center, how we get it back, and how we make our choices in daily activity. Of course, it will be much better to focus on how to cultivate our center than to be laboring over how we may have lost it. In the AYP approach, we focus on developing inner silence, and later on, ecstatic conductivity, and when we are not in sitting practices we just go out and live our life. Then we become naturally radiated from within in much the same way you have described the natural illumination that came to you during the powerful events that happened in your life. The more we go out and walk through our desires, challenges and fears, the more the inner divine will express and become stabilized in us. Sitting practices set the stage for this in a big way. But we still have to go out and actualize the inner transformation in our daily life. For that, all we must do is engage in what is before us. To pick up on another topic, it is hardly a sanyasin's (renunciate's) life.
There is a very good discussion on making our choices in daily living over here: http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....TOPIC_ID=790
AYP does not pretend to know how everyone ought to be choosing in daily living. It is such an organic process, and unique to each person. Yet, we can lay an inner foundation that will illuminate the process of choosing from the inside. Then we are empowered in our individual lives to fulfill a divine purpose, each in our own way. That is a surrender, of course. First a surrender to the means that can transform us inwardly, and, ultimately, to the infinite power of God that seeks to express out through us. It is through this surrender that both we and the world can be illuminated.
Thank you for joining in and sharing, Katrine. Wishing you the best on your path. Enjoy!
The guru is in you.
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2006 : 10:56:29 AM
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Dear Yogani
I feel so blessed by your response. Something in me was touched even before I saw your reply, because I started crying for no reason at all. Just a profound sense of wanting to let go; to surrender; to give in filled the room (I felt a presence). Then I found your reply and the feeling increased. I found your work at just the right time (thank you grace) - My head still has questions, but my heart is still and satisfied after your words. I'll simply continue to live one breath at a time and then what comes may come.
Namaste
Katrine
May all your Nows be Here |
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Manipura
USA
870 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2006 : 11:11:56 AM
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Hi Katrine - Thanks for what you wrote above. It's very inspiring. I'm also 44 (a great age, don't you think?), but haven't the years of experience as you in yogic matters. You could say that I'm still in the teething stage. I have some questions specifically for yoginis, if you don't mind; they're mostly geared toward the female anatomy and the movement of the ecstatic current. Let me know when (if) you're ready and willing and I'll put it under another topic heading. Thanks again - I'm glad that you found AYP.
meg |
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2006 : 11:15:55 AM
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Of course Meg
Anytime, really.
I honestly don't think I am very experienced; but I have longs since stopped keeping myself a secret. Ask away - I'll do my best to answer!
May all your Nows be Here |
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Manipura
USA
870 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2006 : 11:30:09 AM
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| Great. Thanks. I don't have time now, but in the next couple of days I'll post it. Probably under 'Asanas'. |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Feb 12 2006 : 5:35:24 PM
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quote:
One more thing: When I read illuminated literature these days, the ecstacy becomes so strong I have trouble concentrating. (I have taken it to mean that I should stay with the energy and not the books Any tips?
Hi Katrine,
I have had similar experiences these days but not with ecstacy but more with big jumps in inner silence. I find that when reading illuminated literature it is like meditating for me and then when I do practices I have to cut down the time because everything seems to be working more intensely. I feel like the reading accelerates the purification process inside. Sorry no solutions I just wanted to share. I personally self-pace my reading so it's not too much too fast.
Overall, I am observing that the more inner silence, the more effectively all the practices work; it's as if all the purification we go through accelerates over time.
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Feb 15 2006 : 04:54:43 AM
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Thank you, Anthem.
Yes - the issue of self pacing goes for every aspect of our journey. I agree that it is the amount of inner silence that sets the stage for the purification process. One of the difficulties I face with this (when it comes to self pacing)is that it has become impossible for me to not be in touch with the inner silence; yet that very touch itself sets off the ecstacy in ways I cannot pace. In other words: the process now owns me, not the other way around. After taking up pranayama things have occured. I will post a topic in the pranayama section in this forum with my questions relating to this experience.
Enjoy your day!
May all your Nows be Here |
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nearoanoke
USA
525 Posts |
Posted - Feb 16 2006 : 1:36:10 PM
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Hi Katrine,
Great experiences over there. Your example proves the fact that meditation is the single and most important practice that can lead to spiritual progress. The observing kind of meditation you did, I think falls into the category of buddhist vipassana meditation. AYP's method or mantra meditation is more powerful and hence can be (and should be) done for less amount of time than the observing kind
-Near
Genes are a result of karma RATHER THAN A CAUSE OF IT - Yogani |
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Feb 17 2006 : 1:08:20 PM
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Hi Near
You wrote:
quote:
The observing kind of meditation you did, I think falls into the category of buddhist vipassana meditation. AYP's method or mantra meditation is more powerful and hence can be (and should be) done for less amount of time than the observing kind
Yes...I think you are right. Checking out on Vipassana I think that's what I have been doing outside practises these past years. Interesting.
Please explain to me how a mantra meditation can be more powerful? I understand that the sutras carry a hidden frequential meaning that our consciousness responds to, but it is my experience that meditating on space can do the same. I can meditate on the blue/black space behind my eyes, on the colourless space "outside" my body (it is of course the same space - but it feels a little different). I can also do this with my eyes open....it just takes a little shift of focus....then I can have one "foot" in the space inside and another "foot" in the space outside. Sometimes, to me, using a mantra is disturbing.......It creates ripples in the stillness. Other times a mantra is just perfect (if my mind is very active before meditation).
What is your experience (anyone?)
May all your Nows be Here |
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nearoanoke
USA
525 Posts |
Posted - Feb 17 2006 : 10:26:19 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Katrine
Please explain to me how a mantra meditation can be more powerful?
Hi Katrine,
From what I know, Mantra meditation is an active meditation unlike vipassana where it is more passive observing kind. Hence usually mantra meditations can have more side effects if done for longer times unlike the vipassana kind. Probably some others can throw light on this.
-Near
Genes are a result of karma RATHER THAN A CAUSE OF IT - Yogani |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Feb 17 2006 : 11:22:31 PM
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I am sure Yogani can add to this and correct me if my thinking is off but to me mantra meditation has a two-fold effect that differs from other forms of meditation.
One, it brings the mind back into the here and now repeatedly, not allowing the mind to wander off (for long) into the various thoughts and experiences that can come up during meditation. Therefore you spend more time being present and retain more energy (intensity) as less goes off creating thought realities. Therefore to me, mantra meditation seems like a more concentrated and intense form of meditation.
Secondly, the vibration of a carefully thought out mantra, like the ones in AYP, stimulate the spinal nerve in a particular way to increase the rate of opening and purification. The mantras in AYP were also designed by Yogani to go hand in hand with the various pranayama related mudras to maximize a safe and effective opening of the nervous system. |
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Feb 19 2006 : 12:20:32 PM
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I would like to revert to the original topic:
Yogani wrote:
quote:
As for the psychological component -- how we lose our center, how we get it back, and how we make our choices in daily activity. Of course, it will be much better to focus on how to cultivate our center than to be laboring over how we may have lost it.
I don’t mean that it pays off to labor on past losses. I do , however, feel that understanding (with all of my understanding capacity – not only my intellect) an unconscious and limiting pattern within my psyche makes it easier to be alert in the present. Losing my center is not something that only happened in the past. I continuosly lose my center here and now. Or rather – experiences from my past are not digested properly; thus leaving residues that become barriers to the contact with the here and now .Understanding, and working with, the principles of A.H.Almaas and the Diamond Approach have greatly enhanced my ability to notice why and when this happens in the moment. The instant I truly understand the underlying reason for my unconscious behaviour, this behaviour usually drops by itself.
Granted – awareness is all it takes, and that is what AYP is for; but it is also sometimes helpful to know where to place that awareness. Until the day comes when all I am is that awareness itself.
For those who are interested; check out the following link: http://www.ahalmaas.com/
Yogani wrote:
quote:
The more we go out and walk through our desires, challenges and fears, the more the inner divine will express and become stabilized in us. Sitting practices set the stage for this in a big way. But we still have to go out and actualize the inner transformation in our daily life. For that, all we must do is engage in what is before us.
Exactly! I totally agree. Without the actiualization, we easily become keepers of truth instead of fountains of it.
Yogani,
and all the other wonderful people in this forum:
May all your Nows be Here |
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yogani99
USA
153 Posts |
Posted - Feb 19 2006 : 1:05:39 PM
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Hi Katrine:
I agree with you 100%. Inner silence is our starting point and ending point. Cultivating it is essential. But to do so without engaging in life (our own process) in some way is like building a foundation with no house on it.
Many years ago I knew a man who had spent decades meditating in a secluded environment. The radiance of silence around him was palpable. Yet, if anything in his physical environment became displaced, he would throw a hissy fit.
It was then that I knew there is more to this game than cultivating stillness.
Enlightenment = Stillness in Action!
...and that is ecstatic divine love expressing in the world.
The guru is in you.
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presence
11 Posts |
Posted - Jun 20 2007 : 10:00:48 PM
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Katrine wrote:
quote:
I don’t mean that it pays off to labor on past losses. I do , however, feel that understanding (with all of my understanding capacity – not only my intellect) an unconscious and limiting pattern within my psyche makes it easier to be alert in the present. Losing my center is not something that only happened in the past. I continuosly lose my center here and now. Or rather – experiences from my past are not digested properly; thus leaving residues that become barriers to the contact with the here and now .Understanding, and working with, the principles of A.H.Almaas and the Diamond Approach have greatly enhanced my ability to notice why and when this happens in the moment. The instant I truly understand the underlying reason for my unconscious behaviour, this behaviour usually drops by itself.
I find what Katrine is pointing to very important, and I think it was not heard in this, now rather old, discussion.
I am practising "I AM"/TM-meditation, but my main practice is similar to what Katrine describes - removing the blocks so that I come back to my center/essence/inner stillness/being.
Whenever my energy is not flowing free I pay attention to the feelings inside the body, there I soon find pain/contracted energy. By giving 100% attention to this pain (anger,fear,depression...) whithout identifying with it, while allowing it to be it transformes within 1-2 hours. It takes some discipline to do it, but Im always very happy afterwards that I did it, as its like presence after some time use the pain as fuel, almost like a fire that burns wood, and transforms the pain into presence! This means that negative emotions can be a doorway to increased presence! Everytime its like a major breakthrough. (The "procedure" is described in E.Tolle´s "Power of Now" or R.Moss´ latest book)
I feel that praticing mantrameditation when my "pain-body" is active, is a kind of "spiritual bypass", whereby I "dissociate" from the pain (which can lead to a spacey,fuzzy, disoriented state) or I am just not able to enter into any stillness in the mantra-meditation.
I am rather sure that this practice Im describing does not need any
"selfpacing" as it can be praticed for hours, whitout any other side effects than increased presence and grounding. I feel it could easily be included into the AYP repetoire - it belongs to the tantra tradition also - and thereby make the travel to higher awareness even more smooth.
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Integrating Psychology and Spirituality
